An Israeli Should Win The Nobel Peace Prize This Year (It's Not Sharon)

[NATO AIR]

a brave man defends israel's right to exist and prosper, while striving to end the occupation that threatens to destroy israel's very democratic and justice centered nature

to israel and its many staunch supporters on the board, fight the terrorists in gaza and the west bank as you must, defeat (and destory) the hamas and the islamic jihad and their murderous allies. but after you have won this victory you deserve, please end the occupation that denies both peoples their future.

http://couragetorefuse.org/English/nobel.asp

Why Refusal to serve in the Territories is Zionism

Courage to Refuse was founded following the publication of The Combatants Letter in 2002, by a group of 50 combat officers and soldiers. The initiators of the letter, Captain David Zonshein and Lieutenant Yaniv Itzkovits, officers in an elite unit, have served for four years in compulsory service, and another eight years as reserve soldiers, including long periods of active combat both in Lebanon and in the occupied territories.

During their reserve service in Gaza, in the midst of the second Intifada, the two realised that the missions confided to them as commanders in the IDF had in fact nothing to do with the defence of the State of Israel, but were rather intended to expand the colonies at the price of oppressing the local Palestinian population. Many of the commands issued to them were, in fact, harmful to the strategic interests of Israel.

Like all soldiers of the IDF, David and Yaniv were prepared to fight in order to protect their families back home. In January 2002 it became apparent to them that fighting in Gaza and in the West Bank would achieve the opposite result: by obeying orders they would not be protecting the lives of their dear ones. Although only young officers at the time, David and Yaniv understood what is today widely acknowledged by Israel's most decorated generals (including the current IDF Chief of Staff): The Occupation poses a threat to the security of Israel.

Finally, it was the unbearable pain and suffering inflicted upon millions of innocent civilians in the name of the "settlements" that had lead them to draft one of the most shocking documents ever written about the IDF. Over the years, their statement came to be known as The Combatant's Letter.

In the letter, the soldiers pledge their ongoing commitment to the security of Israel, but declare that they will take no part in missions intended to prolong the occupation.

To date, 628 combatants from all units of the IDF and from all sectors of the Israeli society have signed the letter and have joined Courage to Refuse. The members of the movement, often called "refuseniks", continue to do their reserve duty wherever and whenever they are summoned, but refuse to serve in the occupied territories. They are not considering their personal benefit, but rather Israel’s safety and its moral character. Over 280 Members of Courage to Refuse have in fact been court martialed and jailed for periods of up to 35 days as a result of their refusal.

It was the selflessness and determination of the members of Courage to Refuse that won a warm place for the movement in the hearts of many Israelis. Their act of self- sacrifice, their willingness to serve prison terms in order to voice their cry of distress opened the eyes of many who have been morally blinded by fears and pain of war and terrorism.

By and by, well-known public figures expressed their support to the members of Courage to Refuse. Hundreds of University Professors have signed support petitions, and the word SERUV (the Hebrew word designating refusal), which a few years ago was synonymous with treason, has won its place in the Israeli political discourse as a legitimate and sound act of civil awareness.

Sami Michael, the reputed author and the acting chairman of the Israeli Association for Human Rights has gone as far as saying that refusing the occupation is, in fact, not only an act of morality, but is also the purest form of patriotism practiced in Israel today.

According to a survey conducted by Yaffee Center for Strategic Studies, over 25% of all Israelis sympathize with our struggle and acknowledge our civil right and moral duty to refuse to serve the occupation. Courage to Refuse accepts new signatories every week. Its members, beyond refusing to serve in the occupied territories, take part in many demonstrations, cultural events and other activities of public education aimed to end the occupation and bring peace to Israel.

 

[dilloduck]

a brave man defends israel's right to exist and prosper, while striving to end the occupation that threatens to destroy israel's very democratic and justice centered nature

to israel and its many staunch supporters on the board, fight the terrorists in gaza and the west bank as you must, defeat (and destory) the hamas and the islamic jihad and their murderous allies. but after you have won this victory you deserve, please end the occupation that denies both peoples their future.

They got my vote-----I don't even see any other candidates at the moment

 

[NATO AIR]

oh you got the EU and the head of the International Atomic Energy Agency to vote for

 

[drac]

a brave man defends israel's right to exist and prosper, while striving to end the occupation that threatens to destroy israel's very democratic and justice centered nature

to israel and its many staunch supporters on the board, fight the terrorists in gaza and the west bank as you must, defeat (and destory) the hamas and the islamic jihad and their murderous allies. but after you have won this victory you deserve, please end the occupation that denies both peoples their future.

good point, but what do you defined as occuppied land? what do you do if after withdraw from the "occupied" land terror attacks against israeli continue (see lebanon)

 

[NATO AIR]

good point, but what do you defined as occuppied land? what do you do if after withdraw from the "occupied" land terror attacks against israeli continue (see lebanon)

the areas that were palestinian before the 1967 war. that is occupied land. nothing more, nothing less. no right of return for the palestinians.

