Allen West is a disgrace.

[digger]

What you got wrong, is a thing called "Duty". You don't know the meaning of the word, of course, but some of us do. Get this straight; soldiers don't start wars; none of us got to pick and choose which wars we would or would not fight. We took an oath, and we obeyed it, because that is what soldiers do; they trust their superiors to make the right choices for them, and then they live (and die) according to those choices. It does not become a soldier (officers included) to question the order of a superior unless the order is flagrantly and unquestionably unlawful on its face. Anything else, is obeyed now, and reported later.

See, I don't trust the government. I'll make my own decision about whether a war is worth fighting or not. I understand that once i sign up, I do what I'm told because that's how you stay organized. Mindless group think is a necessary evil of war. But that's no reason to glorify mindless group think.

 

[Wicked Jester]

Jroc and Jester are not responding to the points that they disagree with. They describe the point by saying what ideological framework they believe it falls under. Then they pick other thoughts that they believe fall under the same ideological framework. Then they attack their straw men, and high five each other.

I'll give it to you, Gadfly. I don't agree with you on a lot of things. But at least you're having a real conversation.

You are an idiot, who has done nothing but insult those of us who have served.....You deserve no response other than to be constantly reminded that you' are a left wing elitist lil' ****, who is as spineless as they come.

You have completely lied on a number of subjects. You have nothing to offer but your typical far left wing spoonfed drivel, that lends nothing, nor even resembles an original thought.

Basically, you are the epitomy of a troll, nothing more!

 

[digger]

I could have sworn that we left Vietnam after the Tet offensive. That the US embassy was evacuating by helicopter while the Viet Cong were on the outskirts of Saigon.

I thought that the left spent 5 years rioting trying to end the war (didn't really get to rioting until after it had been going on for a while). But Democratic and Republican presidents continued to escalate the war for a decade.

 

[mudwhistle]

I'm not gonna criticize somebody who took the initiative and mind-fucked the enemy. I especially take umrage at anyone who ignores the full story while defending our enemies.

MikeK and you have vastly different enemies. His allies are your enemies, as you and all of the middle class (bourgeoisie) are his enemy.

Bourgeoisie......?

Thanks for the input comrade.

You forgot to talk about Cabals, workers uniting, and adhering to and improving the system of regional autonomy by ethnic minorities, so as to consolidate and develop socialist relations among different ethnic groups based on equality, solidarity, mutual assistance and harmony and shit.

Поцелуйте мою заднюю сторону (Kiss my ass)


Sorry, when I start hearing commie BS I start pinging.

 

[TheBrain]

I have some special Asian friends who say that Vietnam was way worse than Iraq, and my grandpa told me about watching the Zona sink in the Pacific in 41, and swears that was the worst war ever, so I don't think we can sit back and judge what people went through in a war if we didn't participate in that war ourselves.

 

[mudwhistle]

I have some special Asian friends who say that Vietnam was way worse than Iraq, and my grandpa told me about watching the Zona sink in the Pacific in 41, and swears that was the worst war ever, so I don't think we can sit back and judge what people went through in a war if we didn't participate in that war ourselves.

I don't think it matters which was worse.

Sometimes Vietnam was bad, and sometimes not so bad.

Iraq was bad, not so may died, but everyone still has scars if they saw action.

I'm not gonna argue about which war was more screwed up.

In my opinion Iwo Jima was the worst battle. All others were a cake-walk in comparison.

 

[TheBrain]

I have some special Asian friends who say that Vietnam was way worse than Iraq, and my grandpa told me about watching the Zona sink in the Pacific in 41, and swears that was the worst war ever, so I don't think we can sit back and judge what people went through in a war if we didn't participate in that war ourselves.

I don't think it matters which was worse.

Sometimes Vietnam was bad, and sometimes not so bad.

Iraq was bad, not so may died, but everyone still has scars if they saw action.

I'm not gonna argue about which war was more screwed up.

In my opinion Iwo Jima was the worst battle. All others were a cake-walk in comparison.

that would be so hard to say. Is it Midway where more servicemen were killed by sharks than by enemy fire? Bloodiest battle in history? Maybe the battle for Stalingrad in '43. But I would PROBABLY say Gettysburg.

 

[Uncensored2008]

How can that be? I am as middle class as it gets.

Yet you support and promote that which would destroy the middle in favor of a tiny elite ruling an vast underclass.

My enemies are the brainwashed bottom-feeders who rally in defense of the super-rich,

Your enemies are those who have jobs and families and seek the freedom to live their lives unmolested by a ruling elite. Your enemies are those who reject fascism in the form of well connected looters in Kaiser and Blue Cross having the full power of implied force through the federal government to force a captive populace to buy their product.

Your enemies are those who seek to keep more of the fruits of their labor rather than to have it confiscated for the benefit of government workers gorging at the public trough and then retiring after twenty years with full salary and benefits.

My allies are those with the intelligence to know right from wrong and are not afraid to speak their minds.

