Antisemitism is growing on American campuses

[ClaireH]

I would argue that the far-left antisemites and the Islamic Fundamentalists cannot be separated : the overlap is too great. What is happening is that the Islamic Fundies (Omar, etc.), driven by their hatred of Jews, cheer on antisemitic movements such as BDS, and then the far-left, who sees everything in terms of “oppressed” and “oppressors,” jumps onto the bandwagon and aligns with the Jew-hating Muslims.

The more far-leftists align with activist, pro-Palestinian Muslims, the worse antisemitism will become. Nowhere is this more apparent than on college campuses, where the pro-Palestinian, Israel-hating crowd has fermented such an atmosphere of intolerance and outright violence toward Jews that students, such as those at CUNY, are afraid to be on campus.

From your words, the following supports the sentiment:

“Yet the big fallacy is to consider these different types of anti-Semitism as different or even ideologically opposed. In fact, there’s just one type of anti-Semitism that simply dresses its ugly persona in different ideological garments.”

New York Jewish Week - Jewish Telegraphic Agency

jewishweek.timesofisrael.com

I appreciate this type of thinking because it tends to “lose the trees” and focuses on the forest, the bigger picture. Perhaps it matters less about which group is doing what the most, and more about targeting specific antisemitism rhetoric and actions.

This is the tricky part. While it’s important to identify specific individuals for hateful words and violent actions, it’s equally important to identify all groups that allow the rhetoric under their banner.

So here lies the underlying problem: A person can self-label as anything he or she wants. Unicorns for Us…etc. So one guy says, “I am a leftist and I hate “X”, while another member of the same political group says, “ I’m a leftist and I have no problem with “X”. It always falls back to an individual basis, for any determination of innocence and guilt, and for significant thought distinctions.

 

[Lisa558]

From your words, the following supports the sentiment:

“Yet the big fallacy is to consider these different types of anti-Semitism as different or even ideologically opposed. In fact, there’s just one type of anti-Semitism that simply dresses its ugly persona in different ideological garments.”

New York Jewish Week - Jewish Telegraphic Agency

jewishweek.timesofisrael.com

I appreciate this type of thinking because it tends to “lose the trees” and focuses on the forest, the bigger picture. Perhaps it matters less about which group is doing what the most, and more about targeting specific antisemitism rhetoric and actions.

This is the tricky part. While it’s important to identify specific individuals for hateful words and violent actions, it’s equally important to identify all groups that allow the rhetoric under their banner.

So here lies the underlying problem: A person can self-label as anything he or she wants. Unicorns for Us…etc. So one guy says, “I am a leftist and I hate “X”, while another member of the same political group says, “ I’m a leftist and I have no problem with “X”. It always falls back to an individual basis, for any determination of innocence and guilt, and for significant thought distinctions.

I think we DO have to separate them because it helps us determine how best to fight back against the antisemitism - by dispelling the false ideology - that drives the Jew-hate.

For example, those on the left (the overlapping two groups of Muslim fundies and leftist bigots who fall for the propaganda) need to be combatted by being publicizing the truth about Arabs and Jews, the history of Muslim terrorists rejecting offers of two states, how Arabs drove away more Jews from their homes (and without compensation) than the converse in Israel, and so forth. While we won’t make headway with any of the “firm” antisemites, we might move the needle a bit among those uniformed and who would otherwise fall prey to Palestinian propaganda.

Then, too, it’s important to know the numbers in each group, since our resources to fight antisemitism - always based on lies - is limited. While we are always reminded by the leftists of the alt-right who yelled ”Jew will not replace us!,” just how many of these new-Nazis are there, really?

Then consider the 400,000 followers, 90% of whom vote Democrat,of the ”Jews are termites” Farrakhan. A DC city councilman not too long ago repeated one of Farrakhan’s antisemitic tropes.

 

[ClaireH]

I think we DO have to separate them because it helps us determine how best to fight back against the antisemitism - by dispelling the false ideology - that drives the Jew-hate.

For example, those on the left (the overlapping two groups of Muslim fundies and leftist bigots who fall for the propaganda) need to be combatted by being publicizing the truth about Arabs and Jews, the history of Muslim terrorists rejecting offers of two states, how Arabs drove away more Jews from their homes (and without compensation) than the converse in Israel, and so forth. While we won’t make headway with any of the “firm” antisemites, we might move the needle a bit among those uniformed and who would otherwise fall prey to Palestinian propaganda.

Then, too, it’s important to know the numbers in each group, since our resources to fight antisemitism - always based on lies - is limited. While we are always reminded by the leftists of the alt-right who yelled ”Jew will not replace us!,” just how many of these new-Nazis are there, really?

