Chips ....

[Chips Rafferty]

No one "pushes" their faith on anyone because you can't force belief. Its simply impossible to do.

There are those that are more aggressive in sharing it and can be annoying. And then there are others who are so super sensitive that the idea that someone might want to share something with them thats important is offensive to them.

But force? its impossible.

Then there are those who insist that if "God" wants to get a public OR private messsage across, he doesn't need an incestuous tribe of unwarrantedly conceited desert nomads, or their self-appointed Seppo successors, to pass it on.

 

[Chips Rafferty]

I know this! I have a few close friends that are non-believers and they could care less about other's believing....

Only the ones that seem to be struggling with the transition or of course in my opinion because I am a believer , only those that are being nagged by the Supreme being... "protest so much"!

lol and believe me, I love all of mankind, one does not have to be a Christian or believer in God! I think ALL human beings are facinating!

Care

They just go on doing what they want, and leaving other people to what they want..

Then try following your own sage advice, Shatturd!

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Ahh so this is about hating Jews.... Nothing like good old bigotry.

Share with us... what did some evil nasty Jew do to you?

 

[Chips Rafferty]

Ahh so this is about hating Jews.... Nothing like good old bigotry.

Share with us... what did some evil nasty Jew do to you?

Wrote a book on religious and racial apartheid that said they are superior to me.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Ahh you must be referring to that evil nasty Old testament, ohh wait I forgot, you include the new as well. How does it do what you claim?

 

[Chips Rafferty]

Ahh you must be referring to that evil nasty Old testament, ohh wait I forgot, you include the new as well. How does it do what you claim?

I won't bother explaining. You have already proven you mind is as closed as a steel trap to any form of freethought. It would be like feeding strawberries to pigs.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Well of course, when one is faced with the impossible simply refuse to do anything. I will in the future remember that you are incapable of articulating a response other than name calling and selective quoting.

Having been left to my own devices I will simply assume you are a bigot that hates Jews. That this unreasoning, undefined hatred clouds your ability to discuss religion or any matter in a reasonable manner.

In other words your a waste of time. Though I will of course still poke you with a stick when ever it suits me.

 

[Chips Rafferty]

Well of course, when one is faced with the impossible simply refuse to do anything. I will in the future remember that you are incapable of articulating a response other than name calling and selective quoting.

Having been left to my own devices I will simply assume you are a bigot that hates Jews. That this unreasoning, undefined hatred clouds your ability to discuss religion or any matter in a reasonable manner.

In other words your a waste of time. Though I will of course still poke you with a stick when ever it suits me.

Why do you want me to articulate anything? Seeing that you can read God's mind, mine ought to be a cinch!

Tell ya what I’ll do. You promise not to refer to or quote the Bible and I’ll discuss religion with you till the cows come home.

Deal?

 

[Chips Rafferty]

Why do you want me to articulate anything? Seeing that you can read God's mind, mine ought to be a cinch!

Tell ya what I’ll do. You promise not to refer to or quote the Bible and I’ll discuss religion with you till the cows come home.

Deal?

....Whassamada Guns? Satan got your tongue?

I think that my proposal is only fair. I’m willing to argue my point(s) logically and lucidly without resorting to fairytales, superstition, and supposition.

If I wanted to argue with a book there are whole libraries full of far more informative and far less mind-fuckingly boring books than the Bible.

Ya see, I don’t recognise your Bible at all, let alone regard it as a legitimate research work and/or a supreme authority on everything. In fact I’m even willing to defend Mein Kampf as being more moderate and commonsensical than this racially supremacist pot-boiler. So why should I allow you to appeal to its illogical cant to settle an argument ?

Plus I’m not pushing an alternative religion in opposition to yours. I could just as well insist that the text of Heavens Gate, the Koran, or Chucklers Weekly is The Way, The Truth, and The Life and counter your robotic ravings with equally rabid quotes from them.

However I’m not in the habit of humouring delusional people who believe in talking snakes, asses, (arses?) satanic pigs, and “righteous” Patriarchs ******* their own kids.

If you can’t argue without repetitively referring to and repeating its mindless pap, that’s fine by me.

Having been left to my own devices I will simply assume you are a bigot that loves Jews. That this unreasoning, undefined love clouds your ability to discuss religion or any matter in a reasonable manner.

In other words your(sic) a waste of time. Though I will of course still poke you with a stick when ever it suits me.

