Broken Army?

[Charles_Main]

no way. it was someone like you probably. tillman probably whoped some ignorant jarheads ass for killing or raping an innocent civilian and he paid. remember that movie with michael j fox, tom barringer and wiliam defoe? I see you as playing barringers part.

not saying you would do those things, but you are definitely not a leader. you are a follower.

It was an a10 pilot you freaking moron. You know an accident. These things happen in war. A10's provide close air support to ground troops, and therefore often find themselves in situations where they are firing on positions very close to friendly troops. Why do you have to imply it was somehow on purpose.

Good lord some people clearly should not procreate.

 

[sealybobo]

It was an a10 pilot you freaking moron. You know an accident. These things happen in war. A10's provide close air support to ground troops, and therefore often find themselves in situations where they are firing on positions very close to friendly troops. Why do you have to imply it was somehow on purpose.

Good lord some people clearly should not procreate.

is that the oficial word now? his own family isn't buying it. I love how you believe liars. and besides, I don't suggest I know and I don't want to hear you claim you do. not the point anyways. butt out of this one. I don't want to discuss tillman. he was a great man and too sensitive, I should not have mentioned him. real american hero.

 

[sealybobo]

So today you admit you are a liberal, yesterday you were really a conservative.

LOL

i'm not a lefty liberal. one that wants guns banned etc. I just don't like the current gop, which isn't fiscally conservative and they are very anti labor. I love how you admit the gop sucks but you still push their agenda.

 

[sealybobo]

So today you admit you are a liberal, yesterday you were really a conservative.

LOL

i'm not a lefty liberal. one that wants guns banned etc. I just don't like the current gop, which isn't fiscally conservative and they are very anti labor. I love how you admit the gop sucks but you still push their agenda.

 

[Charles_Main]

i'm not a lefty liberal. one that wants guns banned etc. I just don't like the current gop, which isn't fiscally conservative and they are very anti labor. I love how you admit the gop sucks but you still push their agenda.

LOL no I push a conservative Agenda, sometimes that is the same as the GOP agenda, sometimes it is not. If you think all I do is push the GOP agenda I think you are failing to read about half my posts.

On the other hand I love how you claim not to be a lefty liberal, yet repeatedly post in favor of left wing policies. Being fed up with the GOP should not make a conservative all sudden become a liberal, it should make them realize the GOP is no longer the party of conservative values.

 

[sealybobo]

Someone told me that is was not true that the soldiers were sent to Iraq under equipt. I have a buddy who's mom had to send her son a flack jacket. I just love how people try to forget what really happened. I guess they don't want to know what is really going on.

Anyways, I found this Kerry quote:

If I am President, never again will parents or husbands or wives of soldiers have to send them body armor instead of photographs and care packages. Last month a young newlywed in Virginia who, as her husband was about to ship out to Iraq, gave him a bullet proof vest for Valentine's Day. I can tell you right now: in a Kerry Administration, no one will be getting body armor as a gift from a loved one; it will come from the Armed Forces of the United States of America. We will supply our troops with everything they need -- and we will reimburse each and every family who has had to buy body armor because this Administration made Valentine's Day part of the procurement process.

 

[steeliniraq]

Really? Knowing what you know now about Viet Nam or Iraq, you would be willing to sacrafice one of your own to die for those causes? Knowing Bush and most rich kids dodged the draft?

No way is my life or one of my nephews lives worth it. I know that is horrible for most Americans to hear. It is very unpatriotic, but its the truth. I agree with Ali. No Viet Namese ever called me a....

Maybe I would have gone after 9 11, but then Bush spread us thin and that put our troops in both Afgan and Iraq in jeopordy. And our troops sat in the middle of a civil war in iraq for 4 yrs without a game plan.

No, no way i'd let my kids go get blown up in iraq under bush's leadership and get blown up so exxon can make record profits and so haloburton can empty the us treasury.

maybe ww2 I would, but then you see how they use front line soldiers. They sent millions to die in normandy or at midway. small gains but huge losses of life.

What good is freedom when my kid is dead.

Republicans used to be non interventionalists. Unless it directly affected America, we stayed out of world affairs. Today, they tell us we fight for freedom but then it ends up being about power and money.

I respect any kid that signs up, but kids are dumb and think they are invincible.

Look how they treated Tillman. They covered up how he died.

Look at Abu Garabe. Rumsfeld told them to torture and then they court marshalled soldiers when it should have been the commanders that got locked up.

I could go on about how we all know our politicians are corrupt, so why would I go die for their causes?

Not after the last 6 yrs. No way. I couldn't stop my kids, but I sure would try.

