You are nothing but a bunch of damn bed-wetters

[Immanuel]

Sorry Immie but there is just no defense of the tactics that the right is using in the health care debate. It's ignorant, hate filled, fear mongering full of falsehoods and outright lies just look around on these boards.

It goes both ways PI2.

I have my belief about what this plan will do and I have stated them to the best of my ability. If I am wrong then I am more than willing to discuss the issue and learn more about it. However, "that is a lie" is not an argument. It is not proof. It is not discussion and that is about all I have read from the left to date. We get nothing of substance from the defenders of this plan. The only thing we hear is, "you're fear-mongering". That's bullshit. There is no argument there. Tell me where I am wrong. Prove to me that the prohibition of writing new contracts from Y1 D1 won't absolutely kill the industry. I believe it will and I have stated my reasons for doing so in a reasonable manner. I have been called a fear monger for doing so, but no one from the left can tell me why I am wrong.

Care has made some arguments about what she see's from this plan. She and I disagree but at least she's trying. A few others have as well. Sorry, PI2, just realized you are new and may not know who Care is. Care is the nickname for my favorite poster... Care4all, but don't tell her I said she was my favorite. Oh and don't tell any of the other ladies on site either. It will get me in even bigger trouble than being a fear-monger

I may very well be wrong in my belief that the intention of this plan by the U.S. government is control of the Health Insurance Industry, the elimination of Private Insurance, bigger government and higher taxes. But, don't tell me I am a liar for stating my beliefs in a manner that is open for debate.

Prove to me that I am wrong. It would not be the first time someone has done so and won my respect for doing so. Also note: I'm a Taurus and I am stubborn as all hell, you can ask Care4all about that, but I am open to learning and being proven wrong.

Immie

What do you say to a blatant lie some of these claims are so Ignorant and over the top they don't even deserve to be addressed. Let's take the "Death Panel" rhetoric that has been flung about. How do you make the leap from verbage in the bill speaking of "end of life counseling" to the formation of a death panel? It was fear mongering and a lie plain and simple. As far as the Government taking over the Health care industry show me where in the Bill that they are moving in and taking over. Whatever you read into the bill is your business but there is no legitimate support for your fear of the government taking over the health care industry if there is language that supports your position please feel free to post it. And don't hand me the argument of prove me wrong how about you prove yourself right.

Let me take this from the left hand side of the argument... as if I were one of you.

First off, the bill says nothing about "Death Panels". There is nothing in the bill that sets up any such thing. There will be some determination as to what coverage will be extended through the plan, but no where does the bill allow for a panel of professionals who will determine who lives and who dies. By the way, did you know that private insurers already determine whether or not an individual is covered for certain medical problems?

"End of life counseling" has been clearly defined and it has nothing to do with promoting "assisted suicide". Several hospice organizations... including (I don't have the back up to find that at the moment) have spoken out in favor of this counseling. Anyone who has dealt with terminal illnesses and had the assistance of a hospice organization can tell you about the benefits and care given by these organizations. If you have never dealt with one then let me give you peace on this as a person who actually has recently... (I could go on with the experience I dealt with during the passing of my father last June).

As for your concern about government usurpation of the health insurance industry, there really is nothing to be concerned about. The government will open the exchange up and provide plenty of options for private insurers in both pricing and marketing of their policies. This is simply an effort to make the purchase of health insurance easier for all.

Okay, stepping back into my own point of view let me say:

I don't believe there will be a "Death Panel" not right away. I am concerned that this country is moving towards such a thing where we will encourage our elderly to "die with dignity" in the future, but that is not part of this bill and if and when the country goes that route, that will be the time to fight that battle. This is not the time for that battle.

End of life counseling, I honestly have had a recent experience with hospice care and I have had some training in estate planning although I am by no means an expert. I think end of life counseling as described in this debate would be very good. Too many people don't understand what is coming upon them when the end is near.

