"Biden's documents are different from Trump's documents"

President Trump had already sent boxes of documents to the National Archive. He and his attorneys were negotiating which of the remaining documents should be returned to the archive. They knew about the documents, and where they were being held.

They also knew of President Biden's hidden Top Secret documents in the Biden Penn Center when the raid was ordered on Trump's residence. Complete theatrical play by the Democrats to distract from the coming Biden bombshell. It worked on you.

Nice revisionism. In reality, Trump was not returning everything and despite being told all classified documents were returned, the FBI was notified there were still more classified documents, which was the probable cause that led Mar-a-Raided.

And no, they didn't know about Biden's documents when the raid was ordered. The raid occurred in early August while Biden's documents, which no one knew about, were first discovered 3 months later in November.

Like I always say, if conservatives didn't lie, they'd have absolutely nothing to say.
 
Miniions-Th.gif


Because he's President?

"A Honolulu woman who pleaded guilty to taking classified documents while working at the U.S. Embassy in Manila was sentenced today to 90 days in jail. Asia Janay Lavarello pleaded guilty last year to one count of knowingly removing classified information, according to the U.S. Department of Justice. She removed “certain classified documents” from the embassy before hosting a dinner party in her hotel room, with guests including three American co-workers and two foreign nationals, her plea agreement said."

While it's true he can't be charged while president, that's not the only reason he can't be charged.

The main reason he can't be charged is because it's past the statute of limitations.

The third reason he can't be charged is, despite your ignorance, intent is a required element of the law and as you've eagerly demonstrated, you can't show intent.
 
While it's true he can't be charged while president, that's not the only reason he can't be charged.

The main reason he can't be charged is because it's past the statute of limitations.

The third reason he can't be charged is, despite your ignorance, intent is a required element of the law and as you've eagerly demonstrated, you can't show intent.

silence-is-the-best-response-to-a-fool-M-S.png
 
You do seem to think an administration is required to abide by a previous president’s EO’s or that an EO has the force of law.

They are required to abide by them, unless they override them with a new Executive Order. Executive Orders are directives for the Executive branch. And I do believe they carry the force of law because they do.


They are also catalogued by the National Archives as official documents produced by the federal government. Both executive orders and proclamations have the force of law, much like regulations issued by federal agencies, so they are codified under Title 3 of the Code of Federal Regulations, which is the formal collection of all of the rules and regulations issued by the executive branch and other federal agencies.
Executive orders are not legislation; they require no approval from Congress, and Congress cannot simply overturn them. Congress may pass legislation that might make it difficult, or even impossible, to carry out the order, such as removing funding. Only a sitting U.S. President may overturn an existing executive order by issuing another executive order to that effect.
 
You do seem to think an administration is required to abide by a previous president’s EO’s or that an EO has the force of law.
EOs have the force of law.

An administration can repeal an EO by a former president, or its own EO. Until and unless they do, the EO continues to have the force of law.
 
Mishandling classified documents, as both Joe Biden and Donald Trump are now accused of doing, is just one type of crime for which America increasingly has one justice system for the rich and powerful and another, far harsher system for everyone else.

as much as they might obsess the media, the classified documents scandals that engulfed Donald Trump and now President Joe Biden are a bit overblown. Rampant overclassification and absurd levels of government secrecy have been a problem in Washington for decades, often being used to ruin people’s lives in nightmarish, Kafkaesque ways. Of all the pressing crises afflicting the United States right now, presidents mishandling classified documents isn’t just not a top priority — it wouldn’t even rank in the top ten.

But all of that’s not to say that the story doesn’t matter at all, as so many commentators who eagerly pounced on Trump’s document scandal are now trying to claim. The true outrage about this whole affair is that if Biden and Trump weren’t wealthy, prominent, and politically powerful people, we wouldn’t be having any of this discussion at all — they’d simply be prosecuted and thrown in jail without anyone so much as batting an eye.

The fact is, low-level violators of classification law who have mishandled secrets in exactly the careless and sometimes accidental ways that Trump and Biden, respectively, did are never let off the hook, nor given the kind of understanding, empathy, and excuse-making both of those presidents have benefited from.

Take Asia Janay Lavarello, an ex-Pentagon employee who, while assigned to the US embassy in Manilla, took classified documents back to her hotel room to help her work on a thesis, which she had been doing from the embassy’s secure information facility until COVID shut things down. Lavarello took two days to return the documents after a partygoer stumbled onto them in her room, and when she did, she returned them to a safe, not the secure facility. She also took a diary containing notes from a classified meeting back with her to Honolulu.

