i can see this turning ugly

[geauxtohell]

How odd you got that impression.

Because what the APA says is that the consensus is that it's a variety of factors, and that there's a suggestion that it might be biological.

Now you are just being dishonest.

You went on a tangent about how I couldn't prove that the consensus was that homosexuality was not a choice (which is the opposite of what Ms. Keeton erroneously claims) and now you want to dodge the issue?

 

[geauxtohell]

Oh, you mean like Christian = homophobe?

Or that the student was going to "force" her opinions on others?

Lol.

When have I ever said "Christian = homophobe"?

As for the second, that's really the issue at hand here, isn't it?

We don't know the full truth yet. Stop acting like you do.

 

[AllieBaba]

Regarding the facility: Any sort of facility. I've worked in treatment, detention, the jail, and group homes.

Now I'm a caseworker. It's not a facility, but I have clients who are homosexual. I determine eligibility for TANF which means CASE PLANS. Case plans are plans to achieve self sufficiency, and includes testing and creating a plan of attack, which often includes counseling and resource pursual.

My religion has never been an issue. Ever. Not even once. I created life plans for homosexual sex offenders, for Pete's sakes. Not once did my religion and my personal beliefs about sexual orientation cause any sort of problem with any of my clients, my co-workers, community partners, or anyone else.

 

[AllieBaba]

How odd you got that impression.

Because what the APA says is that the consensus is that it's a variety of factors, and that there's a suggestion that it might be biological.

Now you are just being dishonest.

You went on a tangent about how I couldn't prove that the consensus was that homosexuality was not a choice (which is the opposite of what Ms. Keeton erroneously claims) and now you want to dodge the issue?

I'm not dodging the issue. I'm saying you didn't prove it. This is the same problem Madeline had. You can't prove something with a lie. It doesn't matter how many times you say it. But you guys have no concept of fact or truth, so it's a waste of time to try to explain it to you.

 

[ConHog]

Oh, you mean like Christian = homophobe?

Or that the student was going to "force" her opinions on others?

Lol.

When have I ever said "Christian = homophobe"?

As for the second, that's really the issue at hand here, isn't it?

We don't know the full truth yet. Stop acting like you do.

You didn't say t hat, but Madeline did. I to wonder why it is that a leftie will pile all over a rightie for any small thing but NEVER say anything when one of the left loons , which Madeline is, says something ridiculously stupid?

 

[geauxtohell]

Regarding the facility: Any sort of facility. I've worked in treatment, detention, the jail, and group homes.

Now I'm a caseworker. It's not a facility, but I have clients who are homosexual. I determine eligibility for TANF which means CASE PLANS. Case plans are plans to achieve self sufficiency, and includes testing and creating a plan of attack, which often includes counseling and resource pursual.

My religion has never been an issue. Ever. Not even once. I created life plans for homosexual sex offenders, for Pete's sakes. Not once did my religion and my personal beliefs about sexual orientation cause any sort of problem with any of my clients, my co-workers, community partners, or anyone else.

I've never stated that your religion (or anyone's religion) automatically impedes their ability to be a counselor. No one is taking umbrage with Ms. Keeton's personal beliefs.

The issue is her introducing her personal beliefs into a professional or academic setting and to what degree she did so and if the school acted appropriately considering the facts it had.

This is not a "Christian Persecution" issue no matter how much you guys would like it to be.

Furthermore, the fact that you are able to act professionally and separate your personal opinions from your professional job doesn't mean Ms. Keeton was able too.

 

[ConHog]

Regarding the facility: Any sort of facility. I've worked in treatment, detention, the jail, and group homes.

Now I'm a caseworker. It's not a facility, but I have clients who are homosexual. I determine eligibility for TANF which means CASE PLANS. Case plans are plans to achieve self sufficiency, and includes testing and creating a plan of attack, which often includes counseling and resource pursual.

My religion has never been an issue. Ever. Not even once. I created life plans for homosexual sex offenders, for Pete's sakes. Not once did my religion and my personal beliefs about sexual orientation cause any sort of problem with any of my clients, my co-workers, community partners, or anyone else.

I've never stated that your religion (or anyone's religion) automatically impedes their ability to be a counselor. No one is taking umbrage with Ms. Keeton's personal beliefs.

The issue is her introducing her personal beliefs into a professional or academic setting and to what degree she did so and if the school acted appropriately considering the facts it had.

This is not a "Christian Persecution" issue no matter how much you guys would like it to be.

Furthermore, the fact that you are able to act professionally and separate your personal opinions from your professional job doesn't mean Ms. Keeton was able too.

Do you have proof that she did so? No, you don't because this school is in fact preventing her from even entering the profession. How can you defend that?

