Capitalism Guarantees Rising Inequality

[Toddsterpatriot]

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

Opinions are like assholes: everyone's got one, and they all stink.

It doesn't matter what all the ignorant rubes on the street believe. If there's corruption, it's a fact of reality that can be demonstrated, or it isn't. If you don't have proof of this "corruption," then your claim is horseshit.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Most things that are "generally assumed" are pure horseshit. You obviously have no evidence of any "corruption."

"Goldman Sachs is denying that it 'bet against its clients' when it changed its position in the housing market in 2007.

"But the reality is that is exactly when they did and a lot of things that are even worse than that.

"The corruption at Goldman Sachs is very deep and very entrenched, but they will never be fully investigated because they have such close ties to the U.S. government."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

"Goldman Sachs is denying that it 'bet against its clients' when it changed its position in the housing market in 2007.

Is Goldman required to be on the same side of the market as their clients?

If that's the case, they can never sell any product to a customer.
They can never take a position or create a synthetic security to facilitate a customer trade.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why don't you supply some evidence that private capitalist systems produce less corruption than government? Start with Wall Street. Then remind yourself how the parasites in the private detention industry, who earn seven figures annually for their "labor", spend millions more lobbying those responsible for deciding who to incarcerate and for how long how much private profit margins will suffer if US incarceration rates return to where they were forty years ago. Socialize the cost and privatize the profit; it's not rocket science.

First you'll have to list what you call "corruption." I'm not aware of any corruption on Wall Street.

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Thanks for the Michael Snyder link.

He's comedy gold. GOLD Jerry!

 

[dnsmith35]

Capitalism is defined by the idea that everyone pursuing their own interests leads to the common good of all.

Society exists not merely for living but for living well in communities. Capitalism says it too aims for living well. But upon learning of the facts, not many Americans live well (let alone nations in which imperialist capitalist policy has destroyed the chance for decent survival). Nearly 60% of Americans will live on or below the poverty line for over a year. The average household debt is between 125%-150% of household income.

Yet a higher % of people live better in the US than in any other country with a type of economic system not capitalist. Don't forget too, that the government poverty line is arbitrary and takes people from poverty to relative poverty, and those people live better than 4 or 5 billion people in the 3rd world. Capitalism did that for us.

Interest payments on past debt reduce the income that households have to spend and maintain a certain standard of living. An income shock (such as a bout of unemployment, the expenses of having a new baby, or a health problem) can lead families to resort to borrowing, which reduces household living standards in the future. Although future income may rise, the economic circumstances of the family will not improve if most of this extra income must pay interest in order to maintain past debt. This problem is ignored in standard measures of income equality, which take no account of the income lost in order to make interest payments on past consumption debt. They measure differences in personal or disposable income across a large population, but they do not measure differences in living standards, which is what inequality measures are supposed to do.

A contemporary example illustrates this problem. The cost of a college education has
increased by more than any other household spending category over the past two decades
(Newfield 2008). This increase is taken into account in government measures of inflation; so higher college costs lead to lower real household living standards in reported government data.

I have never known a person who has ignored such things, even I, when earning minimum wage 59 years ago, without health care insurance, did not ignore the issue. That is when I made it my business to improve my lot. Sure, I went into debt, such goes life. As to college costs, the relative poor has it all over the person in the middle class when it comes to getting student aid. A personal example: When I was just in the middle of my military career, we had 5 members of my family in college; my wife, 3 of my children, and I were all in college at the same time. The grants paid for everything. So don't go telling those of us who have experienced it how it works. None of that diatribe is relevant to capitalism, except that it was capitalism which funded the social programs which helped us and all other have nots in our country.

For those arguing capitalism makes everyone better off, they must demonstrate this in relative and real terms. People are better off in many cases, but those are relative terms (compared to say 1600s). But in real terms, capitalism has ceased providing the good life for the average citizen. But if capitalism has ceased working for the average person, that means it isn't working because society cannot neglect it's most common constituent.

You miss the point. The only measurement we need to use is the absolute fact, that today, even many of the people under the poverty line, those relative poor, live better than the lower middle class did 60 years ago. That is the success of capitalism funding social programs. None of your links, nor your comments prove anything to the contrary.

