Has Trump ever taken responsibility?

[LA RAM FAN]

Not credit for - he does that all the time, but RESPONSIBILITY for something?

Ronald Reagan:
Ronald Reagan’s acceptance of responsibility in the Iran-Contra Affair in April 1987 when Trump was about to turn 40. Reagan took to the airwaves and revealed his role in the deal that used Nicaragua as the conduit for U.S. arms that were traded for Iranian-held hostages, something Reagan previously had denied. “There are reasons why it happened, but no excuses,” Reagan said. “It was a mistake. I undertook the original Iran initiative in order to develop relations with those who might assume leadership in a post-Khomeini government.” As with Kennedy, the public who genuinely liked Reagan accepted his apology and a potential impeachment was averted. His popularity also returned, scoring him a 64% approval by the time he left office two years later.

John F Kennedy:
John Kennedy’s acceptance of his role in the failed Bay of Pigs Invasion in April 1961 when Donald was nearly 15. The CIA-run operation, begun under the Eisenhower Administration, resulted in the capture of over 1,200 insurgents and ultimately the strengthening of the nascent Castro regime. Kennedy blamed himself for approving the operation and in public held himself solely accountable. "There's an old saying that victory has a hundred fathers and defeat is an orphan ... Further statements, detailed discussions, are not to conceal responsibility because I'm the responsible officer of the Government.” The public liked what they saw from the young president and gave him a pass. Later Kennedy joked that if he had known how his poll numbers would have soared – into the 80s – he might have called for the invasion to occur sooner.

Barak Obama:
President Obama, by his own admission, failed badly during the rollout of Obamacare in fall 2013, more grievously due to the failures of HealthCare.gov. But he took responsibility and fixed it, launching an unprecedented number of outside programmers and tech specialists to overhaul the site and get it in working order. "I take full responsibility for making sure it gets fixed ASAP,” Obama said at the time. And so he did.

Here are a few other things Obama took responsibility for while in office:

• The failed Tom Daschle and Bill Richardson Cabinet nominations in 2009
• The BP oil spill in 2010
• Democrats’ loss of the House of Representatives in 2010
• The attack on the US Consulate in Benghazi, Libya, in 2012
• The VA scandal in 2014
• Democratic losses in the 2014 midterms
• The death of two hostages in an operation against al-Qaeda in 2015
• The Syrian government’s atrocities in Aleppo in 2016

Donald Trump:
..........................................
..........................................
..........................................
..........................................



Can anyone provide some examples?

When he raised his right hand with his left hand on the Bible on January 20, 2017, he accepted responsibility, for better or for worse. So far he's done a great job.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Give the devil his due. I remembered it because it was so stunning.

Sigh....and then he ruins it with this "I’ve said some foolish things, but there is a big difference between words and actions. Bill Clinton has actually abused women and Hillary has bullied, attacked, shamed and intimidated his victims. We will discuss this more in the coming days."

How is that ruining it when he told the truth about the clintons.? That makes no sense

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Of course this thread is flooded with Trump cult members. He can do no wrong in the eyes of some. He could lie about the color of grass, and they would find a way to excuse it.

Sad but so very true indeed.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

When he raised his right hand with his left hand on the Bible on January 20, 2017, he accepted responsibility, for better or for worse. So far he's done a great job.

anybody can raise their hand and say they do. In practical terms? he's a big fat zero.
He's an awful person, and a terrible president. He's done a shit job from day one...

That's your opinion.My answer was a fact.

Total hogwash. He has done a shit job any standards. That is a fact. Your answer is opinion. Nothing more. Nothing less.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Not credit for - he does that all the time, but RESPONSIBILITY for something?

Ronald Reagan:
Ronald Reagan’s acceptance of responsibility in the Iran-Contra Affair in April 1987 when Trump was about to turn 40. Reagan took to the airwaves and revealed his role in the deal that used Nicaragua as the conduit for U.S. arms that were traded for Iranian-held hostages, something Reagan previously had denied. “There are reasons why it happened, but no excuses,” Reagan said. “It was a mistake. I undertook the original Iran initiative in order to develop relations with those who might assume leadership in a post-Khomeini government.” As with Kennedy, the public who genuinely liked Reagan accepted his apology and a potential impeachment was averted. His popularity also returned, scoring him a 64% approval by the time he left office two years later.

John F Kennedy:
John Kennedy’s acceptance of his role in the failed Bay of Pigs Invasion in April 1961 when Donald was nearly 15. The CIA-run operation, begun under the Eisenhower Administration, resulted in the capture of over 1,200 insurgents and ultimately the strengthening of the nascent Castro regime. Kennedy blamed himself for approving the operation and in public held himself solely accountable. "There's an old saying that victory has a hundred fathers and defeat is an orphan ... Further statements, detailed discussions, are not to conceal responsibility because I'm the responsible officer of the Government.” The public liked what they saw from the young president and gave him a pass. Later Kennedy joked that if he had known how his poll numbers would have soared – into the 80s – he might have called for the invasion to occur sooner.

Barak Obama:
President Obama, by his own admission, failed badly during the rollout of Obamacare in fall 2013, more grievously due to the failures of HealthCare.gov. But he took responsibility and fixed it, launching an unprecedented number of outside programmers and tech specialists to overhaul the site and get it in working order. "I take full responsibility for making sure it gets fixed ASAP,” Obama said at the time. And so he did.

Here are a few other things Obama took responsibility for while in office:

• The failed Tom Daschle and Bill Richardson Cabinet nominations in 2009
• The BP oil spill in 2010
• Democrats’ loss of the House of Representatives in 2010
• The attack on the US Consulate in Benghazi, Libya, in 2012
• The VA scandal in 2014
• Democratic losses in the 2014 midterms
• The death of two hostages in an operation against al-Qaeda in 2015
• The Syrian government’s atrocities in Aleppo in 2016

Donald Trump:
..........................................
..........................................
..........................................
..........................................



Can anyone provide some examples?

Acceptance of responsibility, but with no consequences, is pretty worthless. Don't you think?

