Adam sinned, not Eve. Why did Yahweh punish an innocent Eve?

[Leo123]

Adam sinned, not Eve. Why did Yahweh punish an innocent Eve?

Be you a believer or not, your life has been affected by the mainstream religions and the myth of Adam and Eve. It is the source of Christian homophobia and misogyny.

There are many strange things in the myth of Adam and Eve.
Was Adam born alone or first?
If Adam was created in God’s image and likeness, who is woman modeled after?
Satan is depicted in part as a woman.

Who was she modeled on and why female? Likely because of evolution and women being men’s biological prize.

In law, to be punished, one must be shown to have evil intent or an evil mind. Latin, Men’s Rea.

This is what human justice is based on.

Was Eve innocent, given that she had no evil intent?

Regards
DL

I dunno, maybe to try to teach morals to Eve? Like, daddy told you not to do something so, you get little bro to do the nasty deed. Both are guilty. One of being a weak little dweeb with questionable survival skills and the other of using another soul to do your dirty work. You should be flattered that God put woman above men.

 

[BackAgain]

If all true, laudable, yet you do a really cheep form of apologetics.

You make even stupid Christians look stupid and immoral.

They do not need your help in those areas.

Regards
DL

Your remain generally incoherent.

No apologetics at all. I doubt you even understand what that term means.

We all see that you’re a blowhard. But I’m not sure you grasp how shallow you are.

Other than that, feel free to go fuck off.

 

[GreatestIam]

I dunno, maybe to try to teach morals to Eve? Like, daddy told you not to do something so, you get little bro to do the nasty deed. Both are guilty. One of being a weak little dweeb with questionable survival skills and the other of using another soul to do your dirty work. You should be flattered that God put woman above men.

Eve's morals were already good enough for her to ignore a command to remain innocent and not bright at all.

Yahweh also put Eve below man, showing his lack of morality and intelligence.

Regards
DL

Regards
DL

 

[Red Front]

Adam sinned, not Eve. Why did Yahweh punish an innocent Eve?

Be you a believer or not, your life has been affected by the mainstream religions and the myth of Adam and Eve. It is the source of Christian homophobia and misogyny.

There are many strange things in the myth of Adam and Eve.
Was Adam born alone or first?
If Adam was created in God’s image and likeness, who is woman modeled after?
Satan is depicted in part as a woman.

Who was she modeled on and why female? Likely because of evolution and women being men’s biological prize.

In law, to be punished, one must be shown to have evil intent or an evil mind. Latin, Men’s Rea.

This is what human justice is based on.

Was Eve innocent, given that she had no evil intent?

Regards
DL

It's ancient mythology. Do you actually believe the whole universe, with trillions of galaxies, countless stars, and planets, all went helter-skelter because a caveman and his wife, ate from the wrong fruit tree? Really? We already know that humanity didn't come from one single human couple six thousand years ago. People who hold on to these ancient myths do it out of desperation, fear, and ignorance. It's a crutch, a warm security blanket, a teddy bear, that's what the bible is for religious Jews and Christians. A coping mechanism, stunting people's personal growth and ability to think rationally.

 

[Meriweather]

It's ancient mythology. Do you actually believe the whole universe, with trillions of galaxies, countless stars, and planets, all went helter-skelter because a caveman and his wife, ate from the wrong fruit tree? Really? We already know that humanity didn't come from one single human couple six thousand years ago. People who hold on to these ancient myths do it out of desperation, fear, and ignorance. It's a crutch, a warm security blanket, a teddy bear, that's what the bible is for religious Jews and Christians. A coping mechanism, stunting people's personal growth and ability to think rationally.

The story is not about a universe going awry. The story is about mankind on earth, and where man identified where they went awry when given/placed in this existence. They wanted the knowledge of good and evil...but quickly learned the power of obedience, and all that could go wrong when the card of disobedience was played. This is about the journey of man, not the journey of the universe.

 

[Frankenstein]

Eve was as bright as a brick and Yahweh still sent Satan to deceive her.

