Zone1 Did the Jewish Messiah have to come before seventy C. E?

[DennisPTate]

I believe that Rabbi Jonathan Cahn is correct that the Jewish Messiah, [Moshiach ben David / Messiah the Passover Lamb], had to come before 70 C. E., [the time of the fall of the Temple of King Solomon that was rebuilt and added to by King Herod] ?

The Seventy Sevens | Jonathan Cahn Podcast​

20,235 views Jan 25, 2026 Jonathan Cahn Sermons

One of the most fascinating, powerful, majestic, and amazing prophecies of the Messiah – Jonathan Cahn opens up the mysterious Seventy Sevens of Daniel, the exact mathematical countdown to the coming of Messiah and some surprising revelations hidden in the original language.---------Remember to hit subscribe to make sure you don’t miss any of these special messages. Jonathan Cahn has been called the prophetic voice of his generation and is known for unlocking the deep mysteries and revelations of God’s Word. He leads Hope of the World, a worldwide ministry of outreach of God’s Word to all nations, and His love and compassion to the world’s most needy.

That prediction in Daniel is pretty clear....
so it is no wonder that many professional theologians
tend to reject the Book of Daniel. If we accept the Book of Daniel of inspired then.....
we must admit that the Jewish Messiah needed to come before the events of 70 C. E.

Daniel 9:
The Seventy-Weeks Prophecy
20Now while I was speaking, praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the Lord my God for the holy mountain of my God, 21yes, while I was speaking in prayer, the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, reached me about the time of the evening offering. 22And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, “O Daniel, I have now come forth to give you skill to understand. 23At the beginning of your supplications the command went out, and I have come to tell you, for you are greatly beloved; therefore consider the matter, and understand the vision:
24“Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.
25“Know therefore and understand,
That from the going forth of the command
To restore and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks;
The street shall be built again, and the wall,
Even in troublesome times.
26“And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;
And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
27Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolate.”

Daniel 9 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

Daniel’s Prayer for the PeopleIn the first year #Dan. 1:21of Darius the son of Ahasuerus, of the lineage of the Medes, who was made king over the realm of the Chaldeans— in the first year

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Here are the same verses in the Orthodox Jewish Bible.

20;And while I was speaking, and davening tefillos, and making vidduy (confession of sin) for me and for Ami Yisroel, and laying my techinnah (petition) before Hashem Elohai for the sake of the Har Kodesh of Elohai;

21;Yea, while I was davening in tefillah, even haish [see 8:15] Gavriel, whom I had seen in the chazon in the beginning, being caused to fly in weariness, reached me about the time of the minchat erev.

22;And he instructed me, and spoke with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to make thee have seichel in binah.

23;At the beginning of thy tachanunim (supplications) a commandment went forth, and I am come to make the word known; for thou art greatly valued; therefore understand the devar, and consider the vision.

24;Shivi’im heptads is decreed upon thy people and upon thy Ir Kodesh (Holy City), to restrain the peysha (transgression), and to make an end of chattat (sin), and to make kapporah for avon, and to bring in Tzedek Olamim (Everlasting Righteousness), and to seal up the chazon and navi, and to anoint the Kodesh HaKodashim.

25;Have da’as, therefore, and get seichel, that from the going forth of the decree to restore and to rebuild Yerushalayim unto Moshiach Nagid shall be shivah heptads, and threescore and two heptads; the rechov shall be built again, and the charutz, even in troublous times.

26;And after threescore and two heptads, yikaret (will be cut off) Moshiach [Yeshayah 53:8], but not for himself [Yeshayah 53:4-6,8]; and the troops of the coming nagid shall destroy the Ir and the Kodesh (Beis Hamikdash, i.e., 70.C.E.); and the end thereof shall come with a flood, and unto the end there shall be war. Desolations are determined.

27;And he shall confirm brit (covenant) with rabbim for one heptad; and in the midst of the heptad he shall cause the zevach and the minchah to cease, and on the kenaf (wing) of the abominations is one making desolate, even until the complete destruction, a destruction that is decreed, shall be poured out upon the Shomem (Desolator, Destroyer).

Daniel 9 OJB;ESV - In the shnat achat (first year) of - Bible Gateway

In the shnat achat (first year) of Daryavesh ben Achashverosh, by zera (descent) a Mede, who was made melech over the realm of the Kasdim

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And now to give you the Orthodox Jewish Bible translation of Isaiah 53.

Yeshayah 53​

​

53 Who hath believed our report? And to whom is the Zero’a Hashem [Yeshayah 52:10] revealed?

2;For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a Shoresh (Root, Shoresh Yishai, Moshiach, Yeshayah 11:10, Sanhedrin93b) out of a dry ground; he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire [Chaggai 2:7] him.

