Zone1 about John the baptist

[foggedinn]

Let's talk about John the Baptist

Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

This puts John in some pretty exalted company. Greater than Moses? Greater than David? Greater than Solomon? The only exception that I can think of is Adam.

Isaiah 40:3
The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Matthew 3:3
For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

I view the New Testament as an expanded form of the Day of Atonement best described in Leviticus 16 and John as the bullock sacrificed before the Lamb to prepare the priest for the sacrifice of The Lamb.

Anyone have another explanation as to why Jesus named John as greater than any man born of woman?

 

[onefour1]

Let's talk about John the Baptist

Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

This puts John in some pretty exalted company. Greater than Moses? Greater than David? Greater than Solomon? The only exception that I can think of is Adam.

Isaiah 40:3
The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Matthew 3:3
For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

I view the New Testament as an expanded form of the Day of Atonement best described in Leviticus 16 and John as the bullock sacrificed before the Lamb to prepare the priest for the sacrifice of The Lamb.

Anyone have another explanation as to why Jesus named John as greater than any man born of woman?

To say that there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist is not saying he was greater than all. What it is saying is that John was not less great than those who may have been among the greatest. In other words, there may be many who have been born of women who were just a great as John. Jesus is telling us that John is as great as any other great prophet who has been born of women. He ranks among the top. Only the Lord Jesus (the least) himself ranks higher.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Let's talk about John the Baptist

History shows he was a dime a dozen. Many like him proclaiming Biblical nonsense in those times.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Now all of that is clear as mud.

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Let's talk about John the Baptist

Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

This puts John in some pretty exalted company. Greater than Moses? Greater than David? Greater than Solomon? The only exception that I can think of is Adam.

Isaiah 40:3
The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Matthew 3:3
For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

I view the New Testament as an expanded form of the Day of Atonement best described in Leviticus 16 and John as the bullock sacrificed before the Lamb to prepare the priest for the sacrifice of The Lamb.

Anyone have another explanation as to why Jesus named John as greater than any man born of woman?

He (Jesus) gave insight here:

No greater love has a man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. You are My friends if you do what I command you.

 

[Foxfyre]

To say that there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist is not saying he was greater than all. What it is saying is that John was not less great than those who may have been among the greatest. In other words, there may be many who have been born of women who were just a great as John. Jesus is telling us that John is as great as any other great prophet who has been born of women. He ranks among the top. Only the Lord Jesus (the least) himself ranks higher.

It was just Jesus' way of affirming that John the Baptist had his endorsement and affirmed that John was Jesus' messenger. But read carefully the entire quote:
"Matthew 11:11 Truly I tell you, among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet whoever is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he."

A bit of old fashioned Jewish emphasis/exaggerated metaphor/hyperbole perhaps, but the point he was making I think is that John's unclassy appearance etc. did not diminish him in any way--John was a good/great as anybody else. Nor will John (or anybody else) be greater than the least in the kingdom of heaven. We could conclude he says all will be on equal footing in heaven or there may be a parallel message that none of us should consider ourselves superior or better than anybody else in the eyes of God.

The rest of the passage was a warning to those who disrespected John and rejected John's message, even condemned him. And he finishes with hope and an invitation to receive it.

 

[luiza]

Let's talk about John the Baptist

Try talking sense in that case .

He was a right wing ( modern parlance) Essene priest .
A zealot .
Which is why both Rome and Jerusalem had him as their most wanted .
Far more influential than his cousin beforen he mislaid his head .
His cousin was an Essene monk who effectively replaced him .


Try quoting other real sources

 

[Libby von H]

Let's talk about John the Baptist

Matthew 11:11
Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

This puts John in some pretty exalted company. Greater than Moses? Greater than David? Greater than Solomon? The only exception that I can think of is Adam.

Isaiah 40:3
The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Matthew 3:3
For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

I view the New Testament as an expanded form of the Day of Atonement best described in Leviticus 16 and John as the bullock sacrificed before the Lamb to prepare the priest for the sacrifice of The Lamb.

Anyone have another explanation as to why Jesus named John as greater than any man born of woman?

You make no sense at all
What He said is "even the least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he"
THe point was that it is NOT our standing that matters but what we are to God

" I am as I am in the eyes of God. Nothing more, nothing less." St.Francis of Assisi.