Adam sinned but Eve was deceived.

Did you not care that she had no evil intent?

Are you a moral coward or one who can judge fairly using mens rea?

Your bible call it Adam's sin. Did you never notice that it gives Eve a pass?

Regards
DL

She was being selfish, and prideful, both sins! Given a pass?
Genesis 3:16, 20; 4:1–2 in pain you shall bring forth children, yet your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you.

 

[Red Front]

The story is not about a universe going awry. The story is about mankind on earth, and where man identified where they went awry when given/placed in this existence. They wanted the knowledge of good and evil...but quickly learned the power of obedience, and all that could go wrong when the card of disobedience was played. This is about the journey of man, not the journey of the universe.

Genesis is a metaphor that can be interpreted in many different ways. Too many people are interpreting it literally and that's the problem. Jews, Christians, and Muslims have had their minds highjacked, and taken hostage by these myths. We could probably, at this point in our history, save ourselves, if we really wanted to. We have the science and technology, the potential, to turn this world into paradise. What the religious folks are hoping for in another lifetime in the future, could potentially be made real here on Earth, in the not-too-distant future, if we really wanted it. But too many of us are focused on an "afterlife", on hocus-pocus. These ancient mythological religions are a distraction.

We need a new religion based on science and human solidarity. The rational, sincere pursuit of truth, human survival, and success. We should stop focusing on a supposed afterlife and hoping for paradise in another dimension and concentrate on this life, the only life we actually have, and do whatever we can to turn this world into paradise. That will do more to eliminate unnecessary pain and suffering, advancing our well-being as human beings, than these ancient mythological religions.

 

[Meriweather]

What the religious folks are hoping for in another lifetime in the future, could potentially be made real here on Earth, in the not-too-distant future, if we really wanted it. But too many of us are focused on an "afterlife", on hocus-pocus. These ancient mythological religions are a distraction.

There are some who focus on the afterlife. Most of us, with our roots in Judaism, are focused on living this life with the assurance the afterlife will look out for itself. You are focused on the minority. Instead of wiping away religion, why not work on redirecting the minority in reading the Bible as a guide through THIS present, physical life.

If a student gets a wrong answer on a test, should the teacher tear up the entire test because the student didn't have the correct answer to one question?

No, religion is not a distraction. It focuses. Ancient man had a great talent for painting a picture of each lesson they wished to pass on to their descendants. They were extremely intelligent.

 

[Meriweather]

We need a new religion based on science and human solidarity. The rational, sincere pursuit of truth, human survival, and success. We should stop focusing on a supposed afterlife and hoping for paradise in another dimension and concentrate on this life, the only life we actually have, and do whatever we can to turn this world into paradise. That will do more to eliminate unnecessary pain and suffering, advancing our well-being as human beings, than these ancient mythological religions.

No, we do not need a "new religion". The present one is a philosophy that focuses on God and the ways of God.

Possibly, what we need from both people of faith and those with no faith, is for all to understand philosophy/religion can exist quite happily and peacefully along side science. We are all intelligent enough to understand the difference between science and philosophy.

Recommending we replace either one can be compared to recommending we replace all tables with chairs, when both work quite well together.

 

[Red Front]

No, we do not need a "new religion". The present one is a philosophy that focuses on God and the ways of God.

Possibly, what we need from both people of faith and those with no faith, is for all to understand philosophy/religion can exist quite happily and peacefully along side science. We are all intelligent enough to understand the difference between science and philosophy.

Recommending we replace either one can be compared to recommending we replace all tables with chairs, when both work quite well together.

We can have a philosophy without blind, religious dogmatism. That's the point I made that you apparently missed. Philosophy doesn't equate to blind belief or faith.

 

[Meriweather]

We can have a philosophy without blind, religious dogmatism. That's the point I made that you apparently missed. Philosophy doesn't equate to blind belief or faith.

I did not miss the point. What I am pointing out is that we don't discard those who are blind, those who present a wrong answer, those who do not believe as we do. We respect who they are.

