Zone1 Did Satan tell Eve the truth: "You shall NOT surely die?"

[Hafar1014]

lol more like Jews and Muslims created 2000 years of violence against Jews and Muslims.

Thats today in fact crazy Islam is at war with humanity. Look up the Crusades learn some history. The Spanish Inquisition could help you understand too.

 

[Woodznutz]

There is no Satan in Genesis its a serpent the metaphor for guile and the only animal with the power of speech from Hebrew folklore. Jews wo wrote Genesis cant believe in a devil or Satan

Moses was a Levite, not a Jew. The scribes who did the actual writing were likely Levites as well. Lucifer/Satan was likened to a snake, not an actual snake. How it manifested itself to Eve is unknown.

 

[Woodznutz]

There is no Satan in Genesis Jews cant have a devil and Jews wrote Genesis.

Again, Moses was a Levite. Jews had no hand in recording the inspired words of God.

 

[Hafar1014]

Again, Moses was a Levite. Jews had no hand in recording the inspired words of God.

Genesis was written by Jews who used their beliefs. No Satan or hell or original sin exists. Those are Christian creations needed to create the Jesus myth.

 

[Woodznutz]

God said that death would come from eating the fruit.
Satan said not so fast.
Both were correct.
Satan knew that forgiveness was possible for man through substitutionary death.
This death was shown to Adam and Eve through the animal sacrifice that God made on their behalf. However, A and E did eventually die physically. It is certain that they will have eternal life however.

 

[jacksonlamb]

No one knows, Dennis.

If there is, we will find out. If there is not, we will never know.

 

[Woodznutz]

Genesis was written by Jews who used their beliefs. No Satan or hell or original sin exists. Those are Christian creations needed to create the Jesus myth.

One of the biggest errors even many Christians still believe is that all Israelites are/were Jews. The 'Jewifying' of Israel is the biggest hoodwinking in the history of revisionism.

 

[Hafar1014]

God said that death would come from eating the fruit.
Satan said not so fast.
Both were correct.
Satan knew that forgiveness was possible for man through substitutionary death.
This death was shown to Adam and Eve through the animal sacrifice that God made on their behalf. However, A and E did eventually die physically. It is certain that they will have eternal life however.

They didnt die did they. That was a ploy by God a test of free will. Then after they ate the fruiy God said what hast thou done? He know. He is giving Adam a chance to repent to confirm he did learn right from wrong. Thats the test the trial. Adam was ment to eat the fruit all along. That cant be a sin since he is doing what god wants.
There is no hell devil or original sin. Those are Christian inventions to create new religion based on threats and punsihment.

 

[Hafar1014]

One of the biggest errors even many Christians still believe is that all Israelites are/were Jews. The 'Jewifying' of Israel is the biggest hoodwinking in the history of Christianity.

You post gets that award

 

[Woodznutz]

They didnt die did they. That was a ploy by God a test of free will. Then after they ate the fruiy God said what hast thou done? He know. He is giving Adam a chance to repent to confirm he did learn right from wrong. Thats the test the trial. Adam was ment to eat the fruit all along. That cant be a sin since he is doing what god wants.
There is no hell devil or original sin. Those are Christian inventions to create new religion based on threats and punsihment.

"Hell" is simply death, not eternal life in torment.

 

[Woodznutz]

You post gets that award

Using your Bible show me that Moses was a Jew. Oh wait! You don't believe your own bible.

 

[Woodznutz]

Genesis was written by Jews who used their beliefs. No Satan or hell or original sin exists. Those are Christian creations needed to create the Jesus myth.

Judaism is the master of religious myths (although some aboriginal tribes could give you a run for the money).

 

[EdwinAMartin]

Thats today in fact crazy Islam is at war with humanity. Look up the Crusades learn some history. The Spanish Inquisition could help you understand too.

I already know all there is to know about the Crusades, the Inquisition, and Islam's wars. Maybe you need to go study them yourself. Jews aren't exempt from criticism because Islam did some stuff too. The Babylonian Jews started a permanent war against other Jews, and continued it for 1,800 years in the case of the Orthodox and ultra-Orthodox. Just because they lost a lot of them doesn't endow them with innocence and everybody else with guilt. Many of their problems have been self-inflicted. The Babylonian Jews' descendants were Islam's allies more often than not.

 

[EdwinAMartin]

One of the biggest errors even many Christians still believe is that all Israelites are/were Jews. The 'Jewifying' of Israel is the biggest hoodwinking in the history of revisionism.

What?

Using your Bible show me that Moses was a Jew. Oh wait! You don't believe your own bible.

So what was he? Irish?

The Mad Revisionist - The Irish Potato Hoax

[In our next installment: Bronfmans and Kennedys, Rothschilds and Guinnesses (oh my!): The ZOG-HOG Connection]

* NOTE: It is actually erroneous to refer to the Irish as Celts, though we do so because our readers may not be aware of the distinction. Although the Irish may have some Celtic blood in them, their island was beset by the same waves of invasion as England was. Therefore, they are just as much Saxon, Viking, or Normand as they are Celt. Consequently, their claim on Northern Ireland is as ludicrous as Norway or Normandy laying claim to it. However, it is also a fact, suppressed from our schools and from the controlled media, that the Celts migrated from as far as Eastern Europe, and possibly into the steppes of Russia. Therefore, there can be no more doubt: revisionist research has proved conclusively that the true Celts are in fact EAST EUROPEAN JEWS!

