An ethical question

[rtwngAvngr]

Too indecisive, afraid of grey areas.

This is true. They've bought into the meme that any judgement or decision at all is closed minded. Plus, once you make a decision, or state a value, there's the chance of being wrong. Remain wishy washy and no one can pin you down, you can never be wrong. How cool.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Since I attend a real university and always do the work assigned to me, things like that do not happen to me. You are assigned the grade that you earn.
And since classes are not in session, I do not have any projects to complete. Sorry to disappoint you on that one.

My question does not concern presumed guilt and innocence. It refers to human life. If you believe that only God has the right to end life, you should be opposed to killing anyone. Christian theology states "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." Not to mention the fact that Jesus died for our sins. Whether you be an innocent unborn child or a convicted mass murderer, your life remains precious in the eyes of the Lord.

I am a firm believer in life in prison without parole. If you execute a murderer, you are repeating his crimes. At the same time, what is a worth punishment that knowing you will never get out of prison? Maximum security prisons do not carry the horrors of Gitmo, but they aren't exactly The Hilton either. Execution is the easy way out.

Forcing an innocent person to suffer on life support can be compared to torture. For the person and their friends/relatives.
Similarly, there is a school of thought that you do not have sustainable human life until several months into gestation. You may not agree with it, but that does not mean it is not plausible.

"the horrors of Gitmo"? ----I see you are swilling the koolaid.

If you can't justify the simple torturing an enemy combatant with rap music in a hot cell, then surely you couldn't justify the torturous killing of an unborn live baby?

 

[Shattered]

I am a firm believer in life in prison without parole. If you execute a murderer, you are repeating his crimes. At the same time, what is a worth punishment that knowing you will never get out of prison? Maximum security prisons do not carry the horrors of Gitmo, but they aren't exactly The Hilton either. Execution is the easy way out.

You willing to personally foot the bill to keep one murderer alive in prison for the rest of his/her natural life? Killing them is cheaper - especially if they take my advice, and use a simple, single bullet to the head.

 

[Annie]

You willing to personally foot the bill to keep one murderer alive in prison for the rest of his/her natural life? Killing them is cheaper - especially if they take my advice, and use a simple, single bullet to the head.

Shattered, I think max security prisons are way more horrendous than Gitmo. Where are you getting your info?

My error, I read to quickly. I apologize, who said that?

Never mind, I should have known.

 

[Shattered]

Shattered, I think max security prisons are way more horrendous than Gitmo. Where are you getting your info?

My error, I read to quickly. I apologize, who said that?

Does a murderer need electricity? Clothes? Food? A place to sleep? The ability to suck up natural resources like oxygen? Why?

 

[Annie]

Does a murderer need electricity? Clothes? Food? A place to sleep? The ability to suck up natural resources like oxygen? Why?

I edited again. I know it was not you but Gabby. Just when I'm feeling that I need to be consistent regarding life, this jerkoff shows up. Enough to say, firing squads anyone?

 

[Shattered]

I edited again. I know it was not you but Gabby. Just when I'm feeling that I need to be consistent regarding life, this jerkoff shows up. Enough to say, firing squads anyone?

She may yet find herself on the receiving end of a firing squad.

 

[WeAreLegion]

Here is an ethical question for you to ponder while I am toiling at my job:

Why do the same people who so strongly oppose abortion and ending life support also firmly support the death penalty?
To me, ending life is ending life.

You're operating under an assumption that your statement is true in all cases versus in some cases (the truth is always in the middle).

Personally, I am conservative (not Neo-Conservative) and I do not think that the death penalty is a good idea. If we could be absolutely, positively certain (I have examples of where we're often not) of a persons guilt then I can see the arguments for the death penalty but would not vote for it if ever given the opportunity.

Also, as mentioned above, there are gray areas. The assignation of the death penalty is not necessarily something done of revenge or deterrent. To me, it's almost a self defense mechanism particularly when the crime committed was heinous as is the case with most death penalty cases.

Abortion is always wrong in my eyes. I married a woman who agrees with me and that's as far as I can take it. I don't think I can reasonably impose my viewpoints on this on anyone else because I see it as an offense that is above man and therefore not governable by man.

 

[mattskramer]

I think that abortion should only be allowed when the mother’s life is at risk and, perhaps, in cases of rape and incest. Aside form those rare cases it should be illegal. Therefore, I suppose that I could be described as being against abortion. Yet, I am also against capital punishment. When it is an established fact that all people convicted of murder really did commit murder, I will support capital punishment. These days, there are many cases in which death-row inmates are proven to be not guilty of the crimes for which they were convicted.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

I think that abortion should only be allowed when the mother’s life is at risk and, perhaps, in cases of rape and incest. Aside form those rare cases it should be illegal. Therefore, I suppose that I could be described as being against abortion. Yet, I am also against capital punishment. When it is an established fact that all people convicted of murder really did commit murder, I will support capital punishment. These days, there are many cases in which death-row inmates are proven to be not guilty of the crimes for which they were convicted.

Truthfully, imagine what would you do if your little sweet 4 year old girl was raped repeatedly, beaten profusely, and then buried alive in a plastic bag?

Tell me now that you would be willing to let the scumbag spend the rest of his life in a cozy cell with 3 squares a day on your tax dollar? Plus maybe even being allowed out free on parole after a number of years?

You still with the liberal program?

 

[Shattered]

Truthfully, imagine what would you do if you had a little 4 year old girl who was raped repeatedly, beaten profusely, and then buried alive in a plastic bag?

Tell me now that you are willing to let the scumbag spend the rest of his life in a cozy cell with 3 squares a day on your tax dollar? Plus maybe even being allowed out free on parole after a number of years?

You still with the liberal program?