Indeed, American's have picked up on this and have reconfigured "The American Dream."

The 2011 MetLife Study of the American Dream reflects an uncertain era where
Americans no longer seek to become wealthy; rather, they want to achieve a sense of
financial security that allows them to live a sustainable lifestyle.

This has led to new thinking about what the American Dream means, and to a portrayal
of Americans as resilient and adaptive. And while achieving the Dream remains
important — particularly to younger Americans — how it is achieved has changed.

I don't ever remember anyone believing that the American Dream was to become wealthy, even if we would like to have done so. "to achieve a sense of
financial security that allows them to live a sustainable lifestyle." is my understanding of what has been the "American Dream" during my 78 years of life. But even then, the achieving that lifestyle required personal responsible, ambition, motivation, and hard work.

emerging trends that show Americans are less concerned with material issues, and that life’s traditional markers of success — getting married, buying a house, having a family, building wealth — do not matter as much today. Rather, achieving a sense of personal fulfillment is more important toward realizing the American Dream than accumulating material wealth.
This is a significant shift, as it reflects that Americans value close relationships with
family and friends as more important than money and that being content with what
they have and balancing work/life issues are more important than “living large.”
Today, material positions matter less and personal relationships matter more.
And for younger generations, “personal achievement” is the new “opportunity for
all.” Though they show a greater tendency toward this vision of the Dream than their
older counterparts, across generations, less than half of Americans say they need any
of the traditional Dream markers to achieve it.

Agreed, and that is how it should be.

https://www.metlife.com/assets/cao/gbms/studies/metlife-2011-american-dream-report.pdf

Why have Americans ceased believing in the traditional values of success and wealth? Because it genuinely is not available and thus in order to remain sane, one adapts to personal achievement, including the choice to live out of your car because it's the only way you can attain personal dreams.

Living in Your Car: No Longer Just for Bums - Businessweek

Capitalism generates wealth. No one denies that. Who makes the decisions about that wealth are not those who create it, namely the workers. The workers create the surplus for the capitalists and the capitalists decide to give themselves astronomical pay. This is created an obvious division between Americans and is being played out. As the inequality widens, so does the stress on capitalism.

Capitalism is not the end of history and it will be abolished. The matter is when, not if. The common good has been left in the dust and the world is waking up to it. Those arguing for capitalism for not perceptive enough to see this.

Why capitalism is a failure (because it neglects the common good, the average person):

Ah, so we start to see your issues with this statement, "Capitalism generates wealth. No one denies that. Who makes the decisions about that wealth are not those who create it, namely the workers." What a pity fully out dated way to think. During the agrarian era, individuals did the production, and that part of his production which exceeded his needs was "capital." The day that production turned to money as capital, creating and building an industry with inventiveness, the old excess production no longer was "capital." When to better themselves, people went into the city to get JOBS, provided to them by CAPITAL, not only did they better their lifestyle, they then became wage earners, not capital builders. Labor is no longer capital any more than their production. The earn their wage, nothing more. Capitalism will continue to be the most common economic system in free countries. The likely hood of it ever be abolished is zero to none. The reason being, no other economic system creates the per capita wealth to equal capitalism. That is a socialist dream, which if allowed to fruition will cost everyone but the commissars to lose prosperity. I for one do not ever want to go back to an agrarian society, and I don't ever want to live in a socialist country again. I do not like the dictatorship socialism requires. You cannot give us a single example of a socialist experiment which lasted for half the length of our capitalist society.

"From each to his ability and to each his needs" cannot excel in a free society.

 

[dnsmith35]

As a liberal, I subscribe to the belief that we should, within our means, provide all our people good public education and/or job training. We should have universal medical care to prevent the potential of traumatic losses because of health. We need to provide for the least of our citizens the assistance they need to live in dignity. Having lived in poverty, below that which or arbitrary poverty line has selected, I know from personal experience that is not real poverty. As a liberal, I believe in helping the most needy first. I am not a liberal with borders, therefore if the most needy is living in the slums of India, I will try to assist them first. I recognize that the "American Dream" is but a potential, in which the ability with ambition, motivation, personal responsibility and hard work it is made possible. There has never been a time in our history where that was considered the path to wealth, even though such a thing was possible.

