Detroit parents want teachers, officials jailed over low test scores

[Gatekeeper]

They should have a "Sliding Pay Scale", pending on each teachers or instructors classes GPA or average standings across the USA or world standards.

Sliding scale fees are variable costs for products, services, or taxes based on one's ability to pay In this case, based on the ABILITY TO TEACH

Sliding scale fees - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Samson]

They should have a "Sliding Pay Scale", pending on each teachers or instructors classes GPA or average standings across the USA or world standards.

Sliding scale fees are variable costs for products, services, or taxes based on one's ability to pay In this case, based on the ABILITY TO TEACH

Sliding scale fees - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In Educational Lexicon, its called "Merit Based Pay."

Among government empolyees, including teachers, more pay for higher quality performance simply is an astonishingly foreign concept. It is the primary reason why it is very difficult for government retirees to find and hold jobs in a capitalist enterprise.

Putting aside for a moment the much more complicated issue of HOW to evaluate teachers, let's examine WHY.

Our Government employees are not expected to get rich. We want people in Government positions who do not make money a priority. Otherwise, we'd promote corruption. We'd rather teachers make a selfless sacrifice to Serve The People. Merit Pay contravenes this entire concept.

Plus, it makes the system more expensive

 

[Charles Stucker]

They should have a "Sliding Pay Scale", pending on each teachers or instructors classes GPA or average standings across the USA or world standards.

That sounds nice, but then every teacher would insist they deserved better students.
Try to teach a kid who can barely count and never liked math Algebra.
Then test that kid's ability against one who was prepared and always good at math.
Same teacher, two students, two wildly different 'results' because the first student had a big disadvantage.
Kids could hold their teachers for ransom "Give me what I want or I will deliberately blow the test so you starve - I have eight friends in your class, we can drop the average score a LOT."

But, if you use a complex formula for determining sliding pay you get even more gamesmanship.

Good principals can generally determine if a teacher is doing their job.
Here I used 'good' for all of competent and honest and hard working.
Get good principals and give them hiring authority.

Then make parents accountable for the behavior of their children.

Then even Detroit might have decent schools.

 

[bodecea]

They should have a "Sliding Pay Scale", pending on each teachers or instructors classes GPA or average standings across the USA or world standards.

Sliding scale fees are variable costs for products, services, or taxes based on one's ability to pay In this case, based on the ABILITY TO TEACH

Sliding scale fees - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1. Children are not products

2. You'd never get teachers for Spec. Ed.

Edited to add....how come we never expect a football coach to have a winning team when a) they have to take everyone as players INCLUDING those who don't want to play, b) many of the players don't show up for practice or sit refusing to suit up, c) many players are practicing/playing on an empty stomach or have a horrid diet.

How come?

 

[HUGGY]

They should have a "Sliding Pay Scale", pending on each teachers or instructors classes GPA or average standings across the USA or world standards.

Sliding scale fees are variable costs for products, services, or taxes based on one's ability to pay In this case, based on the ABILITY TO TEACH

Sliding scale fees - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1. Children are not products

2. You'd never get teachers for Spec. Ed.

Edited to add....how come we never expect a football coach to have a winning team when a) they have to take everyone as players INCLUDING those who don't want to play, b) many of the players don't show up for practice or sit refusing to suit up, c) many players are practicing/playing on an empty stomach or have a horrid diet.

How come?

Oh...you must be talkin bout the University of Washington...we were 0 an 12 last year

 

[Intense]

Value for Value, Merit Pay, Stop Union Tyranny.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Value for Value, Merit Pay, Stop Union Tyranny.

You just pushed on of my buttons with that phrase "Stop Union Tyranny..."

Here is the latest example of the tyranny:

NY State has the ability to match student scores with their teachers' identity.

Could be valualbe in making decisions such as promotion of the teachers, tenure, salary and/or bonuses.

Could also be worth money to the state as the feds award money to states that do such matching.

Would the teachers' union oppose this information being made public? Why?

Now, check this out:

"One such truth is the effectiveness of individual teachers. Data analysis is far from perfect, and no one argues that it should be used in isolation to make employment decisions. But modern techniques can help us distinguish between teachers whose students excel and teachers whose students languish or fail. There’s just one problem with the data revolution: it doesn’t work without data.

New York has deliberately refused to take that step. The state already has a sophisticated system for tracking student progress, but it doesn’t allow this statewide data set to match students to their teachers. No technical or administrative factors prevent the state from doing so. Only political obstacles stand in the way.

