Debate Now Honest Debate About Abortion: Rules Posted

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Pro-life is an ideological position which opposes abortion.

Which is a deceptive co-opting of that term, since honestly calling themselves "anti choice" would be too honest for them and sounds bad. Because it is bad.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

What makes something living and what makes something human and how can something be living before being human?

Back in the day, the slave was looked at as a glorified ape, so they were looked at as living but were treated like cattle.

The unborn is no different in this regard as they are looked at as living but also beneath the standards of being equals to actual human beings.

Why?

Because mom is more important. As is protecting her right to control her own body.

 

[Flopper]

They need to define what a human is. I think it's a valid question. It's a dangerous one though, because who can trust anyone to define it. We've seen hysterics against the SCOTUS in the past years, with radicals claiming horrible things against them for quite honestly uncontroversial, moderate decisions.

I think with today's feminist ideology, there's no honest path to defining a human. There's no philosophical approach, only a union mentality in what benefits the desires/conveniences of a woman. They are a union so strong and aggressive that will likely become violent and resort to anarchy in their pursuit of their ideals IMO. We've seen massive hysterics of crazed radicals banging on the doors of the SCOTUS during Roe v. Wade hearings, and SCOTUS judges' homes being surrounded by intimidating protestors... and even an assassination attempt on Judge Kavanaugh that was largely suppressed by the media because they don't want him to be a victim.

this type of violence and political radical activism is a horrible influence on the seeking of what human is. They want to bully people into compliance by force and intimidation.. even the SCOTUS judges themselves. A fetus is human being in the making.

We have had a definition of a human being for centuries,
a man, woman, or child of the species Homo sapiens, distinguished from other animals by superior mental development, power of articulate speech, and upright stance.

What you are asking is for the government to redefine a human being to include a fetus. That is not going to happen. A fetus is a human being in the making. We have long recognized that birth is the event where the fetus becomes a human being, a person with rights and legal protection.

 

[JohnDB]

Granted, a very polarizing topic in today's political landscape.

However, I'm happy to discuss the topic with people in good faith who aren't seeking to ego-post, troll, slander, insult, etc. Such discourse is just boring, and I lose interest.

Rules:
1. No political references or accusations. It's about the act of abortion only.
2. No flaming/insults
3. No involving religion.

My take:
At this time, Abortion should be banned after 5 weeks, or what some states view as the "heart beat bill". As science increases on the human fetus (fetus means "offspring"), it increasingly tells us that earlier and earlier measures must be taken to protect it.

This is a unique scenario that is sex-specific, thus, one cannot approach it if you view both sexes as completely and entirely equal in all physical aspects (which is biologically easily proven to be untrue).

I think there are 2 modern viewpoints on abortion.

One is from a victim mentality, with the primary focus on how the consequences of high-volume sex are "forced" onto women, how it's some sort of biological unfairness, how only women can dictate when a life should begin, how consequence-free sexual pleasure is a "right" despite biological truths, and how they should be able to be "freed" from this biological truth by putting their own interests in front of the "consequence" (aka natural cause) of the action they chose to participate in.

The other is from two mentalities, one from the philosophical, the other from the medical. It simply seeks to innocently define what human life is, and no sexes are excluded from discussing this topic, as it effects all humanity. It addresses what the act of sex causes, establishes the differences that the act has on men and women, and acknowledges how these results manifest in society. It promotes the idea that men and women are biologically different, and how that truth will manifest differently in the world by their abilities and choices. It is compassionate to the vulnerable, innocent possible-beings that are voiceless to speak out in the name of supporting their right to their own life/existence, and references medical definitions of life to provide evidence to support these claims.

What Say you?

I'm actually one step further.
No more vasectomy, tubal libations, or birth control until 3 live births have been realized for HEALTHY parents.

We do not have sufficient live births any longer to replace our existing population. We have created a marriage penalty through taxation.

We cannot afford anymore homosexual unions either.

Between the endocrine system damages from Covid-19 the birth rates are going to be low for at least one generation if not two or three. There simply aren't enough children to replace those dying.

Harsh to enforce this kind of thing....but we need the children. Or face extreme de-urbanization all across this nation.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I'm actually one step further.
No more vasectomy, tubal libations, or birth control until 3 live births have been realized for HEALTHY parents.

How nauseating!

Mind your business!

 

[JohnDB]

How nauseating!

Mind your business, asshole!

There's not going to be a nation if we continue this course.
It will cease to exist. Then what?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

There's not going to be a nation if we continue this course.

Well that's insane. Of course there will be.

This is all just white supremacist code talk anyway.

 

[JohnDB]

Well that's insane. Of course there will be.

This is all just white supremacist code talk anyway.

Upon what are you basing your assertion upon....it certainly isn't 2nd generation American birth rates. Because they are below American death rates.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Upon what are you basing your assertion upon.

The fact that white nationalists have been vomiting g this same talking g point for decades.

What worries you is that white births won't pace brown births.

This is an old rerun. It doesn't matter if you just got your first TV.

 

[JohnDB]

The fact that white nationalists have been vomiting g this same talking g point for decades.

What worries you is that white births won't pace brown births.

This is an old rerun. It doesn't matter if you just got your first TV.

