Happy Columbus Day!

[Zincwarrior]

Diseases you say? Then why Mexico is full of the Natives/mestizos and the US has barely a handful of them?

Because

1) The native populations in the Americas were impressively larger, and the Spanish/Portuguese did not come to the Americas in large numbers, vs. the population that the Brits sent over time. But even there the populations in the Yucatan and the Amazon were particularly devastated. They found entire nations in the Amazon that are gone that early Spanish found, and when they came back a few years later were gone.

2) There were multiple larger populations in North America (Mississippian culture for example) that just effectively disappeared.

3) The UK colonists came in force to set up colonies. They and the US after them, just took out the tribes that were here. Early examples are the North East tribes, Cherokee, Seminoles. Later examples are the famous Lakota and Comanche.

 

[el midgetron]

The reality is that you try to justify the genocide of the Natives with ridiculous claims "they also fought, killed and raped each other'. Tell me more about pathetic.

There was no “genocide”. Most of the Indians died from diseases. No genocide has ever maintained the legal sovereignty of the people, or attempted to integrate some backwards Stone Age culture into their society.

The Indians tried to play the same game of warfare and conquest that they had always played. Unfortunately for them, they lost.

 

[el midgetron]

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

He was working for Spain at the time so he’s the first Highspanic American. Good thing this is highspanic heritage month.

 

[Zebra]

is it today?

 

[el midgetron]

is it today?

Hell yes.

 

[JOSweetHeart]

I only wish that the post offices were open because I am expecting something in the mail.

God bless you always!!!

Holly

P.S. But I guess that I can wait one more day.

 

[log cabin republican]

I'm Indian, and I have no problem with Columbus Day.

 

[ESay]

Because

1) The native populations in the Americas were impressively larger, and the Spanish/Portuguese did not come to the Americas in large numbers, vs. the population that the Brits sent over time. But even there the populations in the Yucatan and the Amazon were particularly devastated. They found entire nations in the Amazon that are gone that early Spanish found, and when they came back a few years later were gone.

2) There were multiple larger populations in North America (Mississippian culture for example) that just effectively disappeared.

3) The UK colonists came in force to set up colonies. They and the US after them, just took out the tribes that were here. Early examples are the North East tribes, Cherokee, Seminoles. Later examples are the famous Lakota and Comanche.

In other words, despite the fact that the Spaniards/Portuguese were far from being angels, their goal was not to clean those lands from native population entirely. Unlike the British colonists.

 

[BackAgain]

Happy Columbus Day!

 

[ESay]

There was no “genocide”. Most of the Indians died from diseases. No genocide has ever maintained the legal sovereignty of the people, or attempted to integrate some backwards Stone Age culture into their society.

The Indians tried to play the same game of warfare and conquest that they had always played. Unfortunately for them, they lost.

Strangely enough, the 'Spanish' Indians were not affected by diseases as the 'British' ones were. Yes, unfortunately for them, they lost. And they were genocided. Shit happens. Though, recent influx of the Mexicans into the US, especially in some certain states, can be seen as some historical justice in action.

 

[Hellbilly]

I'm Indian, and I have no problem with Columbus Day.

How far back have you traced your line?

 

[el midgetron]

Strangely enough, the 'Spanish' Indians were not affected by diseases as the 'British' ones were. Yes, unfortunately for them, they lost. And they were genocided. Shit happens. Though, recent influx of the Mexicans into the US, especially in some certain states, can be seen as some historical justice in action.

No, it just demonstrates that you don’t care about colonization or “your land” at all. You just hate white people.

“Spanish” Indians is not the term you are trying to use. Even if you were using the proper term, you would still be making false claims.

Mesoamericans succumb to deadly measles epidemic - Timeline - Native Voices

www.nlm.nih.gov

Drought, epidemic disease, and the fall of classic period cultures in Mesoamerica (AD 750-950). Hemorrhagic fevers as a cause of massive population loss - PubMed

The classical period in Mexico (AD 250-750) was an era of splendor. The city of Teotihuacan was one of the largest and most sophisticated human conglomerates of the pre-industrial world. The Mayan civilization in southeastern Mexico and the Yucatan peninsula reached an impressive degree of...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Cocoliztli epidemics - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

How smallpox devastated the Aztecs – and helped Spain conquer an American civilization 500 years ago

Epidemics are nothing new, and some widespread infectious diseases have profoundly changed the course of human history.

www.pbs.org

 

[el midgetron]

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Like 700 years ago

Just stop

 

[DigitalDrifter]

They discovered nothing

Yes, it WAS nothing, but then the technological world discovered it, and brought you the riches you enjoy today.

Electricity, is nice, isn't it!

 

[ESay]

No, it just demonstrates that you don’t care about colonization or “your land” at all. You just hate white people.

“Spanish” Indians is not the term you are trying to use. Even if you were using the proper term, you would still be making false claims.

Mesoamericans succumb to deadly measles epidemic - Timeline - Native Voices

www.nlm.nih.gov

Drought, epidemic disease, and the fall of classic period cultures in Mesoamerica (AD 750-950). Hemorrhagic fevers as a cause of massive population loss - PubMed

The classical period in Mexico (AD 250-750) was an era of splendor. The city of Teotihuacan was one of the largest and most sophisticated human conglomerates of the pre-industrial world. The Mayan civilization in southeastern Mexico and the Yucatan peninsula reached an impressive degree of...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Cocoliztli epidemics - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

How smallpox devastated the Aztecs – and helped Spain conquer an American civilization 500 years ago

Epidemics are nothing new, and some widespread infectious diseases have profoundly changed the course of human history.

www.pbs.org

Do you even grasp that this your post supports my point? I never argued that the Native American communities were not severely devastated by the diseases, including those brought by the Europeans.

But. Despite the fact that the Central America and what now is Mexico, among others, were severely affected by these diseases, Mexico is now full of mestizos. While the US has only a handful of them.

That proves the point that diseases, despite their severe impact, may not have been the major factor in drastical reduction of the Native population in former British colonies. The main factor was that the British colonists came to 'cleanse' those lands, unlike the Spaniards who never pursued this goal.

 

[el midgetron]

That proves the point that diseases, despite their severe impact, may not have been the major factor in drastical reduction of the Native population in former British colonies. The main factor was that the British colonists came to 'cleanse' those lands, unlike the Spaniards who never pursued this goal.

Is that why Indians have sovereign land? Is that why the Europeans attempted to educate and assimilate the Indians into Western society? Is that why the Europeans didn’t just cleanse the land of the Indians? What was stopping them?

The Europeans bent over backwards to make peace with the Indians. But Indians made a constant menace of themselves, which eventually lead to their total submission. Yet, even then, the Europeans gave them sovereign land and still attempted to bring them into modern society.

The Europeans could have easily wiped them out completely at this point but they didn’t. They even went on to venerate the Indians as symbols of America. You don’t put something you despise, or want to “genocide” or “cleanse the land of”, on your currency, your postage stamps and any other item intended to represent your country and national heritage.

You are assuming one conclusion validates the other. Just because disease ravaged all of the Americas doesn’t mean that the “British came to “cleanse” the land” or committed a genocide. There is a host of differences between what happened on either side of the boarder. You have ignored these differences in favor of making a false equivalency.

 

[skye]

That what open borders gets you.

Biden has allowed tens of millions more into your lands. Yet you’re voting for him.

Exactly. ^^

 

[DakotaKai_fan20]

I am a Republican. I don't celebrate Columbus Day as my European ancestors committed a genocide against my Native American ancestors.