I abhor the left wing extremists who believe some union worker in Detroit deserves to maintain the high income they have, rather than to keep a person elsewhere from starving. I have nothing against high wages for those who earn it, but I see no reason to protect it at the expense of the truly poor, no matter where they may be.

As a liberal, and a humanist, I cannot imagine that any other thinking could be so right.

 

[dnsmith35]

Why don't you supply some evidence that private capitalist systems produce less corruption than government? Start with Wall Street. Then remind yourself how the parasites in the private detention industry, who earn seven figures annually for their "labor", spend millions more lobbying those responsible for deciding who to incarcerate and for how long how much private profit margins will suffer if US incarceration rates return to where they were forty years ago. Socialize the cost and privatize the profit; it's not rocket science.

First you'll have to list what you call "corruption." I'm not aware of any corruption on Wall Street.

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

People believing the banking system is corrupt, does not make it so. Opinions without data is nothing but junk.

What is actually corrupt is the link to BusinessInsider.com, which only republished an article from End Of The American Dream.com, a less than first, or second, or third quality source. So then, here are those 11 examples of recent corruption on Wall Street:

The following are 11 examples of just how insanely corrupt the U.S. financial system has become….

People believing the banking system is corrupt, does not make it so. Opinions without data is nothing but junk.

What is actually corrupt is the link to BusinessInsider.com, which only republished an article from End Of The American Dream.com, a less than first, or second, or third quality source. So then, here are those 11 examples of recent corruption on Wall Street:

The following are 11 examples of just how insanely corrupt the U.S. financial system has become….

#1) An industry insider ”whistle blower” has come forward with “smoking gun” evidence that major financial institutions have been openly and blatantly manipulating the price of gold and silver. But so far those who are supposed to be regulating these firms have been sitting back and doing nothing about it.[A problem, but not corruption.]

#2) It has also now come out that most “gold” that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world’s largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive “gold deposits” at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all. Industry insiders are now revealing that LBMA banks actually have approximately a hundred times more gold deposits than actual gold bullion. When most people think they are buying gold what they are actually buying is pieces of paper that say that they own gold. Meanwhile they are being charged huge storage fees to store the gold. [A problem, but not corruption.]

#3) The guy who helped bring down AIG is going to get off scott-free and will be able to keep the millions in profits that he made in the process. It must be nice to be him. [A problem, but not corruption.]

#4) Goldman Sachs is denying that it “bet against its clients” when it changed its position in the housing market in 2007. But the reality is that is exactly when they did and a lot of things that are even worse than that. The corruption at Goldman Sachs is very deep and very entrenched, but they will never be fully investigated because they have such close ties to the U.S. government.[A problem, but not corruption.]

#5) It is being alleged that the biggest banks in the United States are ripping off American cities with the same predatory deals that brought down the financial system of Greece. Of course the big banks will rip off just about anyone these days if they think they can get away with it.[An unsupported opinion, but not corruption.]

#6) Several major Wall Street banks are beingaccused of using accounting techniques similar to those utilized by Lehman Brothers in its final days to mask the size of their balance sheets at the end of reporting periods.

#7) The Federal Reserve bought up the vast majority of U.S. government debt in 2009. Many analysts claim that this is the same as “printing money out of thin air”, while others are openly calling it a Ponzi scheme.[More unsupported opinions, but not corruption.]

#8) It turns out that the Federal Reserve holds credit-default swaps on the debt of Florida schools, and on debt owed by the states of California and Nevada. So the Federal Reserve would profit if one of those states defaulted on its debt. Talk about a conflict of interest.[A problem, but not corruption.]

#9) Executives at many of the firms that received large amounts of money during the Wall Street bailouts are being lavished with record bonuses as millions of other average Americans are suffering intensely. Even the CEOs of bailed-out regional banks are getting big raises.[A problem, but not corruption.]

#10) We may not know much about what is going on inside some of these banks, but they sure do know a lot about us. For example, it has been revealed that the data mining operations of the major credit card companies are becoming so sophisticated that they can actually predict how likely you are to get a divorce.[A POSSIBLE problem, but not corruption.]

