Analyzing A Practical Minimum Wage

[Jackinthebox]

Interesting that there is a calculated a basic average monthly expense of $3,025
My net expenses are far below that and my net income is far above it.

Rent of $1000 seems quite high, my mortgage is $500 and my daughter and son-in-law just bought a house with a mortgage of about $850.
Transportation of $500 per month also seems quite high, does everybody drive a Mercedes Benz? Maybe my transportation costs are much cheaper because I pay cash for used cars instead of financing.
$350 a month for health care? Are these people in cancer treatment? Including health insurance and medical bills I spend about $250 a month and that includes a weekly surcharge of $23 because I use tobacco.
Are "Advanced Utilities" a necessary expense or want?
What is the miscellaneous $400? On average, I probably spend about $1000 a month for miscellaneous items (tribal artifacts, fossils, antiques) but only because I can afford to do so.

It was all already explained in the article. I am not going to copy and paste the whole thing because of copyright.

 

[Jackinthebox]

So why should everyone be forced to confirm to the average?

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.


"The minimum wage was designed to create a minimum standard of living to protect the health and well-being of employees." -Cornell University Law School, Legal Information Institute

But, as you just acknowledged, some can live for less than others. Why force everyone to follow the same standard? Also, what about people who don't need anything at all? Is volunteering illegal in your great society?

I volunteer, so I don't see that as a problem. What I do have a problem with though is the mandatory work requirement from welfare. Example. the crossing guards in my city used to all be union, state retirement system, medical, and so forth. The mayor decided to lay them all off to save money in the city budget, and then welfare forced people to fill those positions for FREE. So now all those crossing guards who had a decent wage and some benefits wound up out of work and on welfare, going right back to doing the same job for nothing. This not only increased the welfare population in the city, but also sucked money out of the local economy since now they have no money to spend.

Being able to get by on less should not be the standard. Getting by on less is how we get ahead. That is how we find the time and money to get a better education, or to save to start a small business, etc. It also puts you in a position to take care of yourself when trouble hits, rather than turning to welfare.

 

[dblack]

So why should everyone be forced to confirm to the average?

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.


"The minimum wage was designed to create a minimum standard of living to protect the health and well-being of employees." -Cornell University Law School, Legal Information Institute

But, as you just acknowledged, some can live for less than others. Why force everyone to follow the same standard? Also, what about people who don't need anything at all? Is volunteering illegal in your great society?

I volunteer, so I don't see that as a problem.

But shouldn't that be illegal? "None" is well below your suggested minimum wage.

What I do have a problem with though is the mandatory work requirement from welfare. Example. the crossing guards in my city used to all be union, state retirement system, medical, and so forth. The mayor decided to lay them all off to save money in the city budget, and then welfare forced people to fill those positions for FREE. So now all those crossing guards who had a decent wage and some benefits wound up out of work and on welfare, going right back to doing the same job for nothing. This not only increased the welfare population in the city, but also sucked money out of the local economy since now they have no money to spend.

I agree with you there. It should be the exact opposite. People on welfare shouldn't be allowed to work. That would solve the issue of companies like Wal-Mart and McDonald's profiting from the welfare state.

Being able to get by on less should not be the standard. Getting by on less is how we get ahead. That is how we find the time and money to get a better education, or to save to start a small business, etc. It also puts you in a position to take care of yourself when trouble hits, rather than turning to welfare.

What?? I thought you were saying that getting by on less should be illegal?

 

[Jackinthebox]

So why should everyone be forced to confirm to the average?

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.


"The minimum wage was designed to create a minimum standard of living to protect the health and well-being of employees." -Cornell University Law School, Legal Information Institute

But, as you just acknowledged, some can live for less than others. Why force everyone to follow the same standard? Also, what about people who don't need anything at all? Is volunteering illegal in your great society?

I volunteer, so I don't see that as a problem.

But shouldn't that be illegal? "None" is well below your suggested minimum wage.

What I do have a problem with though is the mandatory work requirement from welfare. Example. the crossing guards in my city used to all be union, state retirement system, medical, and so forth. The mayor decided to lay them all off to save money in the city budget, and then welfare forced people to fill those positions for FREE. So now all those crossing guards who had a decent wage and some benefits wound up out of work and on welfare, going right back to doing the same job for nothing. This not only increased the welfare population in the city, but also sucked money out of the local economy since now they have no money to spend.

