‘Historic Palestine’ – A Misleading Anachronism

[watchingfromafar]

Do you see the above as acts of terrorism?

Stern Gang, also called Stern Group or Lehi, formally Loḥamei Ḥerut Yisraʾel (Hebrew: “Fighters for the Freedom of Israel”), Zionist extremist organization in Palestine, founded in 1940 by Avraham Stern (1907–42) after a split in the right-wing underground movement Irgun Zvai Leumi.

Extremely anti-British, the group repeatedly attacked British personnel in Palestine
The group’s terrorist activities extended beyond Palestine: two members assassinated Lord Moyne, British minister of state in the Middle East, at Cairo (November 1944). Later the Stern Gang attacked airfields, railway yards, and other strategic installations in Palestine, some of its units being incorporated in the Israeli defense forces.
Stern Gang | Zionist extremist organization | Britannica

Haganah (Hebrew: הַהֲגָנָה‎, lit. The Defence) was the main Zionist paramilitary organization of the Jewish population ("Yishuv") in Mandatory Palestine between 1920 and its disestablishment in 1948, when it became the core of the Israel Defense Forces (IDF).

It was under the control of the Jewish Agency, which caused the splitting of the more radical Irgun and Lehi. The group received clandestine military support from Poland. Haganah sought cooperation with the British in the event of an Axis invasion of Palestine through North Africa, prompting the creation of the Palmach task force in 1941.
Haganah - Wikipedia
-

 

[watchingfromafar]

Historic Israel – A Misleading Anachronism​

Israel was a person, not a place
-

 

[Sixties Fan]

There haven't been any Dhimmis for 200 years.. and their taxes was less than what Muslims paid,

Meanwhile, Arabic speaking Jews in Arab countries were quite prosperous.

Do you ever stop playing victim?

Do you ever stop changing history and dismissing what actually happened, or responding to how the British behaved not only with one Mandate towards the Jews, but with the other as well?

Jews were prosperous, until the Muslims brought laws or caused pogroms which stripped the Jews of everything.

The same thing in Christian countries.

Wherever you read that there have not been Jewish Dhimmis for 200 years?

And why in the world should Jews and Christians pay any taxes for being Jews or Christians?


Why excuse the ideology which kept Jews and Christians as inferior people, and at the mercy of any laws, attacks, expulsions perpetrated by any Muslim person, group or government?

 

[Sixties Fan]

The Jews of Iran, Iraq, Morocco, Libya, Syria and Yemen would still be there if not for European Zionists. As it turns out they left in 1948-56-67- 73. That's what the Zionists wanted.

In other words, the fact that the Grand Mufti bothered to go to Iraq and start a riot against Jews, means nothing to you. Not a hint.

It is not because of "European Jews" that the Jews from Arab countries had to leave.

It is because of Muslim ideology, intolerance and disrespect they were taught towards the Jewish people for the previous 1300 years before Herzl realized that there was no future for the Jews in Europe, and the only thing to do to protect Jews was to return to the Jewish homeland and reconstruct their nation.

It is a right any indigenous people have.

And the Muslims only had the Jews leave the Arab countries and Iran, is because they saw that move as a way to destroy Israel economically. Other Arabs , at the time and later on, have fully regretted that move for didn't the Jews bring much prosperity to each and everyone of those countries?
What happened to those countries after they expelled as many Jews as they could?

And no, Israel was not ready to receive the nearly Million Jews from Arab/Muslim countries, so NO, Israel/Zionists did not want the Jews to leave their homes in the Arab countries as the Muslims have been wanting someone like you to believe.

 

[Sixties Fan]

The Jews of Iran, Iraq, Morocco, Libya, Syria and Yemen would still be there if not for European Zionists. As it turns out they left in 1948-56-67- 73. That's what the Zionists wanted.

