Here’s a sob story about a college%educated professional who can’t support his four kids without the enchanted government child support

[Papageorgio]

Speaking of tired sentiments...

If you want to be part of this nation you have to contribute. It stopped being your money after Sam collected it.

Most of us contribute thousands a year in taxes. I volunteer as well. Maybe the couple making $150,000 a year could reprioritize their lives as many Americans have had to do when raising a family.

 

[JoeB131]

50 years gone by and no Democrat has spent a penny on education and drug rehabilitation.
But you're too much of an ideologue to admit such.

We haven't spent enough on either, really.

 

[Indeependent]

Um, actually, no.. I haven't been doing what I am doing for 2 decades. Most of my customers are in fact white people (but I welcome anyone) and most of them are happy with my results.



Funny, most of the Indian-Americans I know live very nice lives, have good jobs (only some of them in IT) and work very hard.


Who said I wasn't? I wouldn't be doing it if I also didn't think I was doing a lot of good.

Guess what...when you're helping an Indian H1-B, you're not doing them a favor.
The sad part is that I worked with 2 female Business Visas at two different jobs who were accountants and were really intelligent but were laid off when they got their Green Cards; that is not right.

The funny thing is that the non-Indian Business Visas I have worked with, almost always in Brokerage Firms, who won't hire the inept Indian H1-Bs, were really good at what they did.

 

[Winston]

Your earlier post was, and I'm paraphrasing, "show me anyone on social security who makes less than 40K that pays one dime in taxes". Combine that with, and I'm paraphrasing again, "I'm a financial wizard and investment counselor and I know more than anyone here about finances including Social Security." Turns out people making well below 40K on Social Security pay taxes. I had no reason, when you posted about being an investment advisor, to doubt your word or even about Social Security and taxes.

Now, of course, we know that you didn't actually know at all what you were talking about in regards to Social Security and taxes - things we'd expect and hope our investment counselors would know. That puts into doubt everything you said about managing millions in investments for hundreds of investors, or even being an investment counselor at all. Now, based on your proven lack of knowledge, I doubt anything you have told us is true.

Again, show me where I was wrong. For a married couple the income limit is $32,000 to $44,000. And again, Social Security income does not count until other income reaches that limit. For a single individiual, it is $25,000, and again, that total DOES NOT include Social Security.

 

[JoeB131]

Guess what...when you're helping an Indian H1-B, you're not doing them a favor.
The sad part is that I worked with 2 female Business Visas at two different jobs who were accountants and were really intelligent but were laid off when they got their Green Cards; that is not right.

I agree, it's an abuse of the system. That's a good reason to change the system, but since just about everything in our immigration systems is currently broken, that's not saying much.

The people I have actually helped would disagree with you. Some of them have been repeat customers, and have referred friends.

 

[Indeependent]

I agree, it's an abuse of the system. That's a good reason to change the system, but since just about everything in our immigration systems is currently broken, that's not saying much.

The people I have actually helped would disagree with you. Some of them have been repeat customers, and have referred friends.

Perhaps in Chicago.

 

[Winston]

Winston has called me a piece of shit and told me to STFU up numerous times because I had the audacity to point out how wrong it is that an elderly person on SS, with a total income of $40k, has to keep paying taxes while a professional currently earning $150k and with multiple children he claims can’t support gets off Scott-free.

Let‘s break down how wrong and hypercritical this entitled (and rude) self-righteous leftist is:

1. Bear in mind that Winston, a professional, admitted that he had six kids and took government assistance - including food stamps - so his wife wouldn’t have to work, and he wouldn't have to cut back his standard of living. Shameful.

2. Winston is insisting that an elderly woman on a modest income of $40k, including social security, doesn’t pay a penny in taxes - and he is wrong. (Oye….he says he‘s a financial planner.) A woman getting $20,000 in SS and taking out $20,000 from her IRA will have $2500 of the SS taxable, plus her full withdrawal. That means she has taxable income of $22,500, and she will owe on that even after her standard deduction.

3. Now for the liberals clamoring how hard it is to get by on $150,000 for a family, and thus they shouldn’t pay tax, let’s consider how difficult it is to get by in $40k as a single. So let’s say Granny has to withdraw $30,000 to bring her up to $50k, which is more realistic if she’s in the city. Now $9600 of her SS is taxable, plus the $30k, meaning she now has almost $40k of taxable income. She will be paying thousands in taxes.

