3 things liberals can't lie about

[Dante]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

Unemployment when Bush took office 4.2
Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2


Does the President control the price of gasoline?

 

[PredFan]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

I believe unemployment was at 7.8 but why quibble. The economy was shedding 750,000 jobs a month when Bush finally left office. It is now gaining 250,000 jobs a month. The Obama economy is making a million jobs a month more than Bush left him with

Gas dropped momentarily to $1.78 and then quickly shot up again. Lest we forget, Bush gave us our first $4.00 a gallon gas

Bush debt was $11.3 trillion and he was given a budget surplus when he started. Bush doubled his debt. Obamas budget has to compensate for two Bush wars, an unfunded Medicare Part D and a $2 trillion Bush tax cut

See misty, I told you they could lie.

The old "trying to hide the debt behind the budget" trick again.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

I take that to mean you can't explain your position.

Want me to explain it for you?

Oh, i can explain it. But I see absolutely no point in doing so if you think it is irrelevant. But please, by all means, let us all see your explanation.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

What you are talking about is correlation without mentioning causation. (As are many posters in this thread, con and lib.) To put it more simply, you're not proving anything. You just grabbed some stats and explained who was president at that time. What did Bush do to keep gas so cheap? What did Obama do to make gas so expensive? (Or Congress, or whomever.)

Global temperatures have increasesd since Obama took office. OMG, Obama causes global warming!

More states are passing same-sex legislation. Holy Crap! Obama causes gay marriage!

9/11 happened while Bush was president. I knew it! Bush caused 9/11!

See how stupid this game is? Try using facts (including links if possible) to back up your implied arguments and see where that gets you.

You mean like creating signing statements that forbid new oil drilling on 85 percent of the areas Bush allowed it in? How about calling Senators to oppose the pipe line. Perhaps signing statements that close coal and gas power generating plants? Regulations that encourage the closing of Oil refineries? Do those count?

How about demanding we spend almost 50 cents on every dollar borrowed? Does that count? Calling for increases on taxes for those that invest in our businesses? Any of those count?

 

[g5000]

Yeah, debt to GDP is over 100%.

So?

History has shown that when debt exceeds 90 percent of GDP, nations frequently enter into a debt supercycle. The interest on the debt becomes so great that servicing the debt becomes a bigger and bigger part of the budget, which leads to more borrowing to pay the debt and meet fiscal obligations. Which leads to an even higher debt to GDP percentage. Eventually creditors begin to doubt that nation's ability to service its debts and they begin to demand a higher interest return for their loans. And then you have a snowball effect which ultmately leads to a default.

See Greece for the latest example.


However, we have two things going for us. One, we are the world's reserve currency. And two, our economy is the best of a bad lot, which is why we are being charged a super-low interest rate on our loans. Everybody else sucks so bad that we look like a good risk.

We have been here before, right after WWII. Our debt to GDP was damn near 130 percent. Yet we did not implode nor default. Over the next nine years we had explosive growth and about 4 percent inflation. This considerably lowered out debt to GDP.

Unfortunately, I do not see explosive growth in our immediate future. China's and India's economic gains are coming at our expense.

Once China's and India's explosive growth reaches equilibrium, the US will begin to move forward again with job and GDP growth.

So it is a race against the clock whether we will financially implode under our debt first, or whether two billion new entrants into the global marketplace reach equilibrium first.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

Unemployment when Bush took office 4.2
Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2

US Debt January 20, 2001: $5,727,776,738,304.64
US Debt January 20, 2009: $10,626,877,048,913.08


Republican Party: Cut taxes and spend, spend, spend
Democratic Party: Raise taxes and spend, spend, spend

I kinda like the way David Mamet put it in "The Secret Knowledge,"...


1.”In the election of 2008, environmental, social and financial change were the concerns of both parties. The Right held that a return to first principles would arrest or re-channel this momentum toward bankruptcy and its attendant geopolitical dangers. It suggested fiscal conservatism, greater and more efficient exploitation of natural resources, lower taxes, a strong military. The Left’s view was to suggest that Change was good in itself- the problem need not be dealt with mechanically (by acts whose historical efficacy was demonstrable) but could be addressed psychologically, by identifying “change itself” as a solution.”

a. How to deal with this problematic change? The Conservative answer was increased exploitation of the exploitable and conservation of needless expenditure- in effect, sound business practice. The Liberal answer…cessation of the same.

b. Each side was interested in Justice: Conservatives held that it was best served by strict adherence to the rule of law; Liberals, by an increase in the granting of Rights.