I can see why Jews from any Muslim country would want to move to Israel:

Although Lewis claims they were very rare overall, most forced conversions of dhimmis that did happen occurred in Persia.[22] In 1656, Shah Abbas I expelled the Jews from Isfahan and compelled them to adopt Islam, although the order was subsequently withdrawn, possibly because of the loss of fiscal revenues.[23] In the early eighteenth century, Shia' clergy attempted to force all dhimmis to embrace Islam, but without success. In 1830, all 2500 Jews of Shiraz were forcibly converted to Islam.[24] In 1839, Jews were massacred in Mashhad and survivors were forcibly converted.[25] The same fate awaited the Jews of Barforoush in 1866, even though they were allowed to revert to Judaism after an intervention from the British and French ambassadors.[24]

The Almohads and Muslim authorities in Yemen practiced forcible conversion of children. Ye'or and Parfitt believe that this practice was based on the belief that every child is born a Muslim.[26] Suspecting a lack of sincerity on the part of Jews who were forcibly converted to Islam, Almohad rulers took Jewish children from their parents and raised those children as Muslims.[27] In Yemen, a 1922 Zaydi statute known as the Orphans Decree obligated the state to take under its protection and convert any dhimmi child whose parents had died (later extended to include fatherless children).[28] Although possibly intended to alleviate the plight of orphaned children, the Jewish community was dismayed,[29] and Jewish leaders who helped hide orphans were imprisoned and sometimes tortured.[30] Despite this, the Jews in Yemen generally continued to feel that their position in society was secure.[29]

On November 3, 1839, an edict called the Hatt-i Sharif of Gulhane was put forth by the Sultan that, in part, proclaimed the principle of the equality of all subjects regardless of religion. Part of the motivation for this was the desire to gain support from the British Empire, whose help was desired in a conflict with Egypt.[109]
---------------
On February 18, 1856, another edict was issued called Hatt-i Humayan, which built upon the 1839 edict. It came about partly as a result of pressure from and the efforts of the ambassadors of England, France, and Austria, whose respective countries were needed as allies in the Crimean War. It again proclaimed the principle of the equality of Muslims and non-Muslims, and produced many specific reforms to this end. For example, the jizya tax was abolished and non-Muslims were allowed to join the army.[110][111]

Dhimmi - New World Encyclopedia

www.newworldencyclopedia.org

And still, many many Muslims cannot accept Jews as being sovereign of their destiny on their own ancestral homeland.

Dhimmitude, or whatever one may wish to call it, it is still Islam thinking of Jews as inferior to them, as dependent on them, until the Jews convert to Islam and accept Allah as their god.

Muslims are not allowed to live under Jewish sovereign ty. That is what some Muslims think. Others are only too happy to live in Israel.

Still, no "Historic" Palestine to be found in the history books of any invaders who conquered the area. Israel, Judea, Jews, Judaism, all of those are connected in the history of each and every one of the invaders, conquerors of Israel/Judea/Palestine

 

[Sixties Fan]

There haven't been any Dhimmis for 200 years.. and their taxes was less than what Muslims paid,

Meanwhile, Arabic speaking Jews in Arab countries were quite prosperous.

Do you ever stop playing victim?

Here are some of the prosperous Jews from Arab/Muslim countries:

Arab abuse of the Jews of north Africa, in the mid-1800s

Blogging about Israel and the Arab world since, oh, forever.

elderofziyon.blogspot.com

A eyewitness to Arab antisemitism in Palestine, 1847

Blogging about Israel and the Arab world since, oh, forever.

elderofziyon.blogspot.com

Persecution of Jews by Muslims in Shiraz, Persia in the 1850s

Blogging about Israel and the Arab world since, oh, forever.

elderofziyon.blogspot.com

How Persian Muslims mistreated Jews in the 19th century

Blogging about Israel and the Arab world since, oh, forever.

elderofziyon.blogspot.com

Arab abuse of the Jews of north Africa, in the mid-1800s

Blogging about Israel and the Arab world since, oh, forever.

elderofziyon.blogspot.com

 

[rylah]

The word Palestine derives from Philistia, the name given by Greek writers to the land of the Philistines,

It was not given by Greeks, but the name given to Greek invaders by the locals,
which literally means 'invaders', it has no meaning in any other language.
Neither Greek nor Arabic, only in Hebrew (and maybe Egyptian).

