What no looting?

[Wicked Jester]

Doesn't cost a cent to walk, or to help those who can't.

And for 36 hours prior, it didn't cost a cent to ride the bus either.

The strongest argument in this thread is Jake's "Mini wasn't there" crap.

That's their best hope, rewriting history.

Take a bus where? if you don't have family anywhere else but New Orleans and no money, where are you supposed to go?

Higher ground?

 

[editec]

An enlightened and civilized people.

Eeeekk!!!!

Enlightened, yes.

Civilized???

Could be, now.

WWII showed us how uncivilized they can be.

Remember the Battan Death March

Or the rape of Manchuria which was even more outrageous than even the Bataan Death March.

When societies go mad, (as Japan's obviously had) stuff like this happens.

Who'd have thought, in say 1919, that the German society would also go so mad as to support the NAZI's insanity?

Aside from Keynes, I mean?

He warned people that systematic bankrupting Germany's economy and ending all hopes that they could recover from WWI was going to blow up in Europe's face, and he was spot on, wasn't he?

Incidently, the USA is no exception to this kind of collective madness.

No tyrant or madman who gains enough power every had trouble finding enough people willing carry out his insanity.

This is, one of the more disturbing aspects of social psychology, really.

 

[LostAmerican]

An enlightened and civilized people.

Eeeekk!!!!

Enlightened, yes.

Civilized???

Could be, now.

WWII showed us how uncivilized they can be.

Remember the Battan Death March

Or the rape of Manchuria which was even more outrageous than even the Bataan Death March.

When societies go mad, (as Japan's obviously had) stuff like this happens.

Who'd have thought, in say 1919, that the German society would also go so mad as to support the NAZI's insanity?

Aside from Keynes, I mean?

He warned people that systematic bankrupting Germany's economy and ending all hopes that they could recover from WWI was going to blow up in Europe's face, and he was spot on, wasn't he?

Incidently, the USA is no exception to this kind of collective madness.

No tyrant or madman who gains enough power every had trouble finding enough people willing carry out his insanity.

This is, one of the more disturbing aspects of social psychology, really.

Who'd have thought that one day Mexicans would be ordering the President of the United States around?

 

[HUGGY]

Oh that's nice. Now I'm a white supremacist? Really Huggy? I'm a fucking Indian you idiot!

NOAA issued 53 warnings prior to landfall, and another 7 over the succeeding 24 hours. From August 28th at around 10am, the warnings basically said "If you stay in New Orleans, you're going to die." Go read them yourself:

Hurricane KATRINA Advisory Archive

So the people who stayed, because they didn't have transportation, couldn't read, or didn't understand English (I have no argument for the true invalids....all 20-30 of them), were paralyzed BEFORE landfall, but magically became mobile enough AFTER landfall to find the French Quarter and Canal Street?

Guess what.....

Had they gone on to Canal and the Quarter prior to landfall, they would have been fine. Those areas were not hit nearly as hard, and in fact are basically where they evacuated everyone to once they could get out of L-9 (the Dome and CC are steps off of Canal)

But that story doesn't score you any political or racial apologist points, does it?

They chose to stay in L-9. That proved a fatal decision, even AFTER they were ordered to leave. Once landfall had happened, they couldn't get out. As soon as they could, did they seek help? Nope. Did they band together and save each other? Nope. They broke into every abandoned house they came across. Then they hauled ass to Canal and busted every window they could find, and hauled their new shit back to their flooded homes in L-9. Most of them were black. Some of them were white. NONE of them were Indians.

White supremacist.....

That's the best laugh I've had in months.

Whites stole everything they have, and everything that was ours. And now, the blacks are going to steal it from you.

That is poetic justice, my friend. I doubt I'll get to see it, not from here at least. But when it happens (and we all know it will), think of me, and the smile that will crawl across my face.