(continued next post…l)

First question, why does Grandma not get the standard deduction? If her combined income is $22,500 and the standard deduction for a single person over 65 is $14,250, so she will be taxed on $8,250--$825 total. She has never paid taxes on her IRA money and now, when she draws it out, she is not paying Social Security taxes on that money. That family you claim is not paying taxes is paying thousands of dollars in Social Security taxes, funding Grandma's Social Security check.

 

[Lisa558]

First question, why does Grandma not get the standard deduction? If her combined income is $22,500 and the standard deduction for a single person over 65 is $14,250, so she will be taxed on $8,250--$825 total. She has never paid taxes on her IRA money and now, when she draws it out, she is not paying Social Security taxes on that money. That family you claim is not paying taxes is paying thousands of dollars in Social Security taxes, funding Grandma's Social Security check.

She has such a low income, and she STILL has to pay tax. So on one hand, you’re saying….so, she’s only paying a small amount of tax since her income is so small; and then on the other hand, you’re defending a high-earner for getting excused from all of most of HIS taxes.

And so what if she never paid taxes on the money in her IRA? You don’t have a problem that our $100,000+ software engineer isn‘t paying tax on his six-figure income!

AND…..she has paid taxes for 40 years! She has earned the right, as a retiree, to pay a minimal tax. Why ignore all her contributions since 1980? That is the scary attitude of Democrat socialists like yourself - people may have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal income tax over s long career, but the only thing you consider is that she’s not paying much now.

And lest we forget, you are a professional who took FOOD STAMPS and took money from other people to support your six kids at the lifestyle you felt entitled to, and so your wife wouldn’t have to pitch in - and OTHER people should support your family. Shameful.

Summary: The professional-level poster who took government assistance defends the idea of a $100k software engineer not paying taxes on his earned income, and then insists Granny needs to pay taxes on her IRA, since that’s earned money she didn’t pay tax on.

 

[Indeependent]

She has such a low income, and she STILL has to pay tax. So on one hand, you’re saying….so, she’s only paying a small amount of tax since her income is so small; and then on the other hand, you’re defending a high-earner for getting excused from all of most of HIS taxes.

And so what if she never paid taxes on the money in her IRA? You don’t have a problem that our $100,000+ software engineer isn‘t paying tax on his six-figure income!

AND…..she has paid taxes for 40 years! She has earned the right, as a retiree, to pay a minimal tax. Why ignore all her contributions since 1980? That is the scary attitude of Democrat socialists like yourself - people may have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal income tax over s long career, but the only thing you consider is that she’s not paying much now.

And lest we forget, you are a professional who took FOOD STAMPS and took money from other people to support your six kids at the lifestyle you felt entitled to, and so your wife wouldn’t have to pitch in - and OTHER people should support your family. Shameful.

Summary: The professional-level poster who took government assistance defends the idea of a $100k software engineer not paying taxes on his earned income, and then insists Granny needs to pay taxes on her IRA, since that’s earned money she didn’t pay tax on.

Winston's brain is exploding...
Isn't it fun having a pointless discussion with a brain dead LibBot?

 

[Lisa558]

Winston's brain is exploding...
Isn't it fun having a pointless discussion with a brain dead LibBot?

As a retiree, it keeps my mind active!

 

[Winston]

She has such a low income, and she STILL has to pay tax. So on one hand, you’re saying….so, she’s only paying a small amount of tax since her income is so small; and then on the other hand, you’re defending a high-earner for getting excused from all of most of HIS taxes.

And so what if she never paid taxes on the money in her IRA? You don’t have a problem that our $100,000+ software engineer isn‘t paying tax on his six-figure income!

AND…..she has paid taxes for 40 years! She has earned the right, as a retiree, to pay a minimal tax. Why ignore all her contributions since 1980? That is the scary attitude of Democrat socialists like yourself - people may have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal income tax over s long career, but the only thing you consider is that she’s not paying much now.

And lest we forget, you are a professional who took FOOD STAMPS and took money from other people to support your six kids at the lifestyle you felt entitled to, and so your wife wouldn’t have to pitch in - and OTHER people should support your family. Shameful.

Summary: The professional-level poster who took government assistance defends the idea of a $100k software engineer not paying taxes on his earned income, and then insists Granny needs to pay taxes on her IRA, since that’s earned money she didn’t pay tax on.