I love the philosophies in Genesis and they should not be discarded. Do some misunderstand and even misinterpret what Genesis says? Absolutely. Still, we don't discard math books because so many students get the wrong answers. We work on presenting the truth and the lessons our ancient ancestors felt worthy of passing on to us, their descendants.

 

[Red Front]

I did not miss the point. What I am pointing out is that we don't discard those who are blind, those who present a wrong answer, those who do not believe as we do. We respect who they are.

I love the philosophies in Genesis and they should not be discarded. Do some misunderstand and even misinterpret what Genesis says? Absolutely. Still, we don't discard math books because so many students get the wrong answers. We work on presenting the truth and the lessons our ancient ancestors felt worthy of passing on to us, their descendants.

I did not miss the point. What I am pointing out is that we don't discard those who are blind, those who present a wrong answer, those who do not believe as we do. We respect who they are.

Christians do that all of the time. Demonizing everyone that doesn't believe their mythology. I can respect a person's humanity without having much respect for their cherished assertions and delusions. I believe people should have a right to their religious beliefs and practices provided such beliefs and practices aren't hurting anyone else. I don't care what anyone's religion is, but within the context of a forum like this where we can debate the issues and test our worldview from the vantage point of others, I don't see a problem with rigorously examining other people's religious claims.


I love the philosophies in Genesis and they should not be discarded. Do some misunderstand and even misinterpret what Genesis says? Absolutely. Still, we don't discard math books because so many students get the wrong answers. We work on presenting the truth and the lessons our ancient ancestors felt worthy of passing on to us, their descendants.

You or I appreciating ancient philosophies and myths is fine, I never suggested we should take all of the bibles and burn them. I, however, read the Bible, in the same way, I read the Quran, the Hindu Vedas, and Upanishads, the Buddhist Dharmapada, the Zoroastrian Avesta, and all of the other ancient books of religion. They tell us a lot about ourselves, and our history but I don't believe we should consider what is in those books as "inerrant" or a precise, scientific description of reality or a science textbook, as TOO MANY religious fundamentalists do. I've met many Evangelicals that believe the universe is six thousand years old and that human beings lived with the Dinosaurs. That's ignorance and it doesn't contribute to our survival as a species.

If billions of human beings are waiting here on Earth for a "Messiah" God-Man to return, that might undermine the funding of science and technology, especially in the area of space exploration and colonization. Why even bother to develop science and technology when Jesus is coming back soon to rapture us out of here? I've met many Christians like that. If there were ETs wanting to keep humanity on Earth, preventing it from becoming a multi-planetary, space-faring species, the Abrahamic religions would be the means to do it.

You get all of the humans believing in an afterlife, and waiting here on Earth for an incarnate humanlike deity to return to save them from death and themselves. If I were that Alien that wants to keep humanity...stupid, and indifferent to their needs, focused on "other dimensions", an "afterlife", I would use the Abrahamic religions as a psychological weapon to keep them on Earth as long as possible, preventing them from colonizing space or going beyond the Earth. I would infect their minds with the Bible or the Quran.

 

[Meriweather]

Christians do that all of the time. Demonizing everyone that doesn't believe their mythology. I can respect a person's humanity without having much respect for their cherished assertions and delusions. I believe people should have a right to their religious beliefs and practices provided such beliefs and practices aren't hurting anyone else. I don't care what anyone's religion is, but within the context of a forum like this where we can debate the issues and test our worldview from the vantage point of others, I don't see a problem with rigorously examining other people's religious claims.

Specifically, who is demonized you, and how did they do it?

I am Catholic and people disagree with me all the time. That is not demonizing me or my faith--it is disagreeing with it or its conclusions. No one has tortured me. What were your experiences?

 

[Red Front]

Specifically, who is demonized you, and how did they do it?

I am Catholic and people disagree with me all the time. That is not demonizing me or my faith--it is disagreeing with it or its conclusions. No one has tortured me. What were your experiences?