 

[Care4all]

So a crime that hurts a person forever, should be meted out a punishment that has similiar consequences? Correct?

Not necessarily Avatar.

Malice must be present when the person hurt the other person.

And it depends on the "hurt".... for example if my husband were to commit adultery, which is still against the law in most states....

I could be hurt for life on something like that....it's not a physical hurt...but a hurt none the less....but I would not want my husband to be hurt for life for this mistake.... that seems vindictive and vengence is God's.


You know, I was reading exodus or maybe it was leviticus the other day....and it had verses explaining punishments for certain acts....

I was amazed at how FAIR God really was.... I should not have been amazed, but I was....

especially one part that talked about the punishment towards a man that stole crops or food from your field.... if he stole the food to feed himself, IT WAS NOT A CRIME, but if he stole the food, and took it with him and sold it in town for a profit, then it would be considered stealing....

I was ashamed at myself for thinking that this man in the field STOLE from the other man that owned the field, but the fact of the matter is that God, did not consider it stealing if it was to nourish a human being....

anyway, I think it is important not to over punish and to forgive...as Christ forgave the adulteress in the courtyard that was about to be stoned for her sin and crimes...

care

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Why do you want me to articulate anything? Seeing that you can read God's mind, mine ought to be a cinch!

Tell ya what I’ll do. You promise not to refer to or quote the Bible and I’ll discuss religion with you till the cows come home.

Deal?

LOL, I suggest you READ this thread.... the one quoting passages from the Bible is YOU. I am simply responding to what YOU have said. Provide ONE quote of me "quoting" the Bible.

As for not referring to it, umm it is one of the major religious text I believe in, how does one NOT refer to it?

Follow your own advice, cease misquoting the Bible.

 

[Care4all]

Not necessarily Avatar.

Malice must be present when the person hurt the other person.

And it depends on the "hurt".... for example if my husband were to commit adultery, which is still against the law in most states....

I could be hurt for life on something like that....it's not a physical hurt...but a hurt none the less....but I would not want my husband to be hurt for life for this mistake.... that seems vindictive and vengence is God's.


You know, I was reading exodus or maybe it was leviticus the other day....and it had verses explaining punishments for certain acts....

I was amazed at how FAIR God really was.... I should not have been amazed, but I was....

especially one part that talked about the punishment towards a man that stole crops or food from your field.... if he stole the food to feed himself, IT WAS NOT A CRIME, but if he stole the food, and took it with him and sold it in town for a profit, then it would be considered stealing....

I was ashamed at myself for thinking that this man in the field STOLE from the other man that owned the field, but the fact of the matter is that God, did not consider it stealing if it was to nourish a human being....

anyway, I think it is important not to over punish and to forgive...as Christ forgave the adulteress in the courtyard that was about to be stoned for her sin and crimes...

care

i wanted to add this too, to the above and maybe you could help me or give me your opinion on this ''pretty please'', if you can...

After Christ told those that were getting ready to enforce ''God's'' punishment for adultery on to this women...and Christ said, ''let he who is without sin, cast the first stone...'', and all of these men ended up walking away, without executing their condemnation and punishment upon the adulteress....

Christ said to this woman, ''your sins are FORGIVEN, now go, and sin no more''....

He FORGAVE this adulteress, BEFORE He asked her to repent...

WHY?

this was enlightening to me when thought about....Christ's actions, the forgiveness of sin and even the punishment that was suppose to go with it according to the Law....came before the person even contemplated repenting...

why, would He do that...?

i think i have ''missed'' this aspect of this scripture all of these years...forgiveness was given BEFORE the person repenting and changing their life? wow....it's just a wow!

perhaps, this example of Christ's has been ignored or misunderstood, or just missed in my case....

maybe by forgiving this woman's sin....that she deserved to die for according to the Law, gave this woman the overwhelming desire to change her life for the good..... this undeserved forgiveness, is what turned her around....the gratitude that she felt for this GIFT of mercy upon her, is the catalist that brought her to living her life in the future, ''according to God''?

what do you make of my synopsis?

and if i am right....how does it figure in to punishment of people that hurt us and commit crimes, in today's world?

care

 

[Care4all]

Because I’m s-o-o decent, righteous, and loving I want wicked Christians to repent and have what I have! Plus my God (Sam, The Good Shepherd) has given me a Grand Commission to make the entire world a mirror image of my sanctified self.