Then consider the 400,000 followers, 90% of whom vote Democrat,of the ”Jews are termites” Farrakhan. A DC city councilman not too long ago repeated one of Farrakhan’s antisemitic tropes.

In reviewing your latest post, it became more clear about why efforts to reduce antisemitism move at an amoeba’s pace. It’s because the global narrative regarding Jewish rights and Palestinian rights has narrowed it down to choosing between one side or the other. As if individual abuses on both sides aren’t occurring on a daily basis. As if there wasn’t a choice to back “good Israelis” and “good Palestinians” and oppose corruptive groups (for example, Hamas) and individuals wherever it falls.

That’s pretty much where I fall as an average American voter. I am a broken record when it comes to boiling down all instances to the individual level. Removing blanket stereotypes that are not accurate and only increase racism should have been achieved 20 years back by smarter humans. Our current generation of humans are basically walking advanced primates with advanced technological tools that we often abuse. Much room for progress and progress is good!

Side thought but relative: nobody likes to be told what to think. So knowing it’s not my job to tell people what to think, dealing with individuals on a 1 to 1 basis and within small groups (particularly outside the political arena) can make a positive difference. Multiply small grassroots efforts by 1000 and it can really add up.

Edit-many people would fare much better without hyper-sensitivities. Somebody’s feelings get hurt in middle school from a mean look by the hour. Some adults act worse than kids about this kind of thing. Maybe some had too many dramatic acting classes.

 

[JoeB131]

The degree to which liberals are allowing antisemitism due to their siding with Muslims is now so bad that Jewish students told the president of CUNY Brooklyn that they were afraid to return to campus, given how vicious the Jew-hate is there.

Sounds a bit whiny to me. They should have been at UIC in the 1980's, where the Palestinians and Jews had knock down drag out fights around Israeli Independence Day.

Although liberals are tolerant of antisemites on campus, it’s really nothing new. In the 1980’s, the chairman of the history department at CUNY taught students that Jews were injecting black newborns with AIDS. When the donations of successful Jewish men who had gone to CCNY decades earlier dried up, CCNY reluctantly demoted the chairman to a professor. But he SHOULD have been fired.

Yes, he should have been. BUt it's impossible to fire a tenured professor no matter what crazy shit they say.

Back to the current case, Trump - to fight back against the antisemitism allowed to grow on liberal campuses - issued an EO withholding federal funds to such colleges. Not sure what happened with it, but I imagine that the antisemitic Muslim squad members forced Biden to cancel it - and let the Jew-hating Muslims, and the ignorant non-Muslims, go back to spewing their antisemitism.

Why stop there? Why not have a Government Mandate about what can be taught in colleges. I mean, you guys already don't want to teach about racism in grade school.

 

[Lisa558]

In reviewing your latest post, it became more clear about why efforts to reduce antisemitism move at an amoeba’s pace. It’s because the global narrative regarding Jewish rights and Palestinian rights has narrowed it down to choosing between one side or the other. As if individual abuses on both sides aren’t occurring on a daily basis. As if there wasn’t a choice to back “good Israelis” and “good Palestinians” and oppose corruptive groups (for example, Hamas) and individuals wherever it falls.

That’s pretty much where I fall as an average American voter. I am a broken record when it comes to boiling down all instances to the individual level. Removing blanket stereotypes that are not accurate and only increase racism should have been achieved 20 years back by smarter humans. Our current generation of humans are basically walking advanced primates with advanced technological tools that we often abuse. Much room for progress and progress is good!

Side thought but relative: nobody likes to be told what to think. So knowing it’s not my job to tell people what to think, dealing with individuals on a 1 to 1 basis and within small groups (particularly outside the political arena) can make a positive difference. Multiply small grassroots efforts by 1000 and it can really add up.

Edit-many people would fare much better without hyper-sensitivities. Somebody’s feelings get hurt in middle school from a mean look by the hour. Some adults act worse than kids about this kind of thing. Maybe some had too many dramatic acting classes.

Except we can do both: deal with people on an indIvidual level AND have broad campaigns to fight against the broad campaigns of antisemites when they occur - such as the double stands we see among supporters of BDS.

Take, for example, the antisemite peppering this forum with pro-Palestinian propaganda. We MUST point out how Arabs, as a whole, have mistreated Jews as well as how Israeli Muslims, as a whole, have a better life in Israel than they would in most of the Arab countries - especially if they are women.

 

[JoeB131]

Subhumans like this repulsive Joeb thing are anything BUT liberal.


