CDZ America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

[Tom Paine 1949]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

 

[MarcATL]

See the Bush II administration for that blueprint OP.

 

[flacaltenn]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

You and I SHOULD worry about Authoritarian tendencies in our govt, but I'm quite sure that both YOU and the Atlantic dont share my zeal for liberty and freedom. WANNABEE Authoritarians are all around us.. The kind that make a public speech by teleconference from a Resort in Mehico while telling his CONSTITUENTS to "STAY AT HOME" -- without even flinching or smurking..

And neither you or the Atlantic have given me ANY scary facts or evidence of Trump's "authoritarian" bent that resonate with me. I'm more concerned about a Biden Admin taking POWER FROM THE STATES to run/choose their Covid intervention schemes, then the laissez faire approach where Trump let the many states run/chose their own ways. We LEARNED A LOT about "authoritarianism" from that brilliant experiment -- didn't we?

If ya want to discuss nightmare scenarios about Authoritarianism with folks who AREN'T big emotional readers of The Atlantic -- you're gonna have to allow that the THREAT is not Trump per se. And that it can come quickly from "the other side" as well.

You'll see more attacks on ACTUAL freedoms and liberties in the next 4 years WITHOUT Trump.. We can bet on that..

 

[Dogmaphobe]

I think I see the problem, here.

You haven't the foggiest, fucking clue what the word "authoritarian" even means.

 

[White 6]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

I knew he was inept, knew nothing of government, and of bad character before 2016 election and did not vote for him, but feared Hillary could turn out to be the worst of the two, as she was smart, knew government well, had all the inside connections, was an even better liar than he and equally out for herself. I am thankful, we will probably never know which one truly had the potential to be worse for the country. Just my opinion.

 

[evenflow1969]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

Ya,be scared of some one with brains trying Trump crap. We were fortunate to escape the last four years . A guy with talent and brains would be way more destructive. Ya the future is scary in that regard. Hopefully no one can mimick Trump correctly. I would like to think Trump had some sort of X factor that can not be mimicked. We probably are not that lucky. That all being said there has to be root cause that created the situation that allowed this to happen. The anger is real in his supporters. I wonder where it comes from? Maybe if we address this anger we can prevent such a thing in the future.

 

[OldLady]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

Beau from the Fifth Column talked about this shortly after the election. He says it a lot better than I could. It's worth the 8 minutes.

Trump's supporters need to understand what went on here, what moves he made to establish authoritarian rule. It wasn't okay, it won't be okay the next time, and at least in some people's opinions we do need to investigate and lay bare all the small steps he took, and we allowed him to get away with, that created the monster the country is dealing with now.

Password Protected Site

thefifthcolumnnews.com

 

[OldLady]

I think some people are letting their dislike of the left to get in the way of seeing this clearly. We nearly lost our VOTE, for godssakes. Trump tried taking clever end runs around the Constitution in his four years by using the courts, abused his power by bullying, threatening others' political futures and going behind the scenes to do good old fashioned arm twisting like Ukraine, in order to run things HIS way. And then built a case built on nothing to keep himself in office when he failed.

I don't want to hear about Democrats; I want to hear what you all plan to do the next time a charismatic power hungry player runs for the Presidency. Because you're right--it could very well be a Democrat next time. Even a Libertarian or an Independent. Party doesn't play into it.

If you all could possibly peel away from party politics and hollow rhetoric for a few minutes, it would be appreciated. This is bigger than that, imo.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

Beau from the Fifth Column talked about this shortly after the election. He says it a lot better than I could. It's worth the 8 minutes.

Trump's supporters need to understand what went on here, what moves he made to establish authoritarian rule. It wasn't okay, it won't be okay the next time, and at least in some people's opinions we do need to investigate and lay bare all the small steps he took, and we allowed him to get away with, that created the monster the country is dealing with now.

Password Protected Site

thefifthcolumnnews.com

So, let's see here -- Trump has been advocating a balanced approach to covid that respects people's right to earn a living,, while democrats have been stomping their jack boots on the necks of small business in an attempt to exterminate them.

You are saying it is TRUMP who is the authoritarian, here? That word does not mean what you think it means.

 

[White 6]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

Beau from the Fifth Column talked about this shortly after the election. He says it a lot better than I could. It's worth the 8 minutes.

Trump's supporters need to understand what went on here, what moves he made to establish authoritarian rule. It wasn't okay, it won't be okay the next time, and at least in some people's opinions we do need to investigate and lay bare all the small steps he took, and we allowed him to get away with, that created the monster the country is dealing with now.

