Chirac Est un Ver

[Annie]

Links and a great photo of Chirac the worm...


http://instapundit.com/archives/017679.php

September 09, 2004
MORE ON THE FRANCE-IRAQ CONNECTION, and why it led the French to oppose U.S. intervention:


The intelligence reports showing French assistance to Saddam ongoing in the late winter of 2002 helped explain why France refused to deal harshly with Iraq and blocked U.S. moves at the United Nations.

"No wonder the French are opposing us," one U.S. intelligence official remarked after illegal sales to Iraq of military and dual-use parts, originating in France, were discovered early last year before the war began. . . .

U.S. intelligence would not discover the pipeline until the eve of war last year; sensitive intelligence indicated that parts had been smuggled to Iraq as recently as that January. . . .

As of last year, Iraq owed France an estimated $4 billion for arms and infrastructure projects, according to French government estimates. U.S. officials thought this massive debt was one reason France opposed a military operation to oust Saddam.

The fact that illegal deals continued even as war loomed indicated France viewed Saddam's regime as a future source of income.


Nice to be reminded of this. Meanwhile, Chirac isn't exactly living up to the spirit of Kyoto: "The answer was simple: the French air force, which operates the presidential Airbus 319, was ordered to tack another 1,200 miles on to its flight so that Mr Chirac could sleep undisturbed."


posted at 09:02 AM by Glenn Reynolds

 

[padisha emperor]

Maybe France didn't war for its interests.....but I'm not sure that it is the only reason, and I think It didn't for the reason I've explain in some other post : UN, international rights.......et caetera.

Because I thought one minute : France knew that the war will happen, and that USA will win - we are not dumb, what can do a poor army against the 1st world army ? - . France had interests in Iraq. So, a war would make that France will lose these advantages. So, if France, like you mean, do all ruled by it interests, it would do war with US and UK. So, France would have interests, advantages, like oil...., the winner advantages. But France didn't. And France knew that this war will annihilate the advantages.

Conclusion : if France wanted to keep it interests, it would do war. They didn't. So maybe this question of interests was not the only one which ruled the french decision.

 

[Annie]

Maybe France didn't war for its interests.....but I'm not sure that it is the only, and I think It didn't for the reason I've explain in some other post : UN, international rights.......et caetera.

Because I thought one minute : France knew that the war will happen, and that USA will win - we are not dumb, what can do a poor army against the 1st world army ? - . France had interests in Iraq. So, a war would make that France will lose these advantages. So, if France, like you mean, do all ruled by it interests, it would do war with US and UK. So, France would have interests, advantages, like oil...., the winner advantages. But France didn't. And France knew that this war will annihilate the advantages.

Conclusion : if France wanted to keep it interests, it would do war. They didn't. So myabe this question of interests was not the only one which ruled the french decision.

Curious, did you check out the original site and links? Have you checked out any of the threads discussing the documents being reported all over the place about Bush's service? If the answer is 'No, haven't had time or not interested', please don't tell me you are 'open-minded.'

 

[padisha emperor]

Excuse me, "Kathianne the great", but it's quite hard for me to read and well understand all these text.

And, YOU, my dear, be open-minded.
I didn't that France had so much interests in Iraq - i knew we had some, but not so many - , and I admit that theis question of interestshad certainly plaid in the french decision. But Isay also that if France makes all ruled by interests, it did war. And it did'nt.

SO it's not because I don't read all your links that I 'm close-minded. It's only that I don't speak English like you. If you'ld go one day on a french board with a level in french like mine in english, you'll see it will be hard for you.
I think that the fact I come here, i speak with people who are not really nice with me for the most mart, some are agressive, and that I stay polite, want to understand, maybe want to teach you sometimes when I can, want to leanr from you when it could happen , it is not particularly a demonstration of the fact that I'm "close-minded".....

And in my post you'll never read that I affirm I tell the truth. It is suggestion, supputation....


For the pic, I think that the Sun is a cradle of filth, even the real english journalist say it.

 

[Annie]

Excuse me, "Kathianne the great", but it's quite hard for me to read and well understand all these text.

And, YOU, my dear, be open-minded.
I didn't that France had so much interests in Iraq - i knew we had some, but not so many - , and I admit that theis question of interestshad certainly plaid in the french decision. But Isay also that if France makes all ruled by interests, it did war. And it did'nt.