 

[EdwinAMartin]

Moses was a Levite, not a Jew. The scribes who did the actual writing were likely Levites as well. Lucifer/Satan was likened to a snake, not an actual snake. How it manifested itself to Eve is unknown.

I agree that before Ezra and the Babylonians tried to turn the Hebrew religion into a self-serving racist cult and set themselves up as 'the Real Jews' it was a more open tribal federation, but yes, they were Jewish culturally and linguistically.

 

[Woodznutz]

I agree that before Ezra and the Babylonians tried to turn the Hebrew religion into a self-serving racist cult and set themselves up as 'the Real Jews' it was a more open tribal federation, but yes, they were Jewish culturally and linguistically.

All of Israel shared the same general culture which was largely based in the 'Hebrew' religion up until the split in the days of Jeroboam and Rehoboam. Even after the return from Babylonian captivity daily life was still governed by the same laws that had governed all Israel. What became "Jewish" was the interpretation of the Law, which was appropriated from the Levites and corrupted by the Jewish leaders.

 

[EdwinAMartin]

Even after the return from Babylonian captivity daily life was still governed by the same laws that had governed all Israel.

Not really. In the 500 years or so before the Christian era there were several changes and mutations, civil wars, followed by a Greek 'renaissance' type social revolution and finally a Roman occupation. Pharisaic 'Judaism' didn't win out over several other factions until the failed Revolt around 65-70 A.D., and after the Bar Kokhba Revolt and the attempts to murder all the Samaritans, 'Galileans' AKA Christians, and Romans, they finally invented 'Rabbinical Judaism' and formalized the 'Oral Torah' as their gimmick. That's the short answer, without writing an entire book on some 600 years of Jewish and ME history. Jews remained a distinct culture, even if most were non-religious.

 

[DennisPTate]

No one knows, Dennis.

If there is, we will find out. If there is not, we will never know.

In 1995 the gifted Rick Joyner was given an exceptionally interesting meeting with the Patriarch Adam. Adam gave a message that can be encouraging to all of us.

[Rick Joyner, The Call] :
" Love Releases Life
Another man who looked almost exactly like Abel came and stood beside him.

“I am Adam,” he said. “I was given authority over the earth, but I gave it to the evil one by obeying evil. He now rules in my place and your place. The earth was given to man, but the evil one has taken it. The authority I lost was restored by the cross. Jesus Christ is ‘the last Adam,’ and He will soon take His authority and rule. He will rule through mankind because He gave the earth to mankind. Those who live in your times will prepare the earth for Him to rule.”

“Please tell me more,” I asked, a little surprised to see Adam, but wanting to hear everything he had to say. “How do we prepare for Him?”

“Love,” he said. “You must love one another. You must love the earth, and you must love life. My sin released the death that now flows as rivers upon the earth. Your love will release rivers of life. When evil reigns, death is stronger than life, and death prevails over life. When righteousness reigns, life prevails, and life is stronger than death. Soon the life of the Son of God will swallow up the death that was released through my disobedience. It is not just living that you must love, but life. Death is your enemy. You are called to be a messenger of life.

“When the Lord’s people begin to love, He will use them to release His judgments. His judgments are to be desired. The whole world is groaning and travailing as it waits for His judgments, and when they come, the world will learn righteousness. What He is about to do, He will do through His people, and His people will stand as Elijah in the last days. Their words will shut up the heavens or bring rain; they will prophesy earthquakes and famines, and they will come to pass; they will stop famines and earthquakes.

“When they release armies in the heavens, armies will march on the earth. When they hold back armies, there will be peace. They will decide where He shows mercy and where He shows His wrath. They will have this authority because they will love, and those who love will be one with Him. What you will see through that door is to help prepare you for what He is about to do through His people.

“I know authority. I also know the responsibility of authority. Because of the great authority that I was given, I am responsible for what has happened to the earth. Even so, the grace of God began to cover me, and God’s great redemption will soon swallow up my mistake. Peace will be taken from the earth, but you are called to help restore it. Peace prevails in heaven, and you are called to bring heaven to earth. Those who abide in His presence will know peace and will spread peace.

“The earth itself will shake and tremble. Times of trouble greater than have ever been known will begin to move across the earth like great waves of the sea. Even so, those who know Him will not be troubled. They will stand before the raging of the seas and say, ‘Peace, be still’ and the seas will be calm. Even the least of His little ones will be like a great fortress of peace that will stand through all that is coming. His glory will be revealed to His people first and then through them. Even the creation will recognize Him in His people and will obey them as it does Him.

“This is the authority that I had, and it will be given to mankind again. I used my authority to turn Paradise into a wilderness. The Lord will use His authority to turn the wilderness into Paradise again. This is the authority that He is giving to His people. I used mine wrongly and death came. When His authority is used in righteousness, it will release life. Be careful how you use authority. With authority comes responsibility. You, too, can use it wrongly, but you will not do this if you love. As all of heaven knows, ‘Love never fails.”

“What about the earthquakes, famines and even wars that you said we would release on the earth? Won’t this be releasing death?” I asked.

“All the death that is coming upon the world is being allowed to prepare the way for life. Everything that is sown must be reaped, unless those who have sown evil call upon the cross in Spirit and truth. The army of the cross is about to be released, and it will march in the power of the cross, carrying the offer of mercy to all. Those who reject the mercy of God have rejected life.”

