Abortion is murder

[Faun]

 

[ding]

Scarr, S., Weinberg, R.A., and Levine A., Understanding Development, Harcourt Brace Jovanovich, Inc., 1986. page 86

“The development of a new human being begins when a male’s sperm pierces the cell membrane of a female’s ovum, or egg….The villi become the placenta, which will nourish the developing infant for the next eight and a half months.”

 

[Mudda]

The Developing Human: Clinically Oriented Embryology, 6th ed. Keith L. Moore, Ph.D. & T.V.N. Persaud, Md., (Philadelphia: W.B. Saunders Company, 1998), 2-18:

“[The Zygote] results from the union of an oocyte and a sperm. A zygote is the beginning of a new human being. Human development begins at fertilization, the process during which a male gamete or sperm … unites with a female gamete or oocyte … to form a single cell called a zygote. This highly specialized, totipotent cell marks the beginning of each of us as a unique individual.”

"So what about the soul? Any proof it shows up at fertilization as well?" is what I asked.

I'll take your lack of response as a no. Good for you.

 

[Faun]

Scarr, S., Weinberg, R.A., and Levine A., Understanding Development, Harcourt Brace Jovanovich, Inc., 1986. page 86

“The development of a new human being begins when a male’s sperm pierces the cell membrane of a female’s ovum, or egg….The villi become the placenta, which will nourish the developing infant for the next eight and a half months.”

Who here has said otherwise?

 

[BreezeWood]

.
hey bingo, is it possible to eat a cow without first "murdering" the being ...

.

 

[ding]

From Human Embryology & Teratology, Ronan R. O’Rahilly, Fabiola Muller, (New York: Wiley-Liss, 1996), 5-55.

“Fertilization is an important landmark because, under ordinary circumstances, a new, genetically distinct human being is thereby formed… Fertilization is the procession of events that begins when a spermatozoon makes contact with a secondary oocyte or its investments… The zygote … is a unicellular embryo..”

 

[Mudda]

From Human Embryology & Teratology, Ronan R. O’Rahilly, Fabiola Muller, (New York: Wiley-Liss, 1996), 5-55.

“Fertilization is an important landmark because, under ordinary circumstances, a new, genetically distinct human being is thereby formed… Fertilization is the procession of events that begins when a spermatozoon makes contact with a secondary oocyte or its investments… The zygote … is a unicellular embryo..”

But no soul yet, right?

 

[ding]

Thibodeau, G.A., and Anthony, C.P., Structure and Function of the Body, 8th edition, St. Louis: Times Mirror/Mosby College Publishers, St. Louis, 1988. pages 409-419

“The science of the development of the individual before birth is called embryology. It is the story of miracles, describing the means by which a single microscopic cell is transformed into a complex human being. Genetically the zygote is complete. It represents a new single celled individual.”

 

[Mudda]

Thibodeau, G.A., and Anthony, C.P., Structure and Function of the Body, 8th edition, St. Louis: Times Mirror/Mosby College Publishers, St. Louis, 1988. pages 409-419

“The science of the development of the individual before birth is called embryology. It is the story of miracles, describing the means by which a single microscopic cell is transformed into a complex human being. Genetically the zygote is complete. It represents a new single celled individual.”

What about the soul, when does that appear? At conception? At birth?

 

[thanatos144]

Thanks for showing how stupid those who support infanticide are.

 

[ding]

 

[ding]

THE COURT: What do you tell them, does the fetus feel pain or not when they ask?

THE WITNESS: What I tell them is that the subject of the fetal pain and whether a fetus can appreciate pain is a subject of some research and controversy and that I don’t know to what extent the fetus can feel pain but that its —

THE COURT: Do you tell them it feels some pain?

THE WITNESS: I do know that when we do, for instance an amniocentesis and put a needle through the abdomen into the amniotic cavity that the fetus withdraws so I certainly know based on my experience that the fetus with [sic] withdraw in response it a painful stimulus.

Q. And at the time you either cut the umbilical cord or collapse the skull, is the fetus living?

A. Yes.

 

[Mudda]

THE COURT: What do you tell them, does the fetus feel pain or not when they ask?

THE WITNESS: What I tell them is that the subject of the fetal pain and whether a fetus can appreciate pain is a subject of some research and controversy and that I don’t know to what extent the fetus can feel pain but that its —

THE COURT: Do you tell them it feels some pain?

THE WITNESS: I do know that when we do, for instance an amniocentesis and put a needle through the abdomen into the amniotic cavity that the fetus withdraws so I certainly know based on my experience that the fetus with [sic] withdraw in response it a painful stimulus.

