Affirmative Action Needs to Be Banned (all 50 states)

[protectionist]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

Affirmative action has to do with far more than just top level jobs.

It sure does
It is about providing opportunity

For blacks, while DENYING opportunities to others (AKA malicious, despicable, racist discrimination)

 

[protectionist]

The entire reason I say it should go away is because it uses a factor to benefit that would be considered wrong is used to deny.

Seems you've determined that millions of beneficiaries needed it, whatever that means.

I dont know but either you dont know that discrimation has actually happened or you dont care that it did happen. Thats the only way you can have an idea that righting wrongs is petty.

I didnt say they needed it but YOU DID SAY it should be for only those that "need it". You shouldnt say things if you cant explain what they mean

I don't deny that it happened and that it was wrong. What I said is that trying to make up for it using the same factor that was used is denying it is also wrong.

Your logic is just wrong because what you're doing is using the "Intolerance" argument that goes

"Its intolerant to be intolerant or intolerance"

No helping the people who were adversely affected by a policy is not a bad thing. Its an apology or sorts.

A weak one at that since AA isnt only for Blacks.

AA often IS only for Blacks. I, and 16 other non-Blacks were denied assistantships in our graduate school. 8 assistantships were granted. ALL to the only 8 Blacks who applied. And among those who were denied, were women, Hispanics, and Asians.

How long ago was that? At the inception of the initiative, some blacks(not all) were the beneficiaries of AA, simply because those are the blacks who grew up in an era of legalized discrimination.

It was 1977, so the people there, were mostly about 21 years old, so they would have been 8 years old when the 1964 Civil Rights Acts were passed and AA began (too young to have been victim of race discrimination. Well within the age to be race discrimination (AA) beneficiaries.

 

[Wry Catcher]

1. A consent decree is an agreement or settlement to resolve a dispute between two parties without admission of guilt and most often refers to such a type of settlement in the United States.
2. Many political subdivisions in the US agree to work toward a work force which is demographically close to the racial, ethnic, age and gender of the community they serve
3. Such an agreement recognizes passed injustices and works toward realizing Social Justice, defined as the view that everyone deserves equal economic, political and social rights and opportunities.

Now who would oppose such an outcome?

 

[protectionist]

1. A consent decree is an agreement or settlement to resolve a dispute between two parties without admission of guilt and most often refers to such a type of settlement in the United States.
2. Many political subdivisions in the US agree to work toward a work force which is demographically close to the racial, ethnic, age and gender of the community they serve
3. Such an agreement recognizes passed injustices and works toward realizing Social Justice, defined as the view that everyone deserves equal economic, political and social rights and opportunities.

Now who would oppose such an outcome?

It would be nice if it worked toward recognizing the past injustices of the past 51 years of racial discrimination against Whites, by affirmative action, but as one of the long time victims of these past injustices, I would rather just receive a lump sum reparations$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ payment + a major increase in my Social Security payment amount. All to compensate for the reduced payment I now receive as a result of the lower pay jobs I had to accept, as a result of affirmative action, + the periods of umemployment, which reduce my current payment amount even more.

 

[Asclepias]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

then it should be discontinued

We need 350 more years. Fair is fair.

YOU don't need even ONE more year.. How many years did YOU live under Jim Crow laws ? Whites need 51 more years. That's how long we've been living under Affirmative Action racism.

Thats what you get. You should have told your previous generations not to be lazy.. We need a turn at 400 years of privilege. I say do away with partial AA for Black people and give them full fledged AA like white males had for 400 years.

 

[squeeze berry]

Affirmative action has been a major success in this country that all Americans have benefitted from

That is preposterous. I just stated what AA has been, and as the largest, malicious racial discrimination against the largest # of people, of 51 years, it is also one of America's top disgraces which has ruined hundreds of millions of people lives + kept many poor Whites mired in poverty.

I saw poverty in many Black and Hispanic communities. None of them were nearly as bad as the poverty I saw in the mountain areas of East Tennessee, Eastern Kentucky, and western North Carolina, all among white people.

I never saw Blacks and Hispanics in the cities going without a pair of shoes until they were 10 years old. Even going to school barefoot. I never saw Blacks and Hispanics in the cities without indoor plumbing in their homes. This was common among Whites in the southern mountains, whose water consisted of an outside pump, or retrieving water from a nearby stream (similar to how the pioneers did it 200 years ago).