Depends. Consequences can be hard to define - for example, consequences can be political, etc. But - I think what is more important - is whether accepting responsibility for it leads to changing something as a result. Learning from it. Not just apologizing.

Not one of the instances you gave had consequences attached. None of the perps suffered one iota so in my mind all that happened was they said "yeah, I did it, now fuck off".

Not exactly comforting.

Could not have said it any better myself Pretty pointless accepting responsibility for a criminal action as president that Reagan and obama did when they know because they are a politician,they won’t go to jail for their actions especially if you are the potus.lobest damn post on this thread.

 

[Marion Morrison]

Not credit for - he does that all the time, but RESPONSIBILITY for something?

Ronald Reagan:
Ronald Reagan’s acceptance of responsibility in the Iran-Contra Affair in April 1987 when Trump was about to turn 40. Reagan took to the airwaves and revealed his role in the deal that used Nicaragua as the conduit for U.S. arms that were traded for Iranian-held hostages, something Reagan previously had denied. “There are reasons why it happened, but no excuses,” Reagan said. “It was a mistake. I undertook the original Iran initiative in order to develop relations with those who might assume leadership in a post-Khomeini government.” As with Kennedy, the public who genuinely liked Reagan accepted his apology and a potential impeachment was averted. His popularity also returned, scoring him a 64% approval by the time he left office two years later.

John F Kennedy:
John Kennedy’s acceptance of his role in the failed Bay of Pigs Invasion in April 1961 when Donald was nearly 15. The CIA-run operation, begun under the Eisenhower Administration, resulted in the capture of over 1,200 insurgents and ultimately the strengthening of the nascent Castro regime. Kennedy blamed himself for approving the operation and in public held himself solely accountable. "There's an old saying that victory has a hundred fathers and defeat is an orphan ... Further statements, detailed discussions, are not to conceal responsibility because I'm the responsible officer of the Government.” The public liked what they saw from the young president and gave him a pass. Later Kennedy joked that if he had known how his poll numbers would have soared – into the 80s – he might have called for the invasion to occur sooner.

Barak Obama:
President Obama, by his own admission, failed badly during the rollout of Obamacare in fall 2013, more grievously due to the failures of HealthCare.gov. But he took responsibility and fixed it, launching an unprecedented number of outside programmers and tech specialists to overhaul the site and get it in working order. "I take full responsibility for making sure it gets fixed ASAP,” Obama said at the time. And so he did.

Here are a few other things Obama took responsibility for while in office:

• The failed Tom Daschle and Bill Richardson Cabinet nominations in 2009
• The BP oil spill in 2010
• Democrats’ loss of the House of Representatives in 2010
• The attack on the US Consulate in Benghazi, Libya, in 2012
• The VA scandal in 2014
• Democratic losses in the 2014 midterms
• The death of two hostages in an operation against al-Qaeda in 2015
• The Syrian government’s atrocities in Aleppo in 2016

Donald Trump:
..........................................
..........................................
..........................................
..........................................



Can anyone provide some examples?

Too bad those criminal mother fucker asshole murderers Reagan and Obama did not take responsibility by telling the truth what traiters they were to Americans and how they shit on the constitution and did Not take responsibility and come out and tell the the truth they should have been hung up and strung by the balls to die which describes all politicians,their all criminals,all have committed crimes worse than the criminals all on death row

Uhm, Reagan was a good American. He was shot 70 days into his presidency so that globalist H.W. Bush could run things, and it went like that for a long time. Reagan almost did not live. Oh! And they restricted guns more after he got shot.
Buncha BS!

 

[charwin95]

Well, it looks like this thread is NOT going the way Coyote (Hope) envisioned it......

Bear 513 is back ...

Good I have something to laugh at. Your street smart mouth you once proud to tell me....... still there.

 

[charwin95]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for any fraudulent university or fraudulent foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

 

[BluesLegend]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for fraudulent university and fraudulent trump foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

Trust me this was all inherited from Obama, even the failed impeachment.

 

[Marion Morrison]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for any fraudulent university or fraudulent foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

I'm sure English is not your native language.
Go fuck yourself with a saguaro, leftist shillboi.
You're not American, fuck you.

 

[charwin95]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for any fraudulent university or fraudulent foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

I'm sure English is not your native language.
Go fuck yourself with a saguaro, leftist shillboi.
You're not American, fuck you.

Sorry bud I speak 6 languages but that doesn’t mean my disappointment with your god is not valid. Trump sucks. I am an American pure bred.
.

 

[flacaltenn]

My objection is that I am pretty skeptical miracles touted by snake oil salesmen when they are not supported by good data. And, if it leads to dangerous behavior because people believe a dose of quinine will fix it.

If this is about TRUMP -- you'll never be able to have an "informed opinion" on HCQuine.. Actually 15 doses of HCQuine over a week has SAVED 1000s of lives... DOCUMENTED fact that you STILL can't process in your rage about Trump... I don't think he's a done a thing WRONG on HCQuine.. And time will bear that out.. When MSDNC and DEMNN have to eat their own shit like they did Avenatti , and "Trump is a traitor" and all the other backfires..

You're having trouble finding stuff to BLAME him for, largely because you're not listening to the exculpatory evidence and TOO many ridiculous claims have been made against him by the MAJORITY OF THE MEDIA that has served you badly and SET YOU UP for constant disappointment. Think I tried to tell you WHY there wouldn;'t be "Russian Collusion" about 3 months into the Mueller investigation and you COMPLETELY blew off everything I was telling you.... And NOW we KNOW who WAS spying on the Trump campaign and the conspirators WERE in our Intel Agencies... Had you cared to research it --- would have saved you 18 months of being pumped full of crap by the mainstream media...

Find BETTER ones...

 

[charwin95]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for any fraudulent university or fraudulent foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

I'm sure English is not your native language.
Go fuck yourself with a saguaro, leftist shillboi.
You're not American, fuck you.

This is what happened when you don’t have any rebuttal that you can counter act. Weakling. That is what you most are good at.

 

[charwin95]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for fraudulent university and fraudulent trump foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

Trust me this was all inherited from Obama, even the failed impeachment.