Q. And at the time you either cut the umbilical cord or collapse the skull, is the fetus living?

A. Yes.

Q. Is there a soul in the fetus?

A. Gee, I dunno.

 

[tyroneweaver]

They are not human lives. Or you can show me that abortion is taking a "human life." Show us.

If they are not human lives then you tell us what they are, Jake. I have seen many via ultrasound and they all seem to have arms, legs, a human head, ten fingers and toes. Even the doctor addresses them as the expectant parents' child or if the sex has been discovered via ultrasound, as "your son" or "your daughter". The doctors must believe they are human beings.

That has already been determined in law and by bioethicists, being.

Answer the question, Jake. Don't wiggle out of it.

There is no question to answer. Whatever you think the doctors 'believe" is immaterial.

Yes Jake. I should have realized that you consider yourself more intelligent than they. Point taken.

He backed McMullin and predicted a Trump defeat. He even thought McMullin would be a factor in Utah.
So you're not dealing with the brightest bulb on the left.

 

[ding]

Q. Doctor, don't you make an effort when you perform D&E by dismemberment to count the
fetal parts after the procedure is over?
A. No. We look for sentinel parts. … But we don't count every single part that we've extracted
after one of these procedures, no.
Q. Well you make an effort to count the four extremities and the head, don't you?
A. That we do, yes.
~
Q. You could use a combination of your hand and your instrument; not really grasping but
helping and assisting the delivery of the infant to the point its head gets stuck, right?
A. That is correct.
Q. Sometimes you place an instrument in the uterus, grasp a lower extremity, deliver it into the
vagina, take the instrument off, grasp the lower extremity with your right hand, feel with the
fingers of your left hand beyond the external os to the opposing extremity, deliver that extremity
to get a better grasp on the fetus and then continue the delivery, correct?
A. That is correct.

 

[ding]

THE COURT: Doctor, that isn't my question. Do you discuss dismemberment? Do you tell
them about ripping or tearing a limb off the fetus?

THE WITNESS: I may very often discuss that I remove the fetus in pieces but that is not
necessarily a uniform part of the discussion.

 

[ding]

THE COURT: I want to know whether that woman knows that you are going to take a pair of
scissors and insert them into the base of the skull of her baby, of her fetus. Do you tell her?
THE WITNESS: I do not usually tell patients specific details of the operative approach. I'm
completely --
THE COURT: Do you tell her that you are going to then, ultimately, suck the brain out of the
skull?
THE WITNESS: In all of our D&Es the head is collapsed or crushed and the brains are
definitely out of the skull but those are --
THE COURT: Do you tell them that?
THE WITNESS: Those are details that would be distressing to my patients and would not --
information about that is not directly relevant to their safety.

 

[ding]

Q. Do you tell a woman who is considering a D&E that the fetal arms, legs, extremities may be
dismembered is in the course of a dismemberment variation D&E, Dr. Westhoff?
A. I tell patients that we will remove all of the fetus and the uterus and membrane, the placenta
and membranes from the uterus as safely as possible and that that proceeds somewhat differently
for all patients.
~
Q. How often will it be necessary to collapse the fetal skull during D&E whether the D&E
proceeds by a dismemberment or more relatively intact, Doctor?
A. For the vast majority of D&Es [] be necessary it either crush or collapse the fetal skull.
THE COURT: Do you tell the woman that? Do you use the word crush?
THE WITNESS: Your Honor, I do not.
THE COURT: I didn't think so.

 

[sealybobo]

of course abortion is murder, that's the whole point, to kill the baby. why else would they do it?

If Trump, McConnell and Ryan didn't think abortion was murder in 2017, then that means the Republican party doesn't even believe abortion is murder. If they do believe it is murder and they didn't outlaw it then they are responsible for all those murders. Even Trump admitted it's his fault in a 2013 tweet

Donald J. Trump‏

Leadership: Whatever happens, you're responsible. If it doesn't happen, you're responsible.

11:01 AM - 8 Nov 2013

 

[miketx]

of course abortion is murder, that's the whole point, to kill the baby. why else would they do it?

If Trump, McConnell and Ryan didn't think abortion was murder in 2017, then that means the Republican party doesn't even believe abortion is murder. If they do believe it is murder and they didn't outlaw it then they are responsible for all those murders. Even Trump admitted it's his fault in a 2013 tweet

Donald J. Trump‏

Leadership: Whatever happens, you're responsible. If it doesn't happen, you're responsible.

11:01 AM - 8 Nov 2013

Liberals are responsible.