View attachment 36496

Affirmative Action has been a major success
Prior to affirmative action, women and blacks knew their place in the workforce. Affirmative action opened up all jobs

then it's no longer needed since you are speaking in the past tense

If it is no longer needed, then business has no problem meeting the requirements
We don't want to slide back to where we were in the 50s do we?

we are sliding back now b/c of AA

 

[rightwinger]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

Affirmative action has to do with far more than just top level jobs.

It sure does
It is about providing opportunity

For blacks, while DENYING opportunities to others (AKA malicious, despicable, racist discrimination)

Actually, it opened up the field for everyone

 

[protectionist]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

then it should be discontinued

We need 350 more years. Fair is fair.

YOU don't need even ONE more year.. How many years did YOU live under Jim Crow laws ? Whites need 51 more years. That's how long we've been living under Affirmative Action racism.

Thats what you get. You should have told your previous generations not to be lazy.. We need a turn at 400 years of privilege. I say do away with partial AA for Black people and give them full fledged AA like white males had for 400 years.

That's because you are a despicable piece of racist garbage, and YOU KNOW IT.

 

[protectionist]

Affirmative action has been a major success in this country that all Americans have benefitted from

That is preposterous. I just stated what AA has been, and as the largest, malicious racial discrimination against the largest # of people, of 51 years, it is also one of America's top disgraces which has ruined hundreds of millions of people lives + kept many poor Whites mired in poverty.

I saw poverty in many Black and Hispanic communities. None of them were nearly as bad as the poverty I saw in the mountain areas of East Tennessee, Eastern Kentucky, and western North Carolina, all among white people.

I never saw Blacks and Hispanics in the cities going without a pair of shoes until they were 10 years old. Even going to school barefoot. I never saw Blacks and Hispanics in the cities without indoor plumbing in their homes. This was common among Whites in the southern mountains, whose water consisted of an outside pump, or retrieving water from a nearby stream (similar to how the pioneers did it 200 years ago).

View attachment 36496

Affirmative Action has been a major success
Prior to affirmative action, women and blacks knew their place in the workforce. Affirmative action opened up all jobs

then it's no longer needed since you are speaking in the past tense

If it is no longer needed, then business has no problem meeting the requirements
We don't want to slide back to where we were in the 50s do we?

we are sliding back now b/c of AA

Notice how nowadays we see lots of things that are crazy, unexplainable, weird, and downright idiotic ? Seems like the whole country is going nuts ? You can bet underneath it all, some unqualified affirmative action nitwit is responsible for it.

 

[protectionist]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

Affirmative action has to do with far more than just top level jobs.

It sure does
It is about providing opportunity

For blacks, while DENYING opportunities to others (AKA malicious, despicable, racist discrimination)

Actually, it opened up the field for everyone

So that's the line they've been feeding you at MSNBC, npr, media matters, and other liberal idiocy media ? AMAZING how anybody could repeat something as preposterous as that, even for one second.

 

[rightwinger]

Affirmative action has been a major success in this country that all Americans have benefitted from

That is preposterous. I just stated what AA has been, and as the largest, malicious racial discrimination against the largest # of people, of 51 years, it is also one of America's top disgraces which has ruined hundreds of millions of people lives + kept many poor Whites mired in poverty.

I saw poverty in many Black and Hispanic communities. None of them were nearly as bad as the poverty I saw in the mountain areas of East Tennessee, Eastern Kentucky, and western North Carolina, all among white people.

I never saw Blacks and Hispanics in the cities going without a pair of shoes until they were 10 years old. Even going to school barefoot. I never saw Blacks and Hispanics in the cities without indoor plumbing in their homes. This was common among Whites in the southern mountains, whose water consisted of an outside pump, or retrieving water from a nearby stream (similar to how the pioneers did it 200 years ago).

View attachment 36496

Affirmative Action has been a major success
Prior to affirmative action, women and blacks knew their place in the workforce. Affirmative action opened up all jobs

then it's no longer needed since you are speaking in the past tense

If it is no longer needed, then business has no problem meeting the requirements
We don't want to slide back to where we were in the 50s do we?

we are sliding back now b/c of AA

No we are not

We have millions of women and blacks filling jobs where they were effectively banned from filling in the past

women/blacks lack the "essentials" to perform these jobs. Only white males are capable of doing

 

[rightwinger]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

Affirmative action has to do with far more than just top level jobs.

It sure does
It is about providing opportunity

For blacks, while DENYING opportunities to others (AKA malicious, despicable, racist discrimination)

Actually, it opened up the field for everyone

So that's the line they've been feeding you at MSNBC, npr, media matters, and other liberal idiocy media ? AMAZING how anybody could repeat something as preposterous as that, even for one second.