SO it's not because I don't read all your links that I 'm close-minded. It's only that I don't speak English like you. If you'ld go one day on a french board with a level in french like mine in english, you'll see it will be hard for you.
I think that the fact I come here, i speak with people who are not really nice with me for the most mart, some are agressive, and that I stay polite, want to understand, maybe want to teach you sometimes when I can, want to leanr from you when it could happen , it is not particularly a demonstration of the fact that I'm "close-minded".....

And in my post you'll never read that I affirm I tell the truth. It is suggestion, supputation....


For the pic, I think that the Sun is a cradle of filth, even the real english journalist say it.

Excuse me, watch 'the great' stuff, that could be considered flamming a moderator-see rules.

The French seem to have come to the conclusion that the US is FRANCE"S enemy; while so many of you keep claiming that the US people are treating you too harshly, you seem to forget the very practical maxim, "The enemy of my enemy, is my friend." Since France chose to sell the missiles, right up to the eve of war, knowing they would be used on US pilots, not to mention they had been sold and used, unsuccessfully for the past 13 years on US and UK pilots, France IS our self-declared enemy through actions.

 

[padisha emperor]

Do you really think that France sold missiles for kill US pilots ? it is bad faith.....the international weapon parket is like it is, USA sold also lot of weapons...
Be sure that France and French don't consider USA like an ennemy, if there are some who do, they are dumb.

When we sold Exocet missiles to Argentina, and when one of them sunk a British ship, do you think that we thought "great, exactly like we've planed it"...No !
France is not happy when french weapons kill allied soldiers...

 

[CSM]

The French arms industry did indeed sell arms to Iraq AFTER the UN sanctions went in place. They also aided Iraq in the Oil for Food scandal AFTER the UN sanctions were in place; in other words, France, who severely criticized the US for not complying with the wishes of the international community, did themselves ignore the wishes of the international community.

Much criticism is heaped on the US regarding the lust for money (oil) and power, yet every nation on the planet seeks to further their own interests without regard for the global community, and this includes France. Four billion dollars is not a trivial sum, even to the US.

 

[padisha emperor]

I agree, but sale weapons and do war is not exactly the same thing.

 

[CSM]

I agree, but sale weapons and do war is not exactly the same thing.

True enough, but the sale of weapons to a country which is under international sanctions (sanctions to which France had agreed to adhere) is dishonest as a minimum. France and Germany both seem to have a problem (as do many other nations) following their own advice. Their participation in the EU as well as the UN boils down to "Do as we tell you, not as we do."

 

[Annie]

Do you really think that France sold missiles for kill US pilots ? it is bad faith.....the international weapon parket is like it is, USA sold also lot of weapons...
Be sure that France and French don't consider USA like an ennemy, if there are some who do, they are dumb.

When we sold Exocet missiles to Argentina, and when one of them sunk a British ship, do you think that we thought "great, exactly like we've planed it"...No !
France is not happy when french weapons kill allied soldiers...

Considering they were still selling the weapons on the eve of war, yes, they were doing so with the idea they would be used against the US. Yesterday I provided you with the link that showed the countries that provided weapons and the ranking of what they provided. It was not close-you know that.

So, France was definately working on the presumption of "The enemy of my enemy, is my friend."

 

[CSM]

Considering they were still selling the weapons on the eve of war, yes, they were doing so with the idea they would be used against the US. Yesterday I provided you with the link that showed the countries that provided weapons and the ranking of what they provided. It was not close-you know that.

So, France was definately working on the presumption of "The enemy of my enemy, is my friend."

To be fair, I do think that France, Germany and Russia just plain didn't believe that the US would go in without complete UN approval. I think those countries saw it as a calculated risk. They (like their customer) calculated wrong.

 

[Annie]

To be fair, I do think that France, Germany and Russia just plain didn't believe that the US would go in without complete UN approval. I think those countries saw it as a calculated risk. They (like their customer) calculated wrong.

CSM, if you are correct, which I would take issue with, then you are assuming that your stated triangle, were woefully without a valid thesis. Can't believe that was true, with the possible exception of Germany, which seemed to believe their own electioneering. Certainly not France, nor Russia.