Your allies are terrorists and fascists.

 

[Uncensored2008]

See, I don't trust the government.

Then you are simply stupid? After all, you advocate for more and more government control ever greater parts of the lives of the subjects.

I'll make my own decision about whether a war is worth fighting or not.

Lucky for you that we have a volunteer military. Were it up to the fascist party you promote, that would not be the case.

Mindless group think is a necessary evil of war.

Mindless group think is a necessary aspect of the fascist encroachment of Obamacare.

But that's no reason to glorify mindless group think.

Indeed.

 

[bodecea]

How can that be? I am as middle class as it gets.

Yet you support and promote that which would destroy the middle in favor of a tiny elite ruling an vast underclass.

My enemies are the brainwashed bottom-feeders who rally in defense of the super-rich,

Your enemies are those who have jobs and families and seek the freedom to live their lives unmolested by a ruling elite. Your enemies are those who reject fascism in the form of well connected looters in Kaiser and Blue Cross having the full power of implied force through the federal government to force a captive populace to buy their product.

Your enemies are those who seek to keep more of the fruits of their labor rather than to have it confiscated for the benefit of government workers gorging at the public trough and then retiring after twenty years with full salary and benefits.

My allies are those with the intelligence to know right from wrong and are not afraid to speak their minds.

Your allies are terrorists and fascists.

I see you are back to telling people what they think again.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Bourgeoisie......?

Thanks for the input comrade.

I believe you have misinterpreted my post.

MikeK and the new left are indeed dedicated to the destruction of the middle class, which has been the agenda of the old left since the days of Marx.

Notice that when the attacks are made on the "rich," they are aimed at those making $250k or so a year. Oprah, Michael Moore, Afflec and the rest of the truly wealthy left are not the target - it is the middle, it has always been the middle.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I see you are back to telling people what they think again.

I see you're back to mindlessly flinging feces like the feral baboon that you are...

 

[MikeK]

It doesn't matter the climate, the harsh reality of possible death around the next corner can be tough for some to deal with. Fear of the unknown is key in any war.

I'm not gonna criticize somebody who took the initiative and mind-fucked the enemy. I especially take umrage at anyone who ignores the full story while defending our enemies.

If you are military eligible and you truly believe "we" have "enemies" you should be under arms alongside your countrymen instead of going off about something you apparently have little understanding of.

We are not at war in Iraq and we never were. Iraq was a relatively defenseless sovereign nation which we attacked illegally and without provocation. The Iraqi people are not our enemies. We are their enemies. We invaded and occupied their country, they didn't invade ours. What the Bush Administration ("we") did was a categorical war crime facilitated by a deliberate and calculated lie.

My concern for right and wrong in this regard is the ultimate cost of doing things the wrong way -- such as those five cops in L.A. who beat the shit out of Rodney King learned the hard way. What Colonel West did might appeal to know-nothing, armchair troopers but it's exactly the kind of thing that incites retaliation.

By West's own admission the Iraqi police officer he brutalized was more than likely not guilty of anything. So while that police officer, along with all his relatives and friends, were not our "enemies" before you may rest assured they are now. As are the dozens of questionably detained prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison who were tortured and mistreated in a manner that reflects on all Americans, not just the ones who "took the initiative."

West is a grandstanding opportunist. The problem is others down the line will pay for his malfeasance.

 

[Jroc]

It doesn't matter the climate, the harsh reality of possible death around the next corner can be tough for some to deal with. Fear of the unknown is key in any war.

I'm not gonna criticize somebody who took the initiative and mind-fucked the enemy. I especially take umrage at anyone who ignores the full story while defending our enemies.

If you are military eligible and you truly believe "we" have "enemies" you should be under arms alongside your countrymen instead of going off about something you apparently have little understanding of.

We are not at war in Iraq and we never were. Iraq was a relatively defenseless sovereign nation which we attacked illegally and without provocation. The Iraqi people are not our enemies. We are their enemies. We invaded and occupied their country, they didn't invade ours. What the Bush Administration ("we") did was a categorical war crime facilitated by a deliberate and calculated lie.

My concern for right and wrong in this regard is the ultimate cost of doing things the wrong way -- such as those five cops in L.A. who beat the shit out of Rodney King learned the hard way. What Colonel West did might appeal to know-nothing, armchair troopers but it's exactly the kind of thing that incites retaliation.

By West's own admission the Iraqi police officer he brutalized was more than likely not guilty of anything. So while that police officer, along with all his relatives and friends, were not our "enemies" before you may rest assured they are now. As are the dozens of questionably detained prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison who were tortured and mistreated in a manner that reflects on all Americans, not just the ones who "took the initiative."

West is a grandstanding opportunist. The problem is others down the line will pay for his malfeasance.