If you also knew the inner secrets of the universe, like me (PBUM!), you too would want to continually demonstrate to lesser beings what a nauseating God-ingratiating goody-two-shoes that you are.

Isn't that the whole idea of this particular forum?

i don't really know what the purpose of this forum is....we never had a religion forum on my other boards...?

YOU are pretty funny though....and made me smile a time or two with some of your comments!

care

 

[Chips Rafferty]

LOL, I suggest you READ this thread.... the one quoting passages from the Bible is YOU. I am simply responding to what YOU have said. Provide ONE quote of me "quoting" the Bible.

As for not referring to it, umm it is one of the major religious text I believe in, how does one NOT refer to it?

Follow your own advice, cease misquoting the Bible.

First, I suggest you read my post again, Duke.

I said,

"Tell ya what I’ll do. You promise not to refer to or quote the Bible and I’ll discuss religion with you till the cows come home."

The sentence did NOT accuse you of quoting the Bible. Your reply is a typical Christian straw man argument you are trying to introduce to sidetrack the issue.

Even RSR would have understood that my invitation, and my request that you not refer to or quote the Vilefilled as a credible authority, was conditionally couched in the future tense.

And secondly, you still haven't answered the question that the statement posed.

Are you willing to discuss the causes psychology and consequences of RELIGION....

Religion—sometimes used interchangeably with faith or belief system—is commonly defined as belief concerning the supernatural, sacred, or divine, and the moral codes, practices and institutions associated with such belief. In its broadest sense some have defined it as the sum total of answers given to explain humankind's relationship with the universe. In the course of the development of religion, it has taken a huge number of forms in various cultures and individuals - Wikipedia

....without referring to the Bible as the basis and justification of your illogical beliefs?

Here, I'll even give you a sneak preview of the sort of stuff I'll expect you to logically refute,

Notes on the Christian Imagination
In Christianity neither morality nor religion comes into contact with reality at any point. Nothing but imaginary causes: god, soul, ego, spirit, free-will or unfree-will. Nothing but imaginary effects: sin, redemption, grace, punishment, forgiveness of sins. A traffic between imaginary beings: god, spirits, souls. An imaginary natural science: anthropocentric, complete lack of the concept of natural causes. An imaginary psychology: nothing but self-misunderstandings, interpretations of pleasant or unpleasant general feelings. For example, the condition of the nervous sympathicus with the aid of sign language of religio-moral idiocyncracy: repentance, sting of conscious, temptation by the devil, the proximity of god. An imaginary teleology: the kingdom of god, the last judgement, eternal life. This purely fictitious world is distinguished from the world of dreams very much to its disadvantage by the fact that the latter mirrors actuality while the former falsifies, disvalues and denies actuality. Once the concept "nature" has been devised as a concept antithetical to god, "natural" had to be the word for reprehensible. This entire fictional world has its roots in hatred of the natural actuality. It is the expression of a profound discontent with the actual. But that explains everything. Who alone has reason to lie himself out of actuality? He who suffers from it. But to suffer from actuality means to be an abort of actuality. The preponderance of feelings of displeasure over feelings of pleasure is the cause of a fictitious morality and religion. Such a preponderance however provides the formula for decadance.

Never mind what particular cult you belong to, I am essentially asking you to sell me on your belief by explaining the reasoning behind it.

As far as I'm concerned, you either believe ALL the Bible, as Christ commanded, or you concede you are nothing but a fair-weather cafeteria Christian who picks and chooses self-serving bits of scripture to confirm his prejudices.

In other words, a Christian in name only, whose convenient faith just so happens to conform with what he perceives is the "moral majority." The kind of camp-follower Christian that the biblical Jesus wouldn't piss on if you were on fire.

 

[Gunny]

First, I suggest you read my post again, Duke.

I said,

The sentence did NOT accuse you of quoting the Bible. Your reply is a typical Christian straw man argument you are trying to introduce to sidetrack the issue.

Even RSR would have understood that my invitation, and my request that you not refer to or quote the Vilefilled as a credible authority, was conditionally couched in the future tense.

And secondly, you still haven't answered the question that the statement posed.

Are you willing to discuss the causes psychology and consequences of RELIGION....

....without referring to the Bible as the basis and justification of your illogical beliefs?

Here, I'll even give you a sneak preview of the sort of stuff I'll expect you to logically refute,



Never mind what particular cult you belong to, I am essentially asking you to sell me on your belief by explaining the reasoning behind it.