I think it is important for two reasons, the fist being that this is absolutely NOT liberalism in action. The second reason is a little more subtle, but it has to do with the effective communication of an idea in such a way that the label does not interfere with the understanding of the actual points of view. For people my age, term liberal elicits a much more positive reaction as we remember the liberalism of the sixties and seventies, and so you get an immediate pushback, not because of the issues, but because of the label. The term leftist more accurately evokes the more authoritarian portion of the left such as the Stassi which these hateful authoritarians emulate.

Well, this is where you get confused. I don't consider myself a liberal.

I'm a pragmatist.

There's no real PRAGMATIC reason to support the Zionist Entity. It's not a democracy, it's not strategically important (in fact, it makes the entire region hate us), it provides no value for the lives and treasure we throw into that region.

The thing is, the liberalism of the 60's and 70's was a LOT more radical than it was today. It's just that you take most of their gains for granted.

I would argue that the far-left antisemites and the Islamic Fundamentalists cannot be separated : the overlap is too great. What is happening is that the Islamic Fundies (Omar, etc.), driven by their hatred of Jews, cheer on antisemitic movements such as BDS, and then the far-left, who sees everything in terms of “oppressed” and “oppressors,” jumps onto the bandwagon and aligns with the Jew-hating Muslims.

Not at all.... here's the thing. If it wasn't for our insatiable thirst of oil and the deathgrip the Zionist Lobby has on the testicles of our politicians, why would America CARE about "Islamic Fundamentalists"? Of course, the Palestinian Movement has only become more "Islamic" in recent years because that's where the Zionist Propaganda has placed the emphasis. When I was a young man, they were all allies of Saddam, the evil Baathist... Before that they were Soviet Allies.

Americans tend to see the world through the prism of our own fears, and the Zionists are really masters of manipulating that.

The more far-leftists align with activist, pro-Palestinian Muslims, the worse antisemitism will become. Nowhere is this more apparent than on college campuses, where the pro-Palestinian, Israel-hating crowd has fermented such an atmosphere of intolerance and outright violence toward Jews that students, such as those at CUNY, are afraid to be on campus.

Again- 1980's UIC. That was a scary situation, but the members of Hillel kept showing up to class every day, and holding their events...

 

[daveman]

Are you the guys who argued that babies mistreated by Trump's border policies have no one to blame but their parents... So how is it not the same for Jewish Squatters in Palestine?

Both sides are killing non-combatants, and the Zionists are killing a lot more of them.



And when you log back on, you make a beeline straight for this thread.
Living in your head rent-free... I'm thinking about curtains.

You don't think at all. You're ruled by your emotions, and you only have two: Rage and hatred.

Seek professional help.

 

[daveman]

Yet I come here with facts and figures and all you can do is whine "Anti-Semite"...

Your "facts" are press releases from HAMAS. Since you share their hatred of Jews, you don't question them; you just repeat what you're told.

 

[daveman]

The degree to which liberals are allowing antisemitism due to their siding with Muslims is now so bad that Jewish students told the president of CUNY Brooklyn that they were afraid to return to campus, given how vicious the Jew-hate is there.

Although liberals are tolerant of antisemites on campus, it’s really nothing new. In the 1980’s, the chairman of the history department at CUNY taught students that Jews were injecting black newborns with AIDS. When the donations of successful Jewish men who had gone to CCNY decades earlier dried up, CCNY reluctantly demoted the chairman to a professor. But he SHOULD have been fired.

Back to the current case, Trump - to fight back against the antisemitism allowed to grow on liberal campuses - issued an EO withholding federal funds to such colleges. Not sure what happened with it, but I imagine that the antisemitic Muslim squad members forced Biden to cancel it - and let the Jew-hating Muslims, and the ignorant non-Muslims, go back to spewing their antisemitism.

The irony, of course, is that while Democrats have made fighting racism their #1 issue, they bend over backwards to allow antisemitism to grow.

Fear and Scapegoating at CUNY Following Union’s Anti-Israel Resolution

Students at CUNY Brooklyn College have confided to Professor David Brodsky that they are afraid to return to campus this semester because of the atmosphere of antisemitic hate and violence that pervades the institution.

jewishjournal.com

 

[daveman]

Well, this is where you get confused. I don't consider myself a liberal.

I'm a pragmatist.

You're a Nazi. That's not hyperbole. You support Hitler's goals.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Ah! A most interesting concept of moving that bar to include liberals as moderates! That would not only be an accurate move to distinguish between the two differing ideologies currently merged as one, but greatly needed imo. Considering the huge difference in population size and comparing previous elections to 2022, there are just too many voters expected to hold the same political viewpoints. US voters are bursting at the seams with only having two major parties cutting it down to 2 options.

