Did Middle East mediator Martin Indyk reveal Obama's plan for Israel without Netanyahu in charge?

[Coyote]

Agree. Though I'm not sure if it's what you meant. You can not keep people in a permanent state of occupation under military rule. It's costly to Israel financially, politically and in terms of security. Netanyahu would rather deflect from all that by bringing everyone's attention to Iran. Having an enemy to focus on, whether real or percieved unifies and takes everyone's mind off of local troubles. Same thing applies to the Palestinians. As long as they are at war, they don't feel the need to show responsible governance.

I think they should have a process to become legal residents, and even citizens. To become citizens they need to join the IDF like other Israeli citizens.


Otherwise, they should return to their homelands of Jordan or Egypt.

What if there homeland is where they are?

It's not the West Bank was taken from Jordan, the palestinian state.

Gaza was taken from Egypt.

Those countries are their homelands.

Then return WB to Jordan and Gaza to Egypt.

No can do. They came with the original deed to Moses. Plus a hell of a lot of acreage in Trans-Jordan

Well then...someone should have told them Moses was a shyster

 

[CMike]

Current status quo is untennable. The current oppose every compromise and sticking to your guns approach isn't going to work. Everyone just wants peace, but the current regime would rather have war than peace where an equitable compromise is the deal.

Agree. Though I'm not sure if it's what you meant. You can not keep people in a permanent state of occupation under military rule. It's costly to Israel financially, politically and in terms of security. Netanyahu would rather deflect from all that by bringing everyone's attention to Iran. Having an enemy to focus on, whether real or percieved unifies and takes everyone's mind off of local troubles. Same thing applies to the Palestinians. As long as they are at war, they don't feel the need to show responsible governance.

I think they should have a process to become legal residents, and even citizens. To become citizens they need to join the IDF like other Israeli citizens.


Otherwise, they should return to their homelands of Jordan or Egypt.

What if there homeland is where they are?

It's not the West Bank was taken from Jordan, the palestinian state.

Gaza was taken from Egypt.

Those countries are their homelands.

Then return WB to Jordan and Gaza to Egypt.

They should have thought of that before they tried to invade Israel for the purpose of destroying it.

Now it's too late.

Without the West Bank Israel would be 9 miles wide and indefensible.

 

[Jroc]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

They have Hamas and Fatah to deal with Sorry but like Netanyahu said they are not going to leave the fate of the Jews in the hands of others, that includes Obama


they're goal is no Israel

And again, you can't answer an actual question. What has Netanyahu done to advance peace?

Why is it always up to the Jews? what have the Arabs done? they could have made something of Gaza, they have beach front. instead it is now a terrorist state

 

[Coyote]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

They have Hamas and Fatah to deal with Sorry but like Netanyahu said they are not going to leave the fate of the Jews in the hands of others, that includes Obama


they're goal is no Israel

And again, you can't answer an actual question. What has Netanyahu done to advance peace?

Why is it always up to the Jews? what have the Arabs done? they could have made something of Gaza, they have beach front. instead it is now a terrorist state

It isn't.

But everytime it's asked...what has Netanyahu done, it's deflected onto "but but but...".

And yes, Hamas could have spent it's money making improvements rather than rockets, but that avoids addressing the question.

 

[Jroc]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

They have Hamas and Fatah to deal with Sorry but like Netanyahu said they are not going to leave the fate of the Jews in the hands of others, that includes Obama


they're goal is no Israel

And again, you can't answer an actual question. What has Netanyahu done to advance peace?

Why is it always up to the Jews? what have the Arabs done? they could have made something of Gaza, they have beach front. instead it is now a terrorist state

It isn't.

But everytime it's asked...what has Netanyahu done, it's deflected onto "but but but...".

And yes, Hamas could have spent it's money making improvements rather than rockets, but that avoids addressing the question.

Not really, when the Arabs quite brainwashing their kids and actually make something out of Gaza, otherwise whats the point? The Arabs want the end of Israel, so there is no point in discussing anything.

 

[Phoenall]

Screw Kerry and double screw Obabble with a jackhammer. The two biggest Israel haters in America.

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

 

[Phoenall]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

Agreed to sit down and talk without pre conditions and starting on a level playing field. After so long it gets frustrating when the other side demands illegal pre conditions to the meeting taking place possibly, maybe. He has done more than anyone when he unleashed the troops when he said he would and kept them as far from the fighting to minimise the numbers of deaths. That is the only language the muslims understand as proven by the peace that exists between the Palestinians and Jordan/Lebanon.

