How forgiving are you?

[Joz]

I believe forgiveness is for the person doing the forgiving. Most people don't give a rat's *ss if you forgive them or not. But without being able to forgive a person, you stay suck, revenge is all that can be thought of, it consumes a person & their thinking.

I can forgive those that are extremely close to me. But I am a grudge holder to others. Not so much that it occupies my every tho't, but I have a hard time letting it go. Especially if I've been accused falsely. Do me wrong, & I will treat you nicely, but I will always hold you at an arm's length, never willingly giving you that opportunity again. So, do I really forgive???

 

[deaddude]

I quickly forgive people but I have a long memory. When I get angry at someone I tend to remember things that person did to me in the past to make me angry, and that just makes me angrier. So when I am calm I am one of the quickest people to forgive, when I am angry I remember everything anyone ever did to me.

 

[Nienna]

I forgive people fairly easily, especially for the first offense. After two or three times, I will do as you say, Starla, and not hold it against a person, but not truly trust that person any more. But, I have messed up too many times to be unforgiving toward another. My own inadequacies always spring to my mortified mind.

I agree that forgiveness DOES set one free, should be done for one's own peace of mind. However, I disagree that others do not benefit from it, or feel it. I don't believe that so many people are insensible, that it truly doesn't hurt a person to know that she has offended someone. I cringe to think of my offenses, and I view another person's forgiveness of me as a very valuable gift.

 

[Joz]

...... But, I have messed up too many times to be unforgiving toward another. My own inadequacies always spring to my mortified mind.

I agree that forgiveness DOES set one free, should be done for one's own peace of mind. However, I disagree that others do not benefit from it, or feel it. I don't believe that so many people are insensible, that it truly doesn't hurt a person to know that she has offended someone. I cringe to think of my offenses, and I view another person's forgiveness of me as a very valuable gift.

Ah, but there's where the difference is. For a person to totally forgive, the other person has to be truly sorry for their offense & ask for forgivesness. Otherwise, forgiveness only goes so far. And even tho' some people do not believe in a deity they have managed to adopt some sort of Christian principle.
Yet there are some people that can make it right in their mind that what they do to another person, is okay.

 

[Nienna]

Ah, but there's where the difference is. For a person to totally forgive, the other person has to be truly sorry for their offense & ask for forgivesness.

I'd like to hear more of your thoughts on this idea. I'm not sure I agree with it.

I think it is possible for someone to give up all bad feelings, to wish only good for another person, to refuse to consider past offenses in dealing with someone, even if the other person does not feel sorry or ask forgiveness, even if the other person feels completely justified in offending. As you said before, forgiveness FIRST benefits the forgiver.

 

[5stringJeff]

Ah, but there's where the difference is. For a person to totally forgive, the other person has to be truly sorry for their offense & ask for forgivesness. Otherwise, forgiveness only goes so far.

I disagree. One can truly forgive someone even if they haven't asked for it. Heck, you might never see that person again - like some idiot who cuts you off in traffic and makes you spill coffee on your nice outfit. You'll never see him/her again, but you can still forgive them.

But as to your OP, it's not necessarily wrong to not trust someone as much if they've wronged you. It doesn't mean you haven't forgiven them. It means you can't trust them as well.

 

[Bonnie]

I really do admire those that can forgive and forget easily, with me it usually depends on who and what.

More often than not if I do forgive someone, I still am not able to forget and so I usually make the decision to distance myself from that person simply because I loose trust in them and I prefer to not complicate my life with those I cant' trust. It's more for my own sake than any sort of getting even motivation.

 

[Nienna]

But as to your OP, it's not necessarily wrong to not trust someone as much if they've wronged you. It doesn't mean you haven't forgiven them. It means you can't trust them as well.

GMTA! I was just going to post that trust and forgiveness are two different things.

However, if the offender is truly repentent (in the sense of turning away from the offense, not repeating it), I believe it is incumbent on the forgiver to offer the offender another chance to rebuild trust. If the offense is repeated often, or if it was a particularly bad offense, it is only reasonable that it would take much more time and effort to lay a foundation of trust. But I believe that one does not truly offer forgiveness if he does not offer the chance for a truly penitent offender to rebuild trust.

 

[Joz]

I'd like to hear more of your thoughts on this idea. I'm not sure I agree with it.

I think it is possible for someone to give up all bad feelings, to wish only good for another person, to refuse to consider past offenses in dealing with someone, even if the other person does not feel sorry or ask forgiveness, even if the other person feels completely justified in offending. As you said before, forgiveness FIRST benefits the forgiver.

I agree with you whole-heartedly. We can forgive others without them asking. That is what makes us "unstuck". We have to be able to do this.

God forgives me for my sins. But in order for that to be completed, I have to acknowledge my wrong doing. I have to accept my responsibility in doing the act. There is also a freedom in knowing we've been forgiven. It is something that Christians experience. Those that never ask for forgiveness do not understand this.

