God's Holy Days vs Pagan Holidays

[konradv]

konradv

re: “I never said they did,,,”

But you did. In your post #3 you said: “Jesus himself told his disciples that what they did in His name was alright. They didn't submit to pagan holidays, they co-opted them.”

Don't really see what your point is. He gave them permisssion to do as they saw fit and they went out to spread The Word. The fact that he didn't give them explicit permission to create new Holy Days seems to be irrelevant, IMO.

 

[ABikerSailor]

konradv

re: “I never said they did,,,”

But you did. In your post #3 you said: “Jesus himself told his disciples that what they did in His name was alright. They didn't submit to pagan holidays, they co-opted them.”

Don't really see what your point is. He gave them permisssion to do as they saw fit and they went out to spread The Word. The fact that he didn't give them explicit permission to create new Holy Days seems to be irrelevant, IMO.

Considering what HaShem (God) stated in the first 3 Commandments, with Yeshua being the Son of God, I really don't think that He would have given permission for His disciples to even come close to pagan worship.

Wanna see how HaShem handled it? Read Judges sometime.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Nothing new here. As religions developed the new would be superimposed on the old. This was especially true of those subjugated into a new religion via conquest.

Wrong. Judaic theology has stayed pretty much the same since Moses first received the Torah and the 10 Commandments.

It's when Rome got involved and started trying to sell Christianity to the Pagans (better to rule over them if you've got a religion), THAT is when things started to get messed up.

Incidentally, the Easter Sunrise Service is actually an observance of the Spring solstice, which is a pagan ritual.

Ever since the Catholics messed things up, especially with their editing of the Bible into the KJV, things have gone from bad to worse.

And what of the religions that were absorbed or displaced by Judaism by force or otherwise?

There was no doubt a blending of beliefs as the one god religious sects replaced the many god sects.

 

[Dragon]

And what of the religions that were absorbed or displaced by Judaism by force or otherwise?

There was no doubt a blending of beliefs as the one god religious sects replaced the many god sects.

Actually there's a good deal of evidence in the Bible that the Jews of those days were not a "one god" religious sect. The early Jews were not monotheistic, that is, not believers that only one God exists. They were, or at least were supposed to be, monotheolatrous -- worshipers of only one God -- but only because he was their god and they were supposed to be true to him and not go fooling around with the deities of foreign peoples. (Of course, as the tirades of many of the prophets testify, that was a rule often honored more in the breach than in the observance.)

A profound change came over the Jewish religious system during the Babylonian captivity. Unable to carry out the prescribed religious rituals, they felt they could not worship YHVH in a foreign land. Earlier captives of the Assyrians had lost their faith and assimilated, but the Jews in Babylon appear to have evolved a concept of God that was no longer tied to a place and was universal. It was at this point that Judaism became a monotheistic religion.

During the time before, it's very likely indeed that some of that foreign religious thinking found its way into Jewish practice, especially considering how many Jews did fool around with foreign gods, in spite of the first commandment.

 

[rstrats]

konradv,

re: “Don't really see what your point is.”


My point is that you say what you say you didn’t say.

 

[konradv]

konradv,

re: “Don't really see what your point is.”


My point is that you say what you say you didn’t say.

I'm saying you're saying something I did not say. Is that clear?!?!

 

[konradv]

konradv

re: “I never said they did,,,”

But you did. In your post #3 you said: “Jesus himself told his disciples that what they did in His name was alright. They didn't submit to pagan holidays, they co-opted them.”

Don't really see what your point is. He gave them permisssion to do as they saw fit and they went out to spread The Word. The fact that he didn't give them explicit permission to create new Holy Days seems to be irrelevant, IMO.

Considering what HaShem (God) stated in the first 3 Commandments, with Yeshua being the Son of God, I really don't think that He would have given permission for His disciples to even come close to pagan worship.

Wanna see how HaShem handled it? Read Judges sometime.

That's Old Testament law. Just as circumcision isn't required of Christians, neither are many of the other strictures of Mosaic Law. That was worked out during the first councils of the church, long before Constantine and Nicea, based on the verse I originally cited.

 

[rstrats]

konrady,

re: “I'm saying you're saying something I did not say. Is that clear?!?! “

I was merely quoting you. How can you disagree with your own quote?

 

[uscitizen]

We had Fridays and Saturdays when that was written n the bible?

 

[konradv]

konrady,

re: “I'm saying you're saying something I did not say. Is that clear?!?! “

I was merely quoting you. How can you disagree with your own quote?

NO, you're misquoting me. I never said Jesus specifically mentioned anything in the quote, just that he gave permission for them to do things as they saw fit. It's time for you to anwer the question, why does the quote I cited not prove that co-opting older religious ceremonies would have been OK with Jesus?

 

[konradv]

The only universal religious holiday in the U.S. is Festivus Maximus.

 

[rstrats]

konradv,

re: “NO, you're misquoting me...It's time for you to anwer the question, why does the quote I cited not prove that co-opting older religious ceremonies would have been OK with Jesus?”

Maybe it would have been OK. However, there is no scripture to back up your statement which was: “They didn't submit to pagan holidays, they co-opted them.” Are you suggesting that some hacker snuck those words into your post?

 

[ABikerSailor]

konrady,

re: “I'm saying you're saying something I did not say. Is that clear?!?! “

I was merely quoting you. How can you disagree with your own quote?

NO, you're misquoting me. I never said Jesus specifically mentioned anything in the quote, just that he gave permission for them to do things as they saw fit. It's time for you to anwer the question, why does the quote I cited not prove that co-opting older religious ceremonies would have been OK with Jesus?

Yeshua was the Son of God, and as such, He was also Jewish, so no...........He wouldn't give permission to mix other religions with His, or the other way around.