Notice the left's desperate need to find fault with our country, our military, our police ECT. It's the only way they can justify their dislike of this country, they are truly pathetic. They are the bottom feeders who take all the benefits this country has to offer then turn around and sympathize with are enemies. Of course he would believe an Iraqi "police officer"over our own military personal. Millions and millions in Vietnam and Cambodia were slaughtered when we left Vietnam. Thank you leftist you must be proud.

 

[bodecea]

I see you are back to telling people what they think again.

I see you're back to mindlessly flinging feces like the feral baboon that you are...

Your animal fetish is showing again.

 

[IHBF]

Recognizing race as relevant in American society is not racist. Racism is a structural inequality in which certain people have more hardship and less opportunity. Those of us who perpetuate this are racists, and most of us do to a certain degree.

But, I am not racist, many white folks have said.
But racism's not just a thought in your head
It's the privilege we wield when we walk down the street
And don't have to fear each White cop that we meet
It's the power you're handed from the moment of birth
When you're told your pale skin is your measure of worth.
color blind is a code word for the problems not mine.
Because White folks have the privilege to say everything's fine
It's all the shit we never went through, all the pain we never felt
It's in this stacked deck of cards, and the hand we were dealt.

A White man who speeds past a Black man getting a ticket and does nothing to stop racial profiling is racist.

Being racist isn't about having racist thoughts. It's about participating in a racist structure, and benefiting from it, without doing anything to dismantle it.

With power come responsibility.

 

[SFC Ollie]

It doesn't matter the climate, the harsh reality of possible death around the next corner can be tough for some to deal with. Fear of the unknown is key in any war.

I'm not gonna criticize somebody who took the initiative and mind-fucked the enemy. I especially take umrage at anyone who ignores the full story while defending our enemies.

If you are military eligible and you truly believe "we" have "enemies" you should be under arms alongside your countrymen instead of going off about something you apparently have little understanding of.

We are not at war in Iraq and we never were. Iraq was a relatively defenseless sovereign nation which we attacked illegally and without provocation. The Iraqi people are not our enemies. We are their enemies. We invaded and occupied their country, they didn't invade ours. What the Bush Administration ("we") did was a categorical war crime facilitated by a deliberate and calculated lie.

My concern for right and wrong in this regard is the ultimate cost of doing things the wrong way -- such as those five cops in L.A. who beat the shit out of Rodney King learned the hard way. What Colonel West did might appeal to know-nothing, armchair troopers but it's exactly the kind of thing that incites retaliation.

By West's own admission the Iraqi police officer he brutalized was more than likely not guilty of anything. So while that police officer, along with all his relatives and friends, were not our "enemies" before you may rest assured they are now. As are the dozens of questionably detained prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison who were tortured and mistreated in a manner that reflects on all Americans, not just the ones who "took the initiative."

West is a grandstanding opportunist. The problem is others down the line will pay for his malfeasance.

You are a damned fool.

And LTC West never said any such thing. he said it was possible that he was wrong. Well it is possible that OJ is guilty too. But it's also possible that I can become President.... Do you understand the meaning of the word possible yet? It is possible that you could start using your brain.

 

[mudwhistle]

I have some special Asian friends who say that Vietnam was way worse than Iraq, and my grandpa told me about watching the Zona sink in the Pacific in 41, and swears that was the worst war ever, so I don't think we can sit back and judge what people went through in a war if we didn't participate in that war ourselves.

I don't think it matters which was worse.

Sometimes Vietnam was bad, and sometimes not so bad.

Iraq was bad, not so may died, but everyone still has scars if they saw action.

I'm not gonna argue about which war was more screwed up.

In my opinion Iwo Jima was the worst battle. All others were a cake-walk in comparison.

that would be so hard to say. Is it Midway where more servicemen were killed by sharks than by enemy fire? Bloodiest battle in history? Maybe the battle for Stalingrad in '43. But I would PROBABLY say Gettysburg.

Gettysburg,they all had their wool uniforms on and marched up the hill and got shot.

At Iwo Jima guys got blown to friggen bits.

You really need to read about it.

In Gettysburg the fighting was over in a day or two. Iwo Jima, it went on for over a month. The Marines were wearing rags, lack of water, constantly taking out firing positions, moving past them and being fired on from the positions by their replacements. 22,000 Japanese and 75,000 Marines. All but maybe 200 Japanese were killed, and 29,000 American casualties. The numbers of dead is not a proper measure if you want to consider the pure hellishness of the battles.

 

[SFC Ollie]

It is the same for all wars.


War is hell, but actual combat is a mother ******....

 

[mudwhistle]

Bourgeoisie......?

Thanks for the input comrade.

I believe you have misinterpreted my post.

MikeK and the new left are indeed dedicated to the destruction of the middle class, which has been the agenda of the old left since the days of Marx.

Notice that when the attacks are made on the "rich," they are aimed at those making $250k or so a year. Oprah, Michael Moore, Afflec and the rest of the truly wealthy left are not the target - it is the middle, it has always been the middle.

I did. Sorry. When someone uses the word Bourgeoisie or any of the other usual communist propaganda I see red.