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A good argument for a living wage.

buckeye45_73

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Pretty much. It's how they're going about it that most bothers me. Using OSHA as a general-purpose tool to push social engineering goals is an obvious abuse of power. If they want to do a mandate, run in through the proper channels (Congress and the Courts). This rule by executive order shit is taking us down the wrong path.
Well not only that, but if they have a mandate the govt needs to enforce it....so arrest people.....get some balls.....but they hide behind private business to do their dirty work....which is picture perfect fascism.
 

Smokin' OP

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No, they weren't. They just weren't allowed inside.

This racism argument doesn't wash because the black women they were coming to dine with had already been allowed inside and they were seated and waiting for the guys to show up. However, the guys did not have picture ID so the names could be compared to those on the vaccine passports (presumably the women had picture IDs because they were allowed inside with no problem).

Ironically, the two black women who became belligerent and violent and screaming racism had already been allowed inside the restaurant. This is yet another example of manufactured outrage and people making things about race when it never was.
They weren't allowed to eat inside, they had to be inside at one point.
 

dblack

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Well not only that, but if they have a mandate the govt needs to enforce it....so arrest people.....get some balls.....but they hide behind private business to do their dirty work....which is picture perfect fascism.
Agreed.

But then so is telling businesses that they're not allowed to require vaccines, as DeSantis is trying to do.
 

Smokin' OP

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Both the federal and state mandates forcing vaccine requirements, AND the state mandates prohibiting them, are good examples of overbearing government. Unfortunately, both sides of the two-party shitshow are willing to rule this way.
Really?
If you are born in a hospital in the US, you have to have a number of shots to leave the hospital.
Entering school, you have to get shots.
Entering military, have to get shots.
Entering the country, you have to get shots.
Going overseas, more shots.

No one is whining about them.
 

dblack

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Really?
If you are born in a hospital in the US, you have to have a number of shots to leave the hospital.
Entering school, you have to get shots.
Entering military, have to get shots.
Entering the country, you have to get shots.
Going overseas, more shots.

No one is whining about them.
Because those requirements were implemented with actual consensus, via the proper legislative process. Rule by executive order and regulatory fiat (the OSHA conceit) is bullshit.
 

Smokin' OP

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It's still fascism.....and no....I shouldn't have to........it's my right as an American to take what medical procedures that I deem necessary.....it's not your job to force anyone.........some people like freedom and some don't........seems you're in the latter camp.
'.it's my right as an American to take what medical procedures that I deem necessary.....it's not your job to force anyone.........'

It's also their right to keep themselves, their customers and their businesses safe.

You have a right to find another place to work, eat and shop.
You do have choices.

Do you object to a breathalyzer test, if cops suspect you're driving while impaired?
Sounds like you would.
Good, you lose your right to drive for 6-12 months.
 

Smokin' OP

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Because those requirements were implemented with actual consensus, via the proper legislative process. Rule by executive order and regulatory fiat (the OSHA conceit) is bullshit.
They were not implemented by the legislature.
They were implemented by the CDC, the military, school boards and some companies.
 

dblack

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They were not implemented by the legislature.
They were implemented by the CDC, the military, school boards and some companies.
They were implement with consensus, over time. They weren't implemented via executive order against the wishes of a large minority of society. Trying to govern this way is killing us. Literally.
 

Smokin' OP

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They were implement with consensus, over time. They weren't implemented via executive order against the wishes of a large minority of society. Trying to govern this way is killing us. Literally.
No, they just added additional shots as needed by a consensus of the people having the authority to do so.

People had 20 months of preparation.

July 3, 2021
The Walt Disney Company is now joining the growing number of other American companies who are requiring a COVID-19 vaccinations.
Both vaccinated and unvaccinated workers who are on-site have 60 days to provide verification of vaccination.

Walmart, the nation's largest retailer, said all its US-based corporate employees must be vaccinated by October 4, according to a Friday memo from Doug McMillon, the company's president and CEO.
In an earlier Friday memo, Walmart announced that all employees are required to wear masks inside again, regardless of vaccination status, in places with "substantial or high transmission." The new policy is effective immediately, the nation's largest retailer said Friday.