Well that is because you are PATHETIC American! It truly saddens me to see people like you still don't realize or understand freedom. "What good is freedom when my kid is dead." Well I guess no one should serve and because no one wants to sacrifice then we can all be slaves. Thinking like that is truly what it means to be an American! As long as someone else is willing to bare the brunt and cost, right?

 

[steeliniraq]

is that the oficial word now? his own family isn't buying it. I love how you believe liars. and besides, I don't suggest I know and I don't want to hear you claim you do. not the point anyways. butt out of this one. I don't want to discuss tillman. he was a great man and too sensitive, I should not have mentioned him. real american hero.

Hang in there people that served. This person is someone who has claimed there is no point in sacrifice! It is easy for a person like this who has never been under fire, never in a situation like war, never in a death or death situation (thats right, cant live through certain situations no matter what) to say this is some grand conspiracy. Anyone who has actually fought in a war knows there are times that the fog of war causes horrible things and Americans end up killing other Americans. We (those who fought) understand that but think of it from this persons point of view. Another example of a person being completely stupid on a subject and trying to throw their two cents in like we care. Yea Tillman was too sensitive because he wanted to fight for his country. WHAT A PATRIOT YOU ARE! Do us all a favor and go live in China or Georgia for a while and come back and let us know if America is worth fighting for.

 

[Bootneck]

No, no way i'd let my kids go get blown up in iraq under bush's leadership and get blown up so exxon can make record profits and so haloburton can empty the us treasury.

A natural response from most parents and quite understandable, but chances are that once a son or daughter has made the decision to enlist, the parent will have little influence over their decision. I know. I speak from experience. My route into the military was founded on rebellion against my parents. All through my teens, my father had planned my career path – private education, university and then a partnership in the family business. Once I had completed my degree course, I decided that the family business was not what I wanted. I wanted to travel and I wanted adventure so I joined the Royal Marines. I didn’t tell my parents until I had been accepted for marine training. Needless to say the following weeks were rather torturous with all kinds of parental tactics to try and put me off. All to no avail. My response was pretty much the standard rebellious young man response – it’s my decision, my future and I’m not a kid anymore. Exit stage left with slamming of door.

That was in 2001 and in March 2003 I got my first full dose of travel and adventure.

I respect any kid that signs up, but kids are dumb and think they are invincible.

I think you do youngsters a disservice. Although I speak from a UK perspective, I can’t imagine that kids are any different in the US. Most of the new recruits I come across have volunteered in full awareness of the risks. They realise that enlisting is a choice which entails positives and negatives. Among the positives are the cameraderie, the training, the challenges, the experience and the opportunities to learn skills – apart from fighting – that will benefit them when they leave and seek employment in civvy street. Among the negatives is the obligation to fight, and perhaps to die, for one's country. That’s the deal.

I could go on about how we all know our politicians are corrupt, so why would I go die for their causes?

Yep, agree. Politicians the world over – corrupt, self-serving nest featherers. But having completed several combat tours I can tell you that it is not these bastards that we fight for. First of all, we fight because it is our job. We fight to stay alive and we fight to keep each other alive. We also fight for the kids of the future so that hopefully they don’t have to. If we sacrifice our lives it isn’t for some scum politician. It is to save the lives of our brothers in arms.

 

[Gunny]

Someone told me that is was not true that the soldiers were sent to Iraq under equipt. I have a buddy who's mom had to send her son a flack jacket. I just love how people try to forget what really happened. I guess they don't want to know what is really going on.

Anyways, I found this Kerry quote:

If I am President, never again will parents or husbands or wives of soldiers have to send them body armor instead of photographs and care packages. Last month a young newlywed in Virginia who, as her husband was about to ship out to Iraq, gave him a bullet proof vest for Valentine's Day. I can tell you right now: in a Kerry Administration, no one will be getting body armor as a gift from a loved one; it will come from the Armed Forces of the United States of America. We will supply our troops with everything they need -- and we will reimburse each and every family who has had to buy body armor because this Administration made Valentine's Day part of the procurement process.

Dude, this lameass argument's already been shot to Hell more than twice. As usual, you're running off at the mouth without a clue.

FYI, Pat Tillman was Army. The soldiers in the movie "Platoon" (which IS fiction btw) were Army. SO they wouldn't be "some dumb jarhead which is a Marine.

I dare you to go call "some dumb jarhead" a rapist to his/her face. Come on down to San Antonio as a matter of fact. You can call ME one because I damned sure AM a jarhead and ******* proud of it.

Otherwise, shut your face insulting better men than you will evr be hiding out wherever societal cockroaches like you exist.