White births versus minorities?
White births haven't kept up with deaths for decades....but Hispanics, asians, and blacks have assisted in making 2nd Gen or later Americans the whole time. Making up for whites not procreating.

Now...none of any people group is sufficient for making the next generation be even the same as those dying due to old age. We are shrinking in population as a nation.
The trend needs to reverse immediately or there will not be a nation anymore.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

White births haven't kept up with deaths for decades.

. And as the brown population has grown at the same time in the US, the white nationalists have been spewing this same disgusting crap for those decades.

I already covered this.

 

[JohnDB]

. And as the brown population has grown at the same time in the US, the white nationalists have been spewing this same disgusting crap for those decades.

I already covered this.

No...
Whites have been shrinking as a demographic and percentage of population for decades. The minorities growing both in numbers and percentages the whole time.

Now they have stopped.

This isn't racist in any fashion. This is solely a self imposed curse on our society. 2nd generation citizens are in need of fewer government services and generate more tax dollars than first generation citizens.

If the USA does not reverse their lack of babies being born they flat out will not exist anymore.

 

[otto105]

Granted, a very polarizing topic in today's political landscape.

However, I'm happy to discuss the topic with people in good faith who aren't seeking to ego-post, troll, slander, insult, etc. Such discourse is just boring, and I lose interest.

Rules:
1. No political references or accusations. It's about the act of abortion only.
2. No flaming/insults
3. No involving religion.

My take:
At this time, Abortion should be banned after 5 weeks, or what some states view as the "heart beat bill". As science increases on the human fetus (fetus means "offspring"), it increasingly tells us that earlier and earlier measures must be taken to protect it.

This is a unique scenario that is sex-specific, thus, one cannot approach it if you view both sexes as completely and entirely equal in all physical aspects (which is biologically easily proven to be untrue).

I think there are 2 modern viewpoints on abortion.

One is from a victim mentality, with the primary focus on how the consequences of high-volume sex are "forced" onto women, how it's some sort of biological unfairness, how only women can dictate when a life should begin, how consequence-free sexual pleasure is a "right" despite biological truths, and how they should be able to be "freed" from this biological truth by putting their own interests in front of the "consequence" (aka natural cause) of the action they chose to participate in.

The other is from two mentalities, one from the philosophical, the other from the medical. It simply seeks to innocently define what human life is, and no sexes are excluded from discussing this topic, as it effects all humanity. It addresses what the act of sex causes, establishes the differences that the act has on men and women, and acknowledges how these results manifest in society. It promotes the idea that men and women are biologically different, and how that truth will manifest differently in the world by their abilities and choices. It is compassionate to the vulnerable, innocent possible-beings that are voiceless to speak out in the name of supporting their right to their own life/existence, and references medical definitions of life to provide evidence to support these claims.

What Say you?

“At this time, Abortion should be banned after 5 weeks, or what some states view as the "heart beat bill". As science increases on the human fetus (fetus means "offspring"), it increasingly tells us that earlier and earlier measures must be taken to protect it.”


Why?

Is every measure used to preserve it after the fetus is born? If not, why?

 

[otto105]

No...
Whites have been shrinking as a demographic and percentage of population for decades. The minorities growing both in numbers and percentages the whole time.

Now they have stopped.

This isn't racist in any fashion. This is solely a self imposed curse on our society. 2nd generation citizens are in need of fewer government services and generate more tax dollars than first generation citizens.

If the USA does not reverse their lack of babies being born they flat out will not exist anymore.

Which is why the apolitical jackass ^^^^^ posts his support for a jackass.

White fright.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

Mind your business and leave people alone.

Problem solved, debate over.

An assassin could say the same thing if you had a problem with them killing innocents

“Hey, mind your business and leave me alone”

 

[Mr. Friscus]

We have had a definition of a human being for centuries,
a man, woman, or child of the species Homo sapiens, distinguished from other animals by superior mental development, power of articulate speech, and upright stance.

What you are asking is for the government to redefine a human being to include a fetus. That is not going to happen. A fetus is a human being in the making. We have long recognized that birth is the event where the fetus becomes a human being, a person with rights and legal protection.

Let me get this straight, so I don't represent you incorrectly...

You think any being that isn't able to articulate speech and cannot stand upright isn't human?

Do I have that correct>?

 

[Mr. Friscus]

. And as the brown population has grown at the same time in the US, the white nationalists have been spewing this same disgusting crap for those decades.

I already covered this.

You'll have to go sell your racist boogeyman message elsewhere. Maybe you can get a primetime interview on MSNBC or CNN.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

“At this time, Abortion should be banned after 5 weeks, or what some states view as the "heart beat bill". As science increases on the human fetus (fetus means "offspring"), it increasingly tells us that earlier and earlier measures must be taken to protect it.”


Why?

Because we gauge whether a human is dead by whether they have a pulse or not. It would only be fitting that view it as alive once the pulse of a forming heart begins.

Is every measure used to preserve it after the fetus is born? If not, why?

I'm not sure what your question is.

If a baby is born, the most severe measures are taken to save it if its life is in danger.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

No

Yes, sorry.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

What worries you is that white births won't pace brown births.

You're projecting your racism. This has nothing to do with race.