 

[ajwps]

a brave man defends israel's right to exist and prosper, while striving to end the occupation that threatens to destroy israel's very democratic and justice centered nature

to israel and its many staunch supporters on the board, fight the terrorists in gaza and the west bank as you must, defeat (and destory) the hamas and the islamic jihad and their murderous allies. but after you have won this victory you deserve, please end the occupation that denies both peoples their future.

Israel is ready to end the occupation of its land by aliens who do not want any country of their own. Israel will allow the Arabs living in Israel to live in any country they choose, just not Israel.

To think that the Arabs (palestinians) want peace with Israel is equivalent in an attempt to house train an Egyptian venomous asp.

 

[ajwps]

the areas that were palestinian before the 1967 war. that is occupied land. nothing more, nothing less. no right of return for the palestinians.

The land areas that were palestinian before the 1967 war were Egypt, Lebanon, Syria and Iraq. The Arabs who lived in Israel lost their lands when they attacked Israel.

When you win your own land in a war waged against you, the losers don't get back what they lost in a war of aggression against the owners of the land. That land being ISRAEL....

 

[DaTroof]

Hey NATO Air ...

Are you saying that no European countries split any Germanian lands after WW1 and WW2 ?! Germany might still consider parts of Czecoslovacia as being theirs, not to mention Austria. So is it only the Israelis that should always return every inch of land after being attacked and successfully defending themselves ?! Better look at European and US history a bit more closely.

Do you really believe that the ultimate goal of the Palestinians is peace with Israel ?! I believe that some really want just that, and would be more than happy having the fence run a few miles off the 1967 lines if it meent a chance to concentrate of moving forward. I'd say that there is a good chunk however, that really has no intention of living by Israel's side peacefully.

3) Are you OK w/ this deal ? I'll give everything back to the 1967 border, but if there is one more attack and Israeli citizens die, I kill members of your family. I know it sounds ridiculous, but that is exactly what you are asking Israel to do. I have tons of family in Jerusalem, so i'm just saying "ante up". So now that I put it like that, how much do you really trust Israel's neighbors ?!

Is the reason that you insist on '67 borders because that's what the UN authorized ?! Do you think that the way the UN is set up currently (3o+ Arab members of which Syria is on the flippin Security Council), Israel or the US stand a fighting chance of getting their interest represented ?! How do you think that the UN came up with that line to begin with ?! Much like the other borders drawn by European imperial powers at the time, they suck. No really .. they suck a lot. They often run with complete disregard for geography or demographics. Ever wonder how Iraq, Syria, Lebanon etc got these wonderful borders which have kept things peaceful in the region for the past 90 years or so ?! Just thank the Europeans. Now you are asking Israel to accept a British SNAFUBAR as law ? Law that Israel must pay for with their blood. The question should be; How much have the Arabs respected the 1967 borders ?! They tried to cross it at every opportunity available to destroy Israel. So the Arabs don't respect the border, but you want Israel to ?!

Da Troof is that if you are European or residing in the US, you have nothing to speak of with regards to out and out land grabs. Israel has nothing on either of you ... or the Moslems (see Sudan, Kashmir, Sothern Russia, Indonesia, etc etc). So I hope that this ends the preaching regarding giving all the land back. Not gonna happen. I'm gonna keep a few miles to ensure that I'm not 16 Km wide in the middle. With 1.4 billion Moslems, oil drenched lands for hundreds of miles, I think they'll learn to manage .. I have.

 

[NATO AIR]

da troof,
israel's pre-1967 borders were actually much easier to maintain and defend than what they have now... they reached too much, too far, and now they have suicide bombers, nutjob settlements and a big mess on their hands.

I would station US troops in Israel to guarantee Israel's security and also that of the Palestinians, who I believe will one day accept peace with Israel and two peoples will live side by side in peace. I worry more about future regimes in Syria or Egypt that might attack Israel or do something else stupid.

 

[dilloduck]

Hey NATO Air ...

Are you saying that no European countries split any Germanian lands after WW1 and WW2 ?! Germany might still consider parts of Czecoslovacia as being theirs, not to mention Austria. So is it only the Israelis that should always return every inch of land after being attacked and successfully defending themselves ?! Better look at European and US history a bit more closely.

Do you really believe that the ultimate goal of the Palestinians is peace with Israel ?! I believe that some really want just that, and would be more than happy having the fence run a few miles off the 1967 lines if it meent a chance to concentrate of moving forward. I'd say that there is a good chunk however, that really has no intention of living by Israel's side peacefully.

3) Are you OK w/ this deal ? I'll give everything back to the 1967 border, but if there is one more attack and Israeli citizens die, I kill members of your family. I know it sounds ridiculous, but that is exactly what you are asking Israel to do. I have tons of family in Jerusalem, so i'm just saying "ante up". So now that I put it like that, how much do you really trust Israel's neighbors ?!