 

[DiveCon]

Someone told me that is was not true that the soldiers were sent to Iraq under equipt. I have a buddy who's mom had to send her son a flack jacket. I just love how people try to forget what really happened. I guess they don't want to know what is really going on.

<snipped>

she may have sent one, but i highly doubt the "had to" part

and i doubt it was a flack jacket either

 

[sealybobo]

she may have sent one, but i highly doubt the "had to" part

and i doubt it was a flack jacket either

Oh my god. You are good. See how you want to shift the debate to whether or not she "had to"? Her son didn't have one, so she either sent it or he went without. Isn't that the point?

Also, what do you call a bullet proof vest? That's what I'm talking about. Are you trying to catch me in a gaffe that is irrelivent to the issue? The fact is, troops were sent to iraq, under equipt, under trained and under manned. Was it a "flack jacket". It was if that's the same thing as a bullet proof vest.

The Iraq war is being run by Navi Admirals. Did you know that? What do they know about desert war?

They had to rush kids into iraq so instead of desert training, they were trained in their normal training camps of hills and trees in middle america. So they were not prepared to go to Iraq. You don't know all these things happened? No wonder you are clueless.

And no I'm not making this up and no this isn't a lie that was told to me. They are facts dumb shit.

The fact that you haven't heard any of the stories is rediculous.

 

[Gunny]

Oh my god. You are good. See how you want to shift the debate to whether or not she "had to"? Her son didn't have one, so she either sent it or he went without. Isn't that the point?

Also, what do you call a bullet proof vest? That's what I'm talking about. Are you trying to catch me in a gaffe that is irrelivent to the issue? The fact is, troops were sent to iraq, under equipt, under trained and under manned. Was it a "flack jacket". It was if that's the same thing as a bullet proof vest.

The Iraq war is being run by Navi Admirals. Did you know that? What do they know about desert war?

They had to rush kids into iraq so instead of desert training, they were trained in their normal training camps of hills and trees in middle america. So they were not prepared to go to Iraq. You don't know all these things happened? No wonder you are clueless.

And no I'm not making this up and no this isn't a lie that was told to me. They are facts dumb shit.

The fact that you haven't heard any of the stories is rediculous.

Get off your soapbox. What is ridiculous is you once again blabbing about something you have no clue about.

One, no front line combat troops did not have protective armor. Period. End of story. The whining that was presented on TV was done by National Guardsman who were in the rear with the gear.

Guess what? If the front line troops need your chairpolishing ass's protective armor, you give that shit up without a ******* word or you're a lowlife puke.

Two, the military does not, has not, and does not pretend to issue "bulletproof vests." The kevlar helmet will NOT deflect a direct hit from a round, nor will the body armor. It will deflect shrapnel. You build a better vest and I will build a bullet that will penetrate it.

All branches of the US military have regularly conducted desert warfare training since the early 80s. If National Guard units do not, THAT is on the STATE Governor, not the US military.

So yeah, you ARE making your shit up. Another one of your "friends." According to you, you must know every-damned-one since you've got a friend in just about every facet of life that you wish to comment on.

The real kicker is you aren't fooling anyone. Anyone who has served in the US military knows you're full of shit right off the bat.

 

[DiveCon]

Oh my god. You are good. See how you want to shift the debate to whether or not she "had to"? Her son didn't have one, so she either sent it or he went without. Isn't that the point?

Also, what do you call a bullet proof vest? That's what I'm talking about. Are you trying to catch me in a gaffe that is irrelivent to the issue? The fact is, troops were sent to iraq, under equipt, under trained and under manned. Was it a "flack jacket". It was if that's the same thing as a bullet proof vest.

The Iraq war is being run by Navi Admirals. Did you know that? What do they know about desert war?

They had to rush kids into iraq so instead of desert training, they were trained in their normal training camps of hills and trees in middle america. So they were not prepared to go to Iraq. You don't know all these things happened? No wonder you are clueless.

And no I'm not making this up and no this isn't a lie that was told to me. They are facts dumb shit.

The fact that you haven't heard any of the stories is rediculous.

wow, please do keep posting
you show everyone how totally clueless you are
the military doesnt use "bullet-proof" vests as pointed out by gunny above
and he also pointed out that no matter what body armour you issue, someone will build the better bullet to penitrate it
the issue being that non-direct fire can be stopped is good, but you also have to keep the weight down so the troops can still MOVE
they already carry close to their own body weight and now you want to add MORE to it
the troops had the best that we had in the inventory at the time they went in
yes, things do get improved in time, but there is still the time it takes to get it made and then distributed

you dont even seem to understand the concept of supply and distribution

 

[DiamondDave]

Get off your soapbox. What is ridiculous is you once again blabbing about something you have no clue about.

