After a felon serves their sentence

[sparky]

Incarceration is big business here, because a capitalist society has only capitalist solutions. Individual rights become a quaint detriment to those profiting from it.

For ex., get yourself employed in construction ,and witness God's special children revel in their moral turpitude ...

~S~

 

[CWayne]

i still go with no....all rights should not be restored... are guns a right or a ******* privilege ...i think voting is a right and owning a gun is a privilege

You would have that backward then. If the government has to give it to you -- voting -- then it is a privilege.

The government does not grant me the right to own a gun.

I agree that the right to own a gun is based on the right of defense is superior to any privilege government can give.
But I disagree that voting is a privilege created by government.
You create government by voting, so then voting has to precede government, and not be a privilege created by government.
And not letting a felon vote while still making him pay taxes is taxation without representation, and is illegal.
Every one has the inherent right to vote and be represented.

Then why did it take an act of government to permit voting for blacks and women?

I am not opposed to the right to vote for citizens (which is another segment of how government grants this right) but if we have to be honest about it,

I can own a gun and have the right to a gun, even in the absence of a government. The same cannot be said about voting. After all, why would you vote if you do not have a government?

 

[rightwinger]

Should they be able to own guns?
I ask because them being able to vote is all the rage now.
Shouldn't we be consistent in policy? Meaning all rights restored?

If they were nonviolent felons, they should be allowed to own guns

But voting is ok?

I never saw anyone try to rob a liquor store by threatening to vote

Perhaps, but here's the problem: When you allow felons to vote, it creates a new voting base. And what do politicians do to get votes? They pander to those bases.

Since most criminals are Democrats, the Democrat party will have platforms like reduction of prison sentences, making things legal that are currently illegal, making felonies misdemeanors, just pandering to the criminal element.

Criminals or ex-criminals having a power structure in our country via voting makes it more dangerous for all of us, and our children.

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Treating all convicts equally would be a bad move for public safety.

Convicts can apply to have their records expunged and presumably all their rights returned.

So some should be punished for their rest of their life? Even after their sentence is served?

The punishment was levied against them BEFORE they went to prison. It was their choice to do whatever they did. They can live with the consequences of that choice or apply for expungement.

This isn't difficult to grasp

 

[KissMy]

They should keep their voting rights & guns even while in prison. It will prevent government from jailing those who vote against them, plus prisoners can shoot to kill each-other off so I no longer have to pay for them.

 

[TNHarley]

Treating all convicts equally would be a bad move for public safety.

Convicts can apply to have their records expunged and presumably all their rights returned.

So some should be punished for their rest of their life? Even after their sentence is served?

The punishment was levied against them BEFORE they went to prison. It was their choice to do whatever they did. They can live with the consequences of that choice or apply for expungement.

This isn't difficult to grasp

So, yes. Thanks.

 

[Vastator]

Should they be able to own guns?
I ask because them being able to vote is all the rage now.
Shouldn't we be consistent in policy? Meaning all rights restored?

Yes.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

In fact by agreeing that the lenght of prison sentences should vary according to the crime a person implicitly agrees with the assertion that the rights of a citizen can be taken away and restored on a case by case bases.

The word is "basis",

Sorry about that. I was on my phone, which is set to Dutch and sometimes the autocorrect plays tricks on me.

He is a dick. Dont pay any attention to him. Typos happen.

You apparently don't know the difference in typos and word choice.

Auto correct sometimes picks it's own words. Some people also have a life and dont pay too much attention to grammar on an anonymous message board.

Some people with a life don't care to read the gibberish like you post either. It's called proofreading. It is a skill very important if you are going to write.

Enjoy!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Should they be able to own guns?
I ask because them being able to vote is all the rage now.
Shouldn't we be consistent in policy? Meaning all rights restored?

If they were nonviolent felons, they should be allowed to own guns

But voting is ok?

I never saw anyone try to rob a liquor store by threatening to vote

Perhaps, but here's the problem: When you allow felons to vote, it creates a new voting base. And what do politicians do to get votes? They pander to those bases.