Get over yourself. First, this six figure income family is paying taxes, lots of them. Why do you Republicans utterly ignore the Social Security tax? And yet Grandma, over three hundred grand, paid no income taxes in the past, is getting hit just a little bit today, and never, ever, will pay Social Security tax on that money.

Do you have a mortgage? Do you use the mortgage interest deduction? Well my house has been paid for for a long time. Why do you feel entitled to me subsidizing your home purchase. I am completely confident you take every tax deduction and tax break that is available to you, why do you condemn this family for doing the same thing.

It is called tax expenditures, you might want to look up the definition. But it is basically the loss in federal revenue from a given taxz break. The largest, by far, the tax exclusion for employer provided health insurance. The six figure income family you are so complaining about, well the man's employer only provides health insurance to him. I would never work for such a firm, but OK, let's run with that. He has to buy health insurance for his family with AFTER TAX dollars. Meanwhile, most of us, like myself, pay for health insurance for our families with pre-tax dollars.

The next biggest expenditure, reduced taxes on long term capital gains and dividends. Who the hell do you think benefits from those--poor people? I mean I am here to tell you, Grandma ain't paying her little bit of taxes to prop up this six figure income family of six, she is paying it to prop up Jeff Bezos, Warren Buffet, and Elon Musk.

Third on the least, tax benefits for employer defined contribution plans. Well hello howdy, that is Grandma's IRA. The government spent more on subsidizing her IRA over the years than the government has ever spent on child tax credits. Sorry if I don't feel bad that she is now giving a little of that back.

But the two things that bother me the most. First, your willingness to judge other people and preach to them as to how they conduct their lives. If anything, it is hypocritical, because I am sure not seeing you condemn oil companies for taking their replenishment allowance, or better yet, number 11 on the list of tax expenditures, the 20% deduction from qualified business income. Like me, I get to take all my expenses off my income and then, I get to take a full 20% off the bottom line and pay zero taxes on it. Thank you Donald Trump. Do you get to deduct 20% of your income from your taxable income? Again, Grandma is paying taxes because Donald Trump gets to slash 20% off his income and pays zero taxes on it. I mean wow, you can't see that and yet you complain about a family raising four kids. Absolutely amazing.

Second, your complete unwillingness to realize that the refundable tax credit for children is an investment in the future of this nation. I don't give two shits rather the benefactors use that money to buy jewelry boxes, or socks for their kids. It is extra money in the hands of the people responsible for the next generation. And I know, those government benefits, when used strategically, pay huge dividends because I have lived it. Condemn me all you want, it just makes you look foolish. I mean which of my six kids to you thing shouldn't be here today? The medical doctor? The Phd in Material Science? The fledging lawyer? The entrepreneur? The salesman? You think any one of them hasn't paid back, in spades, any government assistance I accepted?

Here is what I know. Were it not for immigrants this country would have a negative birth rate, meaning the number of children born is not sufficient to replace the number of people dying. Not exactly a foundation for the continuation of this nation, especially in light of how we fund Social Security. Grandma, with her $300,000 IRA at 82 ain't doing so damn bad. She has lived a productive life. And the government strokes her a check for two grand every month, not to mention spends another grand on her Medicare and drug plan each month. The only way that can continue is BY INVESTING IN OUR CHILDREN. You dumbshit boomers have no idea the sacrifices that have made to prop you up and are too damn selfish and self-absorbed to understand the debt you owe to future generations.

 

[Winston]

She has such a low income, and she STILL has to pay tax. So on one hand, you’re saying….so, she’s only paying a small amount of tax since her income is so small; and then on the other hand, you’re defending a high-earner for getting excused from all of most of HIS taxes.

And so what if she never paid taxes on the money in her IRA? You don’t have a problem that our $100,000+ software engineer isn‘t paying tax on his six-figure income!

AND…..she has paid taxes for 40 years! She has earned the right, as a retiree, to pay a minimal tax. Why ignore all her contributions since 1980? That is the scary attitude of Democrat socialists like yourself - people may have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal income tax over s long career, but the only thing you consider is that she’s not paying much now.

And lest we forget, you are a professional who took FOOD STAMPS and took money from other people to support your six kids at the lifestyle you felt entitled to, and so your wife wouldn’t have to pitch in - and OTHER people should support your family. Shameful.

Summary: The professional-level poster who took government assistance defends the idea of a $100k software engineer not paying taxes on his earned income, and then insists Granny needs to pay taxes on her IRA, since that’s earned money she didn’t pay tax on.