One, no front line combat troops did not have protective armor. Period. End of story. The whining that was presented on TV was done by National Guardsman who were in the rear with the gear.

Guess what? If the front line troops need your chairpolishing ass's protective armor, you give that shit up without a ******* word or you're a lowlife puke.

Two, the military does not, has not, and does not pretend to issue "bulletproof vests." The kevlar helmet will NOT deflect a direct hit from a round, nor will the body armor. It will deflect shrapnel. You build a better vest and I will build a bullet that will penetrate it.

All branches of the US military have regularly conducted desert warfare training since the early 80s. If National Guard units do not, THAT is on the STATE Governor, not the US military.

So yeah, you ARE making your shit up. Another one of your "friends." According to you, you must know every-damned-one since you've got a friend in just about every facet of life that you wish to comment on.

The real kicker is you aren't fooling anyone. Anyone who has served in the US military knows you're full of shit right off the bat.

Amen... my military brother

 

[sealybobo]

Get off your soapbox. What is ridiculous is you once again blabbing about something you have no clue about.

One, no front line combat troops did not have protective armor. Period. End of story. The whining that was presented on TV was done by National Guardsman who were in the rear with the gear.

Guess what? If the front line troops need your chairpolishing ass's protective armor, you give that shit up without a ******* word or you're a lowlife puke.

Two, the military does not, has not, and does not pretend to issue "bulletproof vests." The kevlar helmet will NOT deflect a direct hit from a round, nor will the body armor. It will deflect shrapnel. You build a better vest and I will build a bullet that will penetrate it.

All branches of the US military have regularly conducted desert warfare training since the early 80s. If National Guard units do not, THAT is on the STATE Governor, not the US military.

So yeah, you ARE making your shit up. Another one of your "friends." According to you, you must know every-damned-one since you've got a friend in just about every facet of life that you wish to comment on.

The real kicker is you aren't fooling anyone. Anyone who has served in the US military knows you're full of shit right off the bat.

Really, cause I talk to Marines who say they come back all brainwashed like you and then some snap out and some become old swift boat veterans.

WASHINGTON -- All Soldiers in Iraq will be issued fourteen pieces of new Army equipment from the Rapid Fielding Initiative.

Additional RFI equipment is provided for Brigade Combat Teams based on their missions.

Not all Soldiers in Iraq have been equipped with RFI, but Program Executive Office Soldier, anticipate by the end of fiscal year 2004 all deployed Soldiers to Iraq will be wearing RFI.

“We are doing everything we can to make that goal a reality” said Charles Rash, acting Deputy of PEO Soldier. “Next our objective is to finish equipping the remainder of the operational Army with RFI by the end of FY07.”

RFI is a system set up by PEO. Responsibilities to the Army include testing and fielding improved equipment and gear. Since 2002, it has received a total of $1.2 billion in funding.

Thanks to the development of RFI, Soldiers no longer have to purchase or face long delays before receiving new equipment. Rash said the turn-around time has also improved, to provide Soldiers with state-of-the-art weapons, clothing and equipment before they leave for operational deployment.

Before RFI was established, Soldiers could expect a wait of up to five years to get new boots. Today, RFI has drastically reduced this wait so Solders will receive their boots in one year and ten months from when they put in the request. “RFI is about making things happen a lot faster and it has been very successful with that,” said Rash.

Soldiers in Iraq to Get New Equipment

 

[DiveCon]

Really, cause I talk to Marines who say they come back all brainwashed like you and then some snap out and some become old swift boat veterans.

WASHINGTON -- All Soldiers in Iraq will be issued fourteen pieces of new Army equipment from the Rapid Fielding Initiative.

Additional RFI equipment is provided for Brigade Combat Teams based on their missions.

Not all Soldiers in Iraq have been equipped with RFI, but Program Executive Office Soldier, anticipate by the end of fiscal year 2004 all deployed Soldiers to Iraq will be wearing RFI.

“We are doing everything we can to make that goal a reality” said Charles Rash, acting Deputy of PEO Soldier. “Next our objective is to finish equipping the remainder of the operational Army with RFI by the end of FY07.”

RFI is a system set up by PEO. Responsibilities to the Army include testing and fielding improved equipment and gear. Since 2002, it has received a total of $1.2 billion in funding.

Thanks to the development of RFI, Soldiers no longer have to purchase or face long delays before receiving new equipment. Rash said the turn-around time has also improved, to provide Soldiers with state-of-the-art weapons, clothing and equipment before they leave for operational deployment.