“That is a great responsibility,” I said. “How do we know when they have rejected His mercy?”

“Disobedience brought death, and obedience will bring life. When I walked with God, He taught me His ways. As I walked with Him, I began to know Him. You must walk with God and learn of His ways. Your authority is His authority, and you must be one with Him in order to use it. The weapons of His army are not carnal—they are spiritual and much more powerful than any earthly weapons. Your most powerful weapons are truth and love. Even the final judgment of destruction is God’s love extended in mercy.

“When truth spoken in love is rejected, death has been chosen over life. You will understand this as you walk with Him. You will come to understand the Spirit that He has given to you to bring life and not death. There is a time to give men over to reap what they have sown, but you must do all things in obedience. Jesus came to give life. He does not desire for any to perish, and this must be your desire also. For this reason, you must even love your enemies if you are to be trusted with the authority that He wants to give to His people.

“The time is at hand for the fulfillment of what has been written. His people have prayed for more time, and He gave it to them. However, few have used it wisely. You have a little more time, but soon the time can no longer be delayed. The time is near when time itself will seem to speed up. As it is written, when He comes, He will come quickly. However, you are not to fear the times. If you fear Him, you do not need to fear anything that is coming upon the earth.

“All that is about to happen is coming so that His wisdom can again prevail on earth just as it does in heaven. All of the evil that was sown in mankind is about to be reaped. Even so, the good that He has sown will also be reaped. Goodness is stronger than evil. Love is stronger than death. He walked the earth to destroy the works of the devil, and He will finish what He has begun.”

Power And Love​

As Adam talked, I was captured by his grace and dignity. I began to wonder if he had possibly lived his whole life after the fall without sinning again because he seemed to be so pure. Knowing my thoughts, he changed the subject briefly to answer them.

“I lived long on the earth because sin did not have a deep root in me. Even though I had sinned, I was created to walk with God, and my desire was still for Him. I did not know the depths of sin that the following generations knew. As sin grew, life was shortened, but in every generation, those who walk with God touch the life that is in God. Because Moses walked so closely with God, he would have lived on had the Lord not taken him. Enoch walked with Him so closely that the Lord had to take him as well. That is why Jesus said, ‘I am the resurrection and the life; he who believes in Me shall live even if he dies, and everyone who lives and believes in Me shall never die.’ “What you are seeing in me is not just the lack of sin, but the presence of life that I had on the earth. What we were on earth will remain a part of who we are forever. I can look at all of the others here who are a part of the great cloud of witnesses and know much about their life on earth.”

“So you are a part of the great cloud of witnesses.”

“Yes. My story is a part of the eternal gospel. My wife and I were the first to taste sin, and the first to see our children reap the consequences of disobedience. We have beheld the death spread through each generation, but we have also beheld the cross and seen the victory over sin.

“Satan has boasted since the cross that Jesus could redeem men but could not change them. During the times of the greatest darkness and evil that are about to come, His people will stand as a testimony for all time that He not only redeemed His people from sin, but He also removed sin from them. Through them, He will remove sin from the whole earth. He will now display to the whole creation the power of His new creation. He did not come just to forgive sin, but to save mankind from sin, and He is returning for a people who are without stain from the world. This will come to pass in the most difficult of times. “I was created to love the Lord and to love the earth, as were all people. I have loathed the sight of the world’s rivers becoming sewers. Even more have I loathed the sight of what has happened to the human mind. The philosophies of the human mind now filling the streams of human thought are as loathsome as the sewage filling the rivers. But the rivers of human thought will one day be pure again, just as the rivers of the earth. By this, for all time to come, it will be proven that good is stronger than evil.

“The Lord did not go to the cross just to redeem, but also to restore. He walked the earth as a man to show mankind how to live. He will now reveal Himself through His chosen ones to show them who they were created to be. This demonstration will not just come through power, but through love. He will give you power because He is all powerful, and power is also a revelation of Him. Even so, He uses His power because of love and so must you. Even His judgments come because of love. When you send them forth, it must be because of love. Even His final judgment of the earth will be His final mercy.”

I looked at Adam, Abel, Lot and Jonah as they stood together. I knew that it would take forever to understand the depths of the revelation of the great gospel of God that each of their lives represented. Adam’s disobedience made the way for Abel’s obedience, whose blood still speaks as a harbinger of salvation. Righteous Lot could not save a city, while an unrighteous Jonah could. Like the four gospels, there seemed to be no end to the understanding that could be learned from them. This, too, was my call.

4 Truth And Life : The Call

This sequel to The Final Quest issues a prophetic challenge to seize your destiny. Rick Joyner explores the restoration of the earth and the ultimate purpose of the Christian life in the face of spiritual darkness.

ccl-china.org

 

[DennisPTate]

Not really. In the 500 years or so before the Christian era there were several changes and mutations, civil wars, followed by a Greek 'renaissance' type social revolution and finally a Roman occupation. Pharisaic 'Judaism' didn't win out over several other factions until the failed Revolt around 65-70 A.D., and after the Bar Kokhba Revolt and the attempts to murder all the Samaritans, 'Galileans' AKA Christians, and Romans, they finally invented 'Rabbinical Judaism' and formalized the 'Oral Torah' as their gimmick. That's the short answer, without writing an entire book on some 600 years of Jewish and ME history. Jews remained a distinct culture, even if most were non-religious.