Nah! You are in denial.

 

[flacaltenn]

Don’t ever get tired of blaming everything on the Dems? Is that your own version of TDS? Defend Trump at all costs?

Right now your party is stinky dumpster fire.. They have NOTHING to offer to REMOVE Trump.. And the number of times they've SHOT themselves because they've taken weak ass complaints about Trumop to the people or been stupid enough (for instance) to INSIST Mueller take the oath and testify -- only to SHOW the American people that HE was not familar with his OWN REPORT -- is kinda the pitches I get when I'm at bat...

Don't really care if BOTH parties self-destructed... Just want it to be prolonged and painful... Like the suicide the Dem party has decided to do for the past 3 years...

 

[flacaltenn]

Can you provide some examples then?

Taking responsibility is an important part of leadership.

Taking responsibility for a lie created by the media isn't part of being a good leader.

Are you saying all his bad policy rollouts ad outcomes are lies created by media?

You might have to list them because I don't think anything he's rolled out is bad....maybe bad for Anti-American Democrats who side against their own country in favor of China and Russia....but not bad for me.

Post 265 of this thread. And - it's not about the policies themselves (obviously we will disagree there) - it's about how they were rolled out and implemented that was badly done.

Anyone can be critical by being an armchair QB.
Try making suggestions on how to improve on something everyone seems to have been surprised by....including House Democrats who were busy impeaching Trump even though many of them had already been briefed on the virus.

Sure...but let's see....when did you ever do that? You had no problem being critical of Obama without offering improvements so that doesn't wash.

Clinton was able to work, and was handling the crisis in Kosovo during his impeachment. That is no excuse.

In addition, both examples I provided of badly done rollouts and policies were prior to impeachment. Do you have anything to say related to those examples?

Clinton had a problem with going overseas and throwing his weight around. I was deployed to Somalia when he took over the operation. In no time it quickly turned to shit. Instead of a peace-keeping mission, it turned into a armed forces expeditionary mission....a hunt for a warlord. Bill Clinton helped assassinate dozens of tribal leaders when they were trying to sue for peace. So the place turned into a Hornet's nest for us. When I first got there we could walk down the street unmolested , but after Bill Clinton...we had to wear armored vests and travel in tactical formation. We discovered why every other country sent their troops with fully armored APCs....and we were the only ones driving around in un-armored vehicles.

When it comes to Obama....we can all agree his roll-out of Obamacare was a total disaster. My suggestion to him would be not to fuck with the system that was working....but he was trying to take over 2/3rds of the economy through Single-payer health care. We can both admit Obama was a socialist but was afraid of it getting out. The issues I had with him are too numerous to list....and not one of them had to do with the color of his skin.

Lets take that one. I agree with you on that.

Now fast forward to the current administration. How did the roll out of Trump’s “Muslim ban” go?

It wasn't a Muslim ban.....it was a ban of people from specific regions that posed a threat to the US.

Aren't you wishing the Dems had listened to him about stopping some of these disease carrying illegals now?
Some think alot of this virus came into the US during those caravans from Central America. I also think this isn't the first flare-up. Senior citizens have been dying in greater numbers the last 3 winters.....most of them from lung infections. I think this is the 3rd cycle of the coronavirus.

MN Sen. Dr. says reported coronavirus deaths may be off

Minnesota Senator and Doctor Scott Jensen say he received a seven-page document from the Minnesota Department of Health on how doctors should go about filling out a cause of death certificate.

www.valleynewslive.com

I am questioning the stats for sure

Wrong thread dude this isn't about the corona virus.

I am saying he does take responsibility. He is the most open President we have ever had. With his tweets and constant press conferences.

That is not taking responsibility.

When has he ever taken responsibility for something? (ie not credit for).

I think that 100% is. He took responsibility for a better economy? Do you mean negative responsibility? If Trump says Hydrox doesn’t work and needs more research the press would call it a miracle drug and that it works great. Cannot trust our press at all these days. Trump doesn’t bash himself. I agree. The press does enough for him.

Taking responsibility is not the same as taking credit. Taking responsibility for policies or actions that did not go well.

Has he ever?

Yes. When he fires people that he hired that didn’t work out. LOL. Admitting defeat or error is not who he is. I ll Give you that. Most CEOs are like that too. Ever see Jeff Bezos or Jamie Dimon admit they are wrong?

So essentially what you are saying is taking responsibility for mistakes is "not who he is" - in other words, he does not take responsibility.

He does but not for adverse actions or what some perceive to be adverse actions. He took responsibility for our deficit and was frustrated with it for example.

Where did he take responsibility for the deficit?

During his Town Hall on Fox News.

This Town Hall?

Trump blames Obama for federal debt and leaves entitlement-program cuts shrouded in doubt

Reminded at the Fox News town hall this week in Scranton, Pa., that he likely can’t reduce the debt without cutting entitlement programs, like Social...

www.marketwatch.com

Yeah. Did you watch it. He said he was disappointed he could not get the surplus but he took over a bad situation. He still took responsibility for not achieving the surplus and explained why he didn’t. Did you actually watch it? If not, do so.

So...he took responsibility by blaming his predecessor.

He took responsibility for promising to do something he didn’t do and explained why he could not do it. What would you call it?

How is blaming your predecessor taking responsibility? Never heard that being called "taking responsibility" before.

He said and I paraphrase: lt is disappointing and we need to do better but the military was just in such bad shape that we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let go.

To me it is taking responsibility. I agree that the prior administration didn’t prioritize the military. Did you watch the Town Hall?

How is that taking responsibility? He is giving an explanation - and, making an excuse.

He was explaining how he took responsibility. "we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let it go." But we know it doesn't matter what he does TDSers will still find a reason to hate him and anyone who voted for him. Buncha children.

How is that taking responsibility for the current situation?

In what way is it Trump's responsibility when Democrats all over the country have tried to sabotage everything he does to protect us from the coronavirus?

How, specifically, have they tried to sabotage him in regards to Covid19 policies?

By stating he should have started the social distancing sooner and that Hydrox doesn't work when it does.