#11) But the biggest financial fraud of all is being committed against the American people. The exploding U.S. national debt threatens to destroy the financial future of literally generations of Americans. It is obscenely immoral to saddle our children and our grandchildren with the biggest mountain of debt in the history of the world. If they get the chance, future generations of Americans will look back and curse this generation for what we have done to them. [AGREED, VERY BAD, BUT not corruption, just excessive spending.]
​

 

[georgephillip]

First you'll have to list what you call "corruption." I'm not aware of any corruption on Wall Street.

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Thanks for the Michael Snyder link.

He's comedy gold. GOLD Jerry!

Speaking of GOLD:

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world's largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive 'gold deposits' at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

 

[gnarlylove]

"We find that during the labor market downturn (measured from January 2008 to February 2010), employment losses occurred throughout the economy, but were concentrated in mid-wage and higher-wage industries. By contrast, during the recovery (measured from February 2010 to February 2014), employment gains have been concentrated in lower-wage industries. Specifically:

Lower-wage industries constituted 22 percent of recession losses, but 44 percent of recovery growth.
Mid-wage industries constituted 37 percent of recession losses, but only 26 percent of recovery growth.
Higher-wage industries constituted 41 percent of recession losses, and 30 percent of recovery growth.

Today, there are nearly two million fewer jobs in mid- and higher-wage industries than there were before the recession took hold, while there are 1.85 million more jobs in lower-wage industries."

National Employment Law Project | Low Wage Recovery

The fateful capitalist system is doing its personal best to redistribute wealth upwards more so by driving down wages. Success for the .1%. Failure and misery for 40% of the population.

 

[bripat9643]

That isn't capitalism. That's the fascist welfare state that morons like you defend and support. No one who supports in capitalism believes the government should bail out private corporations. Only welfare state bootlickers endorse such a policy.

Have you ever thought about the real difference between Fascism and Socialism? It isn't just the difference between government ownership and government control, which existed in Fascist states like Germany and Italy during the 30s and 40s. The real difference in the overt attempts to control other states by conquering them. Even the Soviets did not overtly go out of their sphere to conquer other countries.

You mean the Soviets didn't try to invade Finland? The Soviets didn't participate in carving up Poland? Also, it's a little known fact that immediately after the revolution, the USSR tried to invade Poland. They were soundly thrashed, which is the only reason Poland remained independent until 1939.

It appears to me that there's hardly any difference between the communists and the Nazis.

 

[bripat9643]

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Thanks for the Michael Snyder link.

He's comedy gold. GOLD Jerry!

Speaking of GOLD:

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world's largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive 'gold deposits' at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

That's called fraud. Traders were led to believe they were purchasing actual gold. If they were lied to, then someone should go to jail.

Also, the "London Bullion Market Assoc" isn't on Wall Street.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Thanks for the Michael Snyder link.

He's comedy gold. GOLD Jerry!

Speaking of GOLD:

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world's largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive 'gold deposits' at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself.

Futures trades, of all kinds, have always dwarfed the actual amount of the underlying.
So what?

 

[dnsmith35]

"If you ask most Americans, they will agree that the financial system is corrupt.

"It is generally assumed that just like most politicians, most big bankers are corrupt by nature.

"But the truth is that the vast majority of Americans have no idea just how corrupt the U.S. financial system has become.

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Thanks for the Michael Snyder link.

He's comedy gold. GOLD Jerry!

Speaking of GOLD:

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world's largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive 'gold deposits' at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Yet you are still trying to fool us into believing that those 11 issues are actually corruption and that Michael Snyder managed to write it for Businessinsider.com. Time to come clean George.

 

[dnsmith35]

"We find that during the labor market downturn (measured from January 2008 to February 2010), employment losses occurred throughout the economy, but were concentrated in mid-wage and higher-wage industries. By contrast, during the recovery (measured from February 2010 to February 2014), employment gains have been concentrated in lower-wage industries. Specifically:

Lower-wage industries constituted 22 percent of recession losses, but 44 percent of recovery growth.
Mid-wage industries constituted 37 percent of recession losses, but only 26 percent of recovery growth.
Higher-wage industries constituted 41 percent of recession losses, and 30 percent of recovery growth.