I have been gaslighted and insulted, demonized not just here on the forum but in "real life", offline, for doubting Christianity or not having the "right belief". You start asking the "wrong questions" and seeking genuine answers and you'll experience it too.

 

[Meriweather]

I've met many Evangelicals that believe the universe is six thousand years old and that human beings lived with the Dinosaurs.

So what? Sixty percent of Americans believe the universe is a great deal older. What others believe does not effect me or change a thing. They are wrong based on Bishop Ussher's literal interpretation of a 'generation' meaning one step in our descendant chart. The Hebrew word covers many descendant steps, in some cases a great, great many. Also the Hebrew word for 'day' can mean an extremely long period of time. Bishop Ushher had a fine idea, but he only knew English; he didn't understand Hebrew, and therefore his calculations couldn't be anything other than wrong.

That's ignorance and it doesn't contribute to our survival as a species.

There are people who believe in a young earth, a flat earth, no moon landing, etc. So what? It affects no one's survival. Being wrong is a human condition. Not knowing is the condition of all the other species here on earth. We are all doing fine.

I recommend showing people what IS right; not telling them THEY are wrong. You can explain about an older universe without putting down people who cannot comprehend the explanation.

 

[Meriweather]

If billions of human beings are waiting here on Earth for a "Messiah" God-Man to return, that might undermine the funding of science and technology, especially in the area of space exploration and colonization. Why even bother to develop science and technology when Jesus is coming back soon to rapture us out of here? I've met many Christians like that. If there were ETs wanting to keep humanity on Earth, preventing it from becoming a multi-planetary, space-faring species, the Abrahamic religions would be the means to do it.

That is a "What if..." What if we can't get funding? Considering what government throws our money at, I am not worried about that particular "What if." Science advanced dramatically even without government funding.

 

[Meriweather]

You get all of the humans believing in an afterlife, and waiting here on Earth for an incarnate humanlike deity to return to save them from death and themselves. If I were that Alien that wants to keep humanity...stupid, and indifferent to their needs, focused on "other dimensions", an "afterlife", I would use the Abrahamic religions as a psychological weapon to keep them on Earth as long as possible, preventing them from colonizing space or going beyond the Earth. I would infect their minds with the Bible or the Quran.

Again, the Bible is about guiding us through our present, physical life on this earth.

 

[Red Front]

So what? Sixty percent of Americans believe the universe is a great deal older. What others believe does not effect me or change a thing. They are wrong based on Bishop Ussher's literal interpretation of a 'generation' meaning one step in our descendant chart. The Hebrew word covers many descendant steps, in some cases a great, great many. Also the Hebrew word for 'day' can mean an extremely long period of time. Bishop Ushher had a fine idea, but he only knew English; he didn't understand Hebrew, and therefore his calculations couldn't be anything other than wrong.

There are people who believe in a young earth, a flat earth, no moon landing, etc. So what? It affects no one's survival. Being wrong is a human condition. Not knowing is the condition of all the other species here on earth. We are all doing fine.

I recommend showing people what IS right; not telling them THEY are wrong. You can explain about an older universe without putting down people who cannot comprehend the explanation.

You have no problem telling me what I supposedly did wrong, huh? This is a forum, where people debate the issues and test arguments, if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

 

[Meriweather]

I have been gaslighted and insulted, demonized not just here on the forum but in "real life", offline, for doubting Christianity or not having the "right belief". You start asking the "wrong questions" and seeking genuine answers and you'll experience it too.

You seem to take very personally what I field with aplomb. I have been hit hard in the face with a softball many times. Part of the game, and never stopped me from loving softball. Never minded Dodge Ball either. I certainly don't mind the give and take of religious discussions.

 

[Red Front]

That is a "What if..." What if we can't get funding? Considering what government throws our money at, I am not worried about that particular "What if." Science advanced dramatically even without government funding.

Without government contracts, infrastructure, direct funding, and assistance, science wouldn't advance much. Even hundreds or thousands of years ago, it was the kings that funded the advancement of science and art. Paying the "scientists" and engineers of the day to design and develop new technology.