Hiroshima....

[westwall]

They were going to surrender even before we dropped the bombs, we were just showing off for the Russians. But these two acts of terrorism sealed the deal.

Ridiculous.

It's history.

It's America-hating fantasy. They were ready to inflict tens of thousands of GI deaths on us to defend mainland Japan...they told their people to attack us with knives and forks if necessary.

Yes. They were holding training classes for civilians in how to sharpen bamboo shoots to use as weapons, as well.

So? Civilians in a country potentially being invaded shouldn't fight back? Interesting.

Typical brainless progressive. Only in your feeble minds is it not proper to conquer a nation that attacked you first. Just go away. You're a halfwit.

 

[Picaro]

Nobody wastes time reading your 'evidence' any more, scat boi.

 

[Unkotare]

It's America-hating fantasy. They were ready to inflict tens of thousands of GI deaths on us to defend mainland Japan...they told their people to attack us with knives and forks if necessary.

Yes. They were holding training classes for civilians in how to sharpen bamboo shoots to use as weapons, as well.

Over 70 years ago, and you're still swallowing propaganda that was never intended for you? Talk about a sap of historic proportions.

...we know the facts about it. ....

You wouldn't know a fact if it picked you up and dumped you on your head. FACTS are what I have provided.

.....you never provide squat...

I'm the only one on this thread who has provided FACTS. You haven't read the links.

 

[SAYIT]

Was Hiroshima Necessary?

Wow! IHR? The Institute of Historical Review? It's a Nazi website where hate for the US - and of course Joooos - is rampant.

I can't believe you would post their drivel.

 

[Unkotare]

Nobody wastes time reading your 'evidence' any more.....

You're afraid to look at facts. You're afraid to read the links.

 

[Unkotare]

Ridiculous.

It's history.

It's America-hating fantasy. They were ready to inflict tens of thousands of GI deaths on us to defend mainland Japan...they told their people to attack us with knives and forks if necessary.

Yes. They were holding training classes for civilians in how to sharpen bamboo shoots to use as weapons, as well.

So? Civilians in a country potentially being invaded shouldn't fight back? Interesting.

Only in your feeble minds is it not proper to conquer a nation that attacked you first. ...

Where did he say that? I missed that post.

 

[Unkotare]

MILITARY VIEWS About Dropping the Atomic Bomb

.

.

 

[whitehall]

The arguably most important question in history is... "was it necessary"? I believe the dying FDR administration compounded the atrocity by sending Marines to invade a non strategic little piece of shit island in order to make a case for using the Bomb. Iwo Jima could have been bypassed but the FDR administration sacrificed seven thousand Marines in a freaking month to take an island which was virtually out of touch from the Japanese mainland and had been fortified for forty years. After the Marines were sacrificed, the administration had the political evidence it needed to try out the creation that all those eggheads were dying to see, their little creation finally used on sub-humans while they were negotiating for surrender terms.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

The arguably most important question in history is... "was it necessary"? I believe the dying FDR administration compounded the atrocity by sending Marines to invade a non strategic little piece of shit island in order to make a case for using the Bomb. Iwo Jima could have been bypassed but the FDR administration sacrificed seven thousand Marines in a freaking month to take an island which was virtually out of touch from the Japanese mainland and had been fortified for forty years. After the Marines were sacrificed, the administration had the political evidence it needed to try out the creation that all those eggheads were dying to see, their little creation finally used on sub-humans while they were negotiating for surrender terms.

Iwo Jima was critical to the bombing Campaign. Even before the island was conquered damaged bombers were landing there.

 

[westwall]

Yes. They were holding training classes for civilians in how to sharpen bamboo shoots to use as weapons, as well.

Over 70 years ago, and you're still swallowing propaganda that was never intended for you? Talk about a sap of historic proportions.

...we know the facts about it. ....

You wouldn't know a fact if it picked you up and dumped you on your head. FACTS are what I have provided.

.....you never provide squat...

I'm the only one on this thread who has provided FACTS. You haven't read the links.

No. What you have provided is a huge heaping of OPINION. Learn the difference. Gar Alperovitz is a well known socialist who has been trying to rewrite history for decades. The facts are well known. The Saipan experience refutes every point that he, and your other sources make. The Japanese leadership wished for their own version of Gottadamerung, and they were bound and determined to see it through.

THESE are the real facts. Facts that your socialist ignores...

"On Aug. 15, 1945, nearly 1,000 soldiers occupied the Imperial Palace grounds for six hours from 2 a.m., aiming to seize two 25-cm records of the reading of the surrender decree and blocking its noon broadcast that day.

The actions of Lt. Gen. Takeshi Mori, commander of the First Imperial Guards Division, and Gen. Shizuichi Tanaka, commander of the Eastern Defense Command, enabled the monarch, known posthumously as Emperor Showa, to announce over the radio to the Japanese people and armed forces the nation’s unconditional surrender.

The broadcast paved the way for the Allied Powers to occupy Japan without serious turmoil.

Emperor Hirohito made the recording at around 11:30 p.m. on Aug. 14, and Chamberlain Yoshihiro Tokugawa put the two records in a small safe in the first-floor office of the monarch’s retinue, hidden from sight with piles of papers.

At around 1:40 a.m. on Aug. 15, Mori, 52, was shot by Maj. Kenji Hatanaka and then hacked to death by Capt. Shigetaro Uehara at his headquarters after rejecting their demand to order his 4,000-man division to revolt against the government and seize the palace.

“Mori rejected the officers’ demands to order his Guards Division to rise up in revolt, because he had recognized the importance of establishing peace with the Allied Powers to prevent the Japanese people from being destroyed by a continued war,” historian Kazutoshi Hando said in a recent interview.