When New York City hinted that it would use its own data system to evaluate teachers based on student test scores, the state legislature passed a law banning the practice. The Obama administration’s Race to the Top grant competition will distribute $4.35 billion to states that pursue modern education reforms. According to the competition’s rules, however, any state with a law that prohibits the use of test-score data to evaluate teachers is immediately disqualified from consideration. A state’s application also becomes more attractive under the guidelines if its data set matches students to teachers. Currently, New York fails on both counts."
Teachers’ Unions vs. Progress—Again by Marcus A. Winters, City Journal 14 December 2009

 

[IanC]

put cameras in the classrooms. study the methods of successful teachers for different groups. in inner city schools, all schools really, give aptitude (IQ) tests, at the end of the year test how much improvement has been made compared to how much talent the teacher started with. that way teachers can earn merit pay without having to start out strong students. the cameras would also help identify the students who cannot function without a different form of discipline. while this may sound draconian, it would put the schools back on the right path of actually educating, and promoting personal responsibility.

VDARE.com: 07/03/08 - Sailer Is Right: Measure School Achievement Relative To IQ!

a link to support the idea

 

[PoliticalChic]

put cameras in the classrooms. study the methods of successful teachers for different groups. in inner city schools, all schools really, give aptitude (IQ) tests, at the end of the year test how much improvement has been made compared to how much talent the teacher started with. that way teachers can earn merit pay without having to start out strong students. the cameras would also help identify the students who cannot function without a different form of discipline. while this may sound draconian, it would put the schools back on the right path of actually educating, and promoting personal responsibility.

VDARE.com: 07/03/08 - Sailer Is Right: Measure School Achievement Relative To IQ!

a link to support the idea

Yes, yes, and yes as far as trying new things.

Innovation!

"The Innovation Schools Act, passed by the Colorado legislature in 2008, permits public schools, groups of schools and school districts to escape some of the heaviest state regulations and the most restrictive collective bargaining agreements and to develop new, creative teaching models for delivering high-quality education to schoolchildren, says Liv Finne, Education Director for the Washington Policy Center.

The Colorado Department of Education's description of the program is two-fold:

The Innovation Schools Act encourages schools and districts to design and implement innovative practices in a wide variety of areas to improve student outcomes.
The act allows schools and districts to obtain waivers from those policies that would otherwise present obstacles to such innovations.
Key findings from Colorado's Innovation Schools Act:

School leaders are allowed to obtain waivers from the heaviest state regulations and the most restrictive collective bargaining agreements to offer new, creative teaching models for delivering high-quality education to schoolchildren.
A principal in an Innovation School is allowed to hire teachers on one-year contracts and pay them bonuses for raising student achievement.
The Innovation School status of a school can be revoked if, after three years, the academic performance of its students does not improve."

http://www.washingtonpolicy.org/Centers/education/policynote/InnovationSchoolsPN.pdf

But this only applies in Colorado.

See my previous post: teachers' unions and the Democrat Party will fight it tooth and nail.

 

[Samson]

Because I have only worked as a teacher in Texas, where State Law prohibits Teacher Labor Unionization, I cannot really say much more than my general opinion: All Labor Unions are Bad.

That being said, I don't think that the fact that Texas has no Teacher Union makes Teachers in Texas the Best in the Nation, or that Students in Texas learn more than they do in New York.

put cameras in the classrooms. study the methods of successful teachers for different groups. in inner city schools, all schools really, give aptitude (IQ) tests, at the end of the year test how much improvement has been made compared to how much talent the teacher started with. that way teachers can earn merit pay without having to start out strong students. the cameras would also help identify the students who cannot function without a different form of discipline. while this may sound draconian, it would put the schools back on the right path of actually educating, and promoting personal responsibility

I don't think cameras in the classroom is a particularly "draconian" idea. Most schools already have lots of video surveilance of the common areas. Why not put them in classrooms? It is a PUBLIC school, after all, and anything going on in the classroom should be public.

Frankly, Ian, I don't think much study of the video feed will be necessary because the camera will intimidate the lazy, stupid, and incompetent teachers to such a degree that they will be unable to function under the stress of such intense scrutiny. The teachers who are left will teach well regardless of merit pay.

 

[AkronGuy]

How about the parents ? Oh wait, that'd be politically uncorrect.