How much do extremely wealthy people owe to the society that gave them the chance to prosper so much?

[justinacolmena]

The wealthy mostly provided the opportunity for others to be employed and for others to benefit from their own labor

That's right. “The Wealthy” have all that lip service and people drawing payroll to support. And all the servants working for them quit or revolt if they don't feel like they're getting their fair share.

 

[Anomalism]

Karl Marx was wealthy.
He was trying to figure out how to deal with the fact the industrial revolution was destroying cottage industries, that was then causing massive loss of rights and freedom.
It was causing economic slavery.
We had in the US around the turn of the century, company towns.
But anti trust laws and unions proved to be the solutions.

I'm still not Karl Marx.

 

[Anomalism]

Society did not permit the wealthy to become wealthy. Quit playing the finger pointing boo hoo victim Once Again. The wealthy mostly provided the opportunity for others to be employed and for others to benefit from their own labor (and we know libbies don’t like that “their Own Labor” stuff)

We all built this thing and keep it rolling together.

 

[justinacolmena]

Surely something, right? I see a lot of people talk like taxes are theft. Is it not just our obligation?

Shoe on the wrong foot, cart before the horse-this is the failed liberal mentality that just got elected.

Don't get in trouble with the bar. You're voting for Trump with your right hand and electing Biden with your left hand when you say that.

 

[Canon Shooter]

Nor has your argument convinced anyone that they should.

A scenario: You and I are given the exact same opportunity to achieve a certain level of wealth.

I decide to work really, really hard to achieve that wealth. My hard work pays off and I become wealthy.

You, on the other hand, vacillate over whether or not you want to invest the time and effort to achieve that certain level of wealth. You try, but you decide you just don't have the patience for it, and you decide that you're not going to work hard to achieve that wealth. Consequently, you find yourself far less successful than me, despite being afforded the exact same opportunity.

Why should I pay more in taxes than you?

I am very familiar with how conservatives think. My grandfather and great grandfather made sure of that.

Why won't you answer the question?

 

[Anomalism]

Why won't you answer the question?

I feel that I did answer the question in previous posts.

 

[bripat9643]

Utter horseshit. Just ask a few landlords how easy it is to make money from rental property.

Why it's cheaper to buy on a 30-year mortgage or whatever the bank offers than it is to rent. People who are responsible for their own property keep it up and make it last longer.

No, the reason it is cheaper to buy than to rent is that there are tax laws deliberately designed to benefit the wealthy.
When you are landlord, you can write off all repairs, pay yourself, take depreciation, etc.
Renters get ZERO tax breaks at all, and banks won't give poor people a mortgage, even if they can prove they have never defaulted on their rent.
The tax laws and bank practices are incredibly discriminatory, unfair, and fraudulent.

Why shouldn't you be able to write off repairs, your salary and depreciation? The 16th amendment allows the government to tax INCOME, which is defined as revenue minus expenses.

You are incredibly stupid.

 

[Rigby5]

There are SOME people who get wealthy by virtue of creativeness, invention, hard work, etc., but very FEW.
Once you have money, it is easy to just loan it out and make big bucks.
For example, if you simply have a good enough credit rating, you do not have to put money down to buy rental properties, and then the tenants actually make the payments, and buy the house for you as the landlord.
Most of the wealthy product nothing and pay almost nothing in taxex.
They can pay themselves in stock options, so they only pay the minimal capital gains tax rate.

How do you get a good credit rating? By being responsible with your money and paying your bills.

Also, if I have a good credit rating and use it to acquire a rental property. Have I not provided something someone wants, why would I do that if no one WANTED to use it?

Being responsible with your money and paying your bills will not get you enough to allow you to buy rentals with no money down.
You have to inherit cash, stocks, other properties, etc.

When landlords buy rental properties, they are not providing anything, because they are not building the property. They are competing against those who want to become home owners, so instead inflate housing prices and are removing housing from the market, not providing anything.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

That's like 1% of what our government spends.

I think there'd be chaos if we cut government spending by 95%.