Does the six figure wage earner pay Social Security taxes? Why do ignore that? And Grandma is 82 with $300,000 in the bank. Are you defending her or the kids that are going to end up with that IRA? Hell, she probably has a house paid for too. A net worth at half a million, and you are crying that she has to pay less than a thousand dollars in income taxes? What is the net-worth of our six figure earner supporting a family of six? And I am here to tell you, that six figure earner pays a hell of a lot more than a thousand dollars in taxes every year.

I believe I see the problem here. Jealousy, of both him and me. Because I doubt I am going to have 300 grand in an IRA at 82. Hell, I doubt I make it to 82. But my "army" as my father has always called my children, will carry on, move forward, and provide me with a legacy that my father once said, "One day, they will call you the father of this country". In my eyes, you got one job while being on this earth, to perpetuate the species, to raise children. And like a good CEO, I leveraged everything and anything I could to do that job most effectively. And then there is this, I never gave two shits what other people did, I focused on what I could control. You might want to do the same.

 

[Lisa558]

Get over yourself. First, this six figure income family is paying taxes, lots of them. Why do you Republicans utterly ignore the Social Security tax? And yet Grandma, over three hundred grand, paid no income taxes in the past, is getting hit just a little bit today, and never, ever, will pay Social Security tax on that money.

Do you have a mortgage? Do you use the mortgage interest deduction? Well my house has been paid for for a long time. Why do you feel entitled to me subsidizing your home purchase. I am completely confident you take every tax deduction and tax break that is available to you, why do you condemn this family for doing the same thing.

It is called tax expenditures, you might want to look up the definition. But it is basically the loss in federal revenue from a given taxz break. The largest, by far, the tax exclusion for employer provided health insurance. The six figure income family you are so complaining about, well the man's employer only provides health insurance to him. I would never work for such a firm, but OK, let's run with that. He has to buy health insurance for his family with AFTER TAX dollars. Meanwhile, most of us, like myself, pay for health insurance for our families with pre-tax dollars.

The next biggest expenditure, reduced taxes on long term capital gains and dividends. Who the hell do you think benefits from those--poor people? I mean I am here to tell you, Grandma ain't paying her little bit of taxes to prop up this six figure income family of six, she is paying it to prop up Jeff Bezos, Warren Buffet, and Elon Musk.

Third on the least, tax benefits for employer defined contribution plans. Well hello howdy, that is Grandma's IRA. The government spent more on subsidizing her IRA over the years than the government has ever spent on child tax credits. Sorry if I don't feel bad that she is now giving a little of that back.

But the two things that bother me the most. First, your willingness to judge other people and preach to them as to how they conduct their lives. If anything, it is hypocritical, because I am sure not seeing you condemn oil companies for taking their replenishment allowance, or better yet, number 11 on the list of tax expenditures, the 20% deduction from qualified business income. Like me, I get to take all my expenses off my income and then, I get to take a full 20% off the bottom line and pay zero taxes on it. Thank you Donald Trump. Do you get to deduct 20% of your income from your taxable income? Again, Grandma is paying taxes because Donald Trump gets to slash 20% off his income and pays zero taxes on it. I mean wow, you can't see that and yet you complain about a family raising four kids. Absolutely amazing.

Second, your complete unwillingness to realize that the refundable tax credit for children is an investment in the future of this nation. I don't give two shits rather the benefactors use that money to buy jewelry boxes, or socks for their kids. It is extra money in the hands of the people responsible for the next generation. And I know, those government benefits, when used strategically, pay huge dividends because I have lived it. Condemn me all you want, it just makes you look foolish. I mean which of my six kids to you thing shouldn't be here today? The medical doctor? The Phd in Material Science? The fledging lawyer? The entrepreneur? The salesman? You think any one of them hasn't paid back, in spades, any government assistance I accepted?

Here is what I know. Were it not for immigrants this country would have a negative birth rate, meaning the number of children born is not sufficient to replace the number of people dying. Not exactly a foundation for the continuation of this nation, especially in light of how we fund Social Security. Grandma, with her $300,000 IRA at 82 ain't doing so damn bad. She has lived a productive life. And the government strokes her a check for two grand every month, not to mention spends another grand on her Medicare and drug plan each month. The only way that can continue is BY INVESTING IN OUR CHILDREN. You dumbshit boomers have no idea the sacrifices that have made to prop you up and are too damn selfish and self-absorbed to understand the debt you owe to future generations.