Yeah, he is.. Been there, had that argument...

Oh, and being found "not guilty" is not the same thing as "innocent". OJ was found "not guilty".

 

[no1tovote4]

I think that abortion should only be allowed when the mother’s life is at risk and, perhaps, in cases of rape and incest. Aside form those rare cases it should be illegal. Therefore, I suppose that I could be described as being against abortion. Yet, I am also against capital punishment. When it is an established fact that all people convicted of murder really did commit murder, I will support capital punishment. These days, there are many cases in which death-row inmates are proven to be not guilty of the crimes for which they were convicted.

It isn't only that, but with the current system it is simply too expensive to put these people to death. They are placed in an area of the Prison that costs nearly twice what it costs to house other prisoners, they have numerous appeals that cost the taxpayer and by the time you finally get down to the deed it cost far more than simply putting them in prison until they come out stiff and in a box of their own much smaller than their shared cell.

Nice to see ya post something, Matt. Your opinions are often different than the people on the board.

However with the abortion thing, I have a problem with giving the death penalty to offspring for the sins of their father. It is always the most innocent who suffer when their voice cannot be heard.

 

[no1tovote4]

Truthfully, imagine what would you do if your little sweet 4 year old girl was raped repeatedly, beaten profusely, and then buried alive in a plastic bag?

Tell me now that you would be willing to let the scumbag spend the rest of his life in a cozy cell with 3 squares a day on your tax dollar? Plus maybe even being allowed out free on parole after a number of years?

You still with the liberal program?

Truthfully now. Do you really think that the Justice system is, and should be, a tool for individuals to get revenge? On an individual basis, a person who killed my 4 year old because of stupidity, even without raping her, would be in serious danger of my personal wrath. There could be no excuse for their idiocy in my eyes. But does that mean that every person that killed my daughter deserved death by society's standard? Are there cases where people who killed my daughter didn't deserve punishment at all? They would still be in danger of my wrath, but does that mean because of my personal feelings they should always get the death penalty?

If somebody raped and killed my 4 year old, they would not survive the trial and would be found sans skin with various large instruments shoved in an orifice where they don't belong. There would be found several new orifices that did not exist while the person was mobile and they too would have unique instruments placed strategically inside them.

That does not mean that society should foot the actually more expensive bill for killing them, not under the current system.

 

[freeandfun1]

Truthfully now. Do you really think that the Justice system is, and should be, a tool for individuals to get revenge?

In certain instances, yes. Furthermore, isn't that the entire point of the legal system (well, it was until the libs started screaming for "rehabilitation" which rarely workds)?

 

[Shattered]

That does not mean that society should foot the actually more expensive bill for killing them, not under the current system.

Repeat after me: "Bullets are cheap. Bullets are cheap."

There are just some people that aren't fit to live.

 

[Bonnie]

Gabrielle

Similarly, there is a school of thought that you do not have sustainable human life until several months into gestation. You may not agree with it, but that does not mean it is not plausible.

My God is truly the God of ALL people. Which includes females, gays, lesbians, liberals, radicals, non-whites, non-Americans and even those with different religious preferences that you don't understand.

So your God thinks it's okay to rip a baby apart and throw it in a dumpster because it's only 12 weeks old as opposed to say 24 weeks????

 

[no1tovote4]

In certain instances, yes. Furthermore, isn't that the entire point of the legal system (well, it was until the libs started screaming for "rehabilitation" which rarely workds)?

No, it was never meant for personal retribution. This is why there is a Cruel and Unusual clause in the Constitution. While the justice system is for punishing criminals, at least originally so, they knew that those in power could use the system for personal retribution and even persecution and therefore protections were placed on the system.

 

[no1tovote4]

Repeat after me: "Bullets are cheap. Bullets are cheap."

There are just some people that aren't fit to live.

The problem with this is that they are due Appeals, while they are appealing they get special accomodations in Prison. Shoot, in California alone there are over 400 Death Row Inmates, while they have killed exactly 1 in the last 20 years. This costs us. It will cost Californians more, but they get appeals in Federal courts as well and it costs all of us. And in every case it ends up costing far more than it would cost to simply give them a tiny cell a 40 Watt Bulb and the Holy Book of their choosing.

While I did give the qualifier, "under the current system", some of that system should not be changed. Too often people are released for wrongful convictions for us to be so sure that as soon as people are convicted they should be shot.

I also think that Death is often too kind to some of these people. Putting them in a small cell and never letting them out again until they are stiff and partially rotted is far more convincingly punishment to me than simply putting them to sleep in the same manner we give animals "dignified" deaths.

 

[mattskramer]

Truthfully, imagine what would you do if your little sweet 4 year old girl was raped repeatedly, beaten profusely, and then buried alive in a plastic bag?

Tell me now that you would be willing to let the scumbag spend the rest of his life in a cozy cell with 3 squares a day on your tax dollar? Plus maybe even being allowed out free on parole after a number of years?

You still with the liberal program?

If there were a person accused of the crime, and if such a person really did the crime, I would want him to be executed. Unfortunately, many people sentenced to death row are eventually released due to irrefutable proof that they didn’t commit the crime for which they were convicted. I would rather have 1 million people who were convicted of murder spend life in a harsh prison environment than execute a truly innocent person.

I never said that I would be willing to let the scumbag spend the rest of his life in a cozy cell with 3 squares a day on my tax dollar. I think that the prisons sentences resemble “paid vacations” to too much of a degree. I would remove televisions, elective surgeries, and many similar conveniences that convicts enjoy. I would also put convicts to work so they could, to a small degree, earn some of their keep.

In summary, I would do what I could to have convicts pose as small a tax burden as practically possible without taking the risk of executing an someone who is not guilty.

 

[dmp]

welcome back, matt.