Today, there are nearly two million fewer jobs in mid- and higher-wage industries than there were before the recession took hold, while there are 1.85 million more jobs in lower-wage industries."

National Employment Law Project | Low Wage Recovery

The fateful capitalist system is doing its personal best to redistribute wealth upwards more so by driving down wages. Success for the .1%. Failure and misery for 40% of the population.

So, because of the housing crash recession, and people stopped buying from Union built goods, some of our elite union workers lost their jobs. I do feel sorry for them, but it is certainly not misery for 40% our population, many of which are still earning in the middle class and a few dropped to the 3rd quintile and high 2nd quintile. Misery can be defined as someone who does not have a decent place to live and food to eat. Losing pay does not mean misery.

But yes, not all industries have fully recovered, so this is true, "Today, there are nearly two million fewer jobs in mid- and higher-wage industries than there were before the recession took hold, while there are 1.85 million more jobs in lower-wage industries." However, recognizing that the 1.85 new jobs were lower wage jobs means that .529% of our citizens lost wages, not 40% of our citizens, and have not fully recovered. From your source "In fact, high-wage industries have only accounted for 30 percent of employment growth over the past four years. Middle-wage jobs are also declining– they accounted for 37 percent of losses but only 26 percent of gains." When you say 40% of our higher paying jobs, you are actually talking about the % of workers losing wage, not of our population; and 37% of those middle-wage jobs lost but gaining 26% back means that only 11% of middle wage workers lost some wage. So let's break this down. 3,579,000 lost jobs from higher wage industries, and only 2,603,000 got them back at the same wage industries leaving 970,000 getting lower paying jobs. 3,240,000 lost midwage jobs and only 2,282,000 got them back leaving 558,000 getting lower paying jobs. And slightly less than 2,000,000 got lower wage industry jobs. That means that1,528,000 million people got lower paying jobs, which is amounts to .00452% of our population have not recovered full wage jobs like they lost. Wow! I feel sorry for them, but that looks like a pretty good recovery to me, as it does to Obama, which he is touting full speed ahead.

They are still many times better off than over 5 billion of our world citizens. You really should at least TRY to stay honest.

 

[dnsmith35]

That isn't capitalism. That's the fascist welfare state that morons like you defend and support. No one who supports in capitalism believes the government should bail out private corporations. Only welfare state bootlickers endorse such a policy.

Have you ever thought about the real difference between Fascism and Socialism? It isn't just the difference between government ownership and government control, which existed in Fascist states like Germany and Italy during the 30s and 40s. The real difference in the overt attempts to control other states by conquering them. Even the Soviets did not overtly go out of their sphere to conquer other countries.

You mean the Soviets didn't try to invade Finland? The Soviets didn't participate in carving up Poland? Also, it's a little known fact that immediately after the revolution, the USSR tried to invade Poland. They were soundly thrashed, which is the only reason Poland remained independent until 1939.

It appears to me that there's hardly any difference between the communists and the Nazis.

You are taking liberties with what I said. The Eastern block was not conquered by war. It was occupied after WWII. Finland was won in war from Sweden by Russia in 1807, long before the Communists took over. I am sure the Swedes were unhappy about losing 1/3 of their country.

Now, back to my point, Fascism and Socialism/Communism are different mostly by the fact that Fascism caused war all over Europe. Most of Russia's acquisition came about by occupation. If you trace the history of the Russian invasion of Poland, you will note it occurred over 2 weeks after Germany invaded Poland, and the Russians were effectively taking over half of Poland as a pre-emptory defense of Russia by ceding half of Poland to the Germans. They believed it would stop Germany from attacking Russia.

 

[gnarlylove]

They are still many times better off than over 5 billion of our world citizens.

Next time I meet my friend, a low-income single mother, I'll be sure to put food on her table and terminate her debts by telling her how much better her life is given she doesn't live in Sierra Leone or Bangladesh. Yeah, that will really make her laugh.