 

[rylah]

Its been the Syrian Province of Palestine since 500 BC.. and you forget that in 700 BC 4 Arab tribes settled in Samaria (the West Bank)

Ok, you're making my argument,
instead of talking about the supposed nation,
you're conflating the mere geographic name with Arab colonization.

All you have is the fallacy of appropriating a geographic name,
which despite all - the Arabs can't even pronounce.

 

[rylah]

That is a lie.
Most Palestinians have deeds.

Sure habibti if you say so...

Is that why you never show them
and end up invoking the Neanderthals instead?

 

[rylah]

The Zionists got off on the wrong foot in 1920.. They were all Socialists or Bolsheviks .. They mistreated and demonized the Palestinian Muslims and Christians even back then..

The Zionists formed their terror gangs in the 1920s and they ridiculed Arab culture. They were a disaster to the extent that the Palestinian Jews organized to stop the huge migrations from Europe by 1922.

Clearly by 1930 they desperately needed sanctuary, but they botched it with their treatment of the indigenous population..

You'd think with the persecution they had suffered in Europe and Russia they would have known better.

Actually you have no idea about history.

 

[rylah]

TERRORISM, THE BEGINNING
Who were the first “terrorist’s” coining the term-?
Terrorist
a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.
ter·ror·ism
the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

Definitions from Oxford Languages

FIRST ACTS OF TERRORISM, COINING THE PHRASE
November 6, 1944. Zionist terrorists of the Stern Gang assassinated the British Minister Resident in the Middle East, Lord Moyne, in Cairo.
July 22, 1946. Zionist terrorists blew up the King David Hotel in Jerusalem,.,.,killing or injuring more than 200 persons.
October 1, 1946. The British Embassy in Rome was badly damaged by bomb explosions, for which Irgun claimed responsibility.
September 3, 1947. A postal bomb addressed to the British War Office exploded in the post office sorting room in London, injuring 2 persons. It was attributed to Irgun or Stern Gangs. (The Sunday Times, Sept. 24, 1972, p.8)
December ll, 1947. Six Arabs were killed and 30 wounded when bombs were thrown from Jewish trucks at Arab buses in Haifa; 12 Arabs were killed and others injured in an attack by armed Zionists on an Arab coastal village near Haifa.
December 19, 1947. Haganah terrorists attacked an Arab village near Safad, blowing up two houses in the ruins of which were found the bodies of 10 Arabs, including 5 children. Haganah admitted responsibility for the attack.
December 13, 1947 -- February 10, 1948. Seven incidents of bomb-tossing at innocent Arab civilians in cafes and markets, killing 138 and wounding 271 others, During this period, there were 9 attacks on Arab buses. Zionists mined passenger trains on at least 4 occasions, killing 93 persons and wounding 161 others.
December 29, 1947. Two British constables and 11 Arabs were killed and 32 Arabs injured, at the Damascus Gate in Jerusalem when Irgun members threw a bomb from a taxi.
June 1947. Letters sent to British Cabinet Ministers were found to contain bombs.
December ll, 1947. Six Arabs were killed and 30 wounded when bombs were thrown from Jewish trucks at Arab buses in Haifa ; 12 Arabs were killed and others injured in an attack by armed Zionists on an Arab coastal village near Haifa.
December 29, 1947. Two British constables and 11 Arabs were killed and 32 Arabs injured, at the Damascus Gate in Jerusalem when Irgun members threw a bomb from a taxi.
January 4, 1948. Haganah terrorists wearing British Army uniforms penetrated into the center of Jaffa and blew up the Serai (the old Turkish Government House) killing more than 40 persons and wounding 98 others.
January 5, 1948. The Arab-owned Semiramis Hotel in Jerusalem was blown up, killing 20 persons.
January 16, 1948. Zionists blew up three Arab buildings. In the first, 8 children between the ages of 18 months and 12 years, died.
February 15, 1948. Haganah terrorists attacked an Arab village near Safad, blew up several houses, killing 11 Arabs, including 4 children.
March 3, 1948. Heavy damage was done to the Arab-owned Salam building in Haifa by Zionists who drove an army lorry ( truck) up to the building and escaped before the detonation of 400 Ib. of explosives; casualties numbered 11 Arabs and 3 Armenians killed and 23 injured.
March 22, 1948. A housing block in Iraq Street in Haifa was blown up killing 17 and injuring 100 others. Four members of the Stern Gang drove two truck-loads of explosives into the street and abandoned the vehicles before the explosion.
March 31, 1948. The Cairo-Haifa Express was mined, for the second time in a month, by an electronically-detonated land mine near Benyamina, killing 40 persons and wounding 60 others.
April 9, 1948. A combined force of Irgun Zvai Leumi and the Stern Gang, captured the Arab village of Deir Yassin and killed more than 200 unarmed civilians, including countless women and children. Older men and young women were paraded in chains in the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem; 20 of the hostages were then in the quarry of Gevaat Shaul.
April 19, 1948. Fourteen Arabs were killed in a house in Tiberias, which was blown up by Zionist terrorists.
May 3, 1948. A book bomb addressed to a British Army officer, who had been stationed in Palestine exploded, killing his brother, Rex Farran.
May11, 1948. A letter bomb addressed to Sir Evelyn Barker, former Commanding Officer in Palestine, was detected in the nick of time by his wife.