Shalom EdwinAMartin:

Am I an idiot to feel that a tiny percentage of Jews felt such extreme animosity toward Rabbi Yeshua - Jesus that they essentially decided that the enemy of my enemy.... must be my friend? Eight thousand five hundred wealtiest of the wealthy is only about one person in a million, [a tiny fraction of all humanity].

Did they decide that Jesus was the ultimate "enemy" of Rabbinic Judaism and that therefore.....
maybe "Satan," [perhaps especially "Azazel" whose name is in Leviticus chapter sixteen], must be at least something of a "friend" to Rabbinic Judaism?

Back in 1990 I began to ask questions and even pray about that subject as you can see from my first e-mail that I sent off to a Jerusalem Sanhedrin Rabbi. [Rabbi Hollander gave me permission to make this correspondence available to anybody who might be able to assist with the long term goal of building a Ezekiel chapter forty to forty eight temple complex as well as a replica of a modern Third Temple over the Gihon Spring that would be a replica of the Temple of King Solomon. I am hopeful that some of these discussions may well influence some influential readers one of these days?

Yeshayahu Hollander
From:yeshol
@g
To:tate4pictoucentre
@yahoo
ca
Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 2:12 PM

​

Dear Mr. Tate,​

​

I read with interest all you wrote, and to understand more about you I did a search and see that you have written MP Peter Mackay regarding abortion. I congratulate you on every word in this letter, an excellent letter in content and form. ​

I started with this because it is relatively simple and straightforword. ​

​

The ideas you wrote about in the current letter are so much more commplex.​

There is no doubt that the Almighty has many means of delivering messages to people. There is no doubt that many people receive messages from the Almighty. ​

​

While it is not possible to discount other iterpretations of your dreams and changes of you thoughts, it is clear that you have a comprehensive world-picture, and that this letter is an expression of the important points you saw fit to write me. ​

​

​

Naturally, I am interested to learn more about your advocacy "that my nation assist The Temple Mount Faithful Community, People For A Bill to Build The Bet HaMikdash and The Sanhedrin in your efforts to control the Temple Mount and rebuild your Jerusalem Third Temple". Why do you thing that this advocacy will help you as a "minor Canadian politician" who is starting his campaign.​

​

Of course we appreciate your support and would like to help you in this - and for that matter in your efforts against abortion. According to the Holy Torah, the prohibition of abortion [except in extreme cases, as you mention] was one of the commands of God to Noah [Genesis 9,6, the KJV translation is not equivalent to the Jewish tradition (it really wasn't meant to be!)] According to our understanding, this means that killing a person who is still inside its mother is a capital crime. ​

​

Please send us some more elaboration of your ideas. ​

​

Sincerely, ​

​

Shalom,​

​

Rabby Yeshayahu Hollander ​

​

On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 8:00 PM, Dennis Tate <tate4pictoucentre​

@yahoo​

.ca> wrote:​

Shalom Rabbi Hollander: I've been participating on The Sanhedrin message board and I was urged to contact you directly. So far as I know I am probably the first minor Canadian politician who has advocated that my nation assist The Temple Mount Faithful Community, People For A Bill to Build The Bet HaMikdash and The Sanhedriin in your efforts to control the Temple Mount and rebuild your Jerusalem Third Temple. It is my firm belief that semi-reality and reality film series could play an important role in working out the fulfillment of every word spoken in the law and in the prophets. My dad, Robert Stewart Tate, passed away on January 1, 1990. His death came at the same time that I was being confronted with the implications of the near death experience accounts. I went through a theological crisis that I believe has relevance for your SanHedrin. "but the goat on which the lot fell for Aza'zel shall be presented alive before the LORD to make atonement over it, that it may be sent away into the wilderness to Aza'zel." (Leviticus 16:10) I had no problem with the positive near death experiences but those negative ones put me into a philosophical crisis unlike I had ever experienced before. I saw this verse in Leviticus as a possible loophole and I asked that the guilt of Azazel would be put on my head. I prayed and asked The G-d of Abraham if he had any use for a volunteer "goat for Azazel?" If so, then I wanted to submit my application for the job. Several unusual things did occur since that time that I feel indicates that my offer may well have been accepted. I would like to elaborate further on how I feel a volunteer goat for Azazel could perhaps be of use in the working out of latter day events in such a way that the death toll is kept to an absolute minimum. Although I am not certain exactly what a volunteer goat for Azazel should do I have seen a videotape in my head of myself signing currency units while my hand is bleeding. The blood that drips onto a particular part of those currency units, along with many examples of my signature serves to authenticate the validity of these specific currency units for a future in which they could turn out to be quite useful. I hereby offer to The Sanhedrin 22 billion Dennis Tate shekels or dollars, similar to CalgaryDollars.ca or the Ithaca Hour. Bill and Melinda Gates are planning on spending 24 billion US dollars in an effort to make this world a better place. I wish to compete with them. This 22 billion in a sense can be used as props in many reality films that tend to promote peace in the Middle East and the reestablishment of the law of Moshe even in foreign lands. It is my belief that the films that you are guided to produce and direct will greatly increase in value over the coming decades and centuries. Shalom and greetings from Nova Scotia.