On topic: I found this after reading Lisa‘s posts and your own Dogmaphobe:

“The first thing to notice is that liberals and leftists usually try and reduce anti- Semitism to a purely right-wing anachronism or neo-Nazi phenomenon. In other words, they invariably ignore latent or overt racism in their own camp. Another method [they use] is to hold Israel responsible for any apparent increase in anti-Semitism, whether in the West or the Middle East. In other words, Israel is to blame, not the anti-Semites themselves.”

“There is a bitter irony here. Both liberals and leftists like to proclaim their commitment to universal human rights.”

Spotlight on modern loathing

Robert Wistrich warns that anti-Semitism will grow as long as West ignores Islamists.

www.jpost.com

So this author distinguishes between far left antisemitism and liberal antisemitism. His claim is that both groups (along with far-right anti-semitism) contain anti-semitism sentiments among individuals who self-label as leftists and liberals.

Yet the following take by Andres Spokoiny, president and CEO of the Jewish Funders Network, is that there are 3 major “branches” of anti-semitism: far left ideology, far right ideology, and Islam Fundamentalism.

New York Jewish Week - Jewish Telegraphic Agency

jewishweek.timesofisrael.com

So maybe a lot less antisemitism among liberals compared to other top three elements?

What wingnut freaks like you call liberals ARE moderates and centrists, in any educated company and in any other first world country. It's you people that have gone off the far right edge of your flat earth.

 

[ClaireH]

What wingnut freaks like you call liberals ARE moderates and centrists, in any educated company and in any other first world country. It's you people that have gone off the far right edge of your flat earth.

Well, well….. another shill resorting to name calling after losing another argument on different thread. Doubling up with the standard go-to Hillary phrase: “you people”. Weren’t you just doing that in another thread? Pipe down No Fun and carry on with your useless jargon, don’t address me as I’ve wasted enough time.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Lisa558 your not awake to what’s going on in Israel.I’m not defending Muslims or anything but the citizens in Israel and Australia have it the worst of being murdered by their government,they are finding out first hand what the citizens in Germany and Russia went through under stalin,if they resist the vaccines,they are rounded up and used in slave labor camps,I fear if the corrupt police forces don’t get off thier asses and arrest all these criminal politicians,it could come to America,it’s already almost thst bad in New York.

 

[Lisa558]

Lisa558 your not awake to what’s going on in Israel.I’m not defending Muslims or anything but the citizens in Israel and Australia have it the worst of being murdered by their government,they are finding out first hand what the citizens in Germany and Russia went through under stalin,if they resist the vaccines,they are rounded up and used in slave labor camps,I fear if the corrupt police forces don’t get off thier asses and arrest all these criminal politicians,it could come to America,it’s already almost thst bad in New York.

I’m not in favor of Israel’s Green Pass, but to compare that to Germany’s killing Jews for being Jewish is an insult to Holocaust survivors. Israel is not rounding up its citizens and marching them into gas chambers.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

I’m not in favor of Israel’s Green Pass, but to compare that to Germany’s killing Jews for being Jewish is an insult to Holocaust survivors. Israel is not rounding up its citizens and marching them into gas chambers.

I’m not comparing the two,I’m just stating you have no idea how bad it is in Israel.The citizens there understand their government is murdering them with forced vaccines,you don’t live in Israel so you have no idea how horrible it is there,why are there so many citizens in the streets fighting the police if it is soooo good fir them there and if their government is not doing bad things to them if they don’t take the vaccine. I am on a tablet now so I can’t post the video but I will happily post thst video tomorrow when I’m on a computer thst proves the citizens are fighting the police in mass numbers because they realise their life’s are on the line with their government forcing them to take the killshot.you going to deny reality that the majority there have been vaccinated,it’s not because of free choice.

I did not say Israel was the only country where the government is violating the human rights of citizens,I said Australia has it just as bad,why is it Israel is the only country of the two thst triggered you?

 

[Coyote]

Except we can do both: deal with people on an indIvidual level AND have broad campaigns to fight against the broad campaigns of antisemites when they occur - such as the double stands we see among supporters of BDS.

Take, for example, the antisemite peppering this forum with pro-Palestinian propaganda. We MUST point out how Arabs, as a whole, have mistreated Jews as well as how Israeli Muslims, as a whole, have a better life in Israel than they would in most of the Arab countries - especially if they are women.

I think we DO have to separate them because it helps us determine how best to fight back against the antisemitism - by dispelling the false ideology - that drives the Jew-hate.