Password Protected Site

thefifthcolumnnews.com

Thanks for that. Just added The Fifth Column to my bookmarks.

 

[DustyInfinity]

I think some people are letting their dislike of the left to get in the way of seeing this clearly. We nearly lost our VOTE, for godssakes. Trump tried taking clever end runs around the Constitution in his four years by using the courts, abused his power by bullying, threatening others' political futures and going behind the scenes to do good old fashioned arm twisting like Ukraine, in order to run things HIS way. And then built a case built on nothing to keep himself in office when he failed.

I don't want to hear about Democrats; I want to hear what you all plan to do the next time a charismatic power hungry player runs for the Presidency. Because you're right--it could very well be a Democrat next time. Even a Libertarian or an Independent. Party doesn't play into it.

If you all could possibly peel away from party politics and hollow rhetoric for a few minutes, it would be appreciated. This is bigger than that, imo.

Hey Oldlady, I respectfully disagree. Trump's policies gave more power to the dwindling middle class. Deregulation(on a grand scale) and tax cuts were beneficial to the peons and non-ruling class. You don't want me to talk about the democrats, fine. Trump did try to do things his way, and he did so legally. He went around the people who were out to destroy him to try to create immigration reform, as one example. Why democrats didn't want to stop unhindered border crossings is obvious. Trump tried to go around Pelosi in the House, but he never attacked the Constitution or the American Public. He never went after citizens for political purposes, or used the government to attack people or groups. I do not think it is Authoritarian when people have more economic and regulatory freedom. Again, you don't want to discuss democrats, but if you did, I think you would see the true face of abusive government power.

 

[OldLady]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

Beau from the Fifth Column talked about this shortly after the election. He says it a lot better than I could. It's worth the 8 minutes.

Trump's supporters need to understand what went on here, what moves he made to establish authoritarian rule. It wasn't okay, it won't be okay the next time, and at least in some people's opinions we do need to investigate and lay bare all the small steps he took, and we allowed him to get away with, that created the monster the country is dealing with now.

Password Protected Site

thefifthcolumnnews.com

So, let's see here -- Trump has been advocating a balanced approach to covid that respects people's right to earn a living,, while democrats have been stomping their jack boots on the necks of small business in an attempt to exterminate them.

You are saying it is TRUMP who is the authoritarian, here? That word does not mean what you think it means.

I do know what it means.
Authoritarianism is a form of government characterized by the rejection of political plurality, the use of a strong central power to preserve the political status quo, and reductions in the rule of law, separation of powers, and democratic voting.

the rejection of political plurality
I see this in the right wing's belief that the left can do no right. They are utterly rejected as communists, even, which is ridiculous but apparentlly believed. There is only one view worth listening to, and that is the right. No plurality allowed.

use of a strong central power to preserve the political status quo,
such as sending in the military and government forces to 'assist' cities who did not ask for it to quell their protests?

reductions in ...democratic voting.
Like what is happening right now, when with no evidence but plenty of propaganda and lawyers to put important sounding but meaningless arguments before the courts, Trump is trying to throw away the votes of millions of Americans in order to stay in power?? To subvert the Electoral College and strong arm legislators to assist in denying millions of votes?

No. I know what it means, and Trump wasn't very good at it because he pissed off too many people. But he won't be the last.

This is not about state health officials and leaders who are trying to slow the spread of a disabling and deadly virus, the likes which we haven't seen in 100 years.

Like I said, I don't want to hear what about the Democrats. You do that all day long in other forums. Try thinking along the lines of what you will do about the next snake oil salesman who tries this.

 

[DustyInfinity]

I defend the basic view of this article. If you disagree, explain why. I am especially interested in debating liberal views, but of course all are welcome to express their opinions.

Trump was ineffective ... A future strongman won’t be...

Trump is just one more example of the many populists on the right who have risen to power around the world.... But there’s one key difference between Trump and everyone else.... The others are all talented politicians who win elections again and again....

Trump is not good at his job. He doesn’t even seem to like it much. He is too undisciplined and thin-skinned to be effective at politics over a sustained period, which involves winning repeated elections....

The situation is ... perfect ... for a talented politician to run on Trumpism in 2024. A person without the eager Twitter fingers and greedy hotel chains, someone with a penchant for governing rather than golf. An individual who does not irritate everyone who doesn’t already like him.... Someone who isn’t on tape boasting about assaulting women, and who says the right things about military veterans. Someone who can send appropriate condolences about senators who die, instead of angering their state’s voters, as Trump did, perhaps to his detriment, in Arizona. A norm-subverting strongman who can create a durable majority and keep his coalition together to win more elections....