Since most criminals are Democrats, the Democrat party will have platforms like reduction of prison sentences, making things legal that are currently illegal, making felonies misdemeanors, just pandering to the criminal element.

Criminals or ex-criminals having a power structure in our country via voting makes it more dangerous for all of us, and our children.

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

 

[rightwinger]

If they were nonviolent felons, they should be allowed to own guns

But voting is ok?

I never saw anyone try to rob a liquor store by threatening to vote

Perhaps, but here's the problem: When you allow felons to vote, it creates a new voting base. And what do politicians do to get votes? They pander to those bases.

Since most criminals are Democrats, the Democrat party will have platforms like reduction of prison sentences, making things legal that are currently illegal, making felonies misdemeanors, just pandering to the criminal element.

Criminals or ex-criminals having a power structure in our country via voting makes it more dangerous for all of us, and our children.

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Incarceration is big business here, because a capitalist society has only capitalist solutions. Individual rights become a quaint detriment to those profiting from it.

For ex., get yourself employed in construction ,and witness God's special children revel in their moral turpitude ...

~S~

I'm a construction worker, and I have no idea what point it is, if any, that you think you are making.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

But voting is ok?

I never saw anyone try to rob a liquor store by threatening to vote

Perhaps, but here's the problem: When you allow felons to vote, it creates a new voting base. And what do politicians do to get votes? They pander to those bases.

Since most criminals are Democrats, the Democrat party will have platforms like reduction of prison sentences, making things legal that are currently illegal, making felonies misdemeanors, just pandering to the criminal element.

Criminals or ex-criminals having a power structure in our country via voting makes it more dangerous for all of us, and our children.

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

They may work to make the prison sentences less severe.

Of course you don't see Democrats wanting to remove the prohibition of firearms for felons, because they don't vote yet. But if we had a federal law that allowed them to vote, that might change.

According to research, by the end of this year, we will have 23 million ex-cons in our society outside of prison. That's a hell of a voting block that Democrats could take advantage of. And also in the estimate, there are over 600,000 more released every year.

https://nypost.com/2016/04/04/statistical-proof-that-america-doesnt-care-about-ex-cons/

One of the reasons our crime is so bad in this country is because our prisons are not enough of a deterrent. By lessening the deterrent we have, or removing it altogether, that makes it more dangerous for the rest of us.

 

[forkup]

I never saw anyone try to rob a liquor store by threatening to vote

Perhaps, but here's the problem: When you allow felons to vote, it creates a new voting base. And what do politicians do to get votes? They pander to those bases.

Since most criminals are Democrats, the Democrat party will have platforms like reduction of prison sentences, making things legal that are currently illegal, making felonies misdemeanors, just pandering to the criminal element.

Criminals or ex-criminals having a power structure in our country via voting makes it more dangerous for all of us, and our children.

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

They may work to make the prison sentences less severe.

Of course you don't see Democrats wanting to remove the prohibition of firearms for felons, because they don't vote yet. But if we had a federal law that allowed them to vote, that might change.

According to research, by the end of this year, we will have 23 million ex-cons in our society outside of prison. That's a hell of a voting block that Democrats could take advantage of. And also in the estimate, there are over 600,000 more released every year.

https://nypost.com/2016/04/04/statistical-proof-that-america-doesnt-care-about-ex-cons/

One of the reasons our crime is so bad in this country is because our prisons are not enough of a deterrent. By lessening the deterrent we have, or removing it altogether, that makes it more dangerous for the rest of us.

BBC NEWS | In Depth
Seems to me the US is pretty big on deterring. How is it worked out for you so far?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Should they be able to own guns?
I ask because them being able to vote is all the rage now.
Shouldn't we be consistent in policy? Meaning all rights restored?

Yes.

Once they have served their debt to society they should be given full rights back.

If they cannot be trusted with those rights, then they should not be let out of prison.

I second that.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Perhaps, but here's the problem: When you allow felons to vote, it creates a new voting base. And what do politicians do to get votes? They pander to those bases.