Does the Bible hint that the extra THREE MILLENNIA between the time to save the descendants of Adam and Eve, [six to eight millennia], vs the time to "Judge" Azazel and the Watchers and their children and grandchildren that is given in the Book of Enoch, may be necessary due to a hidden plan to bring Azazel and the Watchers and their children and grandchildren to repentance and Teshuvah?

I was surprised and rather impressed when I heard a lecture from Messianic Rabbi Jonathan Cahn that could well relate to this question.

Rabbi Jonathan Cahn explores the story of Barabbas and the ritual of Azazel (the scapegoat) as a profound prophetic mystery, highlighting the substitutionary role of Jesus Christ on Yom Kippur. In his teachings, Cahn draws parallels between the two goats of Yom Kippur and the choice between Jesus and Barabbas, who both bear the name "Son of the Father". [1, 2, 3, 4]
The Mystery of the Two Goats and Barabbas

• The Two Goats: On Yom Kippur, two indistinguishable goats were presented. One was sacrificed, and the other was sent away (Azazel) into the wilderness, bearing the sins of the people.
• Barabbas as the "Other Jesus": Cahn points out that Barabbas's full name, according to some ancient manuscripts, was Jesus Barabbas (Jesus son of the father). The crowd had to choose between Jesus of Nazareth (the Messiah) and Jesus Barabbas (the criminal/insurrectionist).
• The Substitution: Barabbas represents humanity—the guilty sinner—who is released, while the innocent Messiah takes his place to take upon Himself the sins of the world.
• Significance of Azazel: The second goat, often associated with the casting out of sins, symbolises the complete removal of sins from the people, according to Cahn's interpretation of Yom Kippur, as mentioned in his September 28, 2025 sermon. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7]

Key Themes in Cahn's Teachings

• Prophetic Fulfillment: Cahn uses the story of Barabbas and the two goats to illustrate the redemption story in a fresh, "messianic mystery" context, often focusing on the significance of the "two sons of the father".
• Freedom from Darkness: Cahn teaches that, like Barabbas, believers are set free from the "darkness" or "habits" that formerly bound them through the sacrifice of the Messiah.
• Connection to Modern Times: Cahn often relates these ancient biblical patterns to current events, suggesting these stories hold relevant messages for today, as noted in his sermons in April 2025 and 2026. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]

For more detailed teachings and to experience this message directly, you can explore the sermons and books of Jonathan Cahn.

Messiah, Barabbas & the Mystery of the Two Goats | Jonathan Cahn Sermon | Resurrection Day 2025​

Here is Leviticus 16 in the Orthodox Jewish Bible:

Vayikra 16​

​

[ACHAREY MOS]​

16 And Hashem spoke unto Moshe after the mot of the two Bnei Aharon, when they approached before Hashem, and died;

2;And Hashem said unto Moshe, Speak unto Aharon thy brother, that he come not at any time into HaKodesh within the Parochet (curtain) before the Kapporet, which is upon the Aron; that he die not; for I will appear in the Anan upon the Kapporet.

3;Thus shall Aharon come into HaKodesh: with a young bull for a chattat, and a ram for an olah (burnt offering).

4;He shall put on the Kesones Bahd Kodesh (holy linen tunic [see Yn 19:23 on Moshiach’s Kesones, the day kapporah was made by the Kohen L’Olahm al Divrati Melki-Tzedek—Ps 110:4]), and he shall have the Mikhnesei Bahd (linen breeches) upon his basar, and shall be girded with a Avnet Bahd (linen sash), and with the Mitznefet Bahd (linen turban) shall he be attired; these are Bigdei Kodesh; therefore shall he immerse his basar in mayim, and so put them on.

5;And he shall take of the Adat Bnei Yisroel two male goats of the goats for a chattat, and one ram for an olah.

6;And Aharon shall offer his bull of the chattat, which is for himself, and make kapporah for himself, and for his bais.

7;And he shall take the two goats, and present them before Hashem at the entrance of the Ohel Mo’ed.

8;And Aharon shall cast lots upon the two goats; one lot for Hashem, and the other lot for Azazel.

9;And Aharon shall bring the goat upon which Hashem’s lot fell, and offer him for a chattat.

10;But the goat, on which the lot fell for Azazel shall be presented chai (alive) before Hashem, to make kapporah through it, and to let him go for Azazel into the midbar.

11;And Aharon shall bring the bull of the chattat, which is for himself, and shall make kapporah for himself, and for his bais, and shall slaughter (shachat) the bull of the chattat which is for himself;

12;And he shall take a machtah (censer) full of burning coals of eish from off the Mizbe’ach before Hashem, and his hands full of ketoret, ground and fragrant, and bring it within the Parochet (Curtain);

13;And he shall put the ketoret upon the eish before Hashem, that the anan of the ketoret may cover the Kapporet that is upon the Edut, that he die not;

14;And he shall take of the dahm of the bull, and sprinkle it with his forefinger upon the eastern front of the Kapporet; and before the Kapporet yazzeh (he shall sprinkle [see Isaiah 52:15 for Moshiach’s world-wide sprinkling]) of the dahm with his forefinger seven times.