Did Lavarello benefit from commentators defending her and explaining why her infraction was “no big deal” and bore “no comparison” to those who took classified documents with more fiendish motives? Of course not. She got three months in prison and a $5,500 fine, as the Democratic, Biden-appointed US attorney who prosecuted her made it exceedingly clear that the mere fact that it was an accident didn’t matter, because “government employees authorized to access classified information should face imprisonment if they misuse that authority.” The law enforcement officers who worked on the case similarly cast it as an example of their “unwavering commitment” to bringing to justice those who put “lives and the US national security at risk,” and Lavarello’s case was later directly cited as a reason to indict Trump.

Or look at another case: in 2009, twenty-two-year-old sailor Kristian Saucier took a bunch of photos of classified areas of a US nuclear submarine so he could one day show his family and future kids what he did when he served in the navy. He got a year in prison, and upon release could look forward to three more years of electronic monitoring under supervised release, six months of which would be spent in home detention.

There are so many more cases like this: the US Navy member sentenced to forty-one months in prison for downloading and storing classified files onto a disc in his home labeled “My Secret TACAMO Stuff”; the CIA contractor who for “no nefarious purpose” copied classified information onto personal notebooks he took home, and got ninety days in jail; the FBI intelligence analyst looking at ten years in prison after she “put her country’s sensitive secrets at risk” by taking and storing hundreds of classified documents; the naval reservist who downloaded classified briefings and digital records onto his personal devices and took them home at the end of his deployment, earning himself two years’ probation, a $7,500 fine, and being stripped of and barred from security clearance.

In these and other cases, the Justice Department and law enforcement made clear that, though the individuals might not have had malign motives, nor even passed classified documents to anyone else, the fact that they broke their solemn oath and the danger their actions posed to US national security meant they had to be strictly punished. This is not to mention the many cases of civic-minded whistleblowers who leaked classified documents for patriotic reasons, only to have the book thrown at them or even be tortured.

So pick one: either mishandling classified documents is such a grave danger and crime that anyone who does it should be prosecuted under any circumstances, in which case both Trump and Biden should probably serve short stints in jail and be barred from holding security clearances, or it doesn’t matter and we should go easier on those whose violations are “inadvertent” and “not intentional,” in which case those, like Biden, who took home or otherwise improperly handled classified documents should be pardoned or have charges dropped against them. In a democracy, the way the law applies shouldn’t depend on the social status of the offender in question.

There is obviously a healthy dollop of hypocrisy from all sides here, especially given Biden’s history of aggressively going after leakers and even government employees who have done exactly what he’s done here. Even John Heilemann had to acknowledge on pro-Biden MSNBC the inconsistency with which their segment of the media has treated Biden’s infraction compared to Trump’s.

But the real scandal is that this is just one more instance of a poisonous trend in American society where those lower down the ladder are treated far differently under the law than those at the top; where poor people are over-targeted for audits as the superrich pay little to nothing in taxes; where you can go to jail for murder but be celebrated after launching a war that kills many thousands; where elites face no legal accountability for plotting to steal an election but deluded low-level protesters are convicted for trespassing or for merely making hyperbolic internet posts about doing drastic things to stop a coup.

This is what we should be talking about when it comes to both Trump and Biden’s scandals. Unfortunately, it’s more than likely they will remain fodder for the never-ending partisan food fight that defines US political discourse, with little mention of the power and wealth imbalances that warp the justice system.
 
EOs have the force of law.

An administration can repeal an EO by a former president, or its own EO. Until and unless they do, the EO continues to have the force of law.
A president can not create, repeal or alter a law through the EO process. EO’s are not laws. They are directives issued by the president as to how his administration conducts their business.

Only the legislative branch can create or alter a law.
 
Last edited:
A president can not create, repeal or alter a law through the EO process. EO’s are not laws. They are directives issued by the president as to how his administration conducts their business.

Only the legislative branch can create or alter a law.

Again... no one said they're laws. :icon_rolleyes:
 
There’s really no defined process for de-classifying information.

An Executive Order issued by Obama does not have the force of law behind it. An Obama EO only apples to his administration. EO’s are not law. A president can not create laws.
Bottom line. An Obama EO has no ability to alter the way a future president de-classifies information. None what so ever.
 
Again... no one said they're laws. :icon_rolleyes:
But yet you claim they are. You just said they have the force of law. They don’t. Only the legislature can pass things which are backed by the force of law.

EO’s are administrating guidelines. Obama often attempted to circumvent the legislative process through the use of EO’s and many of his EO’s were struck down as being unconstitutional.
 
Last edited:
Bottom line. An Obama EO has no ability to alter the way a future president de-classifies information. None what so ever.

Not true at all. Again, Executive Orders are directives on how the Executive branch operates on relevant measures. Trump could have changed Obama's EO, had he wanted to, but he didn't. Therefore, he was bound by it.
 

New Topics

Back
Top Bottom