Wrong. He had preconditions. He just labeled them "preconditions to peace". Effectively no difference. He has done nothing to promote peace.

He only put those pre conditions in place after the arab muslims made their illegal demands and pre conditions. He did not put them on first, read the history books

 

[Challenger]

Go President Obama!

Will you still feel the same way when the Israelis are being massacred by American weapons in their hundreds of thousands because of some fantasy borders that only exist in islamonazi propaganda and fantasy

Just another Obama Butt Kisser, apparently.

Not at all, just happy the guy finally grew a pair.

 

[Challenger]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

Mutually agreed borders, an end to terrorism, violence and belligerence, an end to islamonazi propaganda and a workable mutually agreed peace deal.

Now what have the Palestinians done to advance peace apart from murder children, fire illegal weapons at Israeli civilians and attempted to blow up Israeli schools when the children are in them ?

They're the only ones who ever negotiated in good faith. The only ones murdering children en-masse are the Israelis.

 

[Challenger]

Screw Kerry and double screw Obabble with a jackhammer. The two biggest Israel haters in America.

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

 

[Challenger]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

Agreed to sit down and talk without pre conditions and starting on a level playing field. After so long it gets frustrating when the other side demands illegal pre conditions to the meeting taking place possibly, maybe. He has done more than anyone when he unleashed the troops when he said he would and kept them as far from the fighting to minimise the numbers of deaths. That is the only language the muslims understand as proven by the peace that exists between the Palestinians and Jordan/Lebanon.

Wrong. He had preconditions. He just labeled them "preconditions to peace". Effectively no difference. He has done nothing to promote peace.

He only put those pre conditions in place after the arab muslims made their illegal demands and pre conditions. He did not put them on first, read the history books

 

[Phoenall]

And here I thought America was dancing to Netanyahu's tune....(sarcasm alert).

Bibi is doing everything possible to prevent a two-state solution and keep the Palestinians in a permanent state of occupation in an ever decreasing area.

How about a link from a non partisan source saying just this ?

Like your links?

Bibi's work towards "peace" and a two-state solution:
Israeli president says Netanyahu torpedoed peace deal News The Week UK
Netanyahu has rejected two-state solution - Al-Monitor the Pulse of the Middle East
Herzog I Doubt Netanyahu Will Lead Us to Peace - Middle East - News - Arutz Sheva

So lets get this right in link 1 Netantahu told the mediators to hold back for a few days for a better deal to come along, and the arab muslims did not come up with the goods in 2011

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

Mutually agreed borders, an end to terrorism, violence and belligerence, an end to islamonazi propaganda and a workable mutually agreed peace deal.

Now what have the Palestinians done to advance peace apart from murder children, fire illegal weapons at Israeli civilians and attempted to blow up Israeli schools when the children are in them ?

They're the only ones who ever negotiated in good faith. The only ones murdering children en-masse are the Israelis.

And you have court records proving this do you, or is it just your interpretation of the Geneva conventions that don't apply to the muslims. Negotiating in good faith does not mean putting illegal pre conditions in place before even agreeing to talks.

 

[Phoenall]

Screw Kerry and double screw Obabble with a jackhammer. The two biggest Israel haters in America.

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

Here you go


Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah"

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Quran (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist."

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Muslim (19:4321-4323) - Three separate hadith in which Muhammad shrugs over the news that innocent children were killed in a raid by his men against unbelievers. His response: "They are of them (meaning the enemy)."

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power." Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad's men because he insulted Islam. Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill. An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim.

 

[Phoenall]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

Agreed to sit down and talk without pre conditions and starting on a level playing field. After so long it gets frustrating when the other side demands illegal pre conditions to the meeting taking place possibly, maybe. He has done more than anyone when he unleashed the troops when he said he would and kept them as far from the fighting to minimise the numbers of deaths. That is the only language the muslims understand as proven by the peace that exists between the Palestinians and Jordan/Lebanon.

Wrong. He had preconditions. He just labeled them "preconditions to peace". Effectively no difference. He has done nothing to promote peace.