3;He is despised and chadal ishim (rejected by men); a man of sorrows, and acquainted with suffering; and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

4;Surely he hath borne our sufferings, and nasah (carried [Vayikra 16:22; Yeshayah 53:12)] our sorrows; yet we did esteem him stricken, [i.e., like a leper is stricken] smitten of G-d, and afflicted [see verse 8 below].

5;But he was pierced [Yeshayah 51:9; Zecharyah 12:10 Sukkah 52a, Tehillim 22:17 Targum Hashivim] for our transgressions, he was bruised mei’avonoteinu (for our iniquities); the musar (chastisement) (that brought us shalom [Yeshayah 54:10] was upon him [Moshiach]; and at the cost of his (Moshiach’s) chaburah (stripes, lacerations) we are healed.

6;All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own derech (way; see Prov 16:25); and Hashem hath laid on him [Moshiach] the avon (iniquity, the guilt that separates from G-d) of us all.

7;He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth; he is brought as a seh (lamb; see Shemot 12:3) to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

8;He was taken from prison and from judgment; and who of his generation declared? For he was cut off [Daniel 9:26; Vayikra 17:10] out of Eretz Chayyim [this refers to the mot of Moshiach Ben Dovid, see v.12] mipesha ami (for the transgression of my people [Yisroel]) nega (plague cf Ps 91:10) lamo ([fell] on him [i.e., Moshiach; in light of Ps 11:7 and Job 22:2 we are warranted in saying the suffix is a singular, "him," not "them". Cf Gen 9:26-27; Deut 33:2; Isa 44:15; also compare Divrey Hayamim Alef 21:17]).

9;And he made his kever (grave) with the resha’im, and with the oisher (rich man; see Mt 27:57-60) bemotayv (in his deaths, intensive plural should be translated singular, death); because he had done no chamas (violence), neither was any mirmah (deceit) in his mouth. T.N. We stray as sheep; we return in Moshiach as children (zera); the Techiyas HaMoshiach (Resurrection of Moshiach) predicted in v. 10 [Dead Sea Scrolls Isaiah Scroll says Moshiach "will see the light [of life];" see also the Targum HaShivim]

10;Yet it pleased Hashem to bruise him; He hath put him to suffering; when Thou shalt make his nefesh an asham offering for sin, he (Moshiach) shall see zera [see Psalm 16 and Yn 1:12 OJBC], He shall prolong his yamim (days) and the chefetz Hashem (pleasure, will of Hashem) shall prosper in his [Moshiach’s] hand.

11;He [Hashem] shall see of the travail of his [Moshiach’s] nefesh, and shall be satisfied; by knowledge of him [Moshiach] shall Tzadik Avdi ["My Righteous Servant," Moshiach, Zecharyah 3:8, Yirmeyah 23:5; Zecharyah 6:11-12, Ezra 3:8 Yehoshua, Yeshua shmo] justify many (Ro 5:1); for he [Moshiach] shall bear their avon (iniquities).

12;Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his nefesh unto mavet (death); and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he nasah (Lv 16:22, carried) (like the Yom Kippur scapegoat) the sin of many, and made intercession [did the work of a mafgi’a, intercessor] for the transgressors [see Lk 23:34 OJBC].

Isaiah 53 OJB;ESV - Who hath believed our report? And to - Bible Gateway

Who hath believed our report? And to whom is the Zero’a Hashem [Yeshayah 52:10] revealed? For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a

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This idea of Moshiach ben David / Messiah the Passover Lamb.... is especially important in the context of a possible Latter day Yom Kippur event that may be somewhat like what happened two thousand years ago?

Messiah, Barabbas & the Mystery of the Two Goats | Jonathan Cahn Sermon | Resurrection Day 2025​

Oh no....
I know what is coming next.....
President Trump's enemies are going to associate him with a modern Barabbas or Bar Abbas..... [a Yom Kippur goat of some sort]?

 

[rosends]

the messianic concept is, by definition, Jewish, and according to Jewish law, lore and belief, the 70CE deadline doesn't exist and never did.

Why not ask about the "Christian version of the messiah"?

 

[DennisPTate]

the messianic concept is, by definition, Jewish, and according to Jewish law, lore and belief, the 70CE deadline doesn't exist and never did.

Why not ask about the "Christian version of the messiah"?

I rather like the Jewish ideas about the Personality of Moshiach.

The Personality of Mashiach​

https://www.chabad.org/5785261
By J. Immanuel Schochet
From the Sichos in English Collection

A. Mashiach Human​

Mashiach and the Messianic age are the ultimate end for the world, preconceived from the very beginning, for which the world was created.1 Mashiach, therefore, is one of the things that precede the creation.2 This refers, however, to the principle and soul of Mashiach. On the actual level of the physical world’s reality, Mashiach is a human being:

Mashiach is a human being, born in normal fashion of human parents.3 The only qualification about his origins is that he is a descendant of King David,4 through the lineage of his son Solomon.5 From his birth onwards his righteousness will increase continually, and by virtue of his deeds he will merit sublime levels of spiritual perfection.6

B. Mashiach In Every Generation​

Any time is a potential time for the coming of Mashiach.7 This does not mean, however, that at the appropriate time he will suddenly emerge from Heaven to appear on earth.8 On the contrary: Mashiach is already on earth, a human being of great saintly status (a tzadik) appearing and existing in every generation. “In every generation is born a progeny of Judah fit to be Israel’s Mashiach!”9

....
....