Since most criminals are Democrats, the Democrat party will have platforms like reduction of prison sentences, making things legal that are currently illegal, making felonies misdemeanors, just pandering to the criminal element.

Criminals or ex-criminals having a power structure in our country via voting makes it more dangerous for all of us, and our children.

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

They may work to make the prison sentences less severe.

Of course you don't see Democrats wanting to remove the prohibition of firearms for felons, because they don't vote yet. But if we had a federal law that allowed them to vote, that might change.

According to research, by the end of this year, we will have 23 million ex-cons in our society outside of prison. That's a hell of a voting block that Democrats could take advantage of. And also in the estimate, there are over 600,000 more released every year.

https://nypost.com/2016/04/04/statistical-proof-that-america-doesnt-care-about-ex-cons/

One of the reasons our crime is so bad in this country is because our prisons are not enough of a deterrent. By lessening the deterrent we have, or removing it altogether, that makes it more dangerous for the rest of us.

BBC NEWS | In Depth
Seems to me the US is pretty big on deterring. How is it worked out for you so far?

I don't understand your post. We have the highest percentage of our population locked up behind bars. And as pointed out earlier, a large recidivism rate for ex-cons. It's like they have no fear of going back. I know a few ex-cons, and while they don't want to go back, it wouldn't be the end of the world if they did, therefore, not much of a deterrent.

 

[Bo Didleysquat]

Should they be able to own guns?
I ask because them being able to vote is all the rage now.
Shouldn't we be consistent in policy? Meaning all rights restored?

Anyone subject to the law should be able to vote, even while incarcerated. We should some day actually get to "one hominid one vote", and only humans rather than oligarchs and corporations should decide the outcome of what we refer to as free elections.

Don't worry, none that will come to pass. Recall the founders' vision, only white male members of the aristocracy were to have any representation at all.

 

[Bo Didleysquat]

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

They may work to make the prison sentences less severe.

Of course you don't see Democrats wanting to remove the prohibition of firearms for felons, because they don't vote yet. But if we had a federal law that allowed them to vote, that might change.

According to research, by the end of this year, we will have 23 million ex-cons in our society outside of prison. That's a hell of a voting block that Democrats could take advantage of. And also in the estimate, there are over 600,000 more released every year.

https://nypost.com/2016/04/04/statistical-proof-that-america-doesnt-care-about-ex-cons/

One of the reasons our crime is so bad in this country is because our prisons are not enough of a deterrent. By lessening the deterrent we have, or removing it altogether, that makes it more dangerous for the rest of us.

BBC NEWS | In Depth
Seems to me the US is pretty big on deterring. How is it worked out for you so far?

I don't understand your post. We have the highest percentage of our population locked up behind bars. And as pointed out earlier, a large recidivism rate for ex-cons. It's like they have no fear of going back. I know a few ex-cons, and while they don't want to go back, it wouldn't be the end of the world if they did, therefore, not much of a deterrent.

Private prisons rely and trade upon recidivism and leasing out enslaved labor which is legal once “convicted” to corporate shareholders.

 

[forkup]

Ridiculous theory

There will be no “felon voting base”
Any softening of violent criminal laws would create more negative votes than positive votes from felons wanting to make rape and robbery legal

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

They may work to make the prison sentences less severe.

Of course you don't see Democrats wanting to remove the prohibition of firearms for felons, because they don't vote yet. But if we had a federal law that allowed them to vote, that might change.

According to research, by the end of this year, we will have 23 million ex-cons in our society outside of prison. That's a hell of a voting block that Democrats could take advantage of. And also in the estimate, there are over 600,000 more released every year.

https://nypost.com/2016/04/04/statistical-proof-that-america-doesnt-care-about-ex-cons/

One of the reasons our crime is so bad in this country is because our prisons are not enough of a deterrent. By lessening the deterrent we have, or removing it altogether, that makes it more dangerous for the rest of us.

BBC NEWS | In Depth
Seems to me the US is pretty big on deterring. How is it worked out for you so far?