Is the reason that you insist on '67 borders because that's what the UN authorized ?! Do you think that the way the UN is set up currently (3o+ Arab members of which Syria is on the flippin Security Council), Israel or the US stand a fighting chance of getting their interest represented ?! How do you think that the UN came up with that line to begin with ?! Much like the other borders drawn by European imperial powers at the time, they suck. No really .. they suck a lot. They often run with complete disregard for geography or demographics. Ever wonder how Iraq, Syria, Lebanon etc got these wonderful borders which have kept things peaceful in the region for the past 90 years or so ?! Just thank the Europeans. Now you are asking Israel to accept a British SNAFUBAR as law ? Law that Israel must pay for with their blood. The question should be; How much have the Arabs respected the 1967 borders ?! They tried to cross it at every opportunity available to destroy Israel. So the Arabs don't respect the border, but you want Israel to ?!

Da Troof is that if you are European or residing in the US, you have nothing to speak of with regards to out and out land grabs. Israel has nothing on either of you ... or the Moslems (see Sudan, Kashmir, Sothern Russia, Indonesia, etc etc). So I hope that this ends the preaching regarding giving all the land back. Not gonna happen. I'm gonna keep a few miles to ensure that I'm not 16 Km wide in the middle. With 1.4 billion Moslems, oil drenched lands for hundreds of miles, I think they'll learn to manage .. I have.

Unless Isreal is planning a genocide, they will ALWAYS have Arab neighbors . If Israel would stand up and recognize some borders instead of importing MORE settlers to occupy land in question, the world may treat Israel with a new respect. The world knows that Israel fought a war with Arab attackers and won it. It does not need to keep the land to inflate itself like a bullfrog to intimidate future attackers. The US returned all the land it conquered in WWII.

 

[drac]

da troof,
israel's pre-1967 borders were actually much easier to maintain and defend than what they have now... they reached too much, too far, and now they have suicide bombers, nutjob settlements and a big mess on their hands.

Not true, but it is not an issue at this point. The points were made as follow:
<li> Under what rational were 67 borders defined</li>
<li> Syria, Egypt and Jordan controlled the land (which was supposed to go to Palestine) prior to 67 war and it was not defined as occupied</li>

I would station US troops in Israel to guarantee Israel's security and also that of the Palestinians, who I believe will one day accept peace with Israel and two peoples will live side by side in peace. I worry more about future regimes in Syria or Egypt that might attack Israel or do something else stupid.

I seriously doubt that any US government will risk its troops in the violate region as a buffer. Also, even if israel can be forced to accept american troops peacefully, i am not that sure about palestinian side. I am sure it can be forced on them, but what will happen if some idiot straps a bomb and blows up some GIs.

 

[drac]

Unless Isreal is planning a genocide, they will ALWAYS have Arab neighbors . If Israel would stand up and recognize some borders instead of importing MORE settlers to occupy land in question, the world may treat Israel with a new respect. The world knows that Israel fought a war with Arab attackers and won it. It does not need to keep the land to inflate itself like a bullfrog to intimidate future attackers. The US returned all the land it conquered in WWII.

No one is taking about genocide. Israel accepted its arab/muslim neighbors from the start.

World respect? What is it?
About standing up and recognizing some borders. How about current fence? Can jews now get some respect? I have better idea, why do not arabs keep the respect, but just stop killing innocent jews instead.

 

[ajwps]

da troof,
israel's pre-1967 borders were actually much easier to maintain and defend than what they have now... they reached too much, too far, and now they have suicide bombers, nutjob settlements and a big mess on their hands.

How foolish can you be? Israel's pre-1967 borders were the target of the Arab countries around them since 1947. It it weren't for a mysterious event from an anti-semitic President Nixon, Israel would have hadn't sufficient weapons to prevent themselves from being overrun by their neighbors. Israel didn't overreach for too much, a stupid one-eyed Israeli general by the name of Dayan asked the Arabs to come back into Israel and live in peace. Much like asking a running away hyena into your child's bedroom to be a playmate.

I would station US troops in Israel to guarantee Israel's security and also that of the Palestinians, who I believe will one day accept peace with Israel and two peoples will live side by side in peace. I worry more about future regimes in Syria or Egypt that might attack Israel or do something else stupid.

That little ploy has been tried by the UN troops who sat and watched the Arabs come into Israel and blow up in the crowds of shops and children at play. You needn't worry about Syria, Egypt or Iran attacking Israel as they know all-to-well that this type of move would indeed by stupid.

They have tried 5 times to defeat this little strip of Jewish land since 1947 and, by the grace of Allah, have been defeated and almost overrun if it were not for the US and Russia. The minute that these countries think they can defeat Israel, they would not hesitate for a nano-second to attack Israel.

Israel has the same power that President Truman had and used to end the second world war in Japan.

Turn your speakers on...

http://truman.homestead.com/Character.html