He only put those pre conditions in place after the arab muslims made their illegal demands and pre conditions. He did not put them on first, read the history books

Cant find anything to support your POV so resort to childish abuse again. Typical neo Marxist trait.
Now way back in 1999 Arafat put the illegal demands on the table at camp David as pre conditions to peace talks and Carter walked away fr0om him in disgust.

 

[ChrisL]

Screw Kerry and double screw Obabble with a jackhammer. The two biggest Israel haters in America.

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

The passages in the Quran have been quoted many, many times. It's not our fault if you refuse to see what is right before you. All of the intelligent Americans would choose to support Israel over Palestine, of course. Not even a question about it. We don't like murdering terrorist scum here in America. The Muslim religion is the most oppressive, brutal and violent religion and is really more cult like than anything else. The people who follow this religion are fanatical and want to see the end of the western world so that they can drag us all back into the middle ages with their Sharia Laws.

 

[ChrisL]

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

Here you go


Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah"

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Quran (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist."

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Muslim (19:4321-4323) - Three separate hadith in which Muhammad shrugs over the news that innocent children were killed in a raid by his men against unbelievers. His response: "They are of them (meaning the enemy)."

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power." Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad's men because he insulted Islam. Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill. An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim.

Why bother when all they do is ignore the facts? These people posting here are either really stupid or Muslims.

 

[Challenger]

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

Here you go


Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah"

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Quran (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist."

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Muslim (19:4321-4323) - Three separate hadith in which Muhammad shrugs over the news that innocent children were killed in a raid by his men against unbelievers. His response: "They are of them (meaning the enemy)."

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power." Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad's men because he insulted Islam. Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill. An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim.

Ok, so where in the above do you get this from, "Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews"?

There's nothing there about worshipping Mohammed or about commanding Muslims to hate Jews. making things up again and even plagiarising from a wacko site. The Verses Commanding Jihad and Murder of Non Tsk, tsk, some people have no shame.

 

[Challenger]

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

Here you go


Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah"

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Quran (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist."

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Muslim (19:4321-4323) - Three separate hadith in which Muhammad shrugs over the news that innocent children were killed in a raid by his men against unbelievers. His response: "They are of them (meaning the enemy)."

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power." Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad's men because he insulted Islam. Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill. An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim.

Why bother when all they do is ignore the facts? These people posting here are either really stupid or Muslims.

Post a fact and I'll look at it and evaluate it, so far all you post is drivel and fascist fantasies.

 

[Challenger]

I disagree. Just because they refuse to do Israel's bidding at every turn does not make them Israel haters.

You forget that Obama is a muslim and muslims are forced into hating Jews. It is a command from their gods

Now you are just being silly.

Read the Koran and hadiths instead of just spouting islamonazi cover ups. Since the Jewish tribes of medina refused to worship Mohamed the muslims have been commanded to hate the Jews

Well as you're so well read, lets see the chapter and verse from the Quran and Hadiths to back up your allegations.

The passages in the Quran have been quoted many, many times. It's not our fault if you refuse to see what is right before you. All of the intelligent Americans would choose to support Israel over Palestine, of course. Not even a question about it. We don't like murdering terrorist scum here in America. The Muslim religion is the most oppressive, brutal and violent religion and is really more cult like than anything else. The people who follow this religion are fanatical and want to see the end of the western world so that they can drag us all back into the middle ages with their Sharia Laws.

Drivel.

 

[Challenger]

What's Netanyahu's peace plan? What's he done to advance peace? Anything?

And please - let's not go "but the Palestinians...but Hamas...but but but". What's Bibi done? Far as I can see he has done far less than any of his predecessors.

Agreed to sit down and talk without pre conditions and starting on a level playing field. After so long it gets frustrating when the other side demands illegal pre conditions to the meeting taking place possibly, maybe. He has done more than anyone when he unleashed the troops when he said he would and kept them as far from the fighting to minimise the numbers of deaths. That is the only language the muslims understand as proven by the peace that exists between the Palestinians and Jordan/Lebanon.

Wrong. He had preconditions. He just labeled them "preconditions to peace". Effectively no difference. He has done nothing to promote peace.

He only put those pre conditions in place after the arab muslims made their illegal demands and pre conditions. He did not put them on first, read the history books

Cant find anything to support your POV so resort to childish abuse again. Typical neo Marxist trait.
Now way back in 1999 Arafat put the illegal demands on the table at camp David as pre conditions to peace talks and Carter walked away fr0om him in disgust.

Prove it.