I didn't need MSNBC, it didn't exist at the time. I saw women and blacks in the 60s and early 70s and the jobs they aspired to. Women, no matter how intelligent, would go to be secretaries, nursing or teachers. If they weren't college material, they could be beauticians or maybe be a teller in a bank or supermarket. Waitress was a good option
Blacks might get a job at menial labor. After all, that is what they are best suited for. The really smart blacks may be able to go to a black college where they could graduate and find jobs where they could provide services to black clientele. White firms didn't want to hire them. After all, blacks lacked the "essentials" to be trusted with real responsibility
White males had leadership and skilled positions reserved for them

I can see why you were so upset when affirmative action came along

 

[Wry Catcher]

1. A consent decree is an agreement or settlement to resolve a dispute between two parties without admission of guilt and most often refers to such a type of settlement in the United States.
2. Many political subdivisions in the US agree to work toward a work force which is demographically close to the racial, ethnic, age and gender of the community they serve
3. Such an agreement recognizes passed injustices and works toward realizing Social Justice, defined as the view that everyone deserves equal economic, political and social rights and opportunities.

Now who would oppose such an outcome?

It would be nice if it worked toward recognizing the past injustices of the past 51 years of racial discrimination against Whites, by affirmative action, but as one of the long time victims of these past injustices, I would rather just receive a lump sum reparations$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ payment + a major increase in my Social Security payment amount. All to compensate for the reduced payment I now receive as a result of the lower pay jobs I had to accept, as a result of affirmative action, + the periods of umemployment, which reduce my current payment amount even more.

Seems your basis for the opposing AA or a consent decree is the competition is too tough and you were beaten out for jobs because of a persons status as a protected class. Sadly, European Americans had an advantage up until the civil rights movement, and now, that the playing field is up hill for some whites, it's cause for whining and a new iteration of racism.

It is not the fault of a woman who demands equal pay for equal work, or the black man who for years was denied the opportunity to become a fire fighter or policeman. Men and women were denied equal opportunity for generations, and that is no cause for people to hate others who finally received a helping hand.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Affirmative action has to do with far more than just top level jobs.

It sure does
It is about providing opportunity

For blacks, while DENYING opportunities to others (AKA malicious, despicable, racist discrimination)

Actually, it opened up the field for everyone

So that's the line they've been feeding you at MSNBC, npr, media matters, and other liberal idiocy media ? AMAZING how anybody could repeat something as preposterous as that, even for one second.

I didn't need MSNBC, it didn't exist at the time. I saw women and blacks in the 60s and early 70s and the jobs they aspired to. Women, no matter how intelligent, would go to be secretaries, nurse or teachers. If they weren't college material, they could be beauticians or maybe be a teller in a bank or supermarket. Waitress was a good option
Blacks might get a job at menial labor. After all, that is what they are best suited for. The really smart blacks may be able to go to a black college where they could graduate and find jobs where they could provide services to black clientele. White firms didn't want to hire them. After all, blacks lacked the "essentials" to be trusted with real responsibility
White males had leadership and skilled positions reserved for them

I can see why you were so upset when affirmative action came along

My sister went to work for an insurance company shortly after graduating from High School. She is four years older than me, and I can remember her telling our parents that a year after she became employed, she was teaching a new hire, a man, his job responsibilities and he was hired at a higher salary than she, and was making more than her with her years experience.

 

[rightwinger]

It sure does
It is about providing opportunity

For blacks, while DENYING opportunities to others (AKA malicious, despicable, racist discrimination)

Actually, it opened up the field for everyone

So that's the line they've been feeding you at MSNBC, npr, media matters, and other liberal idiocy media ? AMAZING how anybody could repeat something as preposterous as that, even for one second.

I didn't need MSNBC, it didn't exist at the time. I saw women and blacks in the 60s and early 70s and the jobs they aspired to. Women, no matter how intelligent, would go to be secretaries, nurse or teachers. If they weren't college material, they could be beauticians or maybe be a teller in a bank or supermarket. Waitress was a good option
Blacks might get a job at menial labor. After all, that is what they are best suited for. The really smart blacks may be able to go to a black college where they could graduate and find jobs where they could provide services to black clientele. White firms didn't want to hire them. After all, blacks lacked the "essentials" to be trusted with real responsibility
White males had leadership and skilled positions reserved for them

I can see why you were so upset when affirmative action came along

My sister went to work for an insurance company shortly after graduating from High School. She is four years older than me, and I can remember her telling our parents that a year after she became employed, she was teaching a new hire, a man, his job responsibilities and he was hired at a higher salary than she, and was making more than her with her years experience.