Google is rolling out a policy that will eventually require all its employees to be vaccinated once its sprawling campuses are fully reopened in an attempt to fight the spreading delta variant.

Once offices are fully reopened, everyone working there will have be vaccinated. The requirement will be first imposed in the U.S.

Netflix is requiring COVID-19 vaccines for the casts of all its US productions, as well as the people who come in contact with them,.

Morgan Stanley's New York office is banning all unvaccinated staff and clients from entering its headquarters.

And more, sounds like they had their own 'executive orders'.
 

dblack

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No, they just added additional shots as needed by a consensus of the people having the authority to do so.
Consensus is the key. That means broad, uncontroversial support. We don't have that. And when you don't have consensus, rule by decree is a fool's errand. It just pisses people off and further divides us.
July 3, 2021
The Walt Disney Company is now joining the growing number of other American companies who are requiring a COVID-19 vaccinations.
Both vaccinated and unvaccinated workers who are on-site have 60 days to provide verification of vaccination.

Walmart, the nation's largest retailer, said all its US-based corporate employees must be vaccinated by October 4, according to a Friday memo from Doug McMillon, the company's president and CEO.
In an earlier Friday memo, Walmart announced that all employees are required to wear masks inside again, regardless of vaccination status, in places with "substantial or high transmission." The new policy is effective immediately, the nation's largest retailer said Friday.

Google is rolling out a policy that will eventually require all its employees to be vaccinated once its sprawling campuses are fully reopened in an attempt to fight the spreading delta variant.

Once offices are fully reopened, everyone working there will have be vaccinated. The requirement will be first imposed in the U.S.

Netflix is requiring COVID-19 vaccines for the casts of all its US productions, as well as the people who come in contact with them,.

Morgan Stanley's New York office is banning all unvaccinated staff and clients from entering its headquarters.

And more, sounds like they had their own 'executive orders'.

Exactly. And that's how is should work in a free society. Businesses can decide what they think is best, within their purview, and consumers and society can decide whether they approve - by voting with their feet (avoiding the companies with policies they don't like).

But neither side seems to be willing to accept that. Both are desperate to establish government control and force their preference on everyone else.

Fuck. Both. Sides.
 

Papageorgio

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So, people have choices get vaccinated or get tested every week.
Some companies require yo to wear a hard hat, gloves and work boots.
Some companies require you to wear safety glasses and a clean suite.
Some companies require you to be vaccinated against TB, the measles, whooping cough, chicken pox or small pox.
Is that totalitarian?
You are missing the point, the Democrats are putting into place laws to regulate behavior, they are no better than Republicans, when they try the same crap. The two parties are not that different.
 

buckeye45_73

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'.it's my right as an American to take what medical procedures that I deem necessary.....it's not your job to force anyone.........'

It's also their right to keep themselves, their customers and their businesses safe.

You have a right to find another place to work, eat and shop.
You do have choices.

Do you object to a breathalyzer test, if cops suspect you're driving while impaired?
Sounds like you would.
Good, you lose your right to drive for 6-12 months.
You are a fucktard, these are coming from businesses jackass, they are from the govt......I love it when you try and use the free market like find another job..........but as always you're too stupid to understand the concept...if the govt forces business to do that, you CAN'T find another job.....and again WHY should they.....it's not the business putting this in place, it's the govt....how fucking stupid are you.

What does a DUI have to do with any of this? Wow you guys are really stupid...these analogies...are so off base.. DUI vs a virus? Are you seriously that dumb? So according to your play the govt should just stop you in your car requiring paperwork of vaccination...you're on board with that?

Or how about producing an ID to vote.........hey what a concept.......you guys weren't big on that........
 

bendog

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Consensus is the key. That means broad, uncontroversial support. We don't have that. And when you don't have consensus, rule by decree is a fool's errand. It just pisses people off and further divides us.


Exactly. And that's how is should work in a free society. Businesses can decide what they think is best, within their purview, and consumers and society can decide whether they approve - by voting with their feet (avoiding the companies with policies they don't like).

But neither side seems to be willing to accept that. Both are desperate to establish government control and force their preference on everyone else.