Hydrox is unproven and it's not just Democrats who didn't sign on to it. It's fine to use - but it's also fair to say it's unproven. How is saying social distancing should have started earlier (which is true, but up to individual states and municipal areas, not the president) and is a criticism levied by both parties - sabotaging him?

Can you provide some examples then?

Taking responsibility is an important part of leadership.

Taking responsibility for a lie created by the media isn't part of being a good leader.

Are you saying all his bad policy rollouts ad outcomes are lies created by media?

You might have to list them because I don't think anything he's rolled out is bad....maybe bad for Anti-American Democrats who side against their own country in favor of China and Russia....but not bad for me.

Post 265 of this thread. And - it's not about the policies themselves (obviously we will disagree there) - it's about how they were rolled out and implemented that was badly done.

Anyone can be critical by being an armchair QB.
Try making suggestions on how to improve on something everyone seems to have been surprised by....including House Democrats who were busy impeaching Trump even though many of them had already been briefed on the virus.

Sure...but let's see....when did you ever do that? You had no problem being critical of Obama without offering improvements so that doesn't wash.

Clinton was able to work, and was handling the crisis in Kosovo during his impeachment. That is no excuse.

In addition, both examples I provided of badly done rollouts and policies were prior to impeachment. Do you have anything to say related to those examples?

Clinton had a problem with going overseas and throwing his weight around. I was deployed to Somalia when he took over the operation. In no time it quickly turned to shit. Instead of a peace-keeping mission, it turned into a armed forces expeditionary mission....a hunt for a warlord. Bill Clinton helped assassinate dozens of tribal leaders when they were trying to sue for peace. So the place turned into a Hornet's nest for us. When I first got there we could walk down the street unmolested , but after Bill Clinton...we had to wear armored vests and travel in tactical formation. We discovered why every other country sent their troops with fully armored APCs....and we were the only ones driving around in un-armored vehicles.

When it comes to Obama....we can all agree his roll-out of Obamacare was a total disaster. My suggestion to him would be not to fuck with the system that was working....but he was trying to take over 2/3rds of the economy through Single-payer health care. We can both admit Obama was a socialist but was afraid of it getting out. The issues I had with him are too numerous to list....and not one of them had to do with the color of his skin.

Lets take that one. I agree with you on that.

Now fast forward to the current administration. How did the roll out of Trump’s “Muslim ban” go?

It wasn't a Muslim ban.....it was a ban of people from specific regions that posed a threat to the US.

Aren't you wishing the Dems had listened to him about stopping some of these disease carrying illegals now?
Some think alot of this virus came into the US during those caravans from Central America. I also think this isn't the first flare-up. Senior citizens have been dying in greater numbers the last 3 winters.....most of them from lung infections. I think this is the 3rd cycle of the coronavirus.

MN Sen. Dr. says reported coronavirus deaths may be off

Minnesota Senator and Doctor Scott Jensen say he received a seven-page document from the Minnesota Department of Health on how doctors should go about filling out a cause of death certificate.

www.valleynewslive.com

I am questioning the stats for sure

Wrong thread dude this isn't about the corona virus.

I am saying he does take responsibility. He is the most open President we have ever had. With his tweets and constant press conferences.

That is not taking responsibility.

When has he ever taken responsibility for something? (ie not credit for).

I think that 100% is. He took responsibility for a better economy? Do you mean negative responsibility? If Trump says Hydrox doesn’t work and needs more research the press would call it a miracle drug and that it works great. Cannot trust our press at all these days. Trump doesn’t bash himself. I agree. The press does enough for him.

Taking responsibility is not the same as taking credit. Taking responsibility for policies or actions that did not go well.

Has he ever?

Yes. When he fires people that he hired that didn’t work out. LOL. Admitting defeat or error is not who he is. I ll Give you that. Most CEOs are like that too. Ever see Jeff Bezos or Jamie Dimon admit they are wrong?

So essentially what you are saying is taking responsibility for mistakes is "not who he is" - in other words, he does not take responsibility.

He does but not for adverse actions or what some perceive to be adverse actions. He took responsibility for our deficit and was frustrated with it for example.

Where did he take responsibility for the deficit?

During his Town Hall on Fox News.

This Town Hall?

Trump blames Obama for federal debt and leaves entitlement-program cuts shrouded in doubt

Reminded at the Fox News town hall this week in Scranton, Pa., that he likely can’t reduce the debt without cutting entitlement programs, like Social...

www.marketwatch.com

Yeah. Did you watch it. He said he was disappointed he could not get the surplus but he took over a bad situation. He still took responsibility for not achieving the surplus and explained why he didn’t. Did you actually watch it? If not, do so.

So...he took responsibility by blaming his predecessor.

He took responsibility for promising to do something he didn’t do and explained why he could not do it. What would you call it?

How is blaming your predecessor taking responsibility? Never heard that being called "taking responsibility" before.

He said and I paraphrase: lt is disappointing and we need to do better but the military was just in such bad shape that we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let go.

To me it is taking responsibility. I agree that the prior administration didn’t prioritize the military. Did you watch the Town Hall?

How is that taking responsibility? He is giving an explanation - and, making an excuse.

He was explaining how he took responsibility. "we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let it go." But we know it doesn't matter what he does TDSers will still find a reason to hate him and anyone who voted for him. Buncha children.

How is that taking responsibility for the current situation?

In what way is it Trump's responsibility when Democrats all over the country have tried to sabotage everything he does to protect us from the coronavirus?

How, specifically, have they tried to sabotage him in regards to Covid19 policies?

By stating he should have started the social distancing sooner and that Hydrox doesn't work when it does.

Hydrox is unproven and it's not just Democrats who didn't sign on to it. It's fine to use - but it's also fair to say it's unproven. How is saying social distancing should have started earlier (which is true, but up to individual states and municipal areas, not the president) and is a criticism levied by both parties - sabotaging him?