Government takeover of the Health Insurance Industry--this is one of my three biggest problems with the plan the others being forcing us all to become government dependent and the cost/increased taxes forthcoming/eventual bankruptcy of the plan. I am very concerned that the prohibition of writing new policies from the institution of the plan will spell the death of the Private Insurance Industry. I have laid out my reasons for this elsewhere so won't go into it again unless asked. But I believe that the prohibition of writing new policies and inability to price their products or limit their costs will kill the industry. For speaking this concern, I have been called a fear monger, yet, no one from the left will do anything at all to allay my fears.

Immie

 

[Immanuel]

Oh and one more thing, PI2, don't use the words of a politician, either liberal or conservative, Democrat or Republican, as your proof "text". They hold no water with me. I don't trust them in the least.

Immie

With a statement like that I have to wonder why you bother to post here at all shouldn't you be storing food and water in the bunker and hunkering down? Or maybe cracking a cold one and tuning in American Idol.

Read my signature line!

Someone has to fight to send them packing. You guys won't do it!

Edit: And another reason I post here is that I enjoy reading other people's opinion on the subjects we are discussing. I don't expect to be right in my opinions, but I expect to be able to state them reasonably and then to read what you and others think about them and maybe learn something I did not know. There was a thread, about why do you come here a few weeks ago. Well, I come here because I enjoy discussing politics and I have a family that doesn't want to talk about it. So, I come here to talk. By the way, as far as I know there are no politicians posting on these boards and the only one I think may work for a politician is OneWorld. I'm sure he's a Pelosi plant.

How about you post a passage from the bill and try and give us your interpretation to support the statements you've made. Otherwise I am going to go watch the grass grow.

I stated it although I didn't link it this time. But, I have in many other threads. Search my name and Y1 D1 or maybe Y1D1 (no space) and you'll find it easy. I also gave my interpretation of that passage in my last post which was in answer to a previous one of yours... do I have to retype it?

Immie

 

[EriktheRed]

White House explains Obama 'wee-weed up' comment - Yahoo! News
snip,

President Barack Obama puzzled people when he said Washington "gets all wee-weed up." The White House offered a translation Friday: Folks are wetting the bed over the health care debate.

So, if you are debating government health care, you are damn bed-wetter. Mr articulate just said so.

Debating? No.

Acting like a bunch of assholes in public over it and believing the fearmongering of jagoff radio personalities and a ditzy ex-Governor? You betcha!

 

[PI2]

It goes both ways PI2.

I have my belief about what this plan will do and I have stated them to the best of my ability. If I am wrong then I am more than willing to discuss the issue and learn more about it. However, "that is a lie" is not an argument. It is not proof. It is not discussion and that is about all I have read from the left to date. We get nothing of substance from the defenders of this plan. The only thing we hear is, "you're fear-mongering". That's bullshit. There is no argument there. Tell me where I am wrong. Prove to me that the prohibition of writing new contracts from Y1 D1 won't absolutely kill the industry. I believe it will and I have stated my reasons for doing so in a reasonable manner. I have been called a fear monger for doing so, but no one from the left can tell me why I am wrong.

Care has made some arguments about what she see's from this plan. She and I disagree but at least she's trying. A few others have as well. Sorry, PI2, just realized you are new and may not know who Care is. Care is the nickname for my favorite poster... Care4all, but don't tell her I said she was my favorite. Oh and don't tell any of the other ladies on site either. It will get me in even bigger trouble than being a fear-monger

I may very well be wrong in my belief that the intention of this plan by the U.S. government is control of the Health Insurance Industry, the elimination of Private Insurance, bigger government and higher taxes. But, don't tell me I am a liar for stating my beliefs in a manner that is open for debate.

Prove to me that I am wrong. It would not be the first time someone has done so and won my respect for doing so. Also note: I'm a Taurus and I am stubborn as all hell, you can ask Care4all about that, but I am open to learning and being proven wrong.