Make no mistake: The attempt to harness Trumpism — without Trump, but with calculated, refined, and smarter political talent — is coming. And it won’t be easy to make the next Trumpist a one-term president.

America’s Next Authoritarian Will Be Much More Competent

Beau from the Fifth Column talked about this shortly after the election. He says it a lot better than I could. It's worth the 8 minutes.

Trump's supporters need to understand what went on here, what moves he made to establish authoritarian rule. It wasn't okay, it won't be okay the next time, and at least in some people's opinions we do need to investigate and lay bare all the small steps he took, and we allowed him to get away with, that created the monster the country is dealing with now.

Password Protected Site

thefifthcolumnnews.com

So, let's see here -- Trump has been advocating a balanced approach to covid that respects people's right to earn a living,, while democrats have been stomping their jack boots on the necks of small business in an attempt to exterminate them.

You are saying it is TRUMP who is the authoritarian, here? That word does not mean what you think it means.

I do know what it means.
Authoritarianism is a form of government characterized by the rejection of political plurality, the use of a strong central power to preserve the political status quo, and reductions in the rule of law, separation of powers, and democratic voting.

the rejection of political plurality
I see this in the right wing's belief that the left can do no right. They are utterly rejected as communists, even, which is ridiculous but apparentlly believed. There is only one view worth listening to, and that is the right. No plurality allowed.

use of a strong central power to preserve the political status quo,
such as sending in the military and government forces to 'assist' cities who did not ask for it to quell their protests?

reductions in ...democratic voting.
Like what is happening right now, when with no evidence but plenty of propaganda and lawyers to put important sounding but meaningless arguments before the courts, Trump is trying to throw away the votes of millions of Americans in order to stay in power?? To subvert the Electoral College and strong arm legislators to assist in denying millions of votes?

No. I know what it means, and Trump wasn't very good at it because he pissed off too many people. But he won't be the last.

This is not about state health officials and leaders who are trying to slow the spread of a disabling and deadly virus, the likes which we haven't seen in 100 years.

Like I said, I don't want to hear what about the Democrats. You do that all day long in other forums. Try thinking along the lines of what you will do about the next snake oil salesman who tries this.

The rejection of political plurality - It takes two sides to fight. It isn't like the left isn't trying to wipe out the Republican Party.

As for use of government power, I think Trump showed great restraint when the left burned down their own cities. I thought it was sad, but Trump realized it was a trap for the left to call him a nazi.

As for the election mess, I can see how you think it is a legal trick, but please look at the other side. There are posters on this forum who have stated that they do not care if the election was fraudulant as long as Biden wins. They are against ANY effort to look for ANY election misconduct. I would hate for it to be a legal trick, but at the same time, I NEED to know that elections are not fixed. I don't want to be a puppet of the ruling class, and it is already pretty clear how these people think of us little people.

 

[OldLady]

Trump did try to do things his way, and he did so legally.

Ukraine was not legal. Many of his EO'S were shot down as unconstitutional. What he is doing now with undermining the vote is contrary to the laws of the states and the Constitution. Fortunately, the checks and balances that were established for just such a scenario, worked. This time.

It is very true that the central government has grown exponentially in power and intrusiveness into our lives. Some of it, like EPA regulations and the FDA make sense, in theory. Maybe they go too far sometimes, that's for the people to work out. But it is the very fact that both the federal government and the office of the Presidency now hold so much power that attracts would be authoritarians. Maybe some extra braking mechanisms need to be considered to prevent such a move in the future.

I appreciate you thinking about this seriously.

 

[DustyInfinity]

Trump did try to do things his way, and he did so legally.

Ukraine was not legal. Many of his EO'S were shot down as unconstitutional. What he is doing now with undermining the vote is contrary to the laws of the states and the Constitution. Fortunately, the checks and balances that were established for just such a scenario, worked. This time.

It is very true that the central government has grown exponentially in power and intrusiveness into our lives. Some of it, like EPA regulations and the FDA make sense, in theory. Maybe they go too far sometimes, that's for the people to work out. But it is the very fact that both the federal government and the office of the Presidency now hold so much power that attracts would be authoritarians. Maybe some extra braking mechanisms need to be considered to prevent such a move in the future.

I appreciate you thinking about this seriously.