No it is not 'unproven' doctors are reporting that most cases are cured with it with no side affects. It is more correct to say it is not FDA approved specifically for treatment of the Coronavirus however the FDA did approve it for off label use. It won't be officially 'approved' until FDA mandated double-blind testing is done. As usual, the Devil is in the details here, some want to blame Trump for pushing an 'unapproved' drug but that is only a half truth and, as usual, the TDSers gloom onto that like flies on shit.

Unproven is accurate because what we have are anecdotal claims. Since it's harmless, I see no issue with it. But pushing an unproven drug OVER the statements of medical professionals, is not a good idea.

Is Trump a doctor now?

OK.. I see.. This is all about Trump... Good luck with that...

I'm uncomfortable with politicians touting medicine and going against medical professionals. Trump is the first I've known to do that.

Sorry for coming at you for this -- but it's old and tiresome.. If Trump DEMANDED that people don't blow thru stop signs, all the TDS'ers would be doing it.. You are SO consumed by the politics, that you won't do the defensive thing to save your life or others..

Lemme explain...

Ya know what ELSE IS UNPROVEN??? This entire govt bureaucratic RESPONSE to COVID is "unproven".. Based on modeling that is FAILING so badly, that the modelers have to REVISE their estimates on ALMOST a daily basis.. WHY? Because the MODELS are "educated guesses".. NOT scientific facts.. But that didn't stop the media from grabbing at the WORST CASE NUMBERS and playing on the public fears...

I've done a lot of modeling in more than 4 or 5 different disciplines.. And if you have to REVISE your models constantly, they have very little "predictive value"... Means (in terms of HCQuine) that their "efficacy" SUCKS...

And YET -- we've done a sedation of the entire country, made governors pee their pants over the models.. Financially put 10s of Million at economic risk, because of "unproven" models..

Not JUST the models for deaths and spread... The CDC IS GUESSING at a mortality rate by ESTIMATING the the #infections = (ABOUT) #reported X 2... RIGHT NOW -- there is vibrant scientific debate that the factor of 2 might be more like 10 or even 40... It's NOT "proven" and it's NOT settled science...

But you're here pushing this HCQuine cart UPHILL in a blizzard because you HATE Trump for offering that hope.. That's your burden sis.. But you're SERIOUSLY being selective about what is scientific proof and missing the entire AD HOC nature of the guessing that we're exploring right now as a nation...

Edit... THe OTHER unproven science is the whole EXPERIMENT of "social distancing".. Which is WHY the models FAILED in the 1st place... If you could suppress the TDS long enough to WATCH Dr. Birx at a WH press opportunity yesterday -- SHE ADMITTED that the entire "social distancing" experiment was PURELY ACADEMIC prior to this event.. If we had MEASUREMENTS of efficacy for it -- the models would have SOME predictive ability...

In short -- EVERYONE in charge is "winging itt" if you DEMAND rigid scientific PROOF

No shit sister.

Maybe you should give your own TDS (Trump Defense Syndrome) a rest here Instead of blaming any and all criticism of Trump as “hate”. Geez...you could only come up with one thing you thought he did wrong for God sakes and you accuse me of TDS? No wonder his supporters refuse to hold him accountable. EVER.

My objection is that I am pretty skeptical miracles touted by snake oil salesmen when they are not supported by good data. And, if it leads to dangerous behavior because people believe a dose of quinine will fix it.

And of course there are a lot of unknowns in dealing with this pandemic, who is arguing that? We have never been through this before. I certainly don’t envy the President and state governors in trying to make the determination between public health risks and jobs/economy.

Don’t ever get tired of blaming everything on the Dems? Is that your own version of TDS? Defend Trump at all costs?

Huh? You’re kidding, right?

About what?

I have Said 100x on this board how I wish he would attack the deficit and our healthcare system and now we see what can happen when you don’t. We are spending way more and our hospital system is in Chaos. I also criticized him for dealing too much with China and not pushing for newer supply chains.

That is true, I wouldn’t call you a Trumpist, just a conservative.

I am less a conservative and more an anti Leftist. I am Pro Choice, don’t care who married whom and generally believe we should help those with rougher ladders to climb for success. What I do not like is blaming Trump for all the sins of this country and the world, blaming Jews and Israel for the same sins and the Leftists PC culture.

I did not leave the Democrat party, they left me. I am and always will be an Independent but it’s tough to support a party that openly votes in antisemites like Tlaib and Omar and who tells me that men may identify as women and play sports vs my daughters.

Informative. Libertarian?

Maybe? I generally Vote for the candidates who are pro business and pro military. I just find it illogical that people can state with a straight face that biological boys who identify as girls should be allowed to play contact sports vs my kids and I am not allowed to say anything. That is nuts.

At this point, Republicans are closer to Libertarians than the Democrat party.

Wasn't the case back 15 or 20 years ago.. I had more libertarian support from the Dems than the Reps.. Then the DEMS stopped being liberals and became leftists.. Can't talk to them anymore about Civil Liberties or moral capitalism or FOREIGN policy or any of the stuff we had in common..

 

[Marion Morrison]

Can you provide some examples then?

Taking responsibility is an important part of leadership.

Taking responsibility for a lie created by the media isn't part of being a good leader.

Are you saying all his bad policy rollouts ad outcomes are lies created by media?

You might have to list them because I don't think anything he's rolled out is bad....maybe bad for Anti-American Democrats who side against their own country in favor of China and Russia....but not bad for me.

Post 265 of this thread. And - it's not about the policies themselves (obviously we will disagree there) - it's about how they were rolled out and implemented that was badly done.

Anyone can be critical by being an armchair QB.
Try making suggestions on how to improve on something everyone seems to have been surprised by....including House Democrats who were busy impeaching Trump even though many of them had already been briefed on the virus.

Sure...but let's see....when did you ever do that? You had no problem being critical of Obama without offering improvements so that doesn't wash.

Clinton was able to work, and was handling the crisis in Kosovo during his impeachment. That is no excuse.

In addition, both examples I provided of badly done rollouts and policies were prior to impeachment. Do you have anything to say related to those examples?