15;Then shall he slaughter (shachat) the goat of the chattat, that is for the Am, and bring his dahm within the Parochet, and do with that dahm as he did with the dahm of the bull, and sprinkle it upon the Kapporet, and before the Kapporet;

16;And he shall make kapporah for HaKodesh, because of the tuma of the Bnei Yisroel, and because of their peysha’im in all their chattot; and so shall he do for the Ohel Mo’ed, that remaineth among them in the midst of their tumah.

17;And there shall be no adam in the Ohel Mo’ed when he goeth in to make kapporah in HaKodesh, until he come out, and have made kapporah for himself, and for his bais, and for kol Kehal Yisroel.

18;And he shall go out unto the Mizbe’ach that is before Hashem, and make kapporah for it; and shall take of the dahm of the bull, and of the dahm of the goat, and put it upon the Karnot of the Mizbe’ach around about.

19;And he shall sprinkle of the dahm upon it with his forefinger seven times, and make it tahor, and set it apart as kodesh from the tumah of the Bnei Yisroel.

20;And when he hath finished making kapporah for HaKodesh, and the Ohel Mo’ed, and the Mizbe’ach, he shall bring the live goat;

21;And Aharon shall lay both his hands upon the rosh (head) of the live goat, v’hitvaddah (and confess) over him kol avonot Bnei Yisroel, and all their peysha’im in all their chattot, putting them upon the rosh of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a designated man into the midbar;

22;And the goat nasah (shall carry, see Isaiah 53:12) upon him all their avonot unto an eretz gezerah (uninhabited, solitary place); and he shall release the goat in the midbar.

23;And Aharon shall come into the Ohel Mo’ed, and shall put off the linen garments, which he put on when he went into HaKodesh, and shall leave them there;

24;And he shall wash his basar with mayim in the Makom Kadosh, and put on his garments, come out, and offer his olah and the olah of HaAm, and make kapporah for himself, and for HaAm.

25;And the chelev of the chattat shall he burn upon the Mizbe’ach.

26;And he that released the goat for Azazel shall immerse his garments and immerse his basar in mayim, and afterward come into the machaneh.

27;And the bull for the chattat, and the goat for the chattat whose dahm was brought in to make kapporah in HaKodesh, shall one carry forth outside the machaneh; and they shall burn in the eish their hides, and their basar, and their dung.

28;And he that burneth them shall immerse his garments, and immerse his basar in mayim, and afterward he shall come into the machaneh.

29;And this shall be a chukkat olam (eternal decree) unto you: that in the Chodesh HaShevi’i, on the tenth day of the chodesh, ye shall afflict your nefashot, and do no melachah at all, whether it be ezrach (native) or the ger that sojourneth among you:

30;For on that day shall the kohen make kapporah for you, to make you tahor, that ye may be tahor from all your chattot before Hashem.

31;It shall be a Shabbat Shabbaton unto you, and ye shall afflict your nefashot, by a chukkat olam.

32;And the kohen, who has been anointed or who has been given authority to minister as a kohen in place of his father, shall make kapporah, and shall put on the linen garments, even the Bigdei Hakodesh;

33;And he shall make kapporah for the Mikdash HaKodesh, and he shall make kapporah for the Ohel Mo’ed, and for the Mizbe’ach, and he shall make kapporah for the kohanim, and for kol HaAm HaKahal.

34;And this shall be a chukkat olam unto you, to make kapporah for the Bnei Yisroel for all their chattat once a year. And he did as Hashem commanded Moshe.

I noticed the name Azazel from the RSV translation of Leviticus sixteen.

We know that there is a plan to bring to pass a "New Heaven and a New Earth" but is there also a plan to increase and increase and increase the government of Messiah the Passover Lamb, Yeshua - Jesus even into the Purgatory or Hell Realms, [Sheol and Gehenna]?

1There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse,
And a Branch shall grow out of his roots.
2The Spirit of the Lord shall rest upon Him,
The Spirit of wisdom and understanding,
The Spirit of counsel and might,
The Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord.
3His delight is in the fear of the Lord,
And He shall not judge by the sight of His eyes,
Nor decide by the hearing of His ears;
4But with righteousness He shall judge the poor,
And decide with equity for the meek of the earth;
He shall strike the earth with the rod of His mouth,
And with the breath of His lips He shall slay the wicked.
5Righteousness shall be the belt of His loins,
And faithfulness the belt of His waist.
6“The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb,
The leopard shall lie down with the young goat,
The calf and the young lion and the fatling together;
And a little child shall lead them.
7The cow and the bear shall graze;
Their young ones shall lie down together;
And the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
8The nursing child shall play by the cobra’s hole,
And the weaned child shall put his hand in the viper’s den.
9They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain,
For the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord
As the waters cover the sea.
10“And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse,
Who shall stand as a banner to the people;
For the Gentiles shall seek Him,
And His resting place shall be glorious.”

Isaiah 11 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

The Reign of Jesse’s OffspringThere #(Zech. 6:12); Rev. 5:5shall come forth a Rod from the stem of #(Is. 9:7; 11:10); Matt. 1:5; (Acts 13:23)Jesse,And #Is. 4:2a Branch shall grow out of his root

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Does the government of Messiah the Passover Lamb, [Rabbi Yeshua - Jesus], increase and increase and increase, presumably even into Sheol, the grave? Even the darkest and scariest realms in Sheol?