As a faithful shepherd he already cares so much about his people that he volunteered to suffer all kinds of agonies to assure that not a single Jew of all times will be lost.20

Mashiach shall meditate on the Torah21 and be preoccupied with mitzvot. He shall teach all the Jewish people and instruct them in the way of G‑d. He will prevail upon Israel to follow and observe the Torah, repair its breaches, and fight the battles of G‑d.22

Mashiach will reveal altogether new insights, making manifest the hidden mysteries of the Torah,23 to the point that “all the Torah learned in the present world will be vain compared to the Torah of Mashiach.”24

Though Mashiach comes first and foremost to Israel, all the nations will recognize his wisdom and sublimity and submit to his rule.25 He will guide and instruct them as well.26

There is no need for Mashiach to perform signs and wonders to prove himself.27 Nonetheless, he will do so.28

https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/101679/jewish/The-Personality-of-Mashiach.htm

That Chabad article goes into very old ideas on what Moshiach will do and why. I can't help but marvel at how similar this sounds to and explanation for Psalms 16 that was given to a near death experiencer:

THE DEPTHS OF VISITATION AND PRAYER: THE STEPS JESUS WENT THROUGH IN HELL​

Jesus relinquished His authority, power, and His will over to the Father and the Holy Spirit. He commended His Spirit to them all as He descended into the pit. To fulfill all that was required by justice, He had to go further into hell than any man will ever have to go. He had to go to the depths of hell in order to make redemption complete. During those days in hell, He rehearsed Psalm 16 to Himself, believing that the Father would give the command for the Holy Spirit to raise Him to life again.

Christ’s journey into hell and resurrection has made my spirit a brand-new being (see 2 Cor. 5:17).

Jesus went through everything we go through so that we can have authority and victory in this life.

THE AGREEMENT​

Jesus had an agreement with the Holy Spirit and with the Father about His activities from the time that He was born until the time that He ascended on high.

Because Jesus fulfilled all righteousness, we are therefore able to have victory without having to master situations. Remember that Jesus went before us as our High Priest. He paved the way for us to be successful in everything. He did what He did in the earth realm, and it causes you to walk in such a visitation. During prayer, because of visitation you will see your prayers immediately answered. That is because you are walking in His authority, operating the way He did while He was here on the earth.
Excerpt from Praying from the Heavenly Realms Chapter 20: The Depths of Visitation and Prayer: The Steps Jesus Went Through in Hell

The Depths of Visitation and Prayer: The Steps Jesus Went Through in Hell – Kevin Zadai

kevinzadai.com

This article may help us to understand the exact numbers involved?

"Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place." - Daniel 9:24

The Division of the 70 Weeks​

The angel Gabriel approaches Daniel in the latter half of the ninth chapter after Daniel prays for Israel. Gabriel mentions “seventy sevens” will take place before God will put an end to sin and bring everlasting righteousness (Daniel 9:24).


Scholars agree that the "sevens" appear to mean "years." Therefore, 70 X 7 = 490 years. Although Christians typically refer to the period of God bringing everlasting righteousness as 70 weeks, they really mean 70 X 7 years.

The prophecy divides up these 490 years in a handful of ways.

• 49 years (7 X 7): The time it takes to rebuild Jerusalem since the time the Babylonians had destroyed it (Daniel 9:25), which occurs in the Book of Nehemiah.
• 434 years (62 X 7): A time designated for waiting for the Anointed One to come (Daniel 9:26). The Anointed One appears to mean Jesus, here.
• After those 434 years: They put the Anointed One to death and destroy the city. The first half of this alludes to Jesus’ death on the cross. The Romans destroyed Jerusalem in 70 A.D., including the temple, which had been rebuilt in Nehemiah.
• The last year (1 X 7): Usually referred to the tribulation period, which transpires in Revelation, when the antichrist comes, persecutes Christians, and Jesus returns for His second coming. Theologians dispute whether this has already taken place or whether we have yet to see its fulfillment as we wait in the 69-70-year gap. This article assumes we have not yet reached the 70th week.

The Purpose of the 70 Weeks​

Theologians have added up the dates for the first 69 weeks. According to the timeline of Jewish calendars, the 69th week would lead up to Jesus’ triumphant entry into Jerusalem, followed by his death and resurrection soon after.

What Are the 70 Weeks of Daniel? What Does this End Times Prophecy Mean?

Although theologians have not reached a consensus on the exact timing of the 70 weeks mentioned in Daniel 9, we can draw a number of conclusions from this enigmatic prophecy.

www.christianity.com