Clinton had a problem with going overseas and throwing his weight around. I was deployed to Somalia when he took over the operation. In no time it quickly turned to shit. Instead of a peace-keeping mission, it turned into a armed forces expeditionary mission....a hunt for a warlord. Bill Clinton helped assassinate dozens of tribal leaders when they were trying to sue for peace. So the place turned into a Hornet's nest for us. When I first got there we could walk down the street unmolested , but after Bill Clinton...we had to wear armored vests and travel in tactical formation. We discovered why every other country sent their troops with fully armored APCs....and we were the only ones driving around in un-armored vehicles.

When it comes to Obama....we can all agree his roll-out of Obamacare was a total disaster. My suggestion to him would be not to fuck with the system that was working....but he was trying to take over 2/3rds of the economy through Single-payer health care. We can both admit Obama was a socialist but was afraid of it getting out. The issues I had with him are too numerous to list....and not one of them had to do with the color of his skin.

Lets take that one. I agree with you on that.

Now fast forward to the current administration. How did the roll out of Trump’s “Muslim ban” go?

It wasn't a Muslim ban.....it was a ban of people from specific regions that posed a threat to the US.

Aren't you wishing the Dems had listened to him about stopping some of these disease carrying illegals now?
Some think alot of this virus came into the US during those caravans from Central America. I also think this isn't the first flare-up. Senior citizens have been dying in greater numbers the last 3 winters.....most of them from lung infections. I think this is the 3rd cycle of the coronavirus.

MN Sen. Dr. says reported coronavirus deaths may be off

Minnesota Senator and Doctor Scott Jensen say he received a seven-page document from the Minnesota Department of Health on how doctors should go about filling out a cause of death certificate.

www.valleynewslive.com

I am questioning the stats for sure

Wrong thread dude this isn't about the corona virus.

I am saying he does take responsibility. He is the most open President we have ever had. With his tweets and constant press conferences.

That is not taking responsibility.

When has he ever taken responsibility for something? (ie not credit for).

I think that 100% is. He took responsibility for a better economy? Do you mean negative responsibility? If Trump says Hydrox doesn’t work and needs more research the press would call it a miracle drug and that it works great. Cannot trust our press at all these days. Trump doesn’t bash himself. I agree. The press does enough for him.

Taking responsibility is not the same as taking credit. Taking responsibility for policies or actions that did not go well.

Has he ever?

Yes. When he fires people that he hired that didn’t work out. LOL. Admitting defeat or error is not who he is. I ll Give you that. Most CEOs are like that too. Ever see Jeff Bezos or Jamie Dimon admit they are wrong?

So essentially what you are saying is taking responsibility for mistakes is "not who he is" - in other words, he does not take responsibility.

He does but not for adverse actions or what some perceive to be adverse actions. He took responsibility for our deficit and was frustrated with it for example.

Where did he take responsibility for the deficit?

During his Town Hall on Fox News.

This Town Hall?

Trump blames Obama for federal debt and leaves entitlement-program cuts shrouded in doubt

Reminded at the Fox News town hall this week in Scranton, Pa., that he likely can’t reduce the debt without cutting entitlement programs, like Social...

www.marketwatch.com

Yeah. Did you watch it. He said he was disappointed he could not get the surplus but he took over a bad situation. He still took responsibility for not achieving the surplus and explained why he didn’t. Did you actually watch it? If not, do so.

So...he took responsibility by blaming his predecessor.

He took responsibility for promising to do something he didn’t do and explained why he could not do it. What would you call it?

How is blaming your predecessor taking responsibility? Never heard that being called "taking responsibility" before.

He said and I paraphrase: lt is disappointing and we need to do better but the military was just in such bad shape that we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let go.

To me it is taking responsibility. I agree that the prior administration didn’t prioritize the military. Did you watch the Town Hall?

How is that taking responsibility? He is giving an explanation - and, making an excuse.

He was explaining how he took responsibility. "we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let it go." But we know it doesn't matter what he does TDSers will still find a reason to hate him and anyone who voted for him. Buncha children.

How is that taking responsibility for the current situation?

In what way is it Trump's responsibility when Democrats all over the country have tried to sabotage everything he does to protect us from the coronavirus?

How, specifically, have they tried to sabotage him in regards to Covid19 policies?

By stating he should have started the social distancing sooner and that Hydrox doesn't work when it does.

Hydrox is unproven and it's not just Democrats who didn't sign on to it. It's fine to use - but it's also fair to say it's unproven. How is saying social distancing should have started earlier (which is true, but up to individual states and municipal areas, not the president) and is a criticism levied by both parties - sabotaging him?

Can you provide some examples then?

Taking responsibility is an important part of leadership.

Taking responsibility for a lie created by the media isn't part of being a good leader.

Are you saying all his bad policy rollouts ad outcomes are lies created by media?

You might have to list them because I don't think anything he's rolled out is bad....maybe bad for Anti-American Democrats who side against their own country in favor of China and Russia....but not bad for me.

Post 265 of this thread. And - it's not about the policies themselves (obviously we will disagree there) - it's about how they were rolled out and implemented that was badly done.

Anyone can be critical by being an armchair QB.
Try making suggestions on how to improve on something everyone seems to have been surprised by....including House Democrats who were busy impeaching Trump even though many of them had already been briefed on the virus.

Sure...but let's see....when did you ever do that? You had no problem being critical of Obama without offering improvements so that doesn't wash.

Clinton was able to work, and was handling the crisis in Kosovo during his impeachment. That is no excuse.

In addition, both examples I provided of badly done rollouts and policies were prior to impeachment. Do you have anything to say related to those examples?

Clinton had a problem with going overseas and throwing his weight around. I was deployed to Somalia when he took over the operation. In no time it quickly turned to shit. Instead of a peace-keeping mission, it turned into a armed forces expeditionary mission....a hunt for a warlord. Bill Clinton helped assassinate dozens of tribal leaders when they were trying to sue for peace. So the place turned into a Hornet's nest for us. When I first got there we could walk down the street unmolested , but after Bill Clinton...we had to wear armored vests and travel in tactical formation. We discovered why every other country sent their troops with fully armored APCs....and we were the only ones driving around in un-armored vehicles.