Did I name you in the indictment? Ya I like a big score! That's why I hate soccer. Don't get me started on Native Americans. I'm not going to go through all the NOAA memos...give me the Cliff Notes version. #1 Did the warnings specifically say "Your house will be under water from a failed levee"? #2 How do you know the warnings actually got to the people at risk?

Huggy, quit while you're behind.

There is not "I" in "Team" and no "quit" in HUGGY!!!!

 

[HUGGY]

Did I name you in the indictment? Ya I like a big score! That's why I hate soccer. Don't get me started on Native Americans. I'm not going to go through all the NOAA memos...give me the Cliff Notes version. #1 Did the warnings specifically say "Your house will be under water from a failed levee"? #2 How do you know the warnings actually got to the people at risk?

From the NOAA warnings (SEVERAL of them)

A HURRICANE WARNING IS IN EFFECT FOR THE NORTH CENTRAL GULF COAST
FROM MORGAN CITY LOUISIANA EASTWARD TO THE ALABAMA/FLORIDA
BORDER...INCLUDING THE CITY OF NEW ORLEANS AND LAKE PONTCHARTRAIN.
PREPARATIONS TO PROTECT LIFE AND PROPERTY SHOULD BE COMPLETED THIS
EVENING.

COASTAL STORM SURGE FLOODING OF 18 TO 22 FEET ABOVE NORMAL TIDE
LEVELS...LOCALLY AS HIGH AS 28 FEET...ALONG WITH LARGE AND DANGEROUS
BATTERING WAVES...CAN BE EXPECTED NEAR AND TO THE EAST OF WHERE THE
CENTER MAKES LANDFALL. SOME LEVEES IN THE GREATER NEW ORLEANS AREA
COULD BE OVERTOPPED.

So no, it doesn't say "Tyrone Chatham's house is gonna get fucked up," or "Bessie Mae Johnson, you need to pack yo shit an git, girl!"

And no, I don't think they sent the warnings via Certified Mail, rap songs, or printed on the side of liquor bottles, where a larger percentage of the people would have probably seen it.

They DID send vans through with loud speakers, but again, they probably used multi-syllabic words like "evacuate" and "hurricane," and probably did not take into account the fact that residents of L-9 tend to run away quickly from ANY vehicle with the Seal of the City of New Orleans painted on its doors.

And the warnings also assume that people know how tall "28 feet" is, and what specific terms such as "Louisiana," Preparations," "Levees," and "New Orleans" mean.

The only people more worthy of Darwin Awards than those who ignored EVERYONE and EVERYTHING telling them to leave, ORDERING them to leave, are the people who want to victimize and apologize for them.

They chose to stay. That's the only fact that matters, for without that choice, Katrina is just another hurricane.

And Katrina did exactly what everyone said it would do, destroying everything in its path.

But somehow, its whitey's fault for not sending a fucking limo to pick them up and take them clubbing until the storm had passed.

Alrighty, then...

But one glaring question remains Huggy, for you and all those crying and apologizing about it 10 years later.....

Where the fuck were YOU?

August 29 2005? Fuck if I know...I was pretty focused on one of my inventions around then. I also started writing my first book about then. All I can say I contributed to that disaster was helping a refugee family from NO repair their truck they had driven up to Seattle to stay with some friends of mine.

I rarely cry. I can count the times in my whole life on my hands with fingers to spare. I apologize more frequently.

 

[Grace]

Take a bus where? if you don't have family anywhere else but New Orleans and no money, where are you supposed to go?

They were ordered to evacuate. The Superdome was made available to those who had nowhere to evacuate TO, just as it had always been provided in hurricane conditions. Buses were provided at no charge to shuttle people there, and NOAA had already told everyone that "wooden structures would likely not sustain the destruction."

They ended up walking to the Superdome, through flooded streets, AFTER landfall.

They still chose to stay.

As desperate as people remain to find some other reason for the death and destruction, no one can get over that small, but immovable hurdle.

I personally would have went to the superdome, I don't know why the people stayed, maybe trying to save their homes?