The government only spent 5% of GDP under the monarchy.

So now you are deflecting to GDP?

 

[Rigby5]

They also give a lot of money and time, to charity.

As tax shelters.

who cares as long as they are paying it,,

anytime the people get more and the government gets less is a good thing,,

Except that isn't how it works out. There pay less, the government gets less, and the people they don't pay a living wage to get less to make up for it.

as long as the government gets less there is more for the company to pay employees,,

But they don't. The government's job is to protect it's people, even if what they need protected from is greedy corporations and billionaires.

their job is to protect our rights not our jobs or paychecks,,,

youre thinking of fascist or communist countries,,,

Really? Did you forget "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"?

that has nothing to do with forcing others to provide for you against their will,,

Nobody is doing that. However they should be made to make up the difference between real wages and what they get away with paying the folks who's backs they ride to wealth.

what are real wages???

I live on less that 5K a yr right now and have no savings or pensions,, and next yrs looks like its gonna be worse,,

So you're homeless and hungry, yet you have internet?

Internet is free at any library.
And it should be free to all.
It is an essential public utility that keeps people informed.

 

[bripat9643]

There are SOME people who get wealthy by virtue of creativeness, invention, hard work, etc., but very FEW.
Once you have money, it is easy to just loan it out and make big bucks.
For example, if you simply have a good enough credit rating, you do not have to put money down to buy rental properties, and then the tenants actually make the payments, and buy the house for you as the landlord.
Most of the wealthy product nothing and pay almost nothing in taxex.
They can pay themselves in stock options, so they only pay the minimal capital gains tax rate.

How do you get a good credit rating? By being responsible with your money and paying your bills.

Also, if I have a good credit rating and use it to acquire a rental property. Have I not provided something someone wants, why would I do that if no one WANTED to use it?

Being responsible with your money and paying your bills will not get you enough to allow you to buy rentals with no money down.
You have to inherit cash, stocks, other properties, etc.

When landlords buy rental properties, they are not providing anything, because they are not building the property. They are competing against those who want to become home owners, so instead inflate housing prices and are removing housing from the market, not providing anything.

Wrong, turd. Many people who made a basic wage have managed to build real estate empires. Landlords provide people who can't afford to buy a house the means to live in one. All your theories about real estate are utter horseshit.

 

[Rigby5]

Surely something, right? I see a lot of people talk like taxes are theft. Is it not just our obligation?

They owe the same amount that unsuccessful people owe, who had the same chances.

No, the wealthy owe more because they get more back.
Airports for example.
Poor people get nothing out of the billions in tax money spent on airports.

 

[bripat9643]

They also give a lot of money and time, to charity.

As tax shelters.

who cares as long as they are paying it,,

anytime the people get more and the government gets less is a good thing,,

Except that isn't how it works out. There pay less, the government gets less, and the people they don't pay a living wage to get less to make up for it.

as long as the government gets less there is more for the company to pay employees,,

But they don't. The government's job is to protect it's people, even if what they need protected from is greedy corporations and billionaires.

their job is to protect our rights not our jobs or paychecks,,,

youre thinking of fascist or communist countries,,,

Really? Did you forget "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"?

that has nothing to do with forcing others to provide for you against their will,,

Nobody is doing that. However they should be made to make up the difference between real wages and what they get away with paying the folks who's backs they ride to wealth.

what are real wages???

I live on less that 5K a yr right now and have no savings or pensions,, and next yrs looks like its gonna be worse,,

So you're homeless and hungry, yet you have internet?

Internet is free at any library.
And it should be free to all.
It is an essential public utility that keeps people informed.

Your house should be free to any bum who wants to move in, don't you think?

 

[WEATHER53]

The wealthy mostly provided the opportunity for others to be employed and for others to benefit from their own labor

That's right. “The Wealthy” have all that lip service and people drawing payroll to support. And all the servants working for them quit or revolt if they don't feel like they're getting their fair share.

Comic book assessment

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

That is straight from the Communist Manifesto! You knew that, right?