When it comes to Obama....we can all agree his roll-out of Obamacare was a total disaster. My suggestion to him would be not to fuck with the system that was working....but he was trying to take over 2/3rds of the economy through Single-payer health care. We can both admit Obama was a socialist but was afraid of it getting out. The issues I had with him are too numerous to list....and not one of them had to do with the color of his skin.

Lets take that one. I agree with you on that.

Now fast forward to the current administration. How did the roll out of Trump’s “Muslim ban” go?

It wasn't a Muslim ban.....it was a ban of people from specific regions that posed a threat to the US.

Aren't you wishing the Dems had listened to him about stopping some of these disease carrying illegals now?
Some think alot of this virus came into the US during those caravans from Central America. I also think this isn't the first flare-up. Senior citizens have been dying in greater numbers the last 3 winters.....most of them from lung infections. I think this is the 3rd cycle of the coronavirus.

MN Sen. Dr. says reported coronavirus deaths may be off

Minnesota Senator and Doctor Scott Jensen say he received a seven-page document from the Minnesota Department of Health on how doctors should go about filling out a cause of death certificate.

www.valleynewslive.com

I am questioning the stats for sure

Wrong thread dude this isn't about the corona virus.

I am saying he does take responsibility. He is the most open President we have ever had. With his tweets and constant press conferences.

That is not taking responsibility.

When has he ever taken responsibility for something? (ie not credit for).

I think that 100% is. He took responsibility for a better economy? Do you mean negative responsibility? If Trump says Hydrox doesn’t work and needs more research the press would call it a miracle drug and that it works great. Cannot trust our press at all these days. Trump doesn’t bash himself. I agree. The press does enough for him.

Taking responsibility is not the same as taking credit. Taking responsibility for policies or actions that did not go well.

Has he ever?

Yes. When he fires people that he hired that didn’t work out. LOL. Admitting defeat or error is not who he is. I ll Give you that. Most CEOs are like that too. Ever see Jeff Bezos or Jamie Dimon admit they are wrong?

So essentially what you are saying is taking responsibility for mistakes is "not who he is" - in other words, he does not take responsibility.

He does but not for adverse actions or what some perceive to be adverse actions. He took responsibility for our deficit and was frustrated with it for example.

Where did he take responsibility for the deficit?

During his Town Hall on Fox News.

This Town Hall?

Trump blames Obama for federal debt and leaves entitlement-program cuts shrouded in doubt

Reminded at the Fox News town hall this week in Scranton, Pa., that he likely can’t reduce the debt without cutting entitlement programs, like Social...

www.marketwatch.com

Yeah. Did you watch it. He said he was disappointed he could not get the surplus but he took over a bad situation. He still took responsibility for not achieving the surplus and explained why he didn’t. Did you actually watch it? If not, do so.

So...he took responsibility by blaming his predecessor.

He took responsibility for promising to do something he didn’t do and explained why he could not do it. What would you call it?

How is blaming your predecessor taking responsibility? Never heard that being called "taking responsibility" before.

He said and I paraphrase: lt is disappointing and we need to do better but the military was just in such bad shape that we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let go.

To me it is taking responsibility. I agree that the prior administration didn’t prioritize the military. Did you watch the Town Hall?

How is that taking responsibility? He is giving an explanation - and, making an excuse.

He was explaining how he took responsibility. "we needed to spend more to get back to where it needed to be because the last administration really let it go." But we know it doesn't matter what he does TDSers will still find a reason to hate him and anyone who voted for him. Buncha children.

How is that taking responsibility for the current situation?

In what way is it Trump's responsibility when Democrats all over the country have tried to sabotage everything he does to protect us from the coronavirus?

How, specifically, have they tried to sabotage him in regards to Covid19 policies?

By stating he should have started the social distancing sooner and that Hydrox doesn't work when it does.

Hydrox is unproven and it's not just Democrats who didn't sign on to it. It's fine to use - but it's also fair to say it's unproven. How is saying social distancing should have started earlier (which is true, but up to individual states and municipal areas, not the president) and is a criticism levied by both parties - sabotaging him?

No it is not 'unproven' doctors are reporting that most cases are cured with it with no side affects. It is more correct to say it is not FDA approved specifically for treatment of the Coronavirus however the FDA did approve it for off label use. It won't be officially 'approved' until FDA mandated double-blind testing is done. As usual, the Devil is in the details here, some want to blame Trump for pushing an 'unapproved' drug but that is only a half truth and, as usual, the TDSers gloom onto that like flies on shit.

Unproven is accurate because what we have are anecdotal claims. Since it's harmless, I see no issue with it. But pushing an unproven drug OVER the statements of medical professionals, is not a good idea.

Is Trump a doctor now?

OK.. I see.. This is all about Trump... Good luck with that...

I'm uncomfortable with politicians touting medicine and going against medical professionals. Trump is the first I've known to do that.

Sorry for coming at you for this -- but it's old and tiresome.. If Trump DEMANDED that people don't blow thru stop signs, all the TDS'ers would be doing it.. You are SO consumed by the politics, that you won't do the defensive thing to save your life or others..

Lemme explain...

Ya know what ELSE IS UNPROVEN??? This entire govt bureaucratic RESPONSE to COVID is "unproven".. Based on modeling that is FAILING so badly, that the modelers have to REVISE their estimates on ALMOST a daily basis.. WHY? Because the MODELS are "educated guesses".. NOT scientific facts.. But that didn't stop the media from grabbing at the WORST CASE NUMBERS and playing on the public fears...

I've done a lot of modeling in more than 4 or 5 different disciplines.. And if you have to REVISE your models constantly, they have very little "predictive value"... Means (in terms of HCQuine) that their "efficacy" SUCKS...

And YET -- we've done a sedation of the entire country, made governors pee their pants over the models.. Financially put 10s of Million at economic risk, because of "unproven" models..

Not JUST the models for deaths and spread... The CDC IS GUESSING at a mortality rate by ESTIMATING the the #infections = (ABOUT) #reported X 2... RIGHT NOW -- there is vibrant scientific debate that the factor of 2 might be more like 10 or even 40... It's NOT "proven" and it's NOT settled science...