Perhaps some didn't want to leave their "kids"..meaning animals/pets. I know if I were ordered to evacuate and could not take my pets...I would refuse to go. But that's me.

 

[jeffrockit]

What no looting?

I am watching the aftermath of the earthquake in Japan, something that has effected the entire country. Reports are coming in that the shops are closed and that people are on the roads looking for food and water.

I am amazed at the how the Japanese are responding... in comparison to how the people involved in the katrina flood responded.

They are not looting businesses or turning into whining animals.

Amazing comparison don't you think?

Apples and oranges. Japan's government responded 5 days faster than the US government. In the seiously damage areas that I've seen, there was nothing left. And it depends on your definition of 'looting'.

You don't get to choose your definition.

looting - plundering during riots or in wartime
robbery
pillaging, plundering, pillage - the act of stealing valuable things from a place; "the plundering of the Parthenon"; "his plundering of the great authors"
looting - definition of looting by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

 

[mudwhistle]

Did I name you in the indictment? Ya I like a big score! That's why I hate soccer. Don't get me started on Native Americans. I'm not going to go through all the NOAA memos...give me the Cliff Notes version. #1 Did the warnings specifically say "Your house will be under water from a failed levee"? #2 How do you know the warnings actually got to the people at risk?

Huggy, quit while you're behind.

There is not "I" in "Team" and no "quit" in HUGGY!!!!

Even when you're wrong????

For someone like you that makes sense.

 

[strollingbones]

i am so ready to loot....i am just waiting for the occasion....i got comfie shoes....i got baggy clothes....i got a do rag....now i have to convince my son to go with me and carry stuff for me...oo i need a shopping cart....

 

[mudwhistle]

They were ordered to evacuate. The Superdome was made available to those who had nowhere to evacuate TO, just as it had always been provided in hurricane conditions. Buses were provided at no charge to shuttle people there, and NOAA had already told everyone that "wooden structures would likely not sustain the destruction."

They ended up walking to the Superdome, through flooded streets, AFTER landfall.

They still chose to stay.

As desperate as people remain to find some other reason for the death and destruction, no one can get over that small, but immovable hurdle.

I personally would have went to the superdome, I don't know why the people stayed, maybe trying to save their homes?

Perhaps some didn't want to leave their "kids"..meaning animals/pets. I know if I were ordered to evacuate and could not take my pets...I would refuse to go. But that's me.

I think I would find somewhere else to go. I definitely wouldn't go someplace the government was running unless it was a last resort. As you remember, the Superdome deal turned into a disaster.

 

[mudwhistle]

What no looting?

I am watching the aftermath of the earthquake in Japan, something that has effected the entire country. Reports are coming in that the shops are closed and that people are on the roads looking for food and water.

I am amazed at the how the Japanese are responding... in comparison to how the people involved in the katrina flood responded.

They are not looting businesses or turning into whining animals.

Amazing comparison don't you think?

Apples and oranges. Japan's government responded 5 days faster than the US government. In the seiously damage areas that I've seen, there was nothing left. And it depends on your definition of 'looting'.

You don't get to choose your definition.

looting - plundering during riots or in wartime
robbery
pillaging, plundering, pillage - the act of stealing valuable things from a place; "the plundering of the Parthenon"; "his plundering of the great authors"
looting - definition of looting by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

The press claims that, but is it true?

The National Guard and Coast Guard was flying people out shortly after the flood. Bush asked LA's Democrat Governor for days if he could send in soldiers to help and was refused until pressure from the press became enormous.

Everyone seems to think that Bush needed to personally lift every shovel and fly every bird into the flood-zone, but Obama is allowed to remain detached during crisis after crisis and work on his brackets, take trips to Brazil. It took Obama weeks to react to the BP oil-spill. He said it was BP's problem. He would simply monitor the situation. The fighting in Libya is also being monitored, as is the rising price of fuel, oil, gasoline, Diesel. Where's the fairness in this???