Immie

What do you say to a blatant lie some of these claims are so Ignorant and over the top they don't even deserve to be addressed. Let's take the "Death Panel" rhetoric that has been flung about. How do you make the leap from verbage in the bill speaking of "end of life counseling" to the formation of a death panel? It was fear mongering and a lie plain and simple. As far as the Government taking over the Health care industry show me where in the Bill that they are moving in and taking over. Whatever you read into the bill is your business but there is no legitimate support for your fear of the government taking over the health care industry if there is language that supports your position please feel free to post it. And don't hand me the argument of prove me wrong how about you prove yourself right.

Let me take this from the left hand side of the argument... as if I were one of you.

First off, the bill says nothing about "Death Panels". There is nothing in the bill that sets up any such thing. There will be some determination as to what coverage will be extended through the plan, but no where does the bill allow for a panel of professionals who will determine who lives and who dies. By the way, did you know that private insurers already determine whether or not an individual is covered for certain medical problems?

"End of life counseling" has been clearly defined and it has nothing to do with promoting "assisted suicide". Several hospice organizations... including (I don't have the back up to find that at the moment) have spoken out in favor of this counseling. Anyone who has dealt with terminal illnesses and had the assistance of a hospice organization can tell you about the benefits and care given by these organizations. If you have never dealt with one then let me give you peace on this as a person who actually has recently... (I could go on with the experience I dealt with during the passing of my father last June).

As for your concern about government usurpation of the health insurance industry, there really is nothing to be concerned about. The government will open the exchange up and provide plenty of options for private insurers in both pricing and marketing of their policies. This is simply an effort to make the purchase of health insurance easier for all.

Okay, stepping back into my own point of view let me say:

I don't believe there will be a "Death Panel" not right away. I am concerned that this country is moving towards such a thing where we will encourage our elderly to "die with dignity" in the future, but that is not part of this bill and if and when the country goes that route, that will be the time to fight that battle. This is not the time for that battle.

End of life counseling, I honestly have had a recent experience with hospice care and I have had some training in estate planning although I am by no means an expert. I think end of life counseling as described in this debate would be very good. Too many people don't understand what is coming upon them when the end is near.

Government takeover of the Health Insurance Industry--this is one of my three biggest problems with the plan the others being forcing us all to become government dependent and the cost/increased taxes forthcoming/eventual bankruptcy of the plan. I am very concerned that the prohibition of writing new policies from the institution of the plan will spell the death of the Private Insurance Industry. I have laid out my reasons for this elsewhere so won't go into it again unless asked. But I believe that the prohibition of writing new policies and inability to price their products or limit their costs will kill the industry. For speaking this concern, I have been called a fear monger, yet, no one from the left will do anything at all to allay my fears.

Immie

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

 

[Diuretic]

*yawn*


Really, there's more important things than a president's off-the-cuff remarks that have zero impact on domestic or foreign policy.

Blame the 24 hour news cycle again...

Good for some laughs and some laughs are good.

Yeah, good for laughs, but some people read waaaaaaaaaay too much into it (see some posts on this very thread). "Wee-weed" isn't ghetto-slang, its a lighthearted childish poke. Big deal. Move on.

Methinks some people here have never heard of the story of the little boy who cried wolf...

He grew up and became Glenn Beck.

 

[Immanuel]

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

 

[RadiomanATL]

Good for some laughs and some laughs are good.

Yeah, good for laughs, but some people read waaaaaaaaaay too much into it (see some posts on this very thread). "Wee-weed" isn't ghetto-slang, its a lighthearted childish poke. Big deal. Move on.

Methinks some people here have never heard of the story of the little boy who cried wolf...

He grew up and became Glenn Beck.

Yeah, he's one of the "wolfers" as I like to call them.