Above is not the end of this tragic story, it just marks the beginning.
Google stern gang
Do you see the above as acts of terrorism?
-

So you have nothing to say on topic,
and instead feel the rush to lie about something else?

How about you have another chance, and show us you have any integrity to correct yourself.

 

[rylah]

Historic Israel – A Misleading Anachronism​

Israel was a person, not a place
-

And according to the same source the Land of Israel.

Is this why the Arabs
still call it the 'desert of the Jews'?

Sahara Yahudin - The Jewish Desert

صحراء يهودا

The Judaean Desert or Judean Desert (Hebrew: Midbar Yehuda, both Desert of Judah or Judaean Desert; Arabic:‎ Sahara Yahudin صحراء يهودا ) is a desert in Israel and the West Bank that lies east of Jerusalem and descends to the Dead Sea. It stretches from the northeastern Negev to the east of Beit El, and is marked by natural terraces with escarpments. It ends in a steep escarpment dropping to the Dead Sea and the Jordan Valley. The Judaean Desert is crossed by numerous wadis from northeast to southeast and has many ravines, most of them deep, from 1,200 feet in the west to 600 feet in the east. The Judaean Desert is an area with a special morphological structure along the east of the Judaean Mountains.

Judaean Desert - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[elektra]

Wrong.
It was the Treaty of San Remo and the Treaty of Sevres that divided Trans Jordan into Jordan and Palestine.
The League of Nations has no authority to divide anything.
The Jordanians did not want to allow Jewish immigration at all, so they were the ones who insisted on the division.
The division was to allow Jews to immigrate at all, as the British had promised with the Balfour Declaration.

No one even dreamed of Israel existing until Truman came up with the idea in 1945, and created the UN so he could pull it off.

You knowledge is shallow, The Treaty of San Remo? There is no such thing. San Remo was a place a conference was held that resulted in a Resolution. San Remo was a continuations of the negotiations to divide the Ottoman empire at the conference of London, both conferences negotiated, and implementing the League of Nations mandates concerning said territory.

"No one even dreamed of Israel existing until Truman..."

Unless of course you ignore what was written in the bible and the acts of all the Christian churches of the world, during the 19th century.

 

[surada]

Do you see the above as acts of terrorism?

Stern Gang, also called Stern Group or Lehi, formally Loḥamei Ḥerut Yisraʾel (Hebrew: “Fighters for the Freedom of Israel”), Zionist extremist organization in Palestine, founded in 1940 by Avraham Stern (1907–42) after a split in the right-wing underground movement Irgun Zvai Leumi.