 

[sitarro]

I was born in Alabama, and lived on the Gulf Coast until August 17, 1969.

Google it.

It made Katrina look like a thunderstorm.

On August 18, Dad moved us to Birmingham, but we always kept a home on the coast.

I now have businesses in Bayou la Batre and Biloxi. But New Orleans and Katrina was work with a close friend and business partner, who is a documentary film maker....sometimes. I was very adept with cameras, I owned my own business so I could take off on a whim, and I knew New Orleans very well, so I was a logical choice. We were there for 3 months at the start, all on our own dime, and we gave away a good bit of our own money and an assload of our time, mostly in rice, water and staples....... and a rebuilt Buddhist Temple.

Fuck all of you. What did you do to help them? Laugh at the people who went to help? Good little fuckers, all of you!

Why I ever entertained the thought of arguing with a bunch of folks who weren't there but want to tell me what I saw is beyond me. A true exercise in futility when dealing with the bias of minds as shown by Ravi, Jake, and CG. Huggy, I believe, is just trying to score some rep Not my intention but ...hey why not? Please feel free to give me a bump!

The simple fact is, New Orleans still hasn't recovered. It is not what it was before Katrina, and hopefully, it never will be. If you don't believe me, go visit. L-9 is gone, and it will not come back in our lifetimes. Because the City doesn't want it back. Katrina did New Orleans a favor in L-9. The Quarter is the same as it ever was. Guess who still lives there? Metairie (the true engine of NO), is still Metairie, just as it was the day before, and the day after. People rebuilt their homes, then went into the city to reclaim what was left of their businesses and jobs.

But the areas that took the direct hit....Pass Christian, Bay St. Louis (nice try Jake, but it was a dead giveaway) and particularly Waveland, recovered quickly and have prospered and grown. They didn't sit on their asses waiting for someone to come and save them. They saved themselves. And they have clung together, not preyed on each other as did the residents of L-9, as did almost ALL of NO proper.

So tell yourselves whatever you want if it helps you sleep better at night. Katrina was a wind of rainbows and unicorns, and it pulled the entire Earth together in a sense of brotherhood and unity. There was no looting. There was no fighting. They did not rape and steal from each other. They joined hands, sung negro spirituals and Christian hymns, and then went to work rebuilding their city. The sky was beautiful the next morning, and foxes laid with hens.

Or.......it showed people's true nature. It showed what they were, at their core.....what they were willing to do, and what they weren't. It showed who they wanted to help, and who they didn't.

I don't care what you chose to believe, because I saw it, and I know the truth.

Sleep well, lemmings.

OK maybe I laid to much at your feet but seriously...My thoughts if I was there certainly wouldn't be about televisions. What those people needed was some leadership. I'm sure if they had thought about it and knew old black folks were stuck up in their attics drowning they would have all tried to help. What would have made YOU a hero would be to have recognized the situation with the drowning citizens and organized some search parties...comandeer some boats and tools and get crackin! That would have been my action. I'm sure you wished you had thought to do more when it counted. I'm sure we all do.

Huggy, the pro Monday morning quarterback......... absolutely amazing.

 

[sitarro]

Simplistic...not simple. Firstly you would have to make it clear to those people in the Parish that their homes would likely be under water if they stayed. I do not believe those people had that exact warning. Just telling people that a hurricane is approaching when many have easily survived them in the past is a criminal lie. The other tiny detail you have not taken into account is that MOST of the people there did not have the means( cash or transportation or a place to go) or the physical ability, in the cases of many of the elderly that drowned, to escape.

I'm getting tired of explaining the obvious to people that obviously have another agenda to promote.....AKA white supremacy. "Hey Looky at ME!!!! I'm superior to people of color because they stole and drowned and I didn't!!!"

Oh that's nice. Now I'm a white supremacist? Really Huggy? I'm a fucking Indian you idiot!