6For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7Of the increase of His government and peace
There will be no end,
Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom,
To order it and establish it with judgment and justice
From that time forward, even forever.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

Isaiah 9 | NKJV Bible - Bible App

The Government of the Promised SonNevertheless #Is. 8:22the gloom will not be upon her who is distressed,As when at # Kin. 15:29; 2 Chr. 16:4first He lightly esteemedThe land of Zebulun and the land o

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Did the Eruv Rav, the mixed multitude, perhaps go off into rather unusual ideas on theology and the long term predictions related to Sheol, the grave, as well as to the Gilgul Cycle?

Who is The Erev Rav? Do they 'run' the world? Are they an evil regime with a lot of power? - Part 1​

www.AlonAnava.com/

I Corinthians chapter five give us a hint that maybe Satan is involved in driving and herding "sheep" toward repentance much like the movie "Babe" about a pig that could herd sheep?

1It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and such sexual immorality as is not even named among the Gentiles—that a man has his father’s wife! 2And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he who has done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed. 4In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

I Corinthians 5 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

Immorality Defiles the ChurchIt is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and such sexual immorality as is not even named among the Gentiles—that a man has his father&#82

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All of this would fit with the possibility that the questions that the Apostle Paul felt were "unlawful to be uttered" when he wrote 2 Corinthians 12 verses one to five, may well be answered in Romand chapters nine, ten and eleven? Romans was written several years after 2 Corinthians. It often takes near death experiences about a decade to process the profound experiences that they have had.

1It is doubtless not profitable for me to boast. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord: 2I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or whether out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a one was caught up to the third heaven. 3And I know such a man—whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows— 4how he was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter. 5Of such a one I will boast; yet of myself I will not boast, except in my infirmities. 6For though I might desire to boast, I will not be a fool; for I will speak the truth. But I refrain, lest anyone should think of me above what he sees me to be or hears from me.

II Corinthians 12 | NKJV Bible - Bible App

The Vision of ParadiseIt is doubtless not profitable for me to boast. I will come to #Acts 16:9; 18:9; 22:17, 18; 23:11; 26:13–15; 27:23visions and #Acts 9:3–6; 1 Cor. 14:6; 2 Cor. 12:7; (

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There is a prediction in The Book of Enoch that it would be lost for centuries and then later on restored in the "Latter Days."

Chapter 1​

1The word of the blessing of Enoch, how he blessed the elect and the righteous, who were to exist in the time of trouble; rejecting all the wicked and ungodly. Enoch, a righteous man, who was (1) with God, answered and spoke, while his eyes were open, and while he saw a holy vision in the heavens. This the angels showed me.

(1) N.B. The italicized words supply a gap in the text.


2From them I heard all things, and understood what I saw; that which will not take place in this generation, but in a generation which is to succeed at a distant period, on account of the elect.


3Upon their account I spoke and conversed with him, who will go forth from his habitation, the Holy and Mighty One, the God of the world:


4Who will hereafter tread upon Mount Sinai; appear with his hosts; and be manifested in the strength of his power from heaven.


5All shall be afraid, and the Watchers be terrified.


6Great fear and trembling shall seize them, even to the ends of the earth. The lofty mountains shall be troubled, and the exalted hills depressed, melting like a honeycomb in the flame. The earth shall be immerged, and all things which are in it perish; while judgment shall come upon all, even upon all the righteous:


7But to them shall he give peace: he shall preserve the elect, and towards them exercise clemency.


8Then shall all belong to God; be happy and blessed; and the splendour of the Godhead shall illuminate them.
...
...

Chapter 12​

1Before all these things Enoch was concealed; nor did any one of the sons of men know where he was concealed, where he had been, and what had happened.


2He was wholly engaged with the holy ones, and with the Watchers in his days.


3I, Enoch, was blessing the great Lord and King of peace.


4And behold the Watchers called me Enoch the scribe.


5Then the Lord said to me: Enoch, scribe of righteousness, go tell the Watchers of heaven, who have deserted the lofty sky, and their holy everlasting station, who have been polluted with women.


6And have done as the sons of men do, by taking to themselves wives, and who have been greatly corrupted on the earth;


7That on the earth they shall never obtain peace and remission of sin. For they shall not rejoice in their offspring; they shall behold the slaughter of their beloved; shall lament for the destruction of their sons; and shall petition for ever; but shall not obtain mercy and peace.

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Chapter 13​

1Then Enoch, passing on, said to Azazyel: You shalt not obtain peace. A great sentence is gone forth against you. He shall bind you;


2Neither shall relief, mercy, and supplication be yours, on account of the oppression which you have taught;


3And on account of every act of blasphemy, tyranny, and sin, which you have discovered to the children of men.


4Then departing from him I spoke to them all together;


5And they all became terrified, and trembled;


6Beseeching me to write for them a memorial of supplication, that they might obtain forgiveness; and that I might make the memorial of their prayer ascend up before the God of heaven; because they could not themselves thenceforwards address him, nor raise up their eyes to heaven on account of the disgraceful offence for which they were judged.


7Then I wrote a memorial of their prayer and supplications, for their spirits, for everything which they had done, and for the subject of their entreaty, that they might obtain remission and rest.


8Proceeding on, I continued over the waters of Danbadan, (16) which is on the right to the west of Armon, reading the memorial of their prayer, until I fell asleep.

(16) Danbadan. Dan in Dan (Knibb, p. 94).


