"but Jesus would never JUST hang around sinners"

[hobelim]

I feel like there's some balance between "Jesus hung out with sinners" and "Jesus ONLY hung out with sinners so He could tell them to repent", but I'm not sure what it is

In the beginning of the gospels Jesus is depicted as being tempted by the devil for 40 days and 40 nights while he was living in the wilderness among the wild beasts.

This means that Jesus was living outside of the jurisdiction of Jewish law, the wilderness, (roman towns and villages), among the "wild beasts" meaning the romans, presumably doing what romans do.

According to scripture Jesus partied and hung out with sinners, prostitutes, tax gatherers, and kept all sorts of bad company, the equivalent of first century mobsters, the wild beasts.

When the Pharisees asked Jesus why he upbraided them who always tried to be righteous he told them that only the sick need a doctor, meaning that they, the Pharisees, were the sick ones, not the people that he chose as friends to hangout with. They were demonized, marginalized, criminalized and hated consequent to the perpetuation of perverse interpretations of Mosaic law, the same exact perverse interpretations of Mosaic Law perpetuated by all Christian churches.

If you have ears to hear then hear.

 

[ding]

In the beginning of the gospels Jesus is depicted as being tempted by the devil for 40 days and 40 nights while he was living in the wilderness among the wild beasts.

This means that Jesus was living outside of the jurisdiction of Jewish law, the wilderness, (roman towns and villages), among the "wild beasts" meaning the romans, presumably doing what romans do.

According to scripture Jesus partied and hung out with sinners, prostitutes, tax gatherers, and kept all sorts of bad company, the equivalent of first century mobsters, the wild beasts.

When the Pharisees asked Jesus why he upbraided them who always tried to be righteous he told them that only the sick need a doctor, meaning that they, the Pharisees, were the sick ones, not the people that he chose as friends to hangout with. They were demonized, marginalized, criminalized and hated consequent to the perpetuation of perverse interpretations of Mosaic law, the same exact perverse interpretations of Mosaic Law perpetuated by all Christian churches.

If you have ears to hear then hear.

He didn't give you the option to reject his supernatural nature. That wasn't an accident. If you have ears to hear then hear.

Miracles of Jesus - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[hobelim]

He didn't give you the option to reject his supernatural nature. That wasn't an accident. If you have ears to hear then hear.

lol.... Jesus did not promote any supernatural nature for me to reject. I read the damn bible. I also read the story of the three pigs but did not erect churches and statues to pray to the wise pig every Sunday and hog holiday, live in fear of an invisible big bad wolf, or persecute and build prisons for unbelievers.

Imagine that!

Your mind has been defiled and contaminated by the perversions of scripture that Jesus died fighting perpetuated to this day by every sect of the three monotheistic religions . That's a fact.

"For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be made known and brought to light. Pay attention, therefore, to how you listen. Whoever has will be given more, but whoever does not have, even what he thinks he has will be taken away from him."

 

[evenifigoalone]

In the beginning of the gospels Jesus is depicted as being tempted by the devil for 40 days and 40 nights while he was living in the wilderness among the wild beasts.

This means that Jesus was living outside of the jurisdiction of Jewish law, the wilderness, (roman towns and villages), among the "wild beasts" meaning the romans, presumably doing what romans do.

According to scripture Jesus partied and hung out with sinners, prostitutes, tax gatherers, and kept all sorts of bad company, the equivalent of first century mobsters, the wild beasts.

When the Pharisees asked Jesus why he upbraided them who always tried to be righteous he told them that only the sick need a doctor, meaning that they, the Pharisees, were the sick ones, not the people that he chose as friends to hangout with. They were demonized, marginalized, criminalized and hated consequent to the perpetuation of perverse interpretations of Mosaic law, the same exact perverse interpretations of Mosaic Law perpetuated by all Christian churches.

If you have ears to hear then hear.

That's a stretch tbh. Later tonight I might pull up the original language used in the passages you're referring to and we can examine it further.

 

[hobelim]

That's a stretch tbh. Later tonight I might pull up the original language used in the passages you're referring to and we can examine it further.

Sure, just remember to include in your speculations that even after Jesus was baptized by John as a token for the repentance of sins and heaven was opened to him he didn't stop giving the Pharisees a hard time, keeping bad company, or partying with sinners and prostitutes.....

