Another Nativity Question

[ChristisKing]

Now I'm talking about Nativity scenes here not what actually happened or didn't happen in the Bible. Why is it you see cows, horses, and sheep in Nativity scenes but not pigs, chickens, roosters, or goats? I'm guessing pigs because over where Jesus was born they don't eat them, but what about the other animals?

 

[JoeMoma]

My church puts on a live nativity scene each Christmas Season.

Pigs of course are considered unclean. I have seen goats in nativity scenes. Chickens would simply be too much work and they can be hard to catch if they get loose.

 

[ChristisKing]

Pigs of course are considered unclean.

Are you saying that's what you believe now or that's what they believed back then?

 

[JoeMoma]

Are you saying that's what you believe now or that's what they believed back then?

Bible Gateway Leviticus 11 :: NIV. You may eat any animal that has a split hoof completely divided and that chews the cud. ... And the pig, though it has a split hoof completely divided, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you. You must not eat their meat or touch their carcasses; they are unclean for you.

 

[ChristisKing]

Bible Gateway Leviticus 11 :: NIV. You may eat any animal that has a split hoof completely divided and that chews the cud. ... And the pig, though it has a split hoof completely divided, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you. You must not eat their meat or touch their carcasses; they are unclean for you.

That's not answering my question.

 

[JoeMoma]

That's not answering my question.

Joseph and Mary were Jews. Bethlehem was a Jewish Town. There would be no pigs at that stable, therefore no pigs in the nativity because they are considered unclean. It does answer your question.

 

[ChristisKing]

Joseph and Mary were Jews. Bethlehem was a Jewish Town. There would be no pigs at that stable, therefore no pigs in the nativity because they are considered unclean. It does answer your question.

Yes, but you didn't tell me whether or not you think that pigs are unclean now.

 

[Clyde 154]

Consider the source..........Christ (mass) is not scriptural, its based upon man made tradition. Traditions vary from faith to faith. To a Jew, the swine is unclean........to a Christian A swine is perfectly acceptable if it is eaten with God's blessing....so on, so forth. Today the tradition of Christmas varies even based upon different geological locations, as would any nativity scene. If you travel to Europe it would be a different tradition, travel to the middle east and you would find no such tradition whatsoever....etc.,

I would suggest you construct a nativity scene to suit your own ideology and faith or lack thereof. Its America, you have the personal freedom to celebrate how you wish. To me........all animals are sin free as they lack the comprehension abilities to consider right from wrong. If you cast pearls among swine.......what would you expect them to do with gems? (in the case of the Christ, He was speaking of the gems of wisdom to His teachings) They would act as swine do, they would simply trample them under foot. That does not make them evil.......it just makes them swine.

 

[JoeMoma]

Yes, but you didn't tell me whether or not you think that pigs are unclean now.

Are you saying that's what you believe now or that's what they believed back then?

I answered with what they believe back then. Whether I believe pigs are clean or not is not relevant to why they aren't in nativity scenes. That being said, bring on the bacon.

 

[Ringel05]

We use local animals here on Tatooine.

 

[SweetSue92]

Yes, but you didn't tell me whether or not you think that pigs are unclean now.

Acts 10, Peter's vision about clean and unclean animals, will tell you exactly why Christians do not need to worry about clean and unclean animals for eating.

 

[norwegen]

Acts 10, Peter's vision about clean and unclean animals, will tell you exactly why Christians do not need to worry about clean and unclean animals for eating.

Actually, that was a dream not about animals but about foreigners. Before Christ, Jews believed foreigners were common and unclean (Acts 10:28).

When the prodigal son lived among pigs, he lived among foreigners.

But as for the animals, yes, Jews considered them unclean. Even converted Jews for many years stayed away from pork. So naturally, the primitive Christians would not have included pigs in a menagerie.

 

[SweetSue92]

Actually, that was a dream not about animals but about foreigners. Before Christ, Jews believed foreigners were common and unclean (Acts 10:28).

When the prodigal son lived among pigs, he lived among foreigners.

But as for the animals, yes, Jews considered them unclean. Even converted Jews for many years stayed away from pork. So naturally, the primitive Christians would not have included pigs in a menagerie.

It was a dream about eating animal--clean and unclean. More broadly, about accepting Gentiles into the faith without making them adhere to all the Jewish laws.

 

[norwegen]

It was a dream about eating animal--clean and unclean. More broadly, about accepting Gentiles into the faith without making them adhere to all the Jewish laws.

It was a dream about foreigners. Read the passage down to verse 28. God showed Peter in the vision not to call any person common or unclean.

Context.

 

[SweetSue92]

It was a dream about foreigners. Read the passage down to verse 28. God showed Peter in the vision not to call any person common or unclean.

Context.

I think we are agreeing. It was about accepting Gentiles "foreigners" and thus, not making Gentiles adhere to Jewish law. Other NT writers refer to not adhering to Jewish law as well. ie, circumcision, etc.

 

[norwegen]

I think we are agreeing. It was about accepting Gentiles "foreigners" and thus, not making Gentiles adhere to Jewish law. Other NT writers refer to not adhering to Jewish law as well. ie, circumcision, etc.

The Jews never demanded that anyone else adhere to their law.

 

[SweetSue92]

The Jews never demanded that anyone else adhere to their law.

New Jewish converts had to, and of course, there was plenty of upheaval in the new Christian church about following OT law among new believers. Hence Peter's dream.

 

[norwegen]

New Jewish converts had to, and of course, there was plenty of upheaval in the new Christian church about following OT law among new believers. Hence Peter's dream.

Jewish converts were Christians. They had to abide the Law for only as long as it remained (Mt 5:18). They struggled with the idea of forsaking Moses to follow Christ. They had a hard time divesting themselves of temple custom and the Law; it was their way of life.

Peter's vision summarized the entire history of the attitude of the holy people toward others, all the way back to Adam and the people of Nod. Foreigners had always been beasts of the field; they had always been common and unclean.

 

[SweetSue92]

Jewish converts were Christians. They had to abide the Law for only as long as it remained (Mt 5:18). They struggled with the idea of forsaking Moses to follow Christ. They had a hard time divesting themselves of temple custom and the Law; it was their way of life.

Peter's vision summarized the entire history of the attitude of the holy people toward others, all the way back to Adam and the people of Nod. Foreigners had always been beasts of the field; they had always been common and unclean.

Rejected. The last part at any rate.

One example: Rahab, included in the genealogy of Christ. Another: Ruth the Moabite.

 

[norwegen]

Rejected. The last part at any rate.

One example: Rahab, included in the genealogy of Christ. Another: Ruth the Moabite.

Matthew traces the genealogy of men, not of Rahab or Ruth.

Occasionally, people married into the club, but then they were no longer foreigners, were they.

It's very simple: the holy people considered themselves the chosen people. Others did not rate.