Does it not concern you that LT Colonel Vindman was considered a heroic whislteblower, while all of the voter election misconduct affidavits are being dismissed out of hand or automatically being labeled debunked. I would want the press to at least be a little curious about election integrity. Especially with all the ruthless bull both sides have pulled for the last decade. I don't see how looking into possible misconduct violates the Constitution. I'll agree to disagree about Ukraine. There was no transactional demand in looking into Biden's potential abuse in that country. Again, I do not see a threat at looking for or addressing potential misconduct. EO's have been around for a long time, and I can't say I'm thrilled about them, but again, the practice is not authoritarian or a threat to the Constitution. Under Trump, people have had more freedoms and choices as opposed to having choices taken away. To me that makes him the farthest thing from a dictator. You may not like his policies, but he has not targeted the public on either side, or taken away any freedoms whatsoever. As you said the government is continually growing in power, and I fear the ruling class is laughing at us and buying summer homes and yachts.

 

[flacaltenn]

I think some people are letting their dislike of the left to get in the way of seeing this clearly. We nearly lost our VOTE, for godssakes. Trump tried taking clever end runs around the Constitution in his four years by using the courts, abused his power by bullying, threatening others' political futures and going behind the scenes to do good old fashioned arm twisting like Ukraine, in order to run things HIS way. And then built a case built on nothing to keep himself in office when he failed.

I don't want to hear about Democrats; I want to hear what you all plan to do the next time a charismatic power hungry player runs for the Presidency. Because you're right--it could very well be a Democrat next time. Even a Libertarian or an Independent. Party doesn't play into it.

If you all could possibly peel away from party politics and hollow rhetoric for a few minutes, it would be appreciated. This is bigger than that, imo.

What Civil Liberties or Rights did you lose under Authoritarian Trump?? Cut to the chase here. Aint goin to some guys' site hawking tee shirts and mugs.. What president HASN'T attempted "end arounds" to the limited power of the Chief Exec?? Have you forgotten "well well well I I I still got a pen and THIS PHONE"???

How did you "nearly lose your vote"? We nearly had the Democrats with help from a crooked FBI try to FRAME Trumps campaign and pursued an "UNDOING of the 2016 election" for four whole years.

Presidents DO get to "run things their way" and twist arms.. Well maybe not humble Jimmy Carter.. LOL.....

 

[flacaltenn]

Ukraine was not legal. Many of his EO'S were shot down as unconstitutional. What he is doing now with undermining the vote is contrary to the laws of the states and the Constitution. Fortunately, the checks and balances that were established for just such a scenario, worked. This time.

What's happening NOW post election aftermath is NOT "authoritarian".. THere was MASS DISREGARD for trivial little crap like State and Federal Constitutions by the Democrats and their partisans in govt to UNLAWFULLY ACTUALLY CHANGE election law just prior to the election.. This we KNOW happened. And it just might have resulted in NULLIFYING the votes of 1/2 of this country..

Finding OUT -- is not any kind of Authoritarian..

 

[flacaltenn]

Trump did try to do things his way, and he did so legally.

Ukraine was not legal. Many of his EO'S were shot down as unconstitutional. What he is doing now with undermining the vote is contrary to the laws of the states and the Constitution. Fortunately, the checks and balances that were established for just such a scenario, worked. This time.

It is very true that the central government has grown exponentially in power and intrusiveness into our lives. Some of it, like EPA regulations and the FDA make sense, in theory. Maybe they go too far sometimes, that's for the people to work out. But it is the very fact that both the federal government and the office of the Presidency now hold so much power that attracts would be authoritarians. Maybe some extra braking mechanisms need to be considered to prevent such a move in the future.

I appreciate you thinking about this seriously.

Does it not concern you that LT Colonel Vindman was considered a heroic whislteblower, while all of the voter election misconduct affidavits are being dismissed out of hand or automatically being labeled debunked. I would want the press to at least be a little curious about election integrity. Especially with all the ruthless bull both sides have pulled for the last decade. I don't see how looking into possible misconduct violates the Constitution. I'll agree to disagree about Ukraine. There was no transactional demand in looking into Biden's potential abuse in that country. Again, I do not see a threat at looking for or addressing potential misconduct. EO's have been around for a long time, and I can't say I'm thrilled about them, but again, the practice is not authoritarian or a threat to the Constitution. Under Trump, people have had more freedoms and choices as opposed to having choices taken away. To me that makes him the farthest thing from a dictator. You may not like his policies, but he has not targeted the public on either side, or taken away any freedoms whatsoever. As you said the government is continually growing in power, and I fear the ruling class is laughing at us and buying summer homes and yachts.

I got my 60W incandescent bulbs back under dictator Trump.. Best present ever.. My house looks better inside and out now..