 

[ding]

lol.... Jesus did not promote any supernatural nature for me to reject. I read the damn bible. I also read the story of the three pigs but did not erect churches and statues to pray to the wise pig every Sunday and hog holiday, live in fear of an invisible big bad wolf, or persecute and build prisons for unbelievers.

Imagine that!

Your mind has been defiled and contaminated by the perversions of scripture that Jesus died fighting perpetuated to this day by every sect of the three monotheistic religions . That's a fact.

"For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be made known and brought to light. Pay attention, therefore, to how you listen. Whoever has will be given more, but whoever does not have, even what he thinks he has will be taken away from him."

You must be the only one who believes that.

The largest group of miracles mentioned in the New Testament involves cures. The Gospels give varying amounts of detail for each episode, sometimes Jesus cures simply by saying a few words, at other times, he employs material such as spit and mud.

 

[hobelim]

You must be the only one who believes that.

The largest group of miracles mentioned in the New Testament involves cures. The Gospels give varying amounts of detail for each episode, sometimes Jesus cures simply by saying a few words, at other times, he employs material such as spit and mud.

Right, after writing something on the ground Jesus put spit and mud in the blind man's eyes and then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the blind man see anything with mud in his eyes, dummy.

First he saw trees and then when Jesus told him to take a harder look he finally saw men.

It was a healing of perception not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to understand the metaphors in scripture where men are often compared to trees as in Eden where there were many trees with fruit that was pleasing to the eye and good to eat. The fruit of the mind.

No supernatural reality defying demonstrations of divine power. Teachers open the eyes of children in this way every day all over the world. A miracle!

You understand neither scripture nor the power of God.

 

[ding]

Right, after writing something on the ground Jesus put spit and mud in the blind man's eyes and then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the blind man see anything with mud in his eyes, dummy.

First he saw trees and then when Jesus told him to take a harder look he finally saw men.

It was a healing of perception not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to understand the metaphors in scripture where men are often compared to trees as in Eden where there were many trees with fruit that was pleasing to the eye and good to eat. The fruit of the mind.

No supernatural reality defying demonstrations of divine power. Teachers open the eyes of children in this way every day all over the world.

You understand neither scripture nor the power of God.

Mark's Gospel also has an account of the healing of a man named Bartimaeus, done as Jesus is leaving Jericho.[13] The Gospel of Matthew[14] has a simpler account loosely based on this, with two unnamed blind men instead of one (this 'doubling' is a characteristic of Matthew's treatment of the Mark text) and a slightly different version of the story, taking place in Galilee, earlier in the narrative.[15] The Gospel of Luke tells the same story of Jesus healing an unnamed blind man, but moves the event in the narrative to when Jesus approaches Jericho.

 

[ding]

So many miracles.

 

[Clyde 154]

Right, after writing something on the ground Jesus put spit and mud in the blind man's eyes and then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the blind man see anything with mud in his eyes, dummy.

First he saw trees and then when Jesus told him to take a harder look he finally saw men.

It was a healing of perception not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to understand the metaphors in scripture where men are often compared to trees as in Eden where there were many trees with fruit that was pleasing to the eye and good to eat. The fruit of the mind.

No supernatural reality defying demonstrations of divine power. Teachers open the eyes of children in this way every day all over the world. A miracle!

You understand neither scripture nor the power of God.

The scriptures declare that man was given SIGHT after he followed the instructions of the Christ to go wash the clay from his eyes in the pool of Siloam.

You conveniently omitted the testimony of the "healed" man and those who personally witnessed the healing. John 9.....beginning with vs. 8, "The neighbors therefore, and they which before had seen him that he was blind, Is this not he who sat and begged? Some said, This is he; others said, He is like him; but he said, I am he. Therefore they said unto him, How were thine eyes opened? He answered and said, A man that is called Jesus made clay and anointed mine eyes and said unto me, Go to the pool of Siloam, and wash; and I went and washed..........AND I RECEIVED MY SIGHT." -- John 9:8-11

This was no metaphor ........... there were witnesses that testified that the man was blind and now was given sight. Even the man that was healed declared that he now had sight were he had been blind. You dismiss the eyewitness testimony of those who witnessed the event......now you know more than the individuals that recorded this history, thousands of years later? Yeah......right.