And yes, this is based on her RELIGIOUS beliefs, no amount how much you want to claim it isn't.

 

[WillowTree]

In Madeline, we have the quintessential picture of a complete bigot. We're lucky to have her so. She's a text book example of how bigotry presents.

She blames door-knocking Christians for the fact that the people in a particular neighborhood are getting robbed, and says they make her "afraid".

She says they reduce wariness and make people more vulnerable because they think whomever is knocking on the door is a JH.

It is a perfect picture of bigotry.

In this thread, she maintains that because a person is a Christian, they are also a homophobe. And she further states that in order to work in human services, one cannot be a Christian because Christianity is anathema to human services.

Another example of perfect bigotry.

Nailed it.

 

[geauxtohell]

How odd you got that impression.

Because what the APA says is that the consensus is that it's a variety of factors, and that there's a suggestion that it might be biological.

Now you are just being dishonest.

You went on a tangent about how I couldn't prove that the consensus was that homosexuality was not a choice (which is the opposite of what Ms. Keeton erroneously claims) and now you want to dodge the issue?

I'm not dodging the issue. I'm saying you didn't prove it. This is the same problem Madeline had. You can't prove something with a lie. It doesn't matter how many times you say it. But you guys have no concept of fact or truth, so it's a waste of time to try to explain it to you.

A.) I am not Madeline, so save your hatefest for your interactions with her. I am a separate person.

B.) How is linking to the consensus of the two biggest professional societies in the issues of behavioral health "not proving" what you asked me to do (and by proxy refutes you penchant to excoriate me for what you deemed to be my making up that the professional consensus is that homosexuality is not a personal choice).

Now who is being dishonest?

At any rate, for the rest of the posters on here: the professional consensus of mental health professionals is that homosexuality is not a mental illness, it is not something that a person chooses to be, it can't be changed with group therapy, and it is multifactorial.

 

[geauxtohell]

Oh, you mean like Christian = homophobe?

Or that the student was going to "force" her opinions on others?

Lol.

When have I ever said "Christian = homophobe"?

As for the second, that's really the issue at hand here, isn't it?

We don't know the full truth yet. Stop acting like you do.

You didn't say t hat, but Madeline did. I to wonder why it is that a leftie will pile all over a rightie for any small thing but NEVER say anything when one of the left loons , which Madeline is, says something ridiculously stupid?

Then people should direct their comments to the appropriate posters.

As for this silly notion that I have to police what other posters on a thread say, come off of it. I don't read every post on a thread. I generally read comments that are addressed to me.

Just like everyone else.

 

[ConHog]

When have I ever said "Christian = homophobe"?

As for the second, that's really the issue at hand here, isn't it?

We don't know the full truth yet. Stop acting like you do.

You didn't say t hat, but Madeline did. I to wonder why it is that a leftie will pile all over a rightie for any small thing but NEVER say anything when one of the left loons , which Madeline is, says something ridiculously stupid?

Then people should direct their comments to the appropriate posters.

As for this silly notion that I have to police what other posters on a thread say, come off of it. I don't read every post on a thread. I generally read comments that are addressed to me.

Just like everyone else.

I'm sorry , did I miss where Allie said that you specifically said it?

As for policing other posters. I just find it odd that "lefties" routinely have no problem "policing" the right, but never seem to notice any of the ridiculous comments by their own. Police everyone, or police no one.

 

[geauxtohell]

Do you have proof that she did so? No, you don't because this school is in fact preventing her from even entering the profession. How can you defend that?

And yes, this is based on her RELIGIOUS beliefs, no amount how much you want to claim it isn't.

For the 15th time: no one on here has proof of anything. What we have is the claim of one plaintiff. As I have said before, I want to hear both sides of the story.

I fully defend a school from not awarding a degree to someone who fails to meet the standards. It appears Ms. Keeton has a penchant to editorialize in her academic writing. That is sub-par and anyone that has made it out of English 101 knows that.

And again, I don't take umbrage with Ms. Keeton's religious beliefs. I take umbrage with her belief that she can introduce it into her academic career when it is not germane to the issue.

Her beliefs about homosexuality being a lifestyle choice are at odds with the medical community.

 

[geauxtohell]

You didn't say t hat, but Madeline did. I to wonder why it is that a leftie will pile all over a rightie for any small thing but NEVER say anything when one of the left loons , which Madeline is, says something ridiculously stupid?

Then people should direct their comments to the appropriate posters.

As for this silly notion that I have to police what other posters on a thread say, come off of it. I don't read every post on a thread. I generally read comments that are addressed to me.

Just like everyone else.

I'm sorry , did I miss where Allie said that you specifically said it?