Fuck. Both. Sides.
the 1918 quarantines were not popular, and that's why places like Philly had really bad outcomes compared to other places. So consensus may not be as important as staving off disaster. But imo a natl consensus is impossible. We pretty much kick one party out every 4-8 years. States are differing over mandates for public workers and schools and probably we should leave it there.
 
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PoliticalChic

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I will never understand why conservatives believe it's just fine for those at the top to make millions and pay very little if not zero taxes on it but conservatives believe that it's very wrong for everyone else to earn a living wage.

If those at the top can make more money than god, everyone else should be able to earn a living wage.

No matter what the job is.




Shouldn't you complete junior high school before you post????


Take notes:

“ The top 1% pays 40% of all the income taxes. One addendum: The top 1% earned 21% of the income but paid 40% of the income tax. I’d say that’s twice their fair share. There’s more. The entire bottom half of taxpayers who earned 11.6% of the income paid a scant 2.9% of the income tax.

Some more facts: Six in ten households receive more in direct government benefits than they pay in federal taxes. Another fact, over 53 million low and middle income individuals pay no income taxes because of refundable tax credit, which are effectively a form of federal spending through the tax code.

… , according to Congressional Budget Office data for 2017 the lowest quintile of the income groups actually had an income tax rate of negative 10.9%. The second lowest quintile had a negative 1% income tax. That means they received more benefits from the government than they paid in taxes.” Biden's Budget: The Road to Serfdom
 

Flash

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Moon Bats: "Hey, lets pay people not to work, what could possibly go wrong?"
 

Papageorgio

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Consensus is the key. That means broad, uncontroversial support. We don't have that. And when you don't have consensus, rule by decree is a fool's errand. It just pisses people off and further divides us.


Exactly. And that's how is should work in a free society. Businesses can decide what they think is best, within their purview, and consumers and society can decide whether they approve - by voting with their feet (avoiding the companies with policies they don't like).

But neither side seems to be willing to accept that. Both are desperate to establish government control and force their preference on everyone else.

Fuck. Both. Sides.
Very well stated. Thank you.
 

Smokin' OP

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You are a fucktard, these are coming from businesses jackass, they are from the govt......I love it when you try and use the free market like find another job..........but as always you're too stupid to understand the concept...if the govt forces business to do that, you CAN'T find another job.....and again WHY should they.....it's not the business putting this in place, it's the govt....how fucking stupid are you.

What does a DUI have to do with any of this? Wow you guys are really stupid...these analogies...are so off base.. DUI vs a virus? Are you seriously that dumb? So according to your play the govt should just stop you in your car requiring paperwork of vaccination...you're on board with that?

Or how about producing an ID to vote.........hey what a concept.......you guys weren't big on that........
Good god, what a fucking retard.
Do you know how a calendar works?
Businesses were ALREADY putting these mandates in place BEFORE Biden even thought about it, but you blame the government for what the companies did.

'If the govt forces business to do that, you CAN'T find another job'
Why not?
Too stupid.

Afraid of being tested every week because you're scared of the shot?

'What does a DUI have to do with any of this'?
It's submittal to the 'gubmint', right?
Just like you're whining about now, it's a mandate, right?

You think we are stupid, you're trying to compare voting to a virus shot or testing, you fucking Q NUT.
 

jc456

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Yes it does.
Various studies have proven it did, even before Covid.
Mask reduced the spread of the regular flu, it didn't eliminate it.

You listen to facebook and twitter users who couldn't pass an 8th grade science class.
Nope, the mask manufacturers state so on the outside of the box they come in. You should do a better job of investigating, you suck.
 

Smokin' OP

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Nope, the mask manufacturers state so on the outside of the box they come in. You should do a better job of investigating, you suck.
YES, they do.
Like I stated earlier, you're not supposed to try and kiss someone with a mask on.
With distance, they are effective at reducing the risk.

You're a moron.
 

jc456

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YES, they do.
Like I stated earlier, you're not supposed to try and kiss someone with a mask on.
With distance, they are effective at reducing the risk.

You're a moron.
well if you know that, then you deliberately lied on the board. You should be ashamed of yourself. Are you Mo or are you Ron?
 

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