The very purpose of the miracles was to confirm the word of God being delivered by the Christ while living and later through the Holy Spirit after the ascension. (Matt. 11:2-5, Mark 16:20) The scriptures declare the age of miracles stopped when the need stopped, after the perfect law of liberty was complete in its revelation. (1 Cor. 13:8-10).

Paul states very clearly that the gifts (miracles) of the Spirit (the Holy Spirit) would cease when the PERFECT comes, not the perfect one, or he that is perfect but THAT WHICH IS PERFECT. Jesus was not a THAT. The point Paul is making is clear....the church in its infant stage in the 50 years or so into the 1st century there would be revelations that required Confirmation via signs and miracles and at the time of his record that need had not yet ceased, more revelations were to come before THE PERFECT existed.

Jesus personally instructed the hand picked apostles that after He was gone........after the cross and ascension, He would send the Spirit of Truth to His apostles to reveal the WHOLE TRUTH from Heaven.

"I have many more things to say to you (the apostles), but you cannot bear them now. But when He, the Spirit of truth comes, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak of His own initiative, but whatever He hears; He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come, He will glorify Me, for He will take of mine and will disclose it to you (the apostles). -- John 16:12-14

Paul said these revelations would cease, a time would come when there would be no more new revelations, "no prophecies,..........gifts of prophecy would be done away.

In the book Jude 3, this is confirmed.........the faith has been delivered ONCE by the saints of the 1st century.

The word PERFECT is the same Greek word used when describing the "Perfect Law of Liberty" (James 1:25-27)..i.e., the new testament of grace. When the perfect was here......the entire New Testament Record.........that which was in part ceased. Paul declares that it was looking into mirror that did not reveal everything as it was distorted be each had a part, each part saw different things, some had the gift of prophecy, some the gift of healing, etc.,.....but when the PERFECT (whole.....complete in the Greek) comes that which was in part would be done away.........

The word of God, i.e., the Holy Bible was confirmed by eyewitness testimony over 2000 years ago. (2 Peter 1:16)

 

[evenifigoalone]

Sure, just remember to include in your speculations that even after Jesus was baptized by John as a token for the repentance of sins and heaven was opened to him he didn't stop giving the Pharisees a hard time, keeping bad company, or partying with sinners and prostitutes.....

Mkay, so where we agree is that Jesus hung out with people typically considered "bad company". Where we differ is.... pretty much everything else. Jesus also said multiple times, when confronted with the people He hung around or allowed near Him (such as Mary Magdalene the prostitute who came to Him weeping and wiping His feet with her hair), His respond were to tell the person in question that their sins were forgiven.
Prostitution was definitely against Jewish law, no matter how loose a stance one takes on that. What I believe is Jesus cultivated relationships with these people, treated them with kindness. But didn't affirm their sin.

Yes, the Pharisees did add stuff to the law, they were hyper-legalistic and didn't leave any room for error or the extension of grace and mercy. That was their error.

So far as your heavy heavy emphasis on metaphors, let's look at the original language on Jesus' 40 days in the wilderness.....
Here is the web page I am using: Matthew 4 Interlinear Bible

The word that is translated to wilderness here is ἔρημον
2048 érēmos – properly, an uncultivated, unpopulated place; a desolate (deserted) area; (figuratively) a barren, solitary place that also provides needed quiet (freedom from disturbance).

Strong's Greek: 2048. ἔρημος (erémos) -- solitary, desolate

biblehub.com

The same word is used to describe John the Baptist preaching in the wilderness in Matthew 3:1

 

[surada]

The scriptures declare that man was given SIGHT after he followed the instructions of the Christ to go wash the clay from his eyes in the pool of Siloam.

You conveniently omitted the testimony of the "healed" man and those who personally witnessed the healing. John 9.....beginning with vs. 8, "The neighbors therefore, and they which before had seen him that he was blind, Is this not he who sat and begged? Some said, This is he; others said, He is like him; but he said, I am he. Therefore they said unto him, How were thine eyes opened? He answered and said, A man that is called Jesus made clay and anointed mine eyes and said unto me, Go to the pool of Siloam, and wash; and I went and washed..........AND I RECEIVED MY SIGHT." -- John 9:8-11

This was no metaphor ........... there were witnesses that testified that the man was blind and now was given sight. Even the man that was healed declared that he now had sight were he had been blind. You dismiss the eyewitness testimony of those who witnessed the event......now you know more than the individuals that recorded this history, thousands of years later? Yeah......right.