Extremely anti-British, the group repeatedly attacked British personnel in Palestine
The group’s terrorist activities extended beyond Palestine: two members assassinated Lord Moyne, British minister of state in the Middle East, at Cairo (November 1944). Later the Stern Gang attacked airfields, railway yards, and other strategic installations in Palestine, some of its units being incorporated in the Israeli defense forces.
Stern Gang | Zionist extremist organization | Britannica

Haganah (Hebrew: הַהֲגָנָה‎, lit. The Defence) was the main Zionist paramilitary organization of the Jewish population ("Yishuv") in Mandatory Palestine between 1920 and its disestablishment in 1948, when it became the core of the Israel Defense Forces (IDF).

It was under the control of the Jewish Agency, which caused the splitting of the more radical Irgun and Lehi. The group received clandestine military support from Poland. Haganah sought cooperation with the British in the event of an Axis invasion of Palestine through North Africa, prompting the creation of the Palmach task force in 1941.
Haganah - Wikipedia
-

Avram Stern wrote to Hitler several times promising friendship and support after he won the war.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Avram Stern wrote to Hitler several times promising friendship and support after he won the war.

(Jews fighting for their lives and to free their land of the British who wanted to take the last 22% for themselves, that is always a problem for Jew haters)

( Now, what does that has to do with the word Palestine and what this thread is about? )

"In January 1941, Stern attempted to make an agreement with the German Nazi authorities, offering to "actively take part in the war on Germany's side" in return for German support for Jewish immigration to Palestine and the establishment of a Jewish state. Another attempt to contact the Germans was made in late 1941, but there is no record of a German response in either case.[12] These appeals to Germany were in direct opposition to the views of other Zionists, such as Ze'ev Jabotinsky, who wanted Britain to defeat the Nazis even as they wanted to expel the British from Palestine.[13]"

Avraham Stern - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

--------------------
Meanwhile, Lehi launched attacks against British police and soldiers. The British responded violently, killing several Lehi members, and wounding and arresting many others. Stern maintained that, even in the face of the Nazi threat, it was the British who posed the greatest danger to the Jews. Doubting the Allies could win the war, he advocated an alliance with Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy, believing these ties would assist the nationalist effort in Eretz-Israel.

Avraham Stern

Encyclopedia of Jewish and Israeli history, politics and culture, with biographies, statistics, articles and documents on topics from anti-Semitism to Zionism.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org

 

[surada]

(Jews fighting for their lives and to free their land of the British who wanted to take the last 22% for themselves, that is always a problem for Jew haters)

( Now, what does that has to do with the word Palestine and what this thread is about? )

"In January 1941, Stern attempted to make an agreement with the German Nazi authorities, offering to "actively take part in the war on Germany's side" in return for German support for Jewish immigration to Palestine and the establishment of a Jewish state. Another attempt to contact the Germans was made in late 1941, but there is no record of a German response in either case.[12] These appeals to Germany were in direct opposition to the views of other Zionists, such as Ze'ev Jabotinsky, who wanted Britain to defeat the Nazis even as they wanted to expel the British from Palestine.[13]"

Avraham Stern - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

--------------------
Meanwhile, Lehi launched attacks against British police and soldiers. The British responded violently, killing several Lehi members, and wounding and arresting many others. Stern maintained that, even in the face of the Nazi threat, it was the British who posed the greatest danger to the Jews. Doubting the Allies could win the war, he advocated an alliance with Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy, believing these ties would assist the nationalist effort in Eretz-Israel.

Avraham Stern

Encyclopedia of Jewish and Israeli history, politics and culture, with biographies, statistics, articles and documents on topics from anti-Semitism to Zionism.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org

All the Arabs had signed on with the Allies in 1939 and there was NO WW2 fighting in Palestine.