I agree with you there. It should be the exact opposite. People on welfare shouldn't be allowed to work. That would solve the issue of companies like Wal-Mart and McDonald's profiting from the welfare state.

Being able to get by on less should not be the standard. Getting by on less is how we get ahead. That is how we find the time and money to get a better education, or to save to start a small business, etc. It also puts you in a position to take care of yourself when trouble hits, rather than turning to welfare.

What?? I thought you were saying that getting by on less should be illegal?

Charitable volunteer work and community service are not a serious drain on the job market for one thing. For another, most of those positions are with non profits and government agencies. I would however, go along with making volunteer work illegal for profit driven companies and corporations. There is no reason why an intern shouldn't be paid min wage.

By getting by on less I mean something on the order of, okay, I am not going to pay rent for the next two years so that I can go to college instead, since Mom and Dad will let me move back home. Something along those lines. But moving back home is not something that is an option for a lot of people either. So we can't set that as the standard.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Ride the fucken bus and dont spend 400 for miscellaneous bullshit and you'll save 900 bucks a month.

That was already factored in to the analysis.

Riding the bus wont run you 500 a month. And what the hell are you buying thats "miscellaneous" that costs you 400 a month? Let me guess...weed.

This isn't MY budget. These are national figures and recommended economic practices. Miscellaneous costs can be any number of things from a traffic ticket to a fender bender to a flooded out apartment to school supplies.

So how exactly do you get a traffic ticket or a fender bender when you take the bus?
You will get blown up on this thread. But to tell you the truth it wont be from me because I'm sick of rehashing the same shit every time we get a newb.
I'll just sit back and laugh as you as you try and justify your ridiculous assertations.

There's no bus where I live. And even in places where there is a bus, it often doesn't run late enough to get people to and from late shifts.

Then move. It's not your employers problem where you choose to live.

 

[alan1]

It was all already explained in the article. I am not going to copy and paste the whole thing because of copyright.

Average and median are very different.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.

if you don't put them on welfare there is no welfare class.
Welfare is very dangerous becuase it makes people lazy and dependent. We found when Clinton eliminated welfare as we know it by making it workfare fully half decided they no longer needed welfare.

 

[Jackinthebox]

That was already factored in to the analysis.

Riding the bus wont run you 500 a month. And what the hell are you buying thats "miscellaneous" that costs you 400 a month? Let me guess...weed.

This isn't MY budget. These are national figures and recommended economic practices. Miscellaneous costs can be any number of things from a traffic ticket to a fender bender to a flooded out apartment to school supplies.

So how exactly do you get a traffic ticket or a fender bender when you take the bus?
You will get blown up on this thread. But to tell you the truth it wont be from me because I'm sick of rehashing the same shit every time we get a newb.
I'll just sit back and laugh as you as you try and justify your ridiculous assertations.

There's no bus where I live. And even in places where there is a bus, it often doesn't run late enough to get people to and from late shifts.

Then move. It's not your employers problem where you choose to live.

Moving is an impractical solution. Moving costs a lot of money, and takes a person out of their support network. There is also no guarantee that there will be a job available in the next town.

 

[dblack]

Charitable volunteer work and community service are not a serious drain on the job market for one thing. For another, most of those positions are with non profits and government agencies. I would however, go along with making volunteer work illegal for profit driven companies and corporations. There is no reason why an intern shouldn't be paid min wage.

What if they want to? Where do you get off telling someone else how much they can work for?

By getting by on less I mean something on the order of, okay, I am not going to pay rent for the next two years so that I can go to college instead, since Mom and Dad will let me move back home. Something along those lines. But moving back home is not something that is an option for a lot of people either. So we can't set that as the standard.

Why do we need a standard? Why can't people decide for themselves how much they're willing to work for? Do you really think your idea of the proper standard should be crammed down everyone else's throats by force of law?

 

[Jackinthebox]

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.

if you don't put them on welfare there is no welfare class.
Welfare is very dangerous becuase it makes people lazy and dependent. We found when Clinton eliminated welfare as we know it by making it workfare fully half decided they no longer needed welfare.

Yet today, fully half of all people on welfare have jobs. There is no reason in hell why someone who gets up and goes to work everyday should have to report to the welfare office every month in order to get by.

 

[dblack]

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.

if you don't put them on welfare there is no welfare class.
Welfare is very dangerous becuase it makes people lazy and dependent. We found when Clinton eliminated welfare as we know it by making it workfare fully half decided they no longer needed welfare.