Well you can now understand my confusion that she made her comments while quoting me.

 

[AllieBaba]

Actually, I beg to differ.

Madeline and you have no proof that any of the shit you've said is true.

All I said is that it is about Christianity (and it is, per my links, quotations and the words of the woman's attorneys), that there is no "consensus" that must be embraced in the field, and that it is discrimination to penalize a person based upon their religion alone, and the woman was being singled out and required to recant.

I've proved my side, thanks.

 

[ConHog]

Do you have proof that she did so? No, you don't because this school is in fact preventing her from even entering the profession. How can you defend that?

And yes, this is based on her RELIGIOUS beliefs, no amount how much you want to claim it isn't.

For the 15th time: no one on here has proof of anything. What we have is the claim of one plaintiff. As I have said before, I want to hear both sides of the story.

I fully defend a school from not awarding a degree to someone who fails to meet the standards. It appears Ms. Keeton has a penchant to editorialize in her academic writing. That is sub-par and anyone that has made it out of English 101 knows that.

And again, I don't take umbrage with Ms. Keeton's religious beliefs. I take umbrage with her belief that she can introduce it into her academic career when it is not germane to the issue.

Her beliefs about homosexuality being a lifestyle choice are at odds with the medical community.

Did she pass all the required coursework? Yes or No? That is the ONLY thing the school should be concerned with. Once she gets her degree then if she chooses a field which requires accreditation, she should be subject to THEIR policies regarding that accreditation, but that is not relevant to the school's graduating her.

 

[AllieBaba]

Regarding the facility: Any sort of facility. I've worked in treatment, detention, the jail, and group homes.

Now I'm a caseworker. It's not a facility, but I have clients who are homosexual. I determine eligibility for TANF which means CASE PLANS. Case plans are plans to achieve self sufficiency, and includes testing and creating a plan of attack, which often includes counseling and resource pursual.

My religion has never been an issue. Ever. Not even once. I created life plans for homosexual sex offenders, for Pete's sakes. Not once did my religion and my personal beliefs about sexual orientation cause any sort of problem with any of my clients, my co-workers, community partners, or anyone else.

I've never stated that your religion (or anyone's religion) automatically impedes their ability to be a counselor. No one is taking umbrage with Ms. Keeton's personal beliefs.

The issue is her introducing her personal beliefs into a professional or academic setting and to what degree she did so and if the school acted appropriately considering the facts it had.

This is not a "Christian Persecution" issue no matter how much you guys would like it to be.

Furthermore, the fact that you are able to act professionally and separate your personal opinions from your professional job doesn't mean Ms. Keeton was able too.

Yeah, well, if she isn't able to, then she can lose her license.

But you can't hold up a degree using the requirement that someone recanting their opinions, let alone their faith.

And you can pretend it isn't about religion all you want. You're lying. The lawsuit is about religion and discrimination. The woman says it's about religion. That makes it about her religion.

 

[geauxtohell]

Actually, I beg to differ.

Madeline and you have no proof that any of the shit you've said is true.

All I said is that it is about Christianity (and it is, per my links, quotations and the words of the woman's attorneys), that there is no "consensus" that must be embraced in the field, and that it is discrimination to penalize a person based upon their religion alone, and the woman was being singled out and required to recant.

I've proved my side, thanks.

You mean "no proof" other than the fact that I linked the statements from the 2 APAs? Maybe you think I made up the links? You can solve that conundrum by simply clicking on the links I provided you know.

Finally, your opinion (bolstered by *shockingly* the woman's attorney and the plaintiff's statement) is just that. It's not "fact". Absolute fact will come out if/when this goes to court.

It is my opinion that this isn't a religious discrimination issue, but a failure to meet standards issue, but I would like to see what the school has to say about it.

 

[geauxtohell]

Did she pass all the required coursework? Yes or No?

No one knows. Ms. Keeton's academic record is private information and the school can't even comment on it at this time.

That is the ONLY thing the school should be concerned with. Once she gets her degree then if she chooses a field which requires accreditation, she should be subject to THEIR policies regarding that accreditation, but that is not relevant to the school's graduating her.

I've commented on this sentiment already.

 

[ConHog]

Did she pass all the required coursework? Yes or No?

No one knows. Ms. Keeton's academic record is private information and the school can't even comment on it at this time.

That is the ONLY thing the school should be concerned with. Once she gets her degree then if she chooses a field which requires accreditation, she should be subject to THEIR policies regarding that accreditation, but that is not relevant to the school's graduating her.

I've commented on this sentiment already.

I must have missed it, and don't care to dig through the crap again, can you recap your opinion that matter?

 

[AllieBaba]

Thank you for sparing us a repetition.