9And behold a dream came to me, and visions appeared above me. I fell down and saw a vision of punishment, that I might relate it to the sons of heaven, and reprove them. When I awoke I went to them. All being collected together stood weeping in Oubelseyael, which is situated between Libanos and Seneser, (17) with their faces veiled.

(17) Libanos and Seneser. Lebanon and Senir (near Damascus).


10I related in their presence all the visions which I had seen, and my dream;


11And began to utter these words of righteousness, reproving the Watchers of heaven.

The Book of Enoch, Chapters 1-60

Books of Enoch

reluctant-messenger.com

Was Paul asking questions somewhat like those being asked by Messianic Rabbi Jonathan Cahn about hidden meaning in Yom Kippur?

1I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, 2that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart. 3For I could wish that I myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh, 4who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises; 5of whom are the fathers and from whom, according to the flesh, Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God. Amen.

Romans 9 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

Israel’s Rejection of ChristI # Cor. 1:23tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, #Rom. 10:1that I have great sorrow and continual grie

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25For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:
“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”
28Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.
33Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!
34“For who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has become His counselor?”
35“Or who has first given to Him
And it shall be repaid to him?”
36For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.

Romans 11 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

Israel’s Rejection Not TotalI say then, #Ps. 94:14; Jer. 46:28has God cast away His people? # Sam. 12:22; Jer. 31:37Certainly not! For # Cor. 11:22; Phil. 3:5I also am an Israelite, of the seed

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[/quote]

 

[GavanPeacefan]

Shalom EdwinAMartin:

Am I an idiot to feel that a tiny percentage of Jews felt such extreme animosity toward Rabbi Yeshua - Jesus that they essentially decided that the enemy of my enemy.... must be my friend? Eight thousand five hundred wealtiest of the wealthy is only about one person in a million, [a tiny fraction of all humanity].

Did they decide that Jesus was the ultimate "enemy" of Rabbinic Judaism and that therefore.....
maybe "Satan," [perhaps especially "Azazel" whose name is in Leviticus chapter sixteen], must be at least something of a "friend" to Rabbinic Judaism?

Back in 1990 I began to ask questions and even pray about that subject as you can see from my first e-mail that I sent off to a Jerusalem Sanhedrin Rabbi. [Rabbi Hollander gave me permission to make this correspondence available to anybody who might be able to assist with the long term goal of building a Ezekiel chapter forty to forty eight temple complex as well as a replica of a modern Third Temple over the Gihon Spring that would be a replica of the Temple of King Solomon. I am hopeful that some of these discussions may well influence some influential readers one of these days?




Does the Bible hint that the extra THREE MILLENNIA between the time to save the descendants of Adam and Eve, [six to eight millennia], vs the time to "Judge" Azazel and the Watchers and their children and grandchildren that is given in the Book of Enoch, may be necessary due to a hidden plan to bring Azazel and the Watchers and their children and grandchildren to repentance and Teshuvah?

I was surprised and rather impressed when I heard a lecture from Messianic Rabbi Jonathan Cahn that could well relate to this question.

Messiah, Barabbas & the Mystery of the Two Goats | Jonathan Cahn Sermon | Resurrection Day 2025​

Here is Leviticus 16 in the Orthodox Jewish Bible:



I noticed the name Azazel from the RSV translation of Leviticus sixteen.

We know that there is a plan to bring to pass a "New Heaven and a New Earth" but is there also a plan to increase and increase and increase the government of Messiah the Passover Lamb, Yeshua - Jesus even into the Purgatory or Hell Realms, [Sheol and Gehenna]?




Does the government of Messiah the Passover Lamb, [Rabbi Yeshua - Jesus], increase and increase and increase, presumably even into Sheol, the grave? Even the darkest and scariest realms in Sheol?




Did the Eruv Rav, the mixed multitude, perhaps go off into rather unusual ideas on theology and the long term predictions related to Sheol, the grave, as well as to the Gilgul Cycle?

Who is The Erev Rav? Do they 'run' the world? Are they an evil regime with a lot of power? - Part 1​

www.AlonAnava.com/

I Corinthians chapter five give us a hint that maybe Satan is involved in driving and herding "sheep" toward repentance much like the movie "Babe" about a pig that could herd sheep?




All of this would fit with the possibility that the questions that the Apostle Paul felt were "unlawful to be uttered" when he wrote 2 Corinthians 12 verses one to five, may well be answered in Romand chapters nine, ten and eleven? Romans was written several years after 2 Corinthians. It often takes near death experiences about a decade to process the profound experiences that they have had.



There is a prediction in The Book of Enoch that it would be lost for centuries and then later on restored in the "Latter Days."



Was Paul asking questions somewhat like those being asked by Messianic Rabbi Jonathan Cahn about hidden meaning in Yom Kippur?




25For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:
“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”
28Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.
33Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!
34“For who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has become His counselor?”
35“Or who has first given to Him
And it shall be repaid to him?”
36For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.

Romans 11 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

Israel’s Rejection Not TotalI say then, #Ps. 94:14; Jer. 46:28has God cast away His people? # Sam. 12:22; Jer. 31:37Certainly not! For # Cor. 11:22; Phil. 3:5I also am an Israelite, of the seed

www.bible.com

[/QUOTE]
eh, you display slightly too much unfounded calculations here, and delve too deep into the Bible for me to even understand the timescale of predictions you indicate, sorry.