Common sense gun regulations--need to be passed now.

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Those are not the root causes lol.
99.99o99% of children in single parent homes don't become mass murders. Movies, video games and music? Same stats apply.

MENTAL HEALTH is the underlying issue. A child of sound & stable mentality does not kill.

BOTH sides are so far off the mark on this issue it's sad.

Yet you cannot deny that nearly ALL mass shooters were Leftists.....

When are you people going to get it through your heads that those labels are MEANINGLESS? It's great for trolling on the internet but does NOTHING to address the problem much less solve it.

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

When are you people going to get it through your heads that those labels are MEANINGLESS? It's great for trolling on the internet but does NOTHING to address the problem much less solve it.

Maybe, but a society needs to know the Root of the problem in order to effectively address it.

And guns are NOT the root problem as you well know. The Left adamantly refuses to address the ROOT of the problem.

 

[BlackSand]

Thanks but you didn't answer the question.

In the past the United States has had leaders that provided the kind of leadership I was talking about, so where did it go wrong? When and why did "the People" stop valuing leadership in favor of valuing short term gratification, patronizing rhetoric and celebrity glitz?

Uh ... You didn't understand the answer ...
Representatives are elected to represent the People ... Not to lead the People.

I beg to differ, POTUS is (supposed to be) an elected leadership position, the legislative branch consists of (what are supposed to be) individual leaders chosen to represent the collective interests of their constituencies, the framers never intended or believed that legislators would be nothing more than errand boys carrying lists of wants.

It went wrong when the People expect the federal government to effectively and efficiently do what it cannot or should not.
The problem isn't the politics or politicians ... They are only empowered by the People.

I never disputed that, what I asked was why and when you think that happened?

Stop looking for leadership from the federal government ... They don't have your best interests in mind ... No matter what they promise.
.

I'm not looking for leadership from the federal government, I was and still am bemoaning the fact that it no longer exists there.

Initially the office of President and Vice President were held by opposing candidates.
That wasn't by accident and was put in place to ensure the opposition had a seat at the table.

The People and politicians have since discarded that provision ...
Because it didn't suit their immediate desire to facilitate legislation and grant more consolidated power to the federal government.

Senators were once chosen by the states and not the general public.
That was for a reason and it supported the balance between state and federal powers.

The People and the Politicians in the federal government they elected got rid of that provision.
It didn't allow the ability to leverage the general population of one state against another.
It didn't facilitate the ability for the federal government to more easily pass legislation that was not in the best interests of all states or their residents.

A supermajority vote was required in a lot of circumstances in Congress.
Again ... That was to limit the ability for Congress to easily pass legislation.
Thus further protecting the People from the legislative powers of the federal government.

The People and the politicians they elected screwed the rules to avoid that protection ...
And make it easier for the federal government and a smaller majority to screw the People.



All that (and more) happened because the People thought it would be a good idea to discard parts of the Constitution ...
And empower the government so they could get free cheese ... And get it faster.

The power you are bemoaning never existed ... The Founding Fathers left the People in charge ...
The People have just done their best to systemically screw themselves for free cheese and empty promises.

.

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

So your issue is answered by having the Left address the Root cause of these school shootings.....PEOPLE.

And more precisely...people who associate with Leftist ideals.

Now let's get down to solving THAT problem and the Gun Control (and many other issues of violence) will be taken care of

But Puh-LEASE do not suggest that a solution is changing the Constitution for 325,000,000 people because of less than 20 mentally challenged Leftist.

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

Initially the office of President and Vice President were held by opposing candidates.
That wasn't by accident and was put in place to ensure the opposition had a seat at the table.

The People and politicians have since discarded that provision ...
Because it didn't suit their immediate desire to facilitate legislation and grant more consolidated power to the federal government.

Senators were once chosen by the states and not the general public.
That was for a reason and it supported the balance between state and federal powers.

The People and the Politicians in the federal government they elected got rid of that provision.
It didn't allow the ability to leverage the general population of one state against another.
It didn't facilitate the ability for the federal government to more easily pass legislation that was not in the best interests of all states or their residents.

A supermajority vote was required in a lot of circumstances in Congress.
Again ... That was to limit the ability for Congress to easily pass legislation.
Thus further protecting the People from the legislative powers of the federal government.

The People and the politicians they elected screwed the rules to avoid that protection ...
And make it easier for the federal government and a smaller majority to screw the People.



All that (and more) happened because the People thought it would be a good idea to discard parts of the Constitution ...
And empower the government so they could get free cheese ... And get it faster.

The power you are bemoaning never existed ... The Founding Fathers left the People in charge ...
The People have just done their best to systemically screw themselves for free cheese and empty promises.

.

Precisely why today, more than ever, we MUST defend the 2nd Amendment vigorously and passionately

 

[Marion Morrison]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

Here are my suggestions.

