All The News Anti-Palestinian Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss

[P F Tinmore]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Your silly slogans are a hoot. Just more unsubstantiated Islamist talking points.

Link?

Link to what? I didn't make the claim.

 

[Hollie]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Your silly slogans are a hoot. Just more unsubstantiated Islamist talking points.

Link?

Link to what? I didn't make the claim.

You didn't make your usual, nonsense, ''Israeli talking point'', claim?

That's odd, because you made that claim one page prior to this one?

Link?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

 

[toastman]

RE: All The News Anti-Palestinian Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
SUBTOPIC: Land THEFT Accusation
⁜→ MJB12741, et al,

BLUF: I do not understand this accusation about → "Israel first stole the Palestinian land" comment.

Is that when Israel first stole the Palestinian land I learned about on this board?

(QUESTION)

Please give me "ONE" absolute example of land theft so we can look at the elements of the alleged crime.

Most Respectfully,
R

You're joking, right? Israel has never legally acquired any land. Nobody has ever been able to prove otherwise.

Look up Land Day for one of many examples.

Israel claims that it won land in the 1948 war.
1) Israel did not win the 1948 war.
2) Acquiring land by conquest is illegal.

1948 Arab–Israeli War - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Result: Israeli victory .PALESTINIAN ARAB DEFEAT.
Israel succeeded it achieving its goals during the war. The Palestinians failed at theirs .
That is how you determine which side won a war.

I will now wait for you to provide a link saying otherwise .....

 

[P F Tinmore]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

You make a claim then duck.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

You make a claim then duck.

You claimed Israel took land from Palestinians.
Why don't you prove your claim?

 

[P F Tinmore]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

You make a claim then duck.

You claimed Israel took land from Palestinians.
Why don't you prove your claim?

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land at the point of a gun then claimed the land to be theirs. That is the well known history.

I can post links that you will not look at and tomorrow you will ask the same stupid questions.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

You make a claim then duck.

You claimed Israel took land from Palestinians.
Why don't you prove your claim?

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land at the point of a gun then claimed the land to be theirs. That is the well known history.

I can post links that you will not look at and tomorrow you will ask the same stupid questions.

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land

Why do you feel the Palestinians had any land?

I can post links that you will not look at

Another unsubstantiated terrorist talking point.

 

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Palestinian Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
SUBTOPIC: What is Legally Acquired Sovereign Territory?
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: IF Israel did not win a conflict, THEN the Arab Palestinian cannot logically claim that it acquired territory by conquest.

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

(COMMENT)

The Arab Palestinians had no control or sovereignty over any territory (at least prior to 2012). So, they lost nothing in the conflict. In fact, they rejected any participation in the establishment of self-governing institutions between the fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Treaties Israel formed with Egypt and Jordan.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

You make a claim then duck.

You claimed Israel took land from Palestinians.
Why don't you prove your claim?

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land at the point of a gun then claimed the land to be theirs. That is the well known history.

I can post links that you will not look at and tomorrow you will ask the same stupid questions.

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land

Why do you feel the Palestinians had any land?

I can post links that you will not look at

Another unsubstantiated terrorist talking point.

The land from the defunct Ottoman Empire was transferred to all of the new states in the area. I haven't seen any exception for Palestine. Why would you say that Palestine had no land when there is nothing to substantiate that?

 

[P F Tinmore]

IF Israel did not win a conflict, THEN the Arab Palestinian cannot logically claim that it acquired territory by conquest.

Even though there has been no victory in an ongoing conflict, Israel still holds the territory under military occupation. That occupation covers for settler colonialism.

 

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Palestinian Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
SUBTOPIC: What is Legally Acquired Sovereign Territory?
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: The contemporary recognition and associations...

◈ Article 1(2) UN Charter: "To develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples, and to take other appropriate measures to strengthen universal peace;"​

​

◈ Article 55 UN Charter: "With a view to the creation of conditions of stability and well-being which are necessary for peaceful and friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples, the United Nations shall promote:​

a. higher standards of living, full employment, and conditions of economic and social progress and development;​

b. solutions of international economic, social, health, and related problems; and international cultural and educational cooperation; and​

c. universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language, or religion."​

Self-Determination Theory (SDT) holds that an intrinsic motivation, defined as being a utilitarian effort, out of a nationalistic objective, is not in itself an illegal method of acquisition.

Self-Determination is a legal way to acquire territory?
Link?

(COMMENT)

There are THREE Attributes to "Self-Determination:"

• What is the Law?
• What is the basic Principles?
• What are the grounding concepts?

THE BINDING LAW:

Article 1 • International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights​

1. All peoples have the right of self-determination. By virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development.​

2. All peoples may, for their own ends, freely dispose of their natural wealth and resources without prejudice to any obligations arising out of international economic co-operation, based upon the principle of mutual benefit, and international law. In no case may a people be deprived of its own means of subsistence.​

3. The States Parties to the present Covenant, including those having responsibility for the administration of Non-Self-Governing and Trust Territories, shall promote the realization of the right of self-determination, and shall respect that right, in conformity with the provisions of the Charter of the United Nations.​

The principle of "Self-Determination" is an expression of the "Will of the People in a given Territory"

The concept of self-determination:

• It is a purely political principle concerning autonomy and could include the issues of statehood for ethnic or national groups. ​

• The "Right" is NOT absolute. ​

• The concept of self-determination has a political goal of promoting peace and stability.​

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Hollie]

∆ COUNTER-OBSERVATION: Assume for a moment that your observation that: "Israel did not win the 1948 war" is Sound and Valid. Then, of course, Israel did not acquire any land by "conquest" because it did not win any conflict.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

Even if Israel did win, (it didn't) It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

Israel did not win the 1948 war. I have posted the documents.