For example, those on the left (the overlapping two groups of Muslim fundies and leftist bigots who fall for the propaganda) need to be combatted by being publicizing the truth about Arabs and Jews, the history of Muslim terrorists rejecting offers of two states, how Arabs drove away more Jews from their homes (and without compensation) than the converse in Israel, and so forth. While we won’t make headway with any of the “firm” antisemites, we might move the needle a bit among those uniformed and who would otherwise fall prey to Palestinian propaganda.

Then, too, it’s important to know the numbers in each group, since our resources to fight antisemitism - always based on lies - is limited. While we are always reminded by the leftists of the alt-right who yelled ”Jew will not replace us!,” just how many of these new-Nazis are there, really?

Then consider the 400,000 followers, 90% of whom vote Democrat,of the ”Jews are termites” Farrakhan. A DC city councilman not too long ago repeated one of Farrakhan’s antisemitic tropes.

Publicizing the truth? I think the pro-Israeli propaganda is as insidious as the pro-Palestinian propagand.

700,000 to 726,000 fled or were expelled during the 1948 war. Multiple sources support this (UN, Benny Morris). Estimates range from 550,000 to 935,000.

Another 280,00 to 325,000 fled or were expelled during the Six Day War.

The Jewish Virtual Library puts tbe number of Jewish refugees beho fled or were expelled between 1948 and 1972 at 820,000.

Even the lower end of the Palestinian estimate doesn’t support your claim, and of course the Palestinians got no compensation either.

 

[Coyote]

I’m not comparing the two,I’m just stating you have no idea how bad it is in Israel.The citizens there understand their government is murdering them with forced vaccines,you don’t live in Israel so you have no idea how horrible it is there,why are there so many citizens in the streets fighting the police if it is soooo good fir them there and if their government is not doing bad things to them if they don’t take the vaccine. I am on a tablet now so I can’t post the video but I will happily post thst video tomorrow when I’m on a computer thst proves the citizens are fighting the police in mass numbers because they realise their life’s are on the line with their government forcing them to take the killshot.you going to deny reality that the majority there have been vaccinated,it’s not because of free choice.

I did not say Israel was the only country where the government is violating the human rights of citizens,I said Australia has it just as bad,why is it Israel is the only country of the two thst triggered you?

Do you live in Israel?

 

[Lisa558]

Publicizing the truth? I think the pro-Israeli propaganda is as insidious as the pro-Palestinian propagand.

700,000 to 726,000 fled or were expelled during the 1948 war. Multiple sources support this (UN, Benny Morris). Estimates range from 550,000 to 935,000.

Another 280,00 to 325,000 fled or were expelled during the Six Day War.

The Jewish Virtual Library puts tbe number of Jewish refugees beho fled or were expelled between 1948 and 1972 at 820,000.

Even the lower end of the Palestinian estimate doesn’t support your claim, and of course the Palestinians got no compensation either.

Are you unaware that Jews paid Arabs between $1000 and $1100 per acre, which was well over market value for the arid land? When have Arabs ever paid Jews for the property they took when they drove 850,000 from their homes?

And just to put that $1000 an acre the Jews paid in context, at the time the going rate was $110 an acre for rich, black, farmable land in Iowa.

Myths about Israel and Zionism

Debates about Israel and Palestine often assume a historical narrative that is at odds with historical realities.

www.thepublicdiscourse.com

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Well, well….. another shill resorting to name calling after losing another argument on different thread. Doubling up with the standard go-to Hillary phrase: “you people”. Weren’t you just doing that in another thread? Pipe down No Fun and carry on with your useless jargon, don’t address me as I’ve wasted enough time.

Cry it all out.

The fact remains that it is you nutters who have gone off the deep end. What you fools refer to as "liberals" are moderates and centrists, in ay educated company or other first world country.

 

[Coyote]

Are you unaware that Jews paid Arabs between $1000 and $1100 per acre, which was well over market value for the arid land? When have Arabs ever paid Jews for the property they took when they drove 850,000 from their homes?

And just to put that $1000 an acre the Jews paid in context, at the time the going rate was $110 an acre for rich, black, farmable land in Iowa.

Myths about Israel and Zionism

Debates about Israel and Palestine often assume a historical narrative that is at odds with historical realities.

www.thepublicdiscourse.com

I’m aware that some was paid for, some was confiscated under absentee landowner laws designed to take land from Palestinians who weren’t allowed to return or confiscated by tbe state for other purposes…and some is in jurisdictional dispute.


Did the Palestinians who were expelled, receive payment?