The very purpose of the miracles was to confirm the word of God being delivered by the Christ while living and later through the Holy Spirit after the ascension. (Matt. 11:2-5, Mark 16:20) The scriptures declare the age of miracles stopped when the need stopped, after the perfect law of liberty was complete in its revelation. (1 Cor. 13:8-10).

Paul states very clearly that the gifts (miracles) of the Spirit (the Holy Spirit) would cease when the PERFECT comes, not the perfect one, or he that is perfect but THAT WHICH IS PERFECT. Jesus was not a THAT. The point Paul is making is clear....the church in its infant stage in the 50 years or so into the 1st century there would be revelations that required Confirmation via signs and miracles and at the time of his record that need had not yet ceased, more revelations were to come before THE PERFECT existed.

Jesus personally instructed the hand picked apostles that after He was gone........after the cross and ascension, He would send the Spirit of Truth to His apostles to reveal the WHOLE TRUTH from Heaven.

"I have many more things to say to you (the apostles), but you cannot bear them now. But when He, the Spirit of truth comes, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak of His own initiative, but whatever He hears; He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come, He will glorify Me, for He will take of mine and will disclose it to you (the apostles). -- John 16:12-14

Paul said these revelations would cease, a time would come when there would be no more new revelations, "no prophecies,..........gifts of prophecy would be done away.

In the book Jude 3, this is confirmed.........the faith has been delivered ONCE by the saints of the 1st century.

The word PERFECT is the same Greek word used when describing the "Perfect Law of Liberty" (James 1:25-27)..i.e., the new testament of grace. When the perfect was here......the entire New Testament Record.........that which was in part ceased. Paul declares that it was looking into mirror that did not reveal everything as it was distorted be each had a part, each part saw different things, some had the gift of prophecy, some the gift of healing, etc.,.....but when the PERFECT (whole.....complete in the Greek) comes that which was in part would be done away.........

The word of God, i.e., the Holy Bible was confirmed by eyewitness testimony over 2000 years ago. (2 Peter 1:16)

The Gospels were written years after the fact by some who never met Jesus.

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers

earlychristianwritings.com

 

[Clyde 154]

The Gospels were written years after the fact by some who never met Jesus.

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers

earlychristianwritings.com

FYI: Simply because there was no canon.......until later does not indicate that no record existed prior to the books being placed into a particular order. History documents the existence of the gospels as early as the middle of the 1st century.

Again with the subjective BS? You attempt to DEFLECT away from the actual content of the scriptures by suggesting they are lies? And you present nothing but parroted information that actually contradicts your own position? Your bigotry is showing again......better pull it up. You present evidence of the existence of the early records of the New Testament and then claim that none exists because of the scientific canon of the Books that existed in the 4th century? FYI: The canon used the scientific method that is still in use to today to compile the actual eyewitness testimonies found in the New Testament. ....it called the science of comparative textual analysis. And the 66 books of the Holy Scriptures are there for a reason.....there is no evidence found to exist that proves these records to be in error. As the content, context and subject matter are all in total agreement throughout the 66 books. Even Roman history validates the Christian Record as early as 50AD.

Centuries later? When there is historical documentation from the middle of the 1st century forward?

Annals (Tacitus) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Not according to HISTORY ACTUAL. Example: Cornelius Tacitus era 52-54 AD. He was a Roman Historian.....He directly alluded to the death of Jesus (called Christus by Tacitus). In his works Annals (Annals XV.44) we find, "Hence to suppress the rumor, he (Nero) falsely charged with guilt, and punished with the most extreme tortures, the persons commonly called Christians, who were hated because of their enormities. Christus....THE FOUNDER OF THE NAME....was put to death by Pontius Pilate.........proctor of Judea....in the region of Tiberius........."