You seem to be a lot more familiar than me.

That's because you are stupid.

hes ignorant not stupid,, well he could also be stupid,,

Failure to recognize you are ignorant when proven to be so, mean you are stupid.

 

[WTH_Progs?]

Surely something, right? I see a lot of people talk like taxes are theft. Is it not just our obligation?

If you knew something about taxes I suppose you'd have a point, but that said, I'd gut Google, Amazon, Facebook, Twitter & USPS for starts.

 

[Crepitus]

They also give a lot of money and time, to charity.

As tax shelters.

who cares as long as they are paying it,,

anytime the people get more and the government gets less is a good thing,,

Except that isn't how it works out. There pay less, the government gets less, and the people they don't pay a living wage to get less to make up for it.

as long as the government gets less there is more for the company to pay employees,,

But they don't. The government's job is to protect it's people, even if what they need protected from is greedy corporations and billionaires.

their job is to protect our rights not our jobs or paychecks,,,

youre thinking of fascist or communist countries,,,

Really? Did you forget "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"?

that has nothing to do with forcing others to provide for you against their will,,

Nobody is doing that. However they should be made to make up the difference between real wages and what they get away with paying the folks who's backs they ride to wealth.

what are real wages???

I live on less that 5K a yr right now and have no savings or pensions,, and next yrs looks like its gonna be worse,,

So you're homeless and hungry, yet you have internet?

nope,, I have a 12 acre farm and 150K of tools along with 300K in assets,,,

what are real wages??

Ah, so you lied.

I don't know why I expected better of you.

 

[norwegen]

Surely something, right? I see a lot of people talk like taxes are theft. Is it not just our obligation?

They owe the same amount that unsuccessful people owe, who had the same chances.

No, the wealthy owe more because they get more back.
Airports for example.
Poor people get nothing out of the billions in tax money spent on airports.

Twilight Zone ^^^

 

[Rigby5]

Utter horseshit. Just ask a few landlords how easy it is to make money from rental property.

Why it's cheaper to buy on a 30-year mortgage or whatever the bank offers than it is to rent. People who are responsible for their own property keep it up and make it last longer.

No, the reason it is cheaper to buy than to rent is that there are tax laws deliberately designed to benefit the wealthy.
When you are landlord, you can write off all repairs, pay yourself, take depreciation, etc.
Renters get ZERO tax breaks at all, and banks won't give poor people a mortgage, even if they can prove they have never defaulted on their rent.
The tax laws and bank practices are incredibly discriminatory, unfair, and fraudulent.

Why shouldn't you be able to write of repairs, your salary and depreciation? The 16th amendment allows the government to tax INCOME, which is defined as revenue minus expenses.

You are incredibly stupid.

You have my intent backwards.
Nothing wrong with landlords writing off expenses.
What is wrong is renters being unable to write off their actual cost of living, (doing business).
Rent should be a legal tax write off.

 

[Crepitus]

They also give a lot of money and time, to charity.

As tax shelters.

who cares as long as they are paying it,,

anytime the people get more and the government gets less is a good thing,,

Except that isn't how it works out. There pay less, the government gets less, and the people they don't pay a living wage to get less to make up for it.

as long as the government gets less there is more for the company to pay employees,,

But they don't. The government's job is to protect it's people, even if what they need protected from is greedy corporations and billionaires.

their job is to protect our rights not our jobs or paychecks,,,

youre thinking of fascist or communist countries,,,

Really? Did you forget "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"?

that has nothing to do with forcing others to provide for you against their will,,

Nobody is doing that. However they should be made to make up the difference between real wages and what they get away with paying the folks who's backs they ride to wealth.

what are real wages???

I live on less that 5K a yr right now and have no savings or pensions,, and next yrs looks like its gonna be worse,,

So you're homeless and hungry, yet you have internet?

Internet is free at any library.
And it should be free to all.
It is an essential public utility that keeps people informed.

Unfortunately too damn many folks use it to misinform themselves.