Eschew the vulgar self-commendation of pointing out your brother's mussed hair, for doing so does not make your mop look any more presentable. Better that you lend him your comb before I see either of you.
-- Dad admonishing us not to be "social climbers"​

It's great to see someone here offer positive suggestions about how to reduce the incidence of gun injuries and deaths. That alone illustrates at least levels of concern and sindeerity reflects more effort invested solutioneering than we've seen from GOP elected office holders in God-only-knows how many years.

What one sees from USMB Conservatives strikes me as even more lame for it seems all I've ever from them seen is protestations and attestations about what won't work. Indeed, I have yet to see one USMB Conservative take any proactive suggestions posited here and offer constructive ideas that either directly build on them and/or aid others in doing so rather than attempt to discount, diminish and destroy them.

He has a right to criticize, who has a heart to help.
-- Abraham Lincoln

​

1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.

The matter of banning certain weapons is something about which my best friend and I differ. Whereas he's of the mind that it's what must be done to reduce gun-related deaths and injuries, I'm of the mind that while it'd probably work if very stringently implemented, it's not worth trying to do because that effort would be so all consuming and not likely to prevail, thereby distracting resources from other less sweeping changes that might collectively produce similarly pleasing outcomes. That said, were such policies implemented, I wouldn't complain about them.

2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.

The sentiment of these suggestions is great, and I think you're on the right track in that you're thinking of means by which to setup a behavioral cost-benefit calculus that potential and actual firearm owners would and should perform prior to engaging in a firearm transaction/relationship. The challenge with establishing such an "equation" is that the "teacher" must have an efficient and effective means for identifying inadequacy in one's solving the equation. To wit, how many kids don't do assignments they know, with a high degree of certainty, will never be reviewed or graded? We both know the answer: only the most committed/exceptional ones.

As goes the behavior of the most exceptional-/committed-to-gun-security gun owners, sellers and would-be owners and sellers, it's probably not their behavior with which a society desirous of reducing gun injuries/death most need concern itself. To catalyze compliance among owners/sellers and would-be owners/sellers who incline toward being less diligent (to whatever degree), however, instructions about what be desired behavior must be accompanied by existential enforcement

So looking at your ideas quoted just above, I think the "thou shalt" and "thou shalt not" are mostly reasonable enough, but I suggest you think of what "or else" elements you might add to them so as to transform your suggestions into a coherent whole that pushes gun transaction participants to exercise the utmost circumspection prior to engaging in the transaction and relationship with both trading partners and with firearms.

5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.

Fine.

6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.

There you go. This idea has an implicit "thou shalt not" along with the makings of an "or else."

• Thou shalt not purchase guns on behalf of others.
• Or else, should a gun last lawfully purchased by thee be used unlawfully, thou shalt be subject to the same penalties attendant to the crime in which the gun was used.

Personally, I'd add that the burden of proof for this provision be that of strict liability rather than that of general or specific intent.

7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

Fine

I say boy! You ain't read my postings, huh?

I have all kinds of solutions.

The most effective is to teach the 10 Commandments and not Subjective Morality in the schools.

True story.

 

[MrShangles]

I’m still asking liberal gun grabbers this question that they never answer, how are you going to get criminals to follow all those stupid laws you want, isn’t Murder illegal already, don’t look like they follow that law, but we need a law to ban guns and criminals will follow that one, so please gun grabbers what will new laws really do? Dig down deep.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Marion Morrison]

So your issue is answered by having the Left address the Root cause of these school shootings.....PEOPLE.

And more precisely...people who associate with Leftist ideals.

Now let's get down to solving THAT problem and the Gun Control (and many other issues of violence) will be taken care of

But Puh-LEASE do not suggest that a solution is changing the Constitution for 325,000,000 people because of less than 20 mentally challenged Leftist.

The problem is the Leftist education/indictrination system. Go figure that if you teach the kids there's no God, they'll be running wild like a bunch of little heathens, derp!

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

I’m still asking liberal gun grabbers this question that they never answer, how are you going to get criminals to follow all those stupid laws you want, isn’t Murder illegal already, don’t look like they follow that law, but we need a law to ban guns and criminals will follow that one, so please gun grabbers what will new laws really do? Dig down deep.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What they REALLY want is total Confiscation.

Don't be fooled by their "we only want this"....today crap

"Give Gun Grabbers an inch.....they'll take ALL your Guns"

My advice...don't allow them even ONE MORE INCH. There are already PLENTY of gun laws to cover everything.....obviously they're going about it wrong and instead should be looking at the mentality they are creating that causes this violence instead of focusing on objects.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

The root cause? As we increasingly move to an anything goes society, this is what you get.