 

[PredFan]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

I believe unemployment was at 7.8 but why quibble. The economy was shedding 750,000 jobs a month when Bush finally left office. It is now gaining 250,000 jobs a month. The Obama economy is making a million jobs a month more than Bush left him with

Gas dropped momentarily to $1.78 and then quickly shot up again. Lest we forget, Bush gave us our first $4.00 a gallon gas

Bush debt was $11.3 trillion and he was given a budget surplus when he started. Bush doubled his debt. Obamas budget has to compensate for two Bush wars, an unfunded Medicare Part D and a $2 trillion Bush tax cut

Bush added at most 6 trillion to the debt in 8 YEARS. Obama will add 5 in 4. Explain that away. The left insisted twice under Bush that gas prices WERE his fault, now suddenly the President has no control over gas prices.

As for jobs lets look at Congress, what was the unemployment rate in 2006 and when did it start to climb?

There's the truth right there.

 

[PredFan]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

What you are talking about is correlation without mentioning causation. (As are many posters in this thread, con and lib.) To put it more simply, you're not proving anything. You just grabbed some stats and explained who was president at that time. What did Bush do to keep gas so cheap? What did Obama do to make gas so expensive? (Or Congress, or whomever.)

Global temperatures have increasesd since Obama took office. OMG, Obama causes global warming!

More states are passing same-sex legislation. Holy Crap! Obama causes gay marriage!

9/11 happened while Bush was president. I knew it! Bush caused 9/11!

See how stupid this game is? Try using facts (including links if possible) to back up your implied arguments and see where that gets you.

So nothing is anyone's fault?

Damn, that changes things.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

Unemployment when Bush took office 4.2
Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2


Does the President control the price of gasoline?

Not control, but his actions can certainly effect the price of gas, as obama's has.

Really? Do tell the details.

 

[g5000]

The Left’s view was to suggest that Change was good in itself- the problem need not be dealt with mechanically (by acts whose historical efficacy was demonstrable) but could be addressed psychologically, by identifying “change itself” as a solution.”

Or to put it more simply:

1. We must do something.
2. This is something.
3. We must do this.


And that, boys and girls, is how we got ObamaCare!

 

[PredFan]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

disclosure: I voted against Obama, twice.

You HAVE to admit facts like: there were predictions of imminent collapse of the US and world economies when Obama came into office.

Unemployment numbers were bleeding when Bush left.

There was very little to no job creation with Bush tax cuts for wealthy.

Under GOP and Bush, two wars went unfunded.

so yeah, things are tough, but better than they were.

Who funds the wars? Oh that would be Congress. You know, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reed.

 

[wjmacguffin]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

What you are talking about is correlation without mentioning causation. (As are many posters in this thread, con and lib.) To put it more simply, you're not proving anything. You just grabbed some stats and explained who was president at that time. What did Bush do to keep gas so cheap? What did Obama do to make gas so expensive? (Or Congress, or whomever.)

Global temperatures have increasesd since Obama took office. OMG, Obama causes global warming!

More states are passing same-sex legislation. Holy Crap! Obama causes gay marriage!

9/11 happened while Bush was president. I knew it! Bush caused 9/11!

See how stupid this game is? Try using facts (including links if possible) to back up your implied arguments and see where that gets you.

You mean like creating signing statements that forbid new oil drilling on 85 percent of the areas Bush allowed it in? How about calling Senators to oppose the pipe line. Perhaps signing statements that close coal and gas power generating plants? Regulations that encourage the closing of Oil refineries? Do those count?

How about demanding we spend almost 50 cents on every dollar borrowed? Does that count? Calling for increases on taxes for those that invest in our businesses? Any of those count?

Yes, those count. Thanks! Those are attributed actions that can be researched and argued over rather than simple correlations, much better than the OP's words.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Unemployment when Bush took office 4.2
Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2


Does the President control the price of gasoline?

Not control, but his actions can certainly effect the price of gas, as obama's has.

Really? Do tell the details.

New regulations via signing statements ring a bell? Spending 50 percent of all federal money BORROWED. Banning drilling on 85 percent of the territory Bush allowed? Stopping a pipe line designed to increase oil flow and jobs? Ya Obama is not to blame.