I don't understand your post. We have the highest percentage of our population locked up behind bars. And as pointed out earlier, a large recidivism rate for ex-cons. It's like they have no fear of going back. I know a few ex-cons, and while they don't want to go back, it wouldn't be the end of the world if they did, therefore, not much of a deterrent.

Your alternative would be what?
My point is that other countries, all of which have lower incarceration rates seem to have lower recidivism rates. Something that doesn't really jive with the statement that 'creating a bigger deterrent' is a solution. In fact, Norway which has one of the most humane prison system in the world has a recidivism rate of 20 percent.

 

[sparky]

Incarceration is big business here, because a capitalist society has only capitalist solutions. Individual rights become a quaint detriment to those profiting from it.

For ex., get yourself employed in construction ,and witness God's special children revel in their moral turpitude ...

~S~

I'm a construction worker, and I have no idea what point it is, if any, that you think you are making.

The penal industrial complex in our backyard turned SpringDing into a waiting room for ex-& rotating incarcerates and their families Bob, our lovely state's bloody do gooders grease landlords and employers to take them in & on

Because they're socialized labor, they come with a short leash , rights are traded for the convenience of prostituting them

Which is why this 2011 renovation had just as many parolees as mexican H1B's>

~S~

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Why do you think Trump let all those people out of prison early? That's right, he was trying to buy black votes.

Of course it would be a new voting base. You're a felon. You can't own a firearm. Places won't hire you for a job. But the Democrats come along, and promise if in power, they will make it legal for you to own a gun regardless of what you served time for. You mean to tell me you wouldn't vote for them? Or if they promise to create law that stops employers from discriminating against you because of your criminal record, you would vote Republican instead?

If you let felons vote, the Democrat party (and maybe even the Republicans) will start pandering to them. How would you like to be working at a shop where the guy next to you was in prison for murder, and he has a temper?

It's a terrible idea.

I don’t see Democrat’s advocating arming ex felons

What would happen if ex felons could vote? They would question why 2.5 million Americans are in prison, question the expansion of for profit prisons, question living conditions

They would not work to make rape and robbery legal

They may work to make the prison sentences less severe.

Of course you don't see Democrats wanting to remove the prohibition of firearms for felons, because they don't vote yet. But if we had a federal law that allowed them to vote, that might change.

According to research, by the end of this year, we will have 23 million ex-cons in our society outside of prison. That's a hell of a voting block that Democrats could take advantage of. And also in the estimate, there are over 600,000 more released every year.

https://nypost.com/2016/04/04/statistical-proof-that-america-doesnt-care-about-ex-cons/

One of the reasons our crime is so bad in this country is because our prisons are not enough of a deterrent. By lessening the deterrent we have, or removing it altogether, that makes it more dangerous for the rest of us.

BBC NEWS | In Depth
Seems to me the US is pretty big on deterring. How is it worked out for you so far?

I don't understand your post. We have the highest percentage of our population locked up behind bars. And as pointed out earlier, a large recidivism rate for ex-cons. It's like they have no fear of going back. I know a few ex-cons, and while they don't want to go back, it wouldn't be the end of the world if they did, therefore, not much of a deterrent.

Your alternative would be what?
My point is that other countries, all of which have lower incarceration rates seem to have lower recidivism rates. Something that doesn't really jive with the statement that 'creating a bigger deterrent' is a solution. In fact, Norway which has one of the most humane prison system in the world has a recidivism rate of 20 percent.

The point I was making to RW is that we don't need to have politicians making things easier on the criminal element than we already are. I would think countries who have a lower crime and recidivism rate must have stronger deterrents in their prison system. At one time we did too, but the liberal courts kept siding with complaining criminals with prison life being too harsh.

It's not like the old days where prisoners would break big rocks into little rocks, or a system that operated like in the movie Cool Hand Luke. Today our prisons have accounts where family members can deposit money to the inmates for extras. They have workout rooms, libraries, football fields, and even a little room for them to knock up their wives if they wish to start a family from jail.