As far as I'm concerned, you either believe ALL the Bible, as Christ commanded, or you concede you are nothing but a fair-weather cafeteria Christian who picks and chooses self-serving bits of scripture to confirm his prejudices.

In other words, a Christian in name only, whose convenient faith just so happens to conform with what he perceives is the "moral majority." The kind of camp-follower Christian that the biblical Jesus wouldn't piss on if you were on fire.

The Gunny's point is valid. I began this thread as an extension to another where you chose to pick and choose from the Bible.

Are you going to hold yourself to the same standard? No quoting the Bible? That makes the argument even EASIER.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You don't want a discussion. Your parameters are that religion is a fantasy and illogical. You want the freedom to cite what you please while restricting everyone else to your arbitrary rules.

And again, YOU are the one constantly quoting the Bible. The Bible is to be believed, but not because some church says so, rather each individual is to freely come to the belief and understanding of what is required.

 

[Chips Rafferty]

You don't want a discussion. Your parameters are that religion is a fantasy and illogical. You want the freedom to cite what you please while restricting everyone else to your arbitrary rules.

And again, YOU are the one constantly quoting the Bible. The Bible is to be believed, but not because some church says so, rather each individual is to freely come to the belief and understanding of what is required.

Okay, you can quote the Bible. But be reminded that the burden of proof of a statement is on the professor.

In other words, none of that fundie "The Bible/Jesus says it, I believe it, that settles it!" to slime out of a tough corner.

Otherwise I might as well argue with the inmate oif a mental asylum.

There you go, convince me you are not making all this stuff up or just slavishly following suit to people-please and save your yellow arse from the imaginary fires of Hell when you kark it.

 

[Chips Rafferty]

The Gunny's point is valid. I began this thread as an extension to another where you chose to pick and choose from the Bible.

Are you going to hold yourself to the same standard? No quoting the Bible? That makes the argument even EASIER.

I pick and choose from the Bible? That’s rich! When the favourite Christian comeback when bested is, "When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean--neither more nor less."

Following this line of Loony Toons logic, any of the dyslexic sister-******* Forrest Gumps here trump an agnostic Doctor of Divinity any time!

Do Jack Chick Christians, with their Little Golden Books mentality, ever listen to the madcap mental gymnastics they go through to justify their psychosis? For example their oft repeated, “You can’t interpret the Bible correctly because you’re not a Christian!” If that isn’t the fevered gibbering of dangerously religiously insane people, then what the **** is?

Fancy having to resort to such high farce hocus-pocus to defend your phantasmagorical “faith” against a semiliterate seventh grader!

Yet Jimmy the ******’s - the poo-jabber who gave them their Proddie Bible - interpretation still stands unchallenged and revered after all these years!? Apparently Christians don’t have a problem with putrid Poofs interpreting their Bible for them!

Surely Christian's imaginary friend – who allegedly regards Jimmy as an ABOMINABLE sodomite – would strike down anyone reading from its contaminated pages!

Whoever wants to argue religion with me can start by telling me how the Christian religion is any different to the cargo-cultists up in the islands.

(Funny how so-called savages have a way of cutting through the crap and going straight to the gist of things, isn’t it? )

 

[Chips Rafferty]

You don't want a discussion. Your parameters are that religion is a fantasy and illogical. You want the freedom to cite what you please while restricting everyone else to your arbitrary rules.

And again, YOU are the one constantly quoting the Bible. The Bible is to be believed, but not because some church says so, rather each individual is to freely come to the belief and understanding of what is required.

Here, Guns, don't say I didn't give you a chop out!

 

[Care4all]

Chips! Please take a deep breath and calm down....

Is there a Christian in your life right now that is irking you or is being hypocritical or someone from the past?

Where does all of this anxiety of yours regarding Christians or any of the religious come from?

Who is feeding this "stuff" to you if you are not a Christian or was not raised a christian or a Jew? Your quotes pulled out of the Bible could not have been found just by picking up and reviewing the book in the Library and unless you know the verse and what book of the Bible it is in, it would be near impossible to do an internet search at the Bible Gateways on the net...

So to me, this means that "someone" is leading you to cause this havoc on this site or someone on a blog has moved you in to believing that the whole world would be fine and wonderful without God or anyone believing in HIm...

Or, just plainly, you could be a simple troll.

If I am wrong and you really are searching for some sort of answers in your own mind about how and what you think about God, then I apologize.

Care