 

[alan1]

White House explains Obama 'wee-weed up' comment - Yahoo! News
snip,

President Barack Obama puzzled people when he said Washington "gets all wee-weed up." The White House offered a translation Friday: Folks are wetting the bed over the health care debate.

So, if you are debating government health care, you are damn bed-wetter. Mr articulate just said so.

Debating? No.

Acting like a bunch of assholes in public over it and believing the fearmongering of jagoff radio personalities and a ditzy ex-Governor? You betcha!

And yet another person that failed to read the article, or more specifically the part I quoted that implicitly said "Washington", as in the congress. the true colors are coming out as evident by the people (like you) posting a defense that has absolutely nothing to do with what the point was.
Mr Obama wasn't talking about people shouting at town halls or radio you moron. He was talking about Washington.

 

[PI2]

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

 

[Meister]

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

Yeah they can see both sides of the road.,, Something the left, and the right can't say.

 

[PI2]

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

 

[Meister]

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

Oh brother...one of those. Didn't like the answer so.....

 

[PI2]

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

Tolerant No I'm not tolerant after the destruction foisted on this country by the last administration I have no tolerance for anything from the right. Remember the election?
And you showed nothing other than your support for the right wing talking points.
Your thinly veiled threat of ending polite discussion... well If you choose to show your ignorance by being rude or profane because I called you on your inability to show support for your assertions be my guest.

 

[Diuretic]

Right labeling the left point of view as thinking like "one of you" slipping back into your real skin and spewing the right wing talking points then renders your (for lack of a better analogy) "Bi-partisanship" mute.
I'm going to go watch the grass grow now.

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

Something about yellow lines and dead armadilloes?

 

[alan1]

Something about yellow lines and dead armadilloes?

Keep your armored dildos to yourself.

 

[Ringel05]

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

Something about yellow lines and dead armadilloes?

 

[The T]

White House explains Obama 'wee-weed up' comment - Yahoo! News
snip,


So, if you are debating government health care, you are damn bed-wetter. Mr articulate just said so.

Debating? No.

Acting like a bunch of assholes in public over it and believing the fearmongering of jagoff radio personalities and a ditzy ex-Governor? You betcha!

And yet another person that failed to read the article, or more specifically the part I quoted that implicitly said "Washington", as in the congress. the true colors are coming out as evident by the people (like you) posting a defense that has absolutely nothing to do with what the point was.
Mr Obama wasn't talking about people shouting at town halls or radio you moron. He was talking about Washington.

as a service to you? I will post his comments...(I agree with you...know that)...

Obama: Everyone Gets 'Wee Weed Up' in August

 

[PI2]

I wasn't trying to be "Bi-Partisan". You asked me how to deal with what you termed lies and fear-mongering. I did just that and I did it in a polite way. Which by the way is something not found too often coming from the so-called tolerant left.

I was also reading your attempts at a conversation as being an honest attempt to open up polite dialogue. Was I wrong?

And one more thing, I'm not a member of the right. I'm pretty close to being center of the road with many thoughts being liberal based. Ask most of the posters on here, about that.

Immie

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

Oh brother...one of those. Didn't like the answer so.....

Oh Look Marge there's another one standing right in the middle of the road what do you suppose they're up to? Was he wearing his shorts on the outside did you see that Marge he was wearing his bleeding tighty whities on the outside of his pants! I saw Geoffrey I saw and look he's got something that looks like a turd for an avatar.

 

[alan1]

Well you know what they say about standing in the middle of the road.

Oh brother...one of those. Didn't like the answer so.....

Oh Look Marge there's another one standing right in the middle of the road what do you suppose they're up to? Was he wearing his shorts on the outside did you see that Marge he was wearing his bleeding tighty whities on the outside of his pants! I saw Geoffrey I saw and look he's got something that looks like a turd for an avatar.

That's twice you said that. Go flame somewhere else.

 

[PI2]

Something about yellow lines and dead armadilloes?

Keep your armored dildos to yourself.

LOL put your glasses on