“Had the broadcast of the surrender rescript been blocked, the Japanese military would have kept up its fighting spirit, and the armed forces would have carried on on many battlefields,” he said.

On Aug. 14, the government of then Prime Minister Kantaro Suzuki decided to accept the Allied demand for unconditional surrender. The decision was made at a meeting of the six-member Supreme Council for the Direction of the War, including Suzuki and War Minister Korechika Anami, in the presence of Emperor Hirohito."

Generals foiled Aug. 15 palace coup | The Japan Times

 

[Unkotare]

...






What you have provided is a huge heaping of OPINION. .....

Direct quotes from military leaders at the time are "opinion"? Maybe their opinions, but not my words.


MILITARY VIEWS About Dropping the Atomic Bomb

 

[whitehall]

The arguably most important question in history is... "was it necessary"? I believe the dying FDR administration compounded the atrocity by sending Marines to invade a non strategic little piece of shit island in order to make a case for using the Bomb. Iwo Jima could have been bypassed but the FDR administration sacrificed seven thousand Marines in a freaking month to take an island which was virtually out of touch from the Japanese mainland and had been fortified for forty years. After the Marines were sacrificed, the administration had the political evidence it needed to try out the creation that all those eggheads were dying to see, their little creation finally used on sub-humans while they were negotiating for surrender terms.

Iwo Jima was critical to the bombing Campaign. Even before the island was conquered damaged bombers were landing there.

No offense Gunny but you need too look at history rather than relying on political cliches. The stated mission for the invasion of a stinking island fortified by almost a half century of slave labor that created a network of tunnels and bunkers that had every inch of the island plotted with mortar and machine gun fire was to suppress Japanese fighter planes from harassing Allied bombers. The mission was so freaking lame that it defied explanation. Allied bombers could have pounded the Iwo landing strip and the Japanese fighter planes into the stone age and bypassed the island to starve to death. It is said thar FDR gasped when he learned of the Marine casualties. The Marines were supposed to retreat and show the politicians that the mainlanded had to be nuked but the Marines took the stinking unnecessary island at an incredible cost and God bless them.

 

[80zephyr]

Terrorism can work. It sure did there.

Not really....they didn't quit until we nuked Nagasaki and probably still wouldn't have quit if they'd known we only had two A-bombs.

They were going to surrender even before we dropped the bombs, we were just showing off for the Russians. But these two acts of terrorism sealed the deal.

My dad was in the navy in the Pacific, and he was gearing up to invade Japan. Are you implying that if we didn't drop those bombs that we would never had invaded?

Mark

 

[regent]

Iwo and Okinawa were indicative of what was coming with the invasion of the Japanese mainland.

 

[westwall]

...






What you have provided is a huge heaping of OPINION. .....

Direct quotes from military leaders at the time are "opinion"? Maybe their opinions, but not my words.


MILITARY VIEWS About Dropping the Atomic Bomb

Yes, those were THEIR opinions. Their concerns were with the nature of war itself. They realized that nuclear weapons would forever alter how wars were fought. Only it turns out they were wrong about that too...Weren't they.. The lowest estimate for the continuance of the war from them was two weeks. So, 4 more firebombings and voila, you have more Japanese burned to death than were killed by the bombs. It is ALL opinion. They have no facts to back up their assertions. We do have facts to back up ours.

The quote from LeMay is particularly amusing given his bloodthirsty nature. He and Bomber Harris were two of a kind and casualties among the civilian population never concerned either man in the slightest.

 

[MaryL]

And what was the military view on the necessity of attacking Pearl Harbor, to begin with? Was THAT necessary? Does Japan hash that decision over and over again? Or do they just lament getting their asses kicked? I am not seeing too many "authorities" decrying Japan initiated allied involvement period. Oh no,instead, Japan were poor little victims. Really? How does that work?

 

[regent]

WWII was the biggest event in those generals and admiral's military lives. The war was what they had trained for and there was nothing bigger on the horizon, but most would not be doing the invading. The invasion and loss of life would be mostly enlisted pukes, draftees and second lieutenants. Most of us recognize the names of those generals and admirals because they have gone into the history books and had memorials created for them.

 

[Unkotare]

http://archives.chicagotribune.com/...ids-plague-u-s-west-with-what-might-have-been

 

[Unkotare]

And what was the military view on the necessity of attacking Pearl Harbor, to begin with? Was THAT necessary? Does Japan hash that decision over and over again? Or do they just lament getting their asses kicked? I am not seeing too many "authorities" decrying Japan initiated allied involvement period. Oh no,instead, Japan were poor little victims. Really? How does that work?

You're saying the annihilation of hundreds of thousands of civilians was an act of revenge? Can you document that?

 

[MaryL]

And what was the military view on the necessity of attacking Pearl Harbor, to begin with? Was THAT necessary? Does Japan hash that decision over and over again? Or do they just lament getting their asses kicked? I am not seeing too many "authorities" decrying Japan initiated allied involvement period. Oh no,instead, Japan were poor little victims. Really? How does that work?

You're saying the annihilation of hundreds of thousands of civilians was an act of revenge? Can you document that?

You don't understand the full scope of WW2, do you? The needless attack on Pearl harbor by the Japanese that started American involvement, the bombing of Coventry , the use of V1 or V2 weapons, Japan's research into genetic weapons by the notorious "unit 751". It's sad those civilians died in Hiroshima, compare that to the horror the imperial Japanese perpetrated, and where bent on murdering millions of innocent people. Until Hiroshima. That ended their military march of dominance. Too bad they need 2 A bombs to persuade them.