 

[Thinker101]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

That's a tough one....we already know Democrats/Liberals don't have much common sense.

 

[TemplarKormac]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

The root cause? As we increasingly move to an anything goes society, this is what you get.

Do Conservatives advocate an "Anything goes" position?

There is a "root cause" but we have to be mature enough and strong enough to admit it. (but we're a PC society unfortunately)

 

[TroglocratsRdumb]

We all know that criminals are very important part of the Corrupt Democratic Party’s Voter Base.
The Democrats register criminals to vote.
The Democrats provide criminals sanctuary cities to hide in.
The Democratic Party wants to ban guns so that their criminals will feel safe while they are committing their crimes.

 

[NightFox]

Thanks but you didn't answer the question.

In the past the United States has had leaders that provided the kind of leadership I was talking about, so where did it go wrong? When and why did "the People" stop valuing leadership in favor of valuing short term gratification, patronizing rhetoric and celebrity glitz?

Uh ... You didn't understand the answer ...
Representatives are elected to represent the People ... Not to lead the People.

I beg to differ, POTUS is (supposed to be) an elected leadership position, the legislative branch consists of (what are supposed to be) individual leaders chosen to represent the collective interests of their constituencies, the framers never intended or believed that legislators would be nothing more than errand boys carrying lists of wants.

It went wrong when the People expect the federal government to effectively and efficiently do what it cannot or should not.
The problem isn't the politics or politicians ... They are only empowered by the People.

I never disputed that, what I asked was why and when you think that happened?

Stop looking for leadership from the federal government ... They don't have your best interests in mind ... No matter what they promise.
.

I'm not looking for leadership from the federal government, I was and still am bemoaning the fact that it no longer exists there.

Initially the office of President and Vice President were held by opposing candidates.
That wasn't by accident and was put in place to ensure the opposition had a seat at the table.

The People and politicians have since discarded that provision ...
Because it didn't suit their immediate desire to facilitate legislation and grant more consolidated power to the federal government.

Senators were once chosen by the states and not the general public.
That was for a reason and it supported the balance between state and federal powers.

The People and the Politicians in the federal government they elected got rid of that provision.
It didn't allow the ability to leverage the general population of one state against another.
It didn't facilitate the ability for the federal government to more easily pass legislation that was not in the best interests of all states or their residents.

A supermajority vote was required in a lot of circumstances in Congress.
Again ... That was to limit the ability for Congress to easily pass legislation.
Thus further protecting the People from the legislative powers of the federal government.

The People and the politicians they elected screwed the rules to avoid that protection ...
And make it easier for the federal government and a smaller majority to screw the People.



All that (and more) happened because the People thought it would be a good idea to discard parts of the Constitution ...
And empower the government so they could get free cheese ... And get it faster.

Thanks for the detailed description regarding your viewpoint of why and when, interesting stuff.

The power you are bemoaning never existed ... The Founding Fathers left the People in charge ...
.

I was never talking about POWER I was talking about LEADERSHIP, they're two different things, power denotes a degree of authority, leadership is a trait, the primary attribute of which involves the ability to persuade the "led" to achieve an objective or set of objectives.

 

[BlackSand]

I was never talking about POWER I was talking about LEADERSHIP, they're two different things, power denotes a degree of authority, leadership is a trait, the primary attribute of which involves the ability to persuade the "led" to achieve an objective or set of objectives.

But you don't want leadership ... You want salesmanship.

Leaders go where they want to go and sometimes get there.
Followers go where leaders are already going and sometimes get where they want to go.

Salesmen persuade people to buy into things they have or promise to provide ...
And that they convince the people will satisfy what they want or need ...

.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Save a kids life! Homeschool!

 

[NightFox]

I was never talking about POWER I was talking about LEADERSHIP, they're two different things, power denotes a degree of authority, leadership is a trait, the primary attribute of which involves the ability to persuade the "led" to achieve an objective or set of objectives.

But you don't want leadership ... You want salesmanship.

No I want leadership since I recognize that method, purpose and context are important.

Gandhi was a leader, Donald Trump is a salesman, one served a purpose greater than himself, the other just serves himself.

 

[BlackSand]

No I want leadership since I recognize that method, purpose and context are important.

Gandhi was a leader, Donald Trump is a salesman, one served a purpose greater than himself, the other just serves himself.

Gandhi was Hindu, and was assassinated by a Hindu, because they thought he wasn't doing what was best for Hindus.

Context is important ...

.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

There hasn't been 18 school shootings this year

??? Are you griping because the number is at least 19 rather than 18? Did you not notice that there were 17 school kids shot in FL the other day. A few weeks earlier two more kids were shot deadand 17 were wounded in a KY school.

No I'm not griping I pointing out a factual error. Why are you and others counting accidental discharges of firearms and suicides in that claim ?