 

[FuelRod]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

disclosure: I voted against Obama, twice.

You HAVE to admit facts like: there were predictions of imminent collapse of the US and world economies when Obama came into office.

Unemployment numbers were bleeding when Bush left.

There was very little to no job creation with Bush tax cuts for wealthy.

Under GOP and Bush, two wars went unfunded.

so yeah, things are tough, but better than they were.

Some of what you say is true.
It's also true that while things are better than they were, sometimes there is no where to go but up. That is what the enemic growth being experienced right now is. The left seems to be parroting the Obama administration about a "new normal." That's failure and not an option.

 

[Dante]

Unemployment when Bush took office 4.2
Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2

US Debt January 20, 2001: $5,727,776,738,304.64
US Debt January 20, 2009: $10,626,877,048,913.08


Republican Party: Cut taxes and spend, spend, spend
Democratic Party: Raise taxes and spend, spend, spend

I kinda like the way David Mamet put it in "The Secret Knowledge,"...


1.”In the election of 2008, environmental, social and financial change were the concerns of both parties. The Right held that a return to first principles would arrest or re-channel this momentum toward bankruptcy and its attendant geopolitical dangers. It suggested fiscal conservatism, greater and more efficient exploitation of natural resources, lower taxes, a strong military. The Left’s view was to suggest that Change was good in itself- the problem need not be dealt with mechanically (by acts whose historical efficacy was demonstrable) but could be addressed psychologically, by identifying “change itself” as a solution.”

a. How to deal with this problematic change? The Conservative answer was increased exploitation of the exploitable and conservation of needless expenditure- in effect, sound business practice. The Liberal answer…cessation of the same.

b. Each side was interested in Justice: Conservatives held that it was best served by strict adherence to the rule of law; Liberals, by an increase in the granting of Rights.

Wow a playwright?
how appropriate coming from you

A playwright, also called a dramatist and dramaturge, is a person who...



Oh the drama!

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

Not control, but his actions can certainly effect the price of gas, as obama's has.

Really? Do tell the details.

New regulations via signing statements ring a bell?

Please name these regulations and document their causal effects on the price of gas.

Spending 50 percent of all federal money BORROWED.

??? I would hope the government spends 100% of the money it borrows, as it makes little sense to borrow money you don't need to spend.

Banning drilling on 85 percent of the territory Bush allowed?

Obama has not banned drilling on 85% of the fields that were allowed under Bush, you are severely misinformed.

Stopping a pipe line designed to increase oil flow and jobs? Ya Obama is not to blame.

How many dollars per gallon did this cause the price of gas to increase?

 

[HUGGY]

3 things liberals can't lie about

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

That's six things.

 

[DontBeStupid]

I take that to mean you can't explain your position.

Want me to explain it for you?

Oh, i can explain it. But I see absolutely no point in doing so if you think it is irrelevant. But please, by all means, let us all see your explanation.

You want me to explain why it doesn't matter? While you refuse to explain why it does?

You never took a Logic class did you?

 

[Syphon]

Unemployment when Bush left office 7.2
Unemployment now. 8.3
Gasoline prices when Bush left office. 1.78
Gasoline prices now. 3.76
Debt when Bush left office. 10 trillion
Debt now. 15 trillion.

Spin away.

disclosure: I voted against Obama, twice.

You HAVE to admit facts like: there were predictions of imminent collapse of the US and world economies when Obama came into office.

Unemployment numbers were bleeding when Bush left.

There was very little to no job creation with Bush tax cuts for wealthy.

Under GOP and Bush, two wars went unfunded.

so yeah, things are tough, but better than they were.

Who funds the wars? Oh that would be Congress. You know, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reed.

actually since the GOP had control of congress at the time of wars they originally put the funding together. at that time they also decided to pass all war funding as emergency spending. under house rules, anything that is considered emergency spending does not hit the general budget and is thus not count towards the deficit.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

I take that to mean you can't explain your position.

Want me to explain it for you?

Oh, i can explain it. But I see absolutely no point in doing so if you think it is irrelevant. But please, by all means, let us all see your explanation.

You want me to explain why it doesn't matter? While you refuse to explain why it does?

You never took a Logic class did you?

Is that you rdodge from explaining why debt to GDP @ over 100% doesn't matters?