I stopped reading with your nasty ”get over yourself” remark. I don’t need to be scolded by a hypocritical liberal who took welfare benefits even though he was a professional, because He preferred OTHER people help him support his six kids, rather than either live within his means or have his wife pitch in.

 

[Winston]

I stopped reading with your nasty ”get over yourself” remark. I don’t need to be scolded by a hypocritical liberal who took welfare benefits even though he was a professional, because He preferred OTHER people help him support his six kids, rather than either live within his means or have his wife pitch in.

Typical Repuklican Boomer. "I stopped reading", Why not put your fingers in your ears and go "La, La, La". That seems rather appropriate for you, childish, but appropriate. If you can't handle the heat get out of the kitchen. Your position here has no foundation in reality. It ignores the fact that the family you want to tell how to live pays thousands in taxes every year while the Grandma you want to defend has extraordinary wealth and pays literally pennies on the dollar in taxes.

The BBB, at it's core, expanded the child tax credit and funded it with a surtax on billionaires. How you think leaving the money with people like Bezos can provide more benefit to society than placing it with people that are actually raising future generations is beyond my understanding. Bezos takes from society, mostly through rent-seeking, which I am quite sure is a concept you will never understand. Meanwhile, the family you complain about both gives to society, and builds our future. I got to tell you, I am more confident that the children of that family you want to complain about is going to do more for the future of this country than Bezos, and most certainly the 82 year old woman with 300 grand in the bank.

 

[Indeependent]

I stopped reading with your nasty ”get over yourself” remark. I don’t need to be scolded by a hypocritical liberal who took welfare benefits even though he was a professional, because He preferred OTHER people help him support his six kids, rather than either live within his means or have his wife pitch in.

You don't realize that this is Winston at his most diplomatic.
He's usually an overt douchebag.

 

[Lisa558]

You don't realize that this is Winston at his most diplomatic.
He's usually an overt douchebag.

Well, he did say that his father told him that ”one day they will call you father of the country,” so he obviously was brought up to be a self-entitled, arrogant, sanctimonious jerk: IOW, a leftist!

P.S. He thinks I’m jealous of someone with $300,000 in her IRA. If
he only knew…..

 

[woodwork201]

I find this question to be generic and short-sighted. People make bad decisions. We all know that. From there it comes down to whether or not we will sit idly while people suffer because of bad decisions.

Conservatives seem to believe that people deserve whatever consequences come of their bad decisions regardless of context. I think that's a little too extreme.

Please give an example of a bad decision you might make (actually or theoretically) where I deserve the consequences of your bad decision instead of you deserving the consequences of your bad decision.

 

[woodwork201]

Maybe some say that, but the fact remains that the poor welfare mothers, with three or four kids by age 25, and with mediocre intelligence and no skills, ARE getting lots of government assistance, and that really isn’t in question.

What IS in question is the money being provided to six-figure families with a college-educated professional at the helm. Right now, because BBB didn’t pass, thank G-d, the payout reverts to the pre-Biden amount. They still get some.

I actually think the cut-off for the government help should have a lower cut-off, perhaps $60,000 or so if the purpose is, as liberals claim, to get children off poverty. If that’s the goal, why did liberals expand the benefit to families with an incime of $150,000? That is far, far from poverty.

Poor welfare mothers have not yet been in question in this thread but, since it came up, let's consider it.

There should be zero government assistance for any human being. No transfer of funds from one person to another at the point of an IRS gun. No direct transfer and no transfer with the government as a middle man. The government should be barred from transferring any money to another person except in the case of a product or service provided to the government. Should the government wish to help someone, they can give them a job working on a road crew.

Helping the handicapped or those in need is the purview of families and charities, not government.

 

[woodwork201]

Yes, how dare people think they can work for a living AND enjoy living in a nice place. We should all enjoy being wage slaves for the one percent.

I want to live in Obama's beach house. Why can't I? The government should provide me a nice place, as nice as anyone else's, right? I haven't earned it ; I haven't worked hard enough to afford it; haven't improved my market value to increase my salary to afford it, but I want it.

 

[woodwork201]

So you legitimately and wholeheartedly support some level of social safety nets for the poor? I agree that a family making 60k doesn’t need welfare. That's totally livable. I don't think the public owes people a middle class living. You have to work for that.

Lisa might support it. I do not. Poor people choose to be poor. Why should I make up the difference? Why do we not respect their wishes and let them be as poor as they choose?