 

[CSM]

CSM, if you are correct, which I would take issue with, then you are assuming that your stated triangle, were woefully without a valid thesis. Can't believe that was true, with the possible exception of Germany, which seemed to believe their own electioneering. Certainly not France, nor Russia.

You may be correct. There is no doubt that France and Germany are trying very hard to dominate the EU which indicatges to me that they are seeking parity and perhaps even economic dominance/prominance. That fact alone gives them a reason to want the USA to fail in its foriegn policy. Anything that makes the US more successful weakens their bid. As for Russia, they are in big trouble economically; they must take risks and they aren't exactly best friends despite the end of the Cold War.

As for a valid thesis, what makes you think those governments are capable of developing a valid thesis in the first place. By that I mean their best efforts got them where they are today; that doesn't speak well for their thinking ability.

 

[5stringJeff]

All things said, though, the chick holding that sing is pretty hot!

 

[Johnney]

Do you really think that France sold missiles for kill US pilots ?

your serious with this statement? now what do you think they were selling these things for? to put them on a mantle and admire them? wake up and smell the whine.

 

[padisha emperor]

Ae you dumb or do you do it on purpose ?
France certainly not wanted to sale these weapons for killing AMERICAN or any ALLIED soldiers. France knew it will kill people, like all the weapons, but not allied soldiers.

Now, I will do a parallel : France sold weapons to Iraq, it kill US soldiers, excuse us, but it was really not the researched aim.
Druing the war, a big number of british soldiers were killed by AMERICAN soldiers. You didn't do that on purpose, like France for the weapons, we didn't want that they would kill US. USA didn't want that some M-16 bullets would kill UK soldiers.



Other suject : you say that France and Germany want to rule about EU. France and Germany are at the origin of this Union., with the CECA. France and Germany are the historic fathers of EU, and its motor. This couple lead Europe, yes. But France and Germany respect Bruxelles.

 

[Johnney]

now let me get this straight.
france sells weapons to iraq upto the US deadline for going to war and your saying that they didnt know what they were going to be used for?
now come on. my ten year old nephew figured that one out.
thats probably one of the reasons they didnt go to war with us. why let frogs get killed with the crap they they sold them.
you jsut keep that blind eye blind

 

[padisha emperor]

now let me get this straight.
france sells weapons to iraq upto the US deadline for going to war and your saying that they didnt know what they were going to be used for?
now come on. my ten year old nephew figured that one out.
thats probably one of the reasons they didnt go to war with us. why let frogs get killed with the crap they they sold them.
you jsut keep that blind eye blind

Believe that France sold on purpose weapons TO KILL U.S. SOLDIERS is one of the big stupidities I've ever heard and read....

When you say that France did not war because they didn't want to be killed by their own weapons, sold to iraq, it's dumb : french weapons are good, but who more than France know how to fight them ? hmmm ? fRance kno all the weak of it weapons, like US know the weaks of US weapons....
So if France would have done war, It would have known how to fight against Iraqi with french weapons.....
We were not affraid....so don't say anything

Im not blind , like you want to believe....I'm just sure...sure that France never sale weapons in the planed aim of killing allied soldiers, they could be germans, british, US, it's a non-sense...

YOU are blind, because you believe hard as a rock that France is YOUR ennemy, and that France kill US soldiers....stop to think that. France was the first official US ally, now the relations are not so good than in 1787, but we are still allies....

 

[Annie]

but we are still allies....

No, we are not!

 

[dilloduck]

Believe that France sold on purpose weapons TO KILL U.S. SOLDIERS is one of the big stupidities I've ever heard and read....

When you say that France did not war because they didn't want to be killed by their own weapons, sold to iraq, it's dumb : french weapons are good, but who more than France know how to fight them ? hmmm ? fRance kno all the weak of it weapons, like US know the weaks of US weapons....
So if France would have done war, It would have known how to fight against Iraqi with french weapons.....
We were not affraid....so don't say anything

Im not blind , like you want to believe....I'm just sure...sure that France never sale weapons in the planed aim of killing allied soldiers, they could be germans, british, US, it's a non-sense...

YOU are blind, because you believe hard as a rock that France is YOUR ennemy, and that France kill US soldiers....stop to think that. France was the first official US ally, now the relations are not so good than in 1787, but we are still allies....

Not my ally ! Forgetting everything about about past dealings, France has now chosen to leave what we had allied for in the dust and gone it's own way.