Jesus is contrasting God's view with man's view

 

[surada]

History shows he was a dime a dozen. Many like him proclaiming Biblical nonsense in those times.

More than 700 years after Isaiah’s prophetic vision, the voice of one calling in the wilderness shows up again—this time in literal fashion: “John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins” (Mark 1:4). John applied Isaiah’s prophecy to himself, saying, “I am the voice of one calling in the wilderness, ‘Make straight the way for the Lord’”

 

[luiza]

The Cult Christians hate being reminded that both John and Jesus were Essene Priests and Zealots
Like our Palestine Freedom Fighters -- They wanted Freedom and finally were prepared to resort to violence to achieve it .

Do you really think the Zealots used to go around saying :-
"And the first shall be last "
And, " Ask and it will be given " ?

That level of sentimental drivel is one reason that "Nice" and sanitised Cult Christianity is fast disappearing .
That is , you have to be rather simple to believe it .

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

More than 700 years after Isaiah’s prophetic vision, the voice of one calling in the wilderness shows up again—this time in literal fashion: “John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins” (Mark 1:4). John applied Isaiah’s prophecy to himself, saying, “I am the voice of one calling in the wilderness, ‘Make straight the way for the Lord’”

Yet History and not some silly holy screed, shows he was a dime a dozen. Many like him proclaiming Biblical nonsense in those times.

 

[surada]

The Cult Christians hate being reminded that both John and Jesus were Essene Priests and Zealots
Like our Palestine Freedom Fighters -- They wanted Freedom and finally were prepared to resort to violence to achieve it .

Do you really think the Zealots used to go around saying :-
"And the first shall be last "
And, " Ask and it will be given " ?

That level of sentimental drivel is one reason that "Nice" and sanitised Cult Christianity is fast disappearing .
That is , you have to be rather simple to believe it .

Why do you claim they were Essenes?

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

They were not Essenes.

 

[norwegen]

They were not Essenes.

Certainly not Essenes and Zealots simultaneously. Jesus seemed to have no affiliation at all. He wasn't sequestered with other Essenes, he despised the Pharisees, and he seemed indifferent to the Sadducees. Only by way of his apostle Simon did he seem to have some vague and remote connection to the Zealots.

Perhaps his cousin the Baptist was the reason he chose Simon, as the Baptist himself seemed anti-Roman and anxious for the Imperial City's retreat. Jesus was not anti-Roman, though, so I suspect his reasons for choosing a Zealot were marginal, maybe even coincidental.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Jesus appears to be a sort of Pharisee.

 

[norwegen]

Jesus appears to be a sort of Pharisee.

Show us where.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Show us where.

Not when there have been only allegations before of what or not what he was. Give us evidence so we can respond,

 

[luiza]

Why do you claim they were Essenes?

The evidence is there for everybody to see .
It was not in the interests of early Cult Christianity to have evidence like this in the public domain .
Similarly , the fact of Jesus'marriage and family is buried and, to make the hatchet job complete , they even blackened the Magdalene as being a harlot .

Once you examine all the writings that are available now, it becomes clear as daylight how far the early narratives were completely fabricated .
See findings at Qumran and Nag Hammadi

 

[surada]

The evidence is there for everybody to see .
It was not in the interests of early Cult Christianity to have evidence like this in the public domain .
Similarly , the fact of Jesus'marriage and family is buried and, to make the hatchet job complete , they even blackened the Magdalene as being a harlot .

Once you examine all the writings that are available now, it becomes clear as daylight how far the early narratives were completely fabricated .
See findings at Qumran and Nag Hammadi

Neither Nag Hammadi nor the scrolls indicate Jesus was an Essene or married.

 

[surada]

History shows he was a dime a dozen. Many like him proclaiming Biblical nonsense in those times.

Many important biblical figures, including Samson, Samuel, and Elijah, were Nazarites.

So too, was Paul the Apostle and probably John the Baptist. While we know many interesting facts about John the Baptist, his status as a Nazarite is not always acknowledged.


Bart D. Ehrman - New Testament Scholar, Speaker, and Consultant › john...
John the Baptist Was a Nazarite? Explore the Truth With Me Today - Bart Ehrman