I disagree. One can truly forgive someone even if they haven't asked for it. Heck, you might never see that person again - like some idiot who cuts you off in traffic and makes you spill coffee on your nice outfit. You'll never see him/her again, but you can still forgive them.

I don't see this as a forgivess. Just an acceptance that accidents happen thru the stupid acts of someone else. I'm referring to acts like purposely lying about a person to make yourself seem important. Having a friend steal money from you. Have someone say a hurtful, cutting, insulting remark.

 

[Fisherking]

For if you forgive men their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will also forgive you:
If you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Heavenly Father forgive yours:
Mathew 6: 14-15

We must forgive in order to be forgiven.

I really enjoy reading everyones posts.

Very pleasent thread Joz.

 

[no1tovote4]

I believe forgiveness is for the person doing the forgiving. Most people don't give a rat's *ss if you forgive them or not. But without being able to forgive a person, you stay suck, revenge is all that can be thought of, it consumes a person & their thinking.

I can forgive those that are extremely close to me. But I am a grudge holder to others. Not so much that it occupies my every tho't, but I have a hard time letting it go. Especially if I've been accused falsely. Do me wrong, & I will treat you nicely, but I will always hold you at an arm's length, never willingly giving you that opportunity again. So, do I really forgive???

I have a hard time holding a grudge. There were times I was so angry I thought I would never forgive.... I always ended up forgiving rather quickly. Life is too short to waste it on negative energy.

 

[Dr Grump]

I have a hard time holding a grudge. There were times I was so angry I thought I would never forgive.... I always ended up forgiving rather quickly. Life is too short to waste it on negative energy.

More or less the same as you. I get angry easily, but get over it real quick...Not one to hold a grudge in 99.9% of cases...

 

[manu1959]

I believe forgiveness is for the ordoing the forgiving. Most people don't give a rat's *ss if you forgive them or not. But without being able to forgive a person, you stay suck, revenge is all that can be thought of, it consumes a person & their thinking.

I can forgive those that are extremely close to me. But I am a grudge holder to others. Not so much that it occupies my every tho't, but I have a hard time letting it go. Especially if I've been accused falsely. Do me wrong, & I will treat you nicely, but I will always hold you at an arm's length, never willingly giving you that opportunity again. So, do I really forgive???

i don't forgive....you simply cease to exist

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I forgive easily. There's no other choice for me, because most people treat me poorly at some time or another, simply for exploding their worldview with the truth. People don't like that and can get quite nasty, but they all are forgiven.

 

[jillian]

I can forgive almost anything. I even forget most of it. Some stuff can be forgiven, but shouldn't be forgotten just in terms of your dealings with the person who made you angry in the first place.

I think, though, if we've transgressed against another person, then only that person can forgive us.

 

[Joz]

A. We can forgive others without them asking.
B. When we do the screw-up it is our responsibility to make amends.

But what if you don't know you've hurt someone's feelings by something you said/did? Do you not think it's the responsibility of the injured party to bring it to your attention?

 

[jillian]

A. We can forgive others without them asking.
B. When we do the screw-up it is our responsibility to make amends.

But what if you don't know you've hurt someone's feelings by something you said/did? Do you not think it's the responsibility of the injured party to bring it to your attention?

I think it's pretty much on them if they don't let you know that you inadvertantly wronged them. There's only so much we can and should take on ourselves.

 

[Joz]

I think it's pretty much on them if they don't let you know that you inadvertantly wronged them. There's only so much we can and should take on ourselves.

I understand the first part of your statement. We teach others how to treat us. And if we don't tell them, they may not be aware that their behavior or speech is offensive.
But I'm not sure I understand the second part. Are you saying that I shouldn't take all the responsibility for the things I say & do? Or that around certain people I shouldn't censor myself?

 

[jillian]

I understand the first part of your statement. We teach others how to treat us. And if we don't tell them, they may not be aware that their behavior or speech is offensive.
But I'm not sure I understand the second part. Are you saying that I shouldn't take all the responsibility for the things I say & do? Or that around certain people I shouldn't censor myself?

Sorry. By the second part of my comment I simply meant that if we're unaware that something we did iaffects another person in a negative manner, and they fail to point it out to us, then it's not really worth thinking about because we'll just make ourselves nuts wondering what we might have done wrong. In other words, that's *their* problem.

 

[Joz]

Sorry. By the second part of my comment I simply meant that if we're unaware that something we did iaffects another person in a negative manner, and they fail to point it out to us, then it's not really worth thinking about because we'll just make ourselves nuts wondering what we might have done wrong. In other words, that's *their* problem.

I think you're right.
But what about going back over a conversation & think something I said may have been in question and then apologize, just in case??? Or at least ask?

And what about the friend (or family) who is always making sure you're staying on, what they think, is the straight & narrow.
That can make life unbearable.