Before RFI was established, Soldiers could expect a wait of up to five years to get new boots. Today, RFI has drastically reduced this wait so Solders will receive their boots in one year and ten months from when they put in the request. “RFI is about making things happen a lot faster and it has been very successful with that,” said Rash.

Soldiers in Iraq to Get New Equipment

yeah, see, before RFI, it took FIVE YEARS to get new equipment rolled out
did you actually LEARN anything from that?
this is talking about NEW equipment, not REPLACEMENTS but things NEW to the inventory

 

[Gunny]

Really, cause I talk to Marines who say they come back all brainwashed like you and then some snap out and some become old swift boat veterans.

WASHINGTON -- All Soldiers in Iraq will be issued fourteen pieces of new Army equipment from the Rapid Fielding Initiative.

Additional RFI equipment is provided for Brigade Combat Teams based on their missions.

Not all Soldiers in Iraq have been equipped with RFI, but Program Executive Office Soldier, anticipate by the end of fiscal year 2004 all deployed Soldiers to Iraq will be wearing RFI.

“We are doing everything we can to make that goal a reality” said Charles Rash, acting Deputy of PEO Soldier. “Next our objective is to finish equipping the remainder of the operational Army with RFI by the end of FY07.”

RFI is a system set up by PEO. Responsibilities to the Army include testing and fielding improved equipment and gear. Since 2002, it has received a total of $1.2 billion in funding.

Thanks to the development of RFI, Soldiers no longer have to purchase or face long delays before receiving new equipment. Rash said the turn-around time has also improved, to provide Soldiers with state-of-the-art weapons, clothing and equipment before they leave for operational deployment.

Before RFI was established, Soldiers could expect a wait of up to five years to get new boots. Today, RFI has drastically reduced this wait so Solders will receive their boots in one year and ten months from when they put in the request. “RFI is about making things happen a lot faster and it has been very successful with that,” said Rash.

Soldiers in Iraq to Get New Equipment

The article does not support your allegations. It DOES support divecon's assertion regarding supply and demand.

The fact that I understand the military supply system does not make me brainwashed, Mr Uneducated Civilian. It means I made it my business to understand where my beans, bullets and bandages came from, and what, if any, of that I had to take care of myself.

For instance your article mentions boots. Boots are notorganizational issue. They are individual issue; therefore, the individual, not the organization is responsible for maintenance and replacement.

As has been mentioned on several occasions and even threads posting article on it, and divecon touched on above ... you can KEEP your spiffy-ass "new" protective vest. It weighs almost 40 pounds. Stripped down to combat load I'm still carrying 80 pounds of shit and you want to stick 20 more on me?

I'd rather have my mobility, thanks, because that will save me from direct fire WAY more than a flak jacket designed to deflect only schrapnel.

But you wouldn't know about any of that because YOU haven't been there and humped that shit while someone was shooting at your ass.

If you wish to discuss brainwashing however, we could discuss what and where you get your Kool Aid because your veins run with the stuff, and what little brain you have operates on it.

Who do you REALLY think you're fooling with the crap you post? Seems the only one fooled is you. Bad enough you're a brainwashed political hack and we have to suffer your drivel in the political threads, but you also presume to tell military people how the military is?

 

[DiamondDave]

Trolling is not about fooling... it is about disrupting, aggravating, and having the opportunity to shout slogans and crap over and over and over and over and over again

 

[DiveCon]

The article does not support your allegations. It DOES support divecon's assertion regarding supply and demand.

The fact that I understand the military supply system does not make me brainwashed, Mr Uneducated Civilian. It means I made it my business to understand where my beans, bullets and bandages came from, and what, if any, of that I had to take care of myself.

For instance your article mentions boots. Boots are notorganizational issue. They are individual issue; therefore, the individual, not the organization is responsible for maintenance and replacement.

As has been mentioned on several occasions and even threads posting article on it, and divecon touched on above ... you can KEEP your spiffy-ass "new" protective vest. It weighs almost 40 pounds. Stripped down to combat load I'm still carrying 80 pounds of shit and you want to stick 20 more on me?

I'd rather have my mobility, thanks, because that will save me from direct fire WAY more than a flak jacket designed to deflect only schrapnel.

But you wouldn't know about any of that because YOU haven't been there and humped that shit while someone was shooting at your ass.

If you wish to discuss brainwashing however, we could discuss what and where you get your Kool Aid because your veins run with the stuff, and what little brain you have operates on it.

Who do you REALLY think you're fooling with the crap you post? Seems the only one fooled is you. Bad enough you're a brainwashed political hack and we have to suffer your drivel in the political threads, but you also presume to tell military people how the military is?

its only 80 lbs?
shoot, i thought it was close to double that by now
do you have any of the FCS gear yet?