The Transfer Agreement - Wikipedia

The Transfer Agreement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Transfer Agreement: The Dramatic Story of the Pact Between the Third Reich and Jewish Palestine is a book written by author Edwin Black, documenting the transfer agreement ("Haavara Agreement" in Hebrew) between Zionist organizations and Nazi Germany to transfer a number of Jews and their assets to Palestine. Shortly after Samuel Untermyer's return to the U.S. from Germany in 1933, article…

This book documents the agreement between Nazi Germany and an organization of German Zionists in 1933 to salvage some German Jewish assets and the voluntary emigration of German Jews to Palestine before the Third Reich implemented expulsion and then extermination. The Transfer Agreement rescued some 60,000 German Jews. A sweeping, worldwide economic boycott of Germany by J…

 

[Sixties Fan]

All the Arabs had signed on with the Allies in 1939 and there was NO WW2 fighting in Palestine.

The Transfer Agreement - Wikipedia

The Transfer Agreement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Transfer Agreement: The Dramatic Story of the Pact Between the Third Reich and Jewish Palestine is a book written by author Edwin Black, documenting the transfer agreement ("Haavara Agreement" in Hebrew) between Zionist organizations and Nazi Germany to transfer a number of Jews and their assets to Palestine. Shortly after Samuel Untermyer's return to the U.S. from Germany in 1933, article…

This book documents the agreement between Nazi Germany and an organization of German Zionists in 1933 to salvage some German Jewish assets and the voluntary emigration of German Jews to Palestine before the Third Reich implemented expulsion and then extermination. The Transfer Agreement rescued some 60,000 German Jews. A sweeping, worldwide economic boycott of Germany by J…

And the part you do not give a darn about is about saving Jewish lives, even if it means making a pact with the devil.

This " 60,000 German Jews" who were saved from going to concentration camps, you do not give a damn about.

But if they were Arabs, or Palestinians.......I can hear all the songs you would have been singing.

I will not wait for you to acknowledge the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem's deal with the devil which lead to the Mufti commanding a troop of Bosnia Muslim to massacre all the Bosnia Jews.

Much less how the Nazi ideology has found a deep friend in the Palestinians and other Arabs, in the way they started to decide that not only Israel had no right to exist, but no Jew had a right to exist.

Don't forget the Grand Mufti's role, main role, in the riots which took place in Iraq in June of 1941 and how many Jews were killed, or injured and how the Jewish properties were destroyed.

Jewish attempts to save Jewish lives are beyond different from Arab lives trying to murder Jews using the Nazis.

 

[RoccoR]

​

RE: ‘Historic Palestine’ – A Misleading Anachronism
SUBTOPIC: Stern Gang Strategy
⁜→ surada, et al,

Avram Stern wrote to Hitler several times promising friendship and support after he won the war.

(COMMENT)

So, from the tone, I take it that you are suggesting that Avram STERN was a closet "quisling" of sorts. Am I correct? If so, you are probably close to being accurate.

STERN was extremely anti-British and would have welcomed any alliance with any entity in the pursuit against the British.

But first, I think it is important to clarify a couple of points.

The STERN Gang was a splinter group out of the National Military Organization in Palestine (AKA: LEHI). The STERN attracted Jewish members of LEHI (Commanded by Zeev Jabotinsky) and began building a very Right-Wing openly opposing Jabotinsky's leadership. STERN became a political-military (POL-MIL) liability to the overall direction set by Chaim Weizmann. There is no question that your assertion → that the Stern Gang was an extremist group (Terrorist) is absolutely correct.

Having said that, the Stern Gang did not represent the POL-MIL position and direction of the Jewish Paramilitary Units (typified by the HAGANAH). The counter-productive activities (some of which you mentioned, but not limited to those) of the STERN Gang were so damaging that it is a legacy that still haunts them today.

Assistant Superintendent Geoffrey Morton Palestine Police, killed Avram STERN in February 1942. STERN was killed while attempting to escape.

In the insurgency by the various Jewish entities, the Jewish leadership was not perfect and did not walk away with totally clean hands. They will tell you this if they could speak today. But in the fog of the insurgency decisions that seemed sound and valid at the time, in retrospect, were anything but favorable to the cause.