In 4 more years of his totalitarian rule I might have gotten a washer/dryer that ACTUALLY works, A heat pump that I can buy that doesn't crap out below 40 degrees and MAYBE -- a toilet I wouldn't need to flush 2 or 3 times..

 

[Mindful]

I think some people are letting their dislike of the left to get in the way of seeing this clearly. We nearly lost our VOTE, for godssakes. Trump tried taking clever end runs around the Constitution in his four years by using the courts, abused his power by bullying, threatening others' political futures and going behind the scenes to do good old fashioned arm twisting like Ukraine, in order to run things HIS way. And then built a case built on nothing to keep himself in office when he failed.

I don't want to hear about Democrats; I want to hear what you all plan to do the next time a charismatic power hungry player runs for the Presidency. Because you're right--it could very well be a Democrat next time. Even a Libertarian or an Independent. Party doesn't play into it.

If you all could possibly peel away from party politics and hollow rhetoric for a few minutes, it would be appreciated. This is bigger than that, imo.

What Civil Liberties or Rights did you lose under Authoritarian Trump?? Cut to the chase here. Aint goin to some guys' site hawking tee shirts and mugs.. What president HASN'T attempted "end arounds" to the limited power of the Chief Exec?? Have you forgotten "well well well I I I still got a pen and THIS PHONE"???

How did you "nearly lose your vote"? We nearly had the Democrats with help from a crooked FBI try to FRAME Trumps campaign and pursued an "UNDOING of the 2016 election" for four whole years.

Presidents DO get to "run things their way" and twist arms.. Well maybe not humble Jimmy Carter.. LOL.....

Flacaltenn.

Worth watching.

 

[flacaltenn]

the rejection of political plurality
I see this in the right wing's belief that the left can do no right. They are utterly rejected as communists, even, which is ridiculous but apparentlly believed. There is only one view worth listening to, and that is the right. No plurality allowed.

I'm a big "political spectrum" watcher.. It's clear the left has moved MUCH farther than the right on closing down individual rights and freedoms to choose in the past 10 years. Bernie "Honeymoon in Moscow - supporting every Communist regime even AFTER they Failed" Sanders made this a "selling point" for avoiding "policy discussions".. And you had 12 candidates for the Dem Presidency ALL supporting his views and movement. It's NOT "ridiculous"..,

use of a strong central power to preserve the political status quo,
such as sending in the military and government forces to 'assist' cities who did not ask for it to quell their protests?

No active military used. And it was used sparingly in defending FEDERAL buildings and FEDERAL sites that were purposely NOT defended by local yahoos all trying to out-left themselves.

Eventually as the election drew near the carnage wasn't a great trade-off for FORCING Trump's hand and places like Kenosha, came to their senses and CALLED in the Nat Guard on their own..

reductions in ...democratic voting.
Like what is happening right now, when with no evidence but plenty of propaganda and lawyers to put important sounding but meaningless arguments before the courts, Trump is trying to throw away the votes of millions of Americans in order to stay in power?? To subvert the Electoral College and strong arm legislators to assist in denying millions of votes?

What's happening now SHOULD HAVE HAPPEN prior to election.. The Texas suit is completely correct. The 4 states that mattered all had elements of their EXECUTIVE BRANCH usurping the power to MAKE election law in COMPLETE AND UTTER DISREGARD for their State and Federal Constitutions which specifically states that the StateHouses are the ONLY bodies to MAKE election law.,. You have rogue courts -- particularly in Pennsylvania that IGNORED the law for absentee ballots and WIPED OUT all of the "chain of custody" for mail-in voting. They declared that NO SIGNATURE validation was required on the returns.. Lengthened the "date certain" for reciept of ballots and at the same time -- even ditched the requirement for a postmark with a date.

THEN this same rogue suggested that that LOCALLY -- precincts COULD "peek" at the mail-ins -- if they want some number of days AHEAD OF THE LAW -- and offer voters the chance to "heal their ballots".. But NEVER stated that EVERY PRECINCT had to do this in DIRECT CONFLICT with the "Equal Protection Clause" of the US Constitution.. And you and the ones NOT FOLLOWING any of this may not be responsible for NOT knowing any of this - because the MEDIA has decided -- like the Democrat advocacy group they have become to not ALLOW any of what what I just told to be DISCUSSED anywhere on ALL their platforms.. Thanks to USMB -- we STILL FIGHT for free expression and you'll hear it HERE for maybe the 1st time..

You CAN NOT BE A DICTATOR -- until you control the MEDIA and the GUNS...