Zone1 Christian Zionism

[ding]

Now I understand you. Your use of 'worst' vs 'worse' was confusing.

It's only confusing to you because you don't understand how grammar works. If you are comparing three things and wanted to describe the boundaries, the convention would be to say "worst" or "best" If you are comparing two things the convention would be to say "worse" or "better."

 

[alang1216]

Sure but you don't have to rationalize it as being good. It's a nuance you don't seem to be able to grasp. It's actually quite important to keep evil from growing. Evil doesn't happen all at once. It's a gradual erosion of standards.

The nuance you fail to appreciate is that some people may honestly believe that something you label as evil is in fact a good. No rationalizing needed.

 

[alang1216]

For me to know that I'd have to know what they said about it, right?

Now, are you limiting your concern to what Christian Zionists did? Or does you concern extend to every instance of lands being taken from others? And aren't you making a moral argument? Because according to Darwin, this should be expected, right?

We are in a Christian Zionist thread. I know enough history to know displacement is the rule and not the exception but that doesn't mean I have to like it. Extinction of species is also the rule and not the exception but I'm not in favor of that either.

 

[Meriweather]

The nuance you fail to appreciate is that some people may honestly believe that something you label as evil is in fact a good. No rationalizing needed.

This is the argument that good and evil are not objective, but subjective. When it comes to good and evil, all people have to delve deep enough to identify the objective good and the objective evil.

 

[alang1216]

This is the argument that good and evil are not objective, but subjective. When it comes to good and evil, all people have to delve deep enough to identify the objective good and the objective evil.

True, but my point is that everyone will differ in how they identify the objective good and the objective evil. The world is not black and white, it is an infinite number of shades of grey.

 

[Meriweather]

True, but my point is that everyone will differ in how they identify the objective good and the objective evil. The world is not black and white, it is an infinite number of shades of grey.

Delve deep enough, and the shades for good and evil are more the black and white of objective fact than they are the greys of the subjective. A society makes a grave mistake in allowing everyone decide their own good and their own evil. Ancient man learned this, too.

 

[alang1216]

Delve deep enough, and the shades for good and evil are more the black and white of objective fact than they are the greys of the subjective. A society makes a grave mistake in allowing everyone decide their own good and their own evil. Ancient man learned this, too.

I feel you have it backwards because you wish that is the way it was. I suspect you'd be unable to name an 'objective' fact that has no shades of grey. You're also wrong about society allowing everyone decide their own good and their own evil, it is just the opposite. Society determines what is good or evil and demands everyone follow those rules. If anything, it is religions reliance on a higher authority that empowers everyone to decide their own good and their own evil. Examples would be flying airplanes into buildings or killing an abortion provider.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Earth is a complex place and Christianity is just one attempt at understanding life. One wonders what prehistoric humankind thought, in Asian r in African. Humans make it up as they travel along. Eskimos are interesting example.

The Judeo-Christian faith gave us Western Civilization.

Is there a civilization you think is better?

 

[PoliticalChic]

"Judeo" and "Christian" are two, very different religions. There is only one, true religion. The Christian religion.

I'm going to post Acts 11:26 twice. Tell me which verse is correct and which one has been falsely manipulated:

Acts 11:26, "And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."

Acts 11:26, "And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Judeo-Christians first in Antioch."

One is truth. One is a lie.

Jesus bound Himself to the Old Testament.
It is clear in the New Testament.

Old and New of the same religion.


Jesus was born a Jew, died a Jew and never denied his lineage.

Matthew 5:18, the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.




There is a single religion based on the Ten Commandments......the Judeo-Christian faith.




Clearly Jesus said the very opposite of what you say.


Why is that?

 

[Meriweather]

I feel you have it backwards because you wish that is the way it was. I suspect you'd be unable to name an 'objective' fact that has no shades of grey. You're also wrong about society allowing everyone decide their own good and their own evil, it is just the opposite. Society determines what is good or evil and demands everyone follow those rules. If anything, it is religions reliance on a higher authority that empowers everyone to decide their own good and their own evil. Examples would be flying airplanes into buildings or killing an abortion provider.

It goes back to killing. All your examples are of people killing those who would not be expected/able to defend themselves. Killing, good or evil?

 

[alang1216]

It goes back to killing. All your examples are of people killing those who would not be expected/able to defend themselves. Killing, good or evil?

Not being religious, I'd say the killings in my examples are evil. However, there are examples I could give where killing would be good. In my examples, the perpetrators certainly believed the killings were good.

 

[PoliticalChic]

It goes back to killing. All your examples are of people killing those who would not be expected/able to defend themselves. Killing, good or evil?

 

[PoliticalChic]

"....Christian Zionism, a political ideology driving much of the Trump administration’s current crackdown on Palestine activism on campuses ...The foundation of Christian Zionism is the belief that Israel today is a continuation of the biblical land of Israel. Palestine will be “returned” to the Jews,....

Donald Trump’s pick for US ambassador to Israel, Mike Huckabee, is likely to be the newest addition to a growing list of Christian Zionists in Trump’s cabinet. During his Senate hearing on Tuesday, he reaffirmed the roots of his connection to Israel and Zionism: “We ultimately are people of the book. We believe the Bible. And therefore, that connection is not geopolitical. It is also spiritual.”

Such rhetoric is rooted in the broader movement of Christian Zionism, which includes organizations like Christians United for Israel (CUFI), a group with close ties to Huckabee. ....Under Donald Trump, CUFI made major strides, taking credit for several of the first Trump administration’s hawkish projects including Israel’s annexation of the Golan Heights, moving the US embassy to Jerusalem, and cutting aid to UNRWA, the United Nations body tasked with serving Palestinian refugees."