Josephus - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Then you have the record of Flavius Josephus, a Jewish historian, often working with Rome.....born era 37 AD. He is quoted as saying, "Now there was about this time, Jesus........a wise man, if it be lawful to call Him a man.......for He was a doer of wonderful works (miracles).............He was THE CHRIST.......Pilate condemned Him to the cross......." -- Antiquities, xvii. 33.

History actual is filled with such documentation that proved that Jesus was an actual historical figure and the record of His life and times began to be documented as early as the middle of the 1st century.......by those who were not Jews but rather the enemies of the Gospel.

 

[surada]

Again with the subjective BS?

Centuries later? When there is historical documentation from the middle of the 1st century forward?

Annals (Tacitus) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Not according to HISTORY ACTUAL. Example: Cornelius Tacitus era 52-54 AD. He was a Roman Historian.....He directly alluded to the death of Jesus (called Christus by Tacitus). In his works Annals (Annals XV.44) we find, "Hence to suppress the rumor, he (Nero) falsely charged with guilt, and punished with the most extreme tortures, the persons commonly called Christians, who were hated because of their enormities. Christus....THE FOUNDER OF THE NAME....was put to death by Pontius Pilate.........proctor of Judea....in the region of Tiberius........."

Josephus - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Then you have the record of Flavius Josephus, a Jewish historian, often working with Rome.....born era 37 AD. He is quoted as saying, "Now there was about this time, Jesus........a wise man, if it be lawful to call Him a man.......for He was a doer of wonderful works (miracles).............He was THE CHRIST.......Pilate condemned Him to the cross......." -- Antiquities, xvii. 33.

History actual is filled with such documentation that proved that Jesus was an actual historical figure and the record of His life and times began to be documented as early as the middle of the 1st century.......by those who were not Jews but rather the enemies of the Gospel.

The Jesus Forgery: Josephus Untangled

https://beytdinhillel.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/04-The-Jesus-Forgery.pdf

Nov 04, 2018 · Josephus, but rather is a later Christian insertion in his works. In other words, it is a forgery, rejected by scholars." So well understood was this fact of forgery that these numerous authorities did not spend their precious time and space rehashing the arguments against the TF's authenticity. Nevertheless, in

 

[Clyde 154]

The Jesus Forgery: Josephus Untangled

https://beytdinhillel.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/04-The-Jesus-Forgery.pdf

Nov 04, 2018 · Josephus, but rather is a later Christian insertion in his works. In other words, it is a forgery, rejected by scholars." So well understood was this fact of forgery that these numerous authorities did not spend their precious time and space rehashing the arguments against the TF's authenticity. Nevertheless, in

When are you to learn? You can't win any argument based entirely upon SUBJECTIVE opinions where you surf the web in order to find like minded opinions........that present nothing other than the same subjective BS opinion as you. Your bigotry of Christianity is great, but expected from all antichrists. Its who you are, its what you do...... Your faith can't be true if the record found in the Holy Scriptures is the actual word of God, you must attempt to discredit the Bible instead of objectively proving that YOUR FAITH is based upon truth.



Yeah........the scriptures are forged..........the history is a forgery.......... You pick "ONE" of recorded history..........and attempt to define it as a forgery, when there exists "numerous" examples stating the same as Josephus' revelations.

More logical fallacies? Your dog bites and must be put down.......so all dogs of that bread are classified as vicious and must be destroyed?

Now all you have to do is prove that historians such as "Suetonius", era 120AD.....were a product of forgery. History informs that he lived over 30 years among the Caesars, Tiberius, Caligula, and Nero, as described in the literature of "Suetonius" page 7, as translated by Robert Graves. Among the historical works of Suetonius that were translated include "Claudius" were direct quotes are found that speak of CHRIST (Claudius 25:4) when he was expelled from the city (directly recorded in the Bible...the same event ACTS 18:2, as placed to pen by LUKE the physician). These Roman historians used the word "CHRESTUS" for Christ........history notes that "Chrestus" is a misspelling of the Creek Word "Christos" which translates the Hebrew "Messiah". (Sanders pages 49, 50).

Along with Tacitus and Suetonius history also records the work of "Pliny the Younger" era 110-111 AD. Pliny referred to CHRISTIANS and CHRIST "7" times in his records.