Many times a woman would have a college degree and be training a man without a degree who had been designated her boss
The glass ceiling did exist
I knew many women with business degrees that found the only job that was offered to them was as a secretary

 

[katsteve2012]

I dont know but either you dont know that discrimation has actually happened or you dont care that it did happen. Thats the only way you can have an idea that righting wrongs is petty.

I didnt say they needed it but YOU DID SAY it should be for only those that "need it". You shouldnt say things if you cant explain what they mean

I don't deny that it happened and that it was wrong. What I said is that trying to make up for it using the same factor that was used is denying it is also wrong.

Your logic is just wrong because what you're doing is using the "Intolerance" argument that goes

"Its intolerant to be intolerant or intolerance"

No helping the people who were adversely affected by a policy is not a bad thing. Its an apology or sorts.

A weak one at that since AA isnt only for Blacks.

AA often IS only for Blacks. I, and 16 other non-Blacks were denied assistantships in our graduate school. 8 assistantships were granted. ALL to the only 8 Blacks who applied. And among those who were denied, were women, Hispanics, and Asians.

How long ago was that? At the inception of the initiative, some blacks(not all) were the beneficiaries of AA, simply because those are the blacks who grew up in an era of legalized discrimination.

It was 1977, so the people there, were mostly about 21 years old, so they would have been 8 years old when the 1964 Civil Rights Acts were passed and AA began (too young to have been victim of race discrimination. Well within the age to be race discrimination (AA) beneficiaries.

What about people at that time who were in their 30's and 40's and in their prime earning years and were passed over or denied opportunity because they did not "look like" the person doing the hiring?

A 21 year old in 1977 still had enough time to reinvent themselves and go on to be successful in spite of being passed over "because of AA."

I don't see how AA could have ruined your life as you say unless you just didn't have the right skill set to better yourself and move on

On a daily basis in this forum, people repeat over and over how great a country America is and how anyone can make it if they apply themselves, and I happen to agree with that fact.

If one door closes, one can wait for another to open, or they can open it themselves.

 

[Asclepias]

Affirmative action ended the monopoly that white males had on top level jobs

then it should be discontinued

We need 350 more years. Fair is fair.

YOU don't need even ONE more year.. How many years did YOU live under Jim Crow laws ? Whites need 51 more years. That's how long we've been living under Affirmative Action racism.

Thats what you get. You should have told your previous generations not to be lazy.. We need a turn at 400 years of privilege. I say do away with partial AA for Black people and give them full fledged AA like white males had for 400 years.

That's because you are a despicable piece of racist garbage, and YOU KNOW IT.

I think you are just mad because you cant get a job. Educate yourself and then use those self lifting bootstraps everyone is blessed with. If you were not down there fighting with the low hanging fruit you would have a job by now.

 

[rightwinger]

The main reason women and blacks were blocked form holding positions of responsibility was not their qualifications but because white males did not want to take orders from a black or woman supervisor

 

[rightwinger]

1. A consent decree is an agreement or settlement to resolve a dispute between two parties without admission of guilt and most often refers to such a type of settlement in the United States.
2. Many political subdivisions in the US agree to work toward a work force which is demographically close to the racial, ethnic, age and gender of the community they serve
3. Such an agreement recognizes passed injustices and works toward realizing Social Justice, defined as the view that everyone deserves equal economic, political and social rights and opportunities.

Now who would oppose such an outcome?

It would be nice if it worked toward recognizing the past injustices of the past 51 years of racial discrimination against Whites, by affirmative action, but as one of the long time victims of these past injustices, I would rather just receive a lump sum reparations$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ payment + a major increase in my Social Security payment amount. All to compensate for the reduced payment I now receive as a result of the lower pay jobs I had to accept, as a result of affirmative action, + the periods of umemployment, which reduce my current payment amount even more.

Seems your basis for the opposing AA or a consent decree is the competition is too tough and you were beaten out for jobs because of a persons status as a protected class. Sadly, European Americans had an advantage up until the civil rights movement, and now, that the playing field is up hill for some whites, it's cause for whining and a new iteration of racism.

It is not the fault of a woman who demands equal pay for equal work, or the black man who for years was denied the opportunity to become a fire fighter or policeman. Men and women were denied equal opportunity for generations, and that is no cause for people to hate others who finally received a helping hand.

As the scales level themselves out, those who were marginal paid a price

 

[Asclepias]

Whites in South Africa whining about how its all so unfair. This like the exact opposite of the US with some very major differences. Whites with money still exist and whites were never enslaved,



One other major difference is that Black people actually have compassion.