Reality-check: no one has been or ever will be helped by relative comparisons. It does not matter one ******* bit how her life compares to the worst possible scenario. What ******* matters is her life, here and now! Each human being matters as much as she does. And in a nation with unprecedented wealth, enough to create a truly extraordinary society, capitalism distributes the wealth to the top with such reckless abandon that society wouldn't function if there was no massive re-distribution programs. Why not distribute it right the first time?

 

[dnsmith35]

.......

They are still many times better off than over 5 billion of our world citizens.

Next time I meet my friend, a low-income single mother, I'll be sure to put food on her table and terminate her debts by telling her how much better her life is given she doesn't live in Sierra Leone or Bangladesh. Yeah, that will really make her laugh.

There are always specific people who are losers, but the facts are spread over the whole, and overall there has been a good recovery.

Reality-check: no one has been or ever will be helped by relative comparisons. It does not matter one ******* bit how her life compares to the worst possible scenario. What ******* matters is her life, here and now! Each human being matters as much as she does. And in a nation with unprecedented wealth, enough to create a truly extraordinary society, capitalism distributes the wealth to the top with such reckless abandon that society wouldn't function if there was no massive re-distribution programs. Why not distribute it right the first time?

Some more of your left wing extremist bullshit. Some people will fail no matter what. It just so happens in the US WE DO HAVE MASSIVE REDISTRIBUTION social programs which is funded because we have a prosperity driving capitalist economic system. If that woman was in India she would be begging in the street or squatting on the side of the road breaking big rocks into small ones for barely enough to buy one meal. Do I feel sorry for that hypothetical single mother? Of course I do, but others have less and deserve to be helped first. But if she lived in a true socialist economy she would have been poor and to a more egregious degree.

Your biggest problem is you have no realistic priority sense. You can't get away from the fact that I agree with helping that theoretical single mother, with government safety net programs, and if she makes to much to get that help, she doesn't need it.

 

[gnarlylove]

but the facts are spread over the whole, and overall there has been a good recovery.

"Overall good recovery" is true if you include the top .1% in your analysis. However, considering the .1% skews the recovery to appear good. But for the majority, they lost (or their family member lost) good paying jobs and find themselves either unemployed or are employed in lower paying jobs or in part-time work that isn't meeting their needs. Moreover, the chances of an unemployed person becoming employed each month is 11%.

Are the Long-Term Unemployed on the Margins of the Labor Market?

The trends in your thinking fails to analyze the real picture but you are not to blame for this because you get your complete understanding from mainstream media. You incessantly use generalizations and relative comparisons to distract from the reality that the recovery is only at the top, and is not spread among the people, despite massive re-distribution. Doesn't that mean the re-distribution is not working so well?


It's evident you don't live or volunteer in capitalism's sacrifice zones, which are growing each and every day. It's also evident that you only listen to the mainstream media and have little to no clue about the real people who live in this "recovery." If you gave two shits about people, you wouldn't dismiss their existence as losers. Instead, if you really cared you would learn about their life before making such a nefarious generalization.

 

[georgephillip]

Thanks for the Michael Snyder link.

He's comedy gold. GOLD Jerry!

Speaking of GOLD:

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world's largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive 'gold deposits' at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Yet you are still trying to fool us into believing that those 11 issues are actually corruption and that Michael Snyder managed to write it for Businessinsider.com. Time to come clean George.

Let's make sure we're talking about the same Michael Snyder.
Here's mine:

Michael Snyder - Business Insider

 

[dnsmith35]

Speaking of GOLD:

"It has also now come out that most 'gold' that is traded on the markets is not backed by the actual metal itself. For years, most people have assumed that the London Bullion Market Association, the world's largest gold market, had actual gold to back up the massive 'gold deposits' at the major LBMA banks. But that is not the truth at all."

11 Examples Of Recent Corruption On Wall Street - Business Insider

Yet you are still trying to fool us into believing that those 11 issues are actually corruption and that Michael Snyder managed to write it for Businessinsider.com. Time to come clean George.

Let's make sure we're talking about the same Michael Snyder.
Here's mine:

Michael Snyder - Business Insider

I used your link which showed that Business Insider actually wrote that article for another less prestigious publication. You lose!

 

[dnsmith35]

......

but the facts are spread over the whole, and overall there has been a good recovery.