Then you find historical records dating into the 2nd century by "Celsus" era 178AD.

These are historical records that were "HOSTILE" to Christianity.....yet they directly mention, The Christ, His execution, and His followers known as Christians.....beginning as early as 50AD.

What? You are declaring Hostile historical records as forgeries..........Tacitus, Suetonius, Pliny the Younger......all forgeries?

And that's just a few HOSTLE historical records that prove that Christ was a real person that was executed by the Roman Empire in the 1st century and was referred to as the "Messiah".

Then we have the historical records of those who profess to the Jewish faith. Now Jewish history is to be declared Forgeries as well. Jewish History as recorded in works such as the "Mishnah" and the "Talmud"? Records found to exist only decades after the life of Christ on earth....are all fakes? And there was a 3rd Talmud found around the 3 century AD....

All long before any Council of Nicea. Even though the Jewish faith of the 1st century rejected Christianity as a true religion their history still records the life and times of Christ, the authors of the New Testament....etc.

 

[surada]

Yeah........the scriptures are forged..........the history is a forgery..........

Who said the scriptures were forged? The consensus is that the writings of Josephus were added to at a later date.

 

[Clyde 154]

Who said the scriptures were forged? The consensus is that the writings of Josephus were added to at a later date.

And your point "if" you are not comparing the 2? You are in agreement that the scriptures were written by those who were credited as the authors and were not a product of Roman forgeries from the 4th century on? As I stated........you can't have your cake and eat it also. You are attempting to escape from a corner that your own words painted you into.

You are ATTEMPTING to spin the record of the New Testament to be a product of the 4th century and or later....when there exists history actual that proves that the gospel records existed as early as 50AD

And that why I am here.....its entertaining to watch someone attempt to come spinning out a corner of their own making, like TAZ the cartoon character. Proceed with your "SPINNING".

 

[surada]

And your point "if" you are not comparing the 2? You are in agreement that the scriptures were written by those who were credited as the authors and were not a product of Roman forgeries from the 4th century on? As I stated........you can't have your cake and eat it also. You are attempting to escape from a corner that your own words painted you into.

You are ATTEMPTING to spin the record of the New Testament to be a product of the 4th century and or later....when there exists history actual that proves that the gospel records existed as early as 50AD

And that why I am here.....its entertaining to watch someone attempt to come spinning out a corner of their own making, like TAZ the cartoon character. Proceed with your "SPINNING".

Clyde, I linked early christian writings for you.. Didn't you see the dates in the left side column? Your accusation is stupid.

 

[hobelim]

So far as your heavy heavy emphasis on metaphors, let's look at the original language on Jesus' 40 days in the wilderness.....
Here is the web page I am using: Matthew 4 Interlinear Bible

The word that is translated to wilderness here is ἔρημον
2048 érēmos – properly, an uncultivated, unpopulated place; a desolate (deserted) area; (figuratively) a barren, solitary place that also provides needed quiet (freedom from disturbance).
Strong's Greek: 2048. ἔρημος (erémos) -- solitary, desolate

Mkay. I'm dealing with a child. Good to know. First of all Mary magdalene was not a prostitute.

Secondly in the context of Jewish vernacular the wilderness is a term that describes all areas not under Jewish law just like cattle and all the wild beasts of the field are metaphors for the human animals who roam the wilderness east of Eden.

John also preached in the wilderness as you said. If it was meant to mean a desolate lonely place who was he preaching to? Was he preaching to himself like some nutjob ?

And Jesus was not some lonely aesthetic in the middle of nowhere hearing demonic voices.

He was running around with the Romans who lived in a lawless wilderness doing what Romans do. Remember, when Peter tried to dissuade Jesus from doing the right thing he said fuck off satan. The devil of the temptation story was likewise just some observant friend who said,

"Jesus WTF are you doing wasting your life with these losers? You are a nice good looking guy. You make beautiful furniture. Everyone loves you, You could make millions of shekels and all of this world would be at your command if you would only just listen to me and quit all that crazy talk about right and wrong and good and evil."


There is no other rational way to interpret that story of the temptation. All the pieces fit perfectly.

 

[irosie91]

Mkay, there is historical evidence that Jesus existed. So where is the historical evidence of this?

what is the historical evidence that Jesus existed?