They kicked plenty of Arab ass though........

It wouldn't matter because Israel could not win Palestinian land from its neighbors. It was not their land to lose.

There was no Palestinian land.

There was no Palestinian land.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point. You people keep throwing shit out that you can't prove.

Another unsubstantiated Israeli talking point.

Substantiate your claim that there was.

You make a claim then duck.

You claimed Israel took land from Palestinians.
Why don't you prove your claim?

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land at the point of a gun then claimed the land to be theirs. That is the well known history.

I can post links that you will not look at and tomorrow you will ask the same stupid questions.

Israel drove the Palestinians off their land

Why do you feel the Palestinians had any land?

I can post links that you will not look at

Another unsubstantiated terrorist talking point.

The land from the defunct Ottoman Empire was transferred to all of the new states in the area. I haven't seen any exception for Palestine. Why would you say that Palestine had no land when there is nothing to substantiate that?

So... you’re back to your nonsensical “new states” meme.

Indeed, what are those “new states”?

link?

Indeed, you can’t identify those “new states” so I’m left to believe that you are spamming this thread and others with nonsense claims.

link?

 

[Hollie]

IF Israel did not win a conflict, THEN the Arab Palestinian cannot logically claim that it acquired territory by conquest.

Even though there has been no victory in an ongoing conflict, Israel still holds the territory under military occupation. That occupation covers for settler colonialism.

Even though Israel defended its borders in 1948 from Arab armies crossing the frontier in an effort to destroy the newly formed state, you claim that was not an Israeli victory.

Even though Israel defended its borders on subsequent occasions from Arab armies intending to destroy that state, you claim that is not an Israeli victory.

Indeed, even though you claim Israel holds territory under military occupation as a cover for settler colonialism, you can’t identify what Pally territory is held under military occupation.

link?


Indeed, what about those “new states” you refer to but can’t identify?

link?


Indeed, what territory is Israel settler..rer colonializing?

link?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Even though Israel defended its borders in 1948 from Arab armies crossing the frontier in an effort to destroy the newly formed state, you claim that was not an Israeli victory.

Interesting. Could you post a 1948 map of Israel?

That's a good girl.

 

[Hollie]

Even though Israel defended its borders in 1948 from Arab armies crossing the frontier in an effort to destroy the newly formed state, you claim that was not an Israeli victory.

Interesting. Could you post a 1948 map of Israel?

That's a good girl.

I could do that.

Could you post a map of those “new states” you claim were invented by the Treaty of Lausanne... you know... the “new states” you can’t identify?

link?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Even though Israel defended its borders in 1948 from Arab armies crossing the frontier in an effort to destroy the newly formed state, you claim that was not an Israeli victory.

Interesting. Could you post a 1948 map of Israel?

That's a good girl.

I could do that.

Could you post a map of those “new states” you claim were invented by the Treaty of Lausanne... you know... the “new states” you can’t identify?

link?

https://kms.jadaliyya.com/Images/357x383xo/ScreenShot2015-06-03at6.45.44AM.jpg

http://kms.jadaliyya.com/content/jad_export_content_images/var/www/sites/jadaliyya/content_images/fck_images/pursleypart2-1(3).jpg

 

[P F Tinmore]

Even though Israel defended its borders in 1948 from Arab armies crossing the frontier in an effort to destroy the newly formed state, you claim that was not an Israeli victory.

Interesting. Could you post a 1948 map of Israel?

That's a good girl.

I could do that.

Could you post a map of those “new states” you claim were invented by the Treaty of Lausanne... you know... the “new states” you can’t identify?

link?

I could do that.

So where is it?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The land from the defunct Ottoman Empire was transferred to all of the new states in the area.

Precisely. Including a Jewish homeland.

I haven't seen any exception for Palestine.

Well, Palestine wasn't a state, so no land was transferred to it.

Why would you say that Palestine had no land when there is nothing to substantiate that?

Why would you say that Palestine had any land when there is nothing to substantiate that?

 

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Palestinian Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: I've seen this argument before. It is a syllogistic fallacy! → it occurs in pro-Arab Palestinian arguments that attempt to affirm their conclusion (Israeli Borders are fictitious) uses a negative premise (there is no 1948 Map) to cement the implication. It is a pretty straight-forward implication.

Interesting. Could you post a 1948 map of Israel?

(COMMENT)

Many pro-Arab Palestinian Arguments come in the form of a continuous repetition (argumentum ad nauseam AKA: argumentum ad infinitum) → particularly on issues which been discussed extensively. Not very many Israeli-Palestinian Conflict Arguments lend themselves to proof by assertion.

The "no 1948 Map" Argument is a stunted variant of the repetitious argument we have all seen before → on the matter of contemporary treaties and agreements which establish recognized international boundaries. (ie Posting 631)

Most Respectfully,
R