Christian Zionism Is on the March

Mike Huckabee began his confirmation hearings to become Donald Trump’s ambassador to Israel this week. He has a long history of close association with the Christian Zionist movement and its degradation of Palestinian lives.

jacobin.com

 

[PoliticalChic]

Judeo-Christianity.....one religion or two?

a. Obvious differences notwithstanding....the Messiah, who maintains His commection to the Old Testament
b....both are based on the same ideology and theology....the Ten Commandments
c. Both are connected through an uninterrupted timeline
d. Both are connected through America's Founders who saw themselves as the continuationm of the Old Testament Hebrews.
e. Which of the two cites the psalms? Both, Jesus as one of his last words.....22nd psalm

 

[The Irish Ram]

Your math is still off. Hebrew immigrated there around 1200 BC. Islam arrived by 700 AD. By my calculator that is 1900 years.

God gave that land to Abraham around 2,000 BC.

 

[alang1216]

God gave that land to Abraham around 2,000 BC.

And then He took it away and gave the land to others. Numerous times.

Here is a list of major conquerors and ruling powers of the region that became known as Palestine, organized chronologically:

Ancient and Classical Periods​

• Ancient Egyptians (Late Bronze Age)
• Israelite Kingdoms (Kingdoms of Israel and Judah)
• Philistines (Controlled the southern coast)
• Assyrian Empire (8th century BCE)
• Babylonian Empire (c. 601 BCE)
• Achaemenid (Persian) Empire (Conquered Babylon in 539 BCE)
• Macedonian Empire (Conquered by Alexander the Great in 332 BCE)
  • Succeeded by the Ptolemies (Egyptian-based Hellenistic kingdom)
  • And the Seleucids (Syrian-based Hellenistic kingdom)
• Hasmonean Kingdom (Jewish kingdom established after the Maccabean Revolt)
• Roman Republic/Empire (Annexed in 63 BCE, later the province of Judea and then Syria Palaestina)
• Byzantine Empire (Eastern Roman Empire)

Medieval and Early Modern Periods​

• Rashidun Caliphate (Began the Muslim conquest in the 7th century CE)
• Umayyad Caliphate
• Abbasid Caliphate
• Fatimids (Shi'a Islamic Caliphate)
• Seljuks (Turkic Empire)
• Crusaders (Established the Kingdom of Jerusalem, 1099-1187, with later intermittent control)
• Ayyubid Sultanate (Reconquered Jerusalem under Saladin in 1187)
• Mamluk Sultanate (Defeated the Mongols and reunified the region)
• Ottoman Empire (Conquered in 1516, ruling until World War I)

Modern Period​

• United Kingdom (Occupied during WWI, administered as the British Mandate for Palestine from 1922)
• Jordan and Egypt (Controlled the West Bank/East Jerusalem and the Gaza Strip, respectively, after the 1948 Arab-Israeli War)
• Israel (Established in 1948, and captured the West Bank, East Jerusalem, and the Gaza Strip in 1967)

 

[The Irish Ram]

Jerusalem has been overtaken and recaptured 44 times. This time, God said He will get involved personally. Israel will forever belong to the Jews. And not just the little sliver they have now.

 

[Hector12]

When I say that I am a Christian Zionist I mean that I am a Christian and that my support for Israel is unconditional.

 

[alang1216]

Jerusalem has been overtaken and recaptured 44 times. This time, God said He will get involved personally. Israel will forever belong to the Jews. And not just the little sliver they have now.

Wow! I had no idea! When did He say this and to whom?

 

[Hector12]

As I have posited several times, there is only one single religion, not two different ones, the Judeo-Christian religion, that is the mainstay of Western Civilization and of America. The history of Zionism attests to that fact.



1. “…the movement arrived in America with the first settlers. The Puritans and the Scottish Covenanters were Christian Zionists who modeled their escape from the British Isles over the Atlantic on the Israelite exodus from Egypt through the Red Sea….The universities they founded, Harvard and Yale, required all students to learn Hebrew. Salem, one of their first settlements, was named after the Hebrew word for “peace.”


2. …radical Protestants such as the Puritans read biblical promises made to the Jews as unfulfilled commitments to modern Jews. These included, crucially, the repatriation of the Jews and reconstruction of a Third Temple.


3. The emergence of the Jewish Zionist movement in the late nineteenth century was shaped by Christian Zionists who were far greater in number and had been agitating for centuries for the repatriation of the Jews to their biblical homeland. William Blackstone, a highly influential evangelical author who dubbed himself “God’s little errand boy,” headed up a mass petition to then-president Benjamin Harrison for the delivery of Palestine to the Jews….petitioning for the transportation of Jews to Palestine was sent in 1891, several years before the Jewish Zionist movement had emerged.


4. William Hechler, an Anglican clergyman, and a patron and door-opener for Theodor Herzl, the founder of modern Jewish Zionism, is another important figure in the history of Christian Zionism. Hechler lobbied Herzl to select Palestine as the political objective for the movement over other options in Africa and Asia offered by the British Empire. So implicated were nineteenth-century Christians in the early days of Zionism that many scholars and rabbis have gone as far as to describe Zionism as a Christian phenomenon.


5. …Gil Hochberg, a professor of Middle East Studies at Colombia (sic), has argued that “the majority of Zionists across the globe are Christians. In fact, it has always been the case. Zionism is a Christian ideology with deep roots in both Catholic and Protestant communities.” Christian eschatology, which conflates the Jews of the Bible with contemporary European Jews and which advocates for their physical restoration to Palestine, dates back to at least early seventeenth century Jacobean England.”

• End-Times for Christian Zionism

PoliticalChic, you have the most beautiful avatar on the US Message Board.

Is that you?