And while the activities of Avram STERN and his followers represent a dark stain in the history leading up to Independence in 1948, very few countries that have been involved in asymmetric warfare are without their share of blemishes.

When we look back in history, we have to remember that it was made by men. And men are not perfect.

Just My Shekel's worth of input.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[surada]

​

RE: ‘Historic Palestine’ – A Misleading Anachronism
SUBTOPIC: Stern Gang Strategy
⁜→ surada, et al,

(COMMENT)

So, from the tone, I take it that you are suggesting that Avram STERN was a closet "quisling" of sorts. Am I correct? If so, you are probably close to being accurate.

STERN was extremely anti-British and would have welcomed any alliance with any entity in the pursuit against the British.

But first, I think it is important to clarify a couple of points.

The STERN Gang was a splinter group out of the National Military Organization in Palestine (AKA: LEHI). The STERN attracted Jewish members of LEHI (Commanded by Zeev Jabotinsky) and began building a very Right-Wing openly opposing Jabotinsky's leadership. STERN became a political-military (POL-MIL) liability to the overall direction set by Chaim Weizmann. There is no question that your assertion → that the Stern Gang was an extremist group (Terrorist) is absolutely correct.

Having said that, the Stern Gang did not represent the POL-MIL position and direction of the Jewish Paramilitary Units (typified by the HAGANAH). The counter-productive activities (some of which you mentioned, but not limited to those) of the STERN Gang were so damaging that it is a legacy that still haunts them today.

Assistant Superintendent Geoffrey Morton Palestine Police, killed Avram STERN in February 1942. STERN was killed while attempting to escape.

In the insurgency by the various Jewish entities, the Jewish leadership was not perfect and did not walk away with totally clean hands. They will tell you this if they could speak today. But in the fog of the insurgency decisions that seemed sound and valid at the time, in retrospect, were anything but favorable to the cause.

And while the activities of Avram STERN and his followers represent a dark stain in the history leading up to Independence in 1948, very few countries that have been involved in asymmetric warfare are without their share of blemishes.

When we look back in history, we have to remember that it was made by men. And men are not perfect.

Just My Shekel's worth of input.

Most Respectfully,
R

I happen to agree with you.. I didn't know he'd been killed in 1942.

 

[surada]

And the part you do not give a darn about is about saving Jewish lives, even if it means making a pact with the devil.

This " 60,000 German Jews" who were saved from going to concentration camps, you do not give a damn about.

But if they were Arabs, or Palestinians.......I can hear all the songs you would have been singing.

I will not wait for you to acknowledge the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem's deal with the devil which lead to the Mufti commanding a troop of Bosnia Muslim to massacre all the Bosnia Jews.

Much less how the Nazi ideology has found a deep friend in the Palestinians and other Arabs, in the way they started to decide that not only Israel had no right to exist, but no Jew had a right to exist.

Don't forget the Grand Mufti's role, main role, in the riots which took place in Iraq in June of 1941 and how many Jews were killed, or injured and how the Jewish properties were destroyed.

Jewish attempts to save Jewish lives are beyond different from Arab lives trying to murder Jews using the Nazis.

Its become very fashionable to blame the Mufti for what Hitler did... Bibi Netanyahu has basically white washed Hitler to blame the Mufti.. which is utterly ridiculous. The population of Palestine had already doubled with European Jews.

The Transfer Agreement was in place before 1933.

Don't you remember that Samuel Untermyer declared war on all things German in the spring of 1933 from the safety of Madison Square Garden?

The Transfer Agreement - Wikipedia

The Transfer Agreement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Transfer Agreement: The Dramatic Story of the Pact Between the Third Reich and Jewish Palestine is a book written by author Edwin Black, documenting the transfer agreement ("Haavara Agreement" in Hebrew) between Zionist organizations and Nazi Germany to transfer a number of Jews and their assets to Palestine. Shortly after Samuel Untermyer's return to the U.S. from Germany in 1933, articles appeared on the front page of newspapers in London and New York declaring that "Judea declares war on Germany"…