But you're here pushing this HCQuine cart UPHILL in a blizzard because you HATE Trump for offering that hope.. That's your burden sis.. But you're SERIOUSLY being selective about what is scientific proof and missing the entire AD HOC nature of the guessing that we're exploring right now as a nation...

Edit... THe OTHER unproven science is the whole EXPERIMENT of "social distancing".. Which is WHY the models FAILED in the 1st place... If you could suppress the TDS long enough to WATCH Dr. Birx at a WH press opportunity yesterday -- SHE ADMITTED that the entire "social distancing" experiment was PURELY ACADEMIC prior to this event.. If we had MEASUREMENTS of efficacy for it -- the models would have SOME predictive ability...

In short -- EVERYONE in charge is "winging itt" if you DEMAND rigid scientific PROOF

No shit sister.

Maybe you should give your own TDS (Trump Defense Syndrome) a rest here Instead of blaming any and all criticism of Trump as “hate”. Geez...you could only come up with one thing you thought he did wrong for God sakes and you accuse me of TDS? No wonder his supporters refuse to hold him accountable. EVER.

My objection is that I am pretty skeptical miracles touted by snake oil salesmen when they are not supported by good data. And, if it leads to dangerous behavior because people believe a dose of quinine will fix it.

And of course there are a lot of unknowns in dealing with this pandemic, who is arguing that? We have never been through this before. I certainly don’t envy the President and state governors in trying to make the determination between public health risks and jobs/economy.

Don’t ever get tired of blaming everything on the Dems? Is that your own version of TDS? Defend Trump at all costs?

Huh? You’re kidding, right?

About what?

I have Said 100x on this board how I wish he would attack the deficit and our healthcare system and now we see what can happen when you don’t. We are spending way more and our hospital system is in Chaos. I also criticized him for dealing too much with China and not pushing for newer supply chains.

That is true, I wouldn’t call you a Trumpist, just a conservative.

I am less a conservative and more an anti Leftist. I am Pro Choice, don’t care who married whom and generally believe we should help those with rougher ladders to climb for success. What I do not like is blaming Trump for all the sins of this country and the world, blaming Jews and Israel for the same sins and the Leftists PC culture.

I did not leave the Democrat party, they left me. I am and always will be an Independent but it’s tough to support a party that openly votes in antisemites like Tlaib and Omar and who tells me that men may identify as women and play sports vs my daughters.

Informative. Libertarian?

Maybe? I generally Vote for the candidates who are pro business and pro military. I just find it illogical that people can state with a straight face that biological boys who identify as girls should be allowed to play contact sports vs my kids and I am not allowed to say anything. That is nuts.

At this point, Republicans are closer to Libertarians than the Democrat party.

Wasn't the case back 15 or 20 years ago.. I had more libertarian support from the Dems than the Reps.. Then the DEMS stopped being liberals and became leftists.. Can't talk to them anymore about Civil Liberties or moral capitalism or FOREIGN policy or any of the stuff we had in common..

"informative"

 

[Marion Morrison]

President Trump is still 'inheriting' Obama's problems. He won't need to take responsibility until mid way through his 2nd term like Obama.

1. I’m sure Obama did not make the farmers welfare recipients.
2. I’m sure Obama did not replenish the supplies in last 3 years.
3. I’m sure Obama did not get impeach.
4.I’m sure Obama did not pay for any fraudulent university or fraudulent foundation.

Trump inherit a booming economy that he doesn’t deserves.

I'm sure English is not your native language.
Go fuck yourself with a saguaro, leftist shillboi.
You're not American, fuck you.

Kind of interesting. I quoted some of your post on different thread but you remained so quiet. Is it because you and your buddies are here. LOL.

I get a lot of notices, link?
I'll skewer you there as well.

 

[flacaltenn]

No one this side of complete insanity, and with at least a lick of sense, would confuse a model with a "scientific" fact. A model is just a complex set of causations, or rather, in this case, statistical correlations put into action in order to determine more or less likely outcomes of an ongoing development - that is to say, a hypothesis.

So you're lecturing me on modeling?? You confused about the diff between "causations" and statistical correlations?? No matter.. Modeling AINT EITHER of them..

Modeling is the mathematical description of the behavior of a system.. It treats that system - be it a bridge or an airplane or the stock market or a pandemic the SAME way.. It produces a time and/or space variant SINGLE outcome or ensemble of outcomes..

And its usefulness for PREDICTION is only as good as the GUESSES you supply to it. And in THIS case, the guesses are NOT that good.. WHY??? Because there's no solid grounding in EMPIRICAL or ACADEMIC FACTS AND DATA on -- for instance -- what locking down a country the size and scope of America would DO to affect #infections vs time or #deaths vs time.. IN FACT -- CDC ADMITS it doesn't KNOW #infections.. It is guessing and the SCIENCE is NOT settled there.

So when IHME TUNES there model almost daily, it's an ADMISSION that they don't HAVE a predictive model YET... The Max death rate over various modeling runs just over a 3 week period (or slightly less) has gone from 1.2 -- 2MILL dead - to 100,00 or 200,000 dead - to 60,000 to 80,000 just recently.

My point WAS -- THIS "guessing" at the bureaucratic level is FAR LESS "proven" than the myriad of field reports coming in on HCQuine.. It's been ALL Ad Hoc.. And we don't even have to argue at this point.. Because the EXPERIENCE will be moving on in a couple weeks... And for the folks that want to HARANGUE the French, Russian, Spanish, Italian doctors who TOOK NOTES and TELL US that HCQuine was 30 or 50% effective in keeping folks out of respiratory trauma -- that's a far sight CLEARER than the modeling.....

And as Coyote said, the motive for HARANGUING that -- is just because Trump put out it there to extend some hope and compassion to the afflicted.. NOT because you'd personally argue with a loved one NOT TO TAKE IT --- because "science"....

 

[flacaltenn]

No, Dr. Birx did not call social distancing "academic".

Actually she used those exact words.. Talked about how it only EXISTED in academic exercises and textbooks until now...