"Overall good recovery" is true if you include the top .1% in your analysis. However, considering the .1% skews the recovery to appear good. But for the majority, they lost (or their family member lost) good paying jobs and find themselves either unemployed or are employed in lower paying jobs or in part-time work that isn't meeting their needs. Moreover, the chances of an unemployed person becoming employed each month is 11%.

Are the Long-Term Unemployed on the Margins of the Labor Market?

The trends in your thinking fails to analyze the real picture but you are not to blame for this because you get your complete understanding from mainstream media.

Horse Puckey

You incessantly use generalizations and relative comparisons to distract from the reality that the recovery is only at the top, and is not spread among the people, despite massive re-distribution. Doesn't that mean the re-distribution is not working so well?


It's evident you don't live or volunteer in capitalism's sacrifice zones, which are growing each and every day. It's also evident that you only listen to the mainstream media and have little to no clue about the real people who live in this "recovery." If you gave two shits about people, you wouldn't dismiss their existence as losers. Instead, if you really cared you would learn about their life before making such a nefarious generalization.

When it comes to people, individuals of all walks of life, I use more than the media of any kind. News is a different matter, I learn what is going on by reading an article and throwing out ALL OF THE COMENTARY. My experience with the media is, once you throw out the editorial commentary, they all say basically the same thing. I also read the studies, the manner in which it was conducted, look at the data and summarize it myself since even with data, most still skew it in the direction of the opinion they want to show. I shall outline below how I think about the issue. I even accept the Brookings Institute studies to show the correct data. From that and my personal experiences I formulate my own course of action. You seem to still fling your self at your pet groups.

Let me explain it to you with an anecdote since you obviously are not smart enough to understand the tables and graphs I have posted. In addition, I will keep it local instead of including the destitute people all over the world for which you have cleary told us you have no compassion.

Mister A makes over $400,000 a year. We both recognize he needs no help.

Mister B makes about $60,000 a year, about what a union auto worker earns in wage.

Mister C makes $30,000 a year, and based on dependencies is just under the poverty line.

Mister D has no job, cannot get government assistance because he has no address. He has mental health problems and does not understand the processes to even go the the Health and Human Services to even try.

Messrs A, B, and C all lose their jobs but over time find new ones, BUT, at lower wages. Each now earns only what is in the next tier down.

According to the studies I have read their new wages have dropped by 30% making their new income is for A: $280,000; B: $42,000; and C: $21,000. Then there is old D, who is still sleeping in an old furniture box back in the woods so the people can't see him and call the cops to throw him out.

Making the assumption that you have enough money to help any one of them, but only to a specific amount of money, say $1,000 a month. Which one would you help? Put your single mother lady friend in the circumstances above explained in A, B, or C. Then tell me again, which one will you help.

This is a straight forward comparison showing the well off, the middle-wage group, and the relative poor and bouncing their situation against the old mentally ill homeless guy.

 

[georgephillip]

Yet you are still trying to fool us into believing that those 11 issues are actually corruption and that Michael Snyder managed to write it for Businessinsider.com. Time to come clean George.

Let's make sure we're talking about the same Michael Snyder.
Here's mine:

Michael Snyder - Business Insider

I used your link which showed that Business Insider actually wrote that article for another less prestigious publication. You lose!

Not as much as the taxpayers lost on AIG.
Do you think Snyder's example of Joseph Cassano proves my contention of corruption on Wall Street regardless of where it's appeared?

"During his career at AIGFP from 1987 until he was forced to retire in March 2008, Cassano received $315 million: $280 million in cash and an additional $34 million in bonuses.[9]

"An initial $1 million-a-month consulting fee was later canceled.[10]

"According to Matt Taibbi:

"In fact, Cassano remained on the payroll and kept collecting his monthly million through the end of September 2008, even after taxpayers had been forced to hand AIG $85 billion to patch up his mistakes.

"When asked in October why the company still retained Cassano at his $1 million-a-month rate despite his role in the probable downfall of Western civilization, CEO Martin Sullivan told Congress with a straight face that AIG wanted to 'retain the 20-year knowledge that Mr. Cassano had.'"

Joseph Cassano - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia