First in the nation, healthcare is now a human right in Oregon

[Carl in Michigan]

I think you need to think this through. Calling something a HUMAN RIGHT doesn't mean you get everything you want. It means that government controls how much you get. A bit Orwellian in that sense, but that's how progs roll.

What do you think I believe?
If the sarcasm isn't obvious, I don't know what to tell you. Everybody else gets it.

 

[dblack]

What do you think I believe?
If the sarcasm isn't obvious, I don't know what to tell you. Everybody else gets it.

I get it. I'm just trying to help.

 

[toobfreak]

Quit crying, your broke ass can go to the doctor now.

And get minimal, socialist healthcare any illegal undocumented immigrant can get---- well, maybe not that good.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Healthcare in South Korea - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Medicare is pretty good. It could be better, but the Parents liked it. It really beat no healthcare.

Except for the fact it pays peanuts.

 

[struth]

healthcare has always been a human right

 

[Rogue AI]

Funny, they never really define what 'health care' entails....From the OP's link...

"The amendment reads: “It is the obligation of the state to ensure that every resident of Oregon has access to cost-effective, clinically appropriate and affordable health care as a fundamental right.”

"It does not define “cost-effective, clinically appropriate and affordable,” nor does it say who would foot the bill."

It's now in their Constitution, so the state is now liable for the costs. The whole thing will crash and burn once the homeless, addicts, and others realize just how exploitable this is.

 

[presonorek]

Another first.
This state has now fully become the leftist's utopia. We've decriminalized ALL illicit drugs, we damn near have made it nearly impossible to buy a gun with Measure 114 that these asswipes voted for, and now healthcare is a 'human right'.
Anytime you hear someone say "healthcare should be a human right", what they're really saying is, "someone else needs to pay for my healthcare".

Voters in Oregon pass health care measure​

By AP staff (AP)
PORTLAND, Ore. Nov. 14, 2022 9:01 p.m.
Oregon voters have narrowly passed a measure that decrees health care a human right.
Measure 111 makes Oregon the first state in the nation to change its constitution to explicitly declare affordable health care a fundamental right.

Voters in Oregon pass health care measure

Oregon voters have narrowly passed a measure that mandates the state recognize health care as a human right.

www.opb.org

I think the other 47 states (excluding Hawaii and Alaska) need to start budgeting money for bus fare to Oregon for people with debilitating illnesses. Get the sick people out of their own states and send them to greener pastures of free health care. Thank you Oregon for being an experiment. I hope all goes well. I suspect your population will increase dramatically. I hope that was the goal.

 

[presonorek]

It's now in their Constitution, so the state is now liable for the costs. The whole thing will crash and burn once the homeless, addicts, and others realize just how exploitable this is.

Yeah. I suspect their population to spike over the next few years. (if you know what I mean)

 

[presonorek]

You're describing what you imagine to be a problem of our government, not a problem inherent in government. The results of first world nations who provide universal Healthcare to their citizens is in. Their citizens live longer, healthier lives and their Healthcare costs are less than that of ours.

Americans aren't dying younger because of our health care system. We are dying younger because of our buffet system. If other countries started eating all the amazing food we have in the United States they could die younger too.

 

[presonorek]

When is a person denied care in the US?

I know. Nobody wants to admit that we already have free health care in the United States. We just don't officially proclaim it. You can go to the emergency room in any hospital in the United States and they have to treat you even if they only receive $0.01 of government money. I'd call that free health care.

 

[presonorek]

If I get health care that won't bankrupt me? Heck yes. I've had friends lose their life savings to pay for their spouse's cancer treatments.

Name five persons that should have paid for your friend's spouse's cancer treatment. Why would doctors practice if they aren't going to get paid? People buy $30,000 cars. People buy $200,000 houses. It seems to me that saving someone's life is a pretty valuable service that people would be willing to pay top dollar for. Why does nobody want to pay for health care? And if your friend didn't want to pay for his wife's cancer treatment then why would somebody else want to? This whole mentality is whacky to me. I'll never understand the healthcare industry, the health insurance industry, or the industry of higher education. These services are so convoluted by whacky delusions and government interference that it has become unintelligible. I prefer going to the store, seeing the price, and picking the product I want. There is no food insurance. There is no book insurance. There is no internet insurance. If I want something, I buy it. If the price is too high, I don't buy it. I think rational people have lost the debate and we should just grab some popcorn to see how this is all going to play out.

 

[presonorek]

As long as Oregon and it's voters pay for it... I'm not

The sick people from your state will be moving to Oregon so your taxes may actually go down.

 

[Curried Goats]

The police have a monopoly on violence, as does government. It's necessary for there to be consistent laws and law enforcement. We all have to play the same game by the same rules. With other services, like healthcare, or even the fire protection (not always a government service, btw), don't require that kind conformity, and in those cases people should remain free to go their own way.

Go there own way includes advocating for Universal Healthcare.

The Constitution is supposed to be the documented agreement regarding which things government should do, and which things it should not do. Healthcare isn't one of things listed in the Constitution.

I don't remember seeing any mention of standing armies or police forces in the Constitution.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

Another first.
This state has now fully become the leftist's utopia. We've decriminalized ALL illicit drugs, we damn near have made it nearly impossible to buy a gun with Measure 114 that these asswipes voted for, and now healthcare is a 'human right'.
Anytime you hear someone say "healthcare should be a human right", what they're really saying is, "someone else needs to pay for my healthcare".

Voters in Oregon pass health care measure​

By AP staff (AP)
PORTLAND, Ore. Nov. 14, 2022 9:01 p.m.
Oregon voters have narrowly passed a measure that decrees health care a human right.
Measure 111 makes Oregon the first state in the nation to change its constitution to explicitly declare affordable health care a fundamental right.

Voters in Oregon pass health care measure

Oregon voters have narrowly passed a measure that mandates the state recognize health care as a human right.

www.opb.org

Want to see how Government run healthcare works ?

8 years after scandal, VA is still untruthful about wait times for veteran care

The effort to conceal the obvious — that the VA is failing to provide timely care — prevents vets from getting referred to non-VA doctors as required.

news.yahoo.com

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Another first.
This state has now fully become the leftist's utopia. We've decriminalized ALL illicit drugs, we damn near have made it nearly impossible to buy a gun with Measure 114 that these asswipes voted for, and now healthcare is a 'human right'.
Anytime you hear someone say "healthcare should be a human right", what they're really saying is, "someone else needs to pay for my healthcare".

Voters in Oregon pass health care measure​

By AP staff (AP)
PORTLAND, Ore. Nov. 14, 2022 9:01 p.m.
Oregon voters have narrowly passed a measure that decrees health care a human right.
Measure 111 makes Oregon the first state in the nation to change its constitution to explicitly declare affordable health care a fundamental right.

Voters in Oregon pass health care measure

Oregon voters have narrowly passed a measure that mandates the state recognize health care as a human right.

www.opb.org

Democratic Party definition of "Affordable Healthcare".

1) High Deductible that basically means you will never receive a dime in benefits unless you have a catastrophic event.
2) Lowering copay to 70/30 from 80/20, so if you ever actually get any benefits... it will be less than before.
3) Enormous out-of-pocket limits. In the 5 figures. So, again, if you have a catastrophic event and actually get benefits you will still go bankrupt.

And THAT - is the definition of Affordable Care under the Democrat Party

 

[presonorek]

Democratic Party definition of "Affordable Healthcare".

1) High Deductible that basically means you will never receive a dime in benefits unless you have a catastrophic event.
2) Lowering copay to 70/30 from 80/20, so if you ever actually get any benefits... it will be less than before.
3) Enormous out-of-pocket limits. In the 5 figures. So, again, if you have a catastrophic event and actually get benefits you will still go bankrupt.

And THAT - is the definition of Affordable Care under the Democrat Party

There are some people that use the term Healthcare and Health Insurance interchangeably. Healthcare is when the doctor performs surgery. Health Insurance is when a salesman collects money from a group of people collectively and hopes to pay out less money than was collected.

Let's try not to confuse the two things. This issue is already complicated enough. The terms should be used properly. Does the law suggest health care is a right or that health insurance is a right? Health care is already free in every single hospital in the United States that receives $0.01 or more in government funding. Basically that means the law says nothing. If the law says that health insurance is a right then you are right. It may have to be a Oregon run insurance policy like you are describing. The purpose of insurance is to take in more than you pay out.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

There are some people that use the term Healthcare and Health Insurance interchangeably. Healthcare is when the doctor performs surgery. Health Insurance is when a salesman collects money from a group of people collectively and hopes to pay out less money than was collected.

Let's try not to confuse the two things. This issue is already complicated enough. The terms should be used properly. Does the law suggest health care is a right or that health insurance is a right? Health care is already free in every single hospital in the United States that receives $0.01 or more in government funding. Basically that means the law says nothing. If the law says that health insurance is a right then you are right. It may have to be a Oregon run insurance policy like you are describing. The purpose of insurance is to take in more than you pay out.

I am confusing nothing... they are.
They are talking about "affordable healthcare" as a right.
Which, yes, as you say, is meaningless really. What is affordable healthcare anyway?
How can you define that term?
Obama did - and look at what that did - raised the cost of healthcare for all but the poorest in the nation. And note - I said COST of healthcare. Which means - what you pay for healthcare out of your own pocket. Which has STEADILY risen for the past 14 years. Even though the cost of many-many procedures has gone down.

 

[dblack]

Go there own way includes advocating for Universal Healthcare.

No - that's insisting that their preferences be forced on others. "Going your own way" doesn't include forcing others to go that way as well. --- Is this deliberte irony?

I don't remember seeing any mention of standing armies or police forces in the Constitution.

Try reading it again. Maybe take a class or something.

In any case, what are you trying to say? Should government be allowed to do anything the majority votes for? Do you acknowledge any limits on state power?

 

[Curried Goats]

No - that's insisting that their preferences be forced on others. "Going your own way" doesn't include forcing others to go that way as well.

Are you going for irony?

We all agree to participate in democratic government you Snowflake, no one is forcing you to. **** off into the woods and live by yourself if you don't want to pay taxes.

Try reading it again. Maybe take a class or something.

Oh I've read it, it's how I know it ain't in there.

In any case, what are you trying to say?

I'm saying that you're argument that the government cant provide universal healthcare because it isn't in the Constitution is stupid and bullshit because all sorts of things arent mentioned in the Constitution like police forces and yet you arent here arguing they shouldnt exist either.

Should government be allowed to do anything the majority votes for? Do you acknowledge any limits on state power?

I do, I just don't see funding and operating a national Healthcare system to be one of them.

 

[dblack]

Health care is already free in every single hospital in the United States that receives $0.01 or more in government funding.

Sorry to pluck this out, but it's one of the bigger turds in the universal healthcare argument. It simply not true. While these hospitals are required to provide emergency treatment without payment up front, patients are still billed and most of the still pay. And, if they're not paying, they're kicked to the curb as soon as they are stabilized.

So, it might seem like a nice wedge for nationalizing healthcare - but it's not a declaration of a right. Just an unfunded mandate on hospitals to provide emergency services.