Yet today, fully half of all people on welfare have jobs. There is no reason in hell why someone who gets up and goes to work everyday should have to report to the welfare office every month in order to get by.

Absolutely. Companies should not be allowed to profit from the welfare system. They shouldn't be allowed to hire anyone on public assistance.

 

[Jackinthebox]

Charitable volunteer work and community service are not a serious drain on the job market for one thing. For another, most of those positions are with non profits and government agencies. I would however, go along with making volunteer work illegal for profit driven companies and corporations. There is no reason why an intern shouldn't be paid min wage.

What if they want to? Where do you get off telling someone else how much they can work for?

Where do I get off? When I have to start paying to feed and shelter WalMarts labor force, that's where I get off.

By getting by on less I mean something on the order of, okay, I am not going to pay rent for the next two years so that I can go to college instead, since Mom and Dad will let me move back home. Something along those lines. But moving back home is not something that is an option for a lot of people either. So we can't set that as the standard.

Why do you need a standard? Why can't people decide for themselves how much they're willing to work for? Do you really think your idea of the proper standard should be crammed down everyone else's throats by force of law?

Why do we need a standard? In order to eliminate the welfare class.

 

[Roadrunner]

It was all already explained in the article. I am not going to copy and paste the whole thing because of copyright.

Average and median are very different.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

This guy is advocating for a minimum wage higher than the median wage.

Utopian bullshit.

 

[Jackinthebox]

Absolutely. Companies should not be allowed to profit from the welfare system. They shouldn't be allowed to hire anyone on public assistance.

Agreed. And a practical min wage achieves that.

 

[dblack]

Charitable volunteer work and community service are not a serious drain on the job market for one thing. For another, most of those positions are with non profits and government agencies. I would however, go along with making volunteer work illegal for profit driven companies and corporations. There is no reason why an intern shouldn't be paid min wage.

What if they want to? Where do you get off telling someone else how much they can work for?

Where do I get off? When I have to start paying to feed and shelter WalMarts labor force, that's where I get off.

I agree. As I said, companies shouldn't be allowed to profit from public assistance.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.

if you don't put them on welfare there is no welfare class.
Welfare is very dangerous becuase it makes people lazy and dependent. We found when Clinton eliminated welfare as we know it by making it workfare fully half decided they no longer needed welfare.

Yet today, fully half of all people on welfare have jobs. There is no reason in hell why someone who gets up and goes to work everyday should have to report to the welfare office every month in order to get by.

Absolutely. Companies should not be allowed to profit from the welfare system. They shouldn't be allowed to hire anyone on public assistance.

Marxist BS. You want to punish corps even if it means crippling human beings with welfare

 

[dblack]

Absolutely. Companies should not be allowed to profit from the welfare system. They shouldn't be allowed to hire anyone on public assistance.

Agreed. And a practical min wage achieves that.

No it doesn't. It just makes it illegal for anyone to work for less. It forces people to go on public assistance who might otherwise work.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Absolutely. Companies should not be allowed to profit from the welfare system. They shouldn't be allowed to hire anyone on public assistance.

Agreed. And a practical min wage achieves that.

absurd since our poor are very rich by African standards. They already get $12,000 a year in free medical care just for starters. You are fundamentally confused about life.

 

[dblack]

Paying workers less than they need to live on creates a permanent welfare class.

if you don't put them on welfare there is no welfare class.
Welfare is very dangerous becuase it makes people lazy and dependent. We found when Clinton eliminated welfare as we know it by making it workfare fully half decided they no longer needed welfare.

Yet today, fully half of all people on welfare have jobs. There is no reason in hell why someone who gets up and goes to work everyday should have to report to the welfare office every month in order to get by.

Absolutely. Companies should not be allowed to profit from the welfare system. They shouldn't be allowed to hire anyone on public assistance.

Marxist BS. You want to punish corps even if it means crippling human beings with welfare

Special Ed, you are not a free market advocate. You are far too stupid to even understand it. Please stop typing.

 

[Jackinthebox]

It was all already explained in the article. I am not going to copy and paste the whole thing because of copyright.

Average and median are very different.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

This guy is advocating for a minimum wage higher than the median wage.

Utopian bullshit.

The median wage should be higher too. 90% of workers today make less than the min wage standard of 1950. But if the people at the bottom, who are traditionally the biggest spenders and consumers had more money there would be greater market liquidity and therefore the economy could support higher wages for those further up the ladder as well.