NOAA issued 53 warnings prior to landfall, and another 7 over the succeeding 24 hours. From August 28th at around 10am, the warnings basically said "If you stay in New Orleans, you're going to die." Go read them yourself:

Hurricane KATRINA Advisory Archive

So the people who stayed, because they didn't have transportation, couldn't read, or didn't understand English (I have no argument for the true invalids....all 20-30 of them), were paralyzed BEFORE landfall, but magically became mobile enough AFTER landfall to find the French Quarter and Canal Street?

Guess what.....

Had they gone on to Canal and the Quarter prior to landfall, they would have been fine. Those areas were not hit nearly as hard, and in fact are basically where they evacuated everyone to once they could get out of L-9 (the Dome and CC are steps off of Canal)

But that story doesn't score you any political or racial apologist points, does it?

They chose to stay in L-9. That proved a fatal decision, even AFTER they were ordered to leave. Once landfall had happened, they couldn't get out. As soon as they could, did they seek help? Nope. Did they band together and save each other? Nope. They broke into every abandoned house they came across. Then they hauled ass to Canal and busted every window they could find, and hauled their new shit back to their flooded homes in L-9. Most of them were black. Some of them were white. NONE of them were Indians.

White supremacist.....

That's the best laugh I've had in months.

Whites stole everything they have, and everything that was ours. And now, the blacks are going to steal it from you.

That is poetic justice, my friend. I doubt I'll get to see it, not from here at least. But when it happens (and we all know it will), think of me, and the smile that will crawl across my face.

I was north of Houston, I'm from Louisiana originally, there is no way I would have stayed anywhere near the Gulf Coast with a category 5 hurricane approaching. We received over 250,000 of the "refugees", where ever they ended up, mostly in Southeast Houston, it has become disaster areas. Apartment complexes were burning each week. Very few went back to help rebuild, to this day.

 

[sitarro]

Japan is now an incredible society that had one of the best economies in the world. Germany is doing good too. That is what I meant.

Had is the key word here.... HAD

Their economy was, and is, in the tank for doing what we are CURRENTLY doing.

This is going to hurt Japan in a bad way any way ya look at it.

Maybe..maybe not.

Horrible as it is..they are going to need to rebuild. And that opens up a great deal of opportunity.

Incredibly stupid, liberal attempt at thinking. How is having to spend a couple hundred billion to attempt to get back to where you were a good thing........... It's so amazing that imbeciles just like you are attempting to run this country......... are you in the current administration? You sound like it.

 

[LostAmerican]

[
Japan is now an incredible society that had one of the best economies in the world. Germany is doing good too. That is what I meant.

Had is the key word here.... HAD

Their economy was, and is, in the tank for doing what we are CURRENTLY doing.

This is going to hurt Japan in a bad way any way ya look at it.

But the Japanese and Germans weren't and aren't the "crybabies" that Latin Americans are.

"Feed us evil America! You OWE us!" then crank out a few million more bandito babies to prove that they aren't poor.

Compare overpopulated Latin America to Africa. Children don't last long in countries with real poverty.

 

[Mini 14]

\
I was north of Houston, I'm from Louisiana originally, there is no way I would have stayed anywhere near the Gulf Coast with a category 5 hurricane approaching. We received over 250,000 of the "refugees", where ever they ended up, mostly in Southeast Houston, it has become disaster areas. Apartment complexes were burning each week. Very few went back to help rebuild, to this day.

We had a similar experience here, when 1200 were brought in to FEMA trailers set up at a State Park just outside of town.

The Sheriff almost went insane trying to keep order there, and to this day, the Tallapoosa County Jail has an affectionate nickname to remind us all.

If the Sheriff offers to take you to see "The French Quarter," don't be alarmed. You'll get to make 1 phone call first.

But not all of them were bad people, in fact most of them were great, and some even wound up staying. There was one family of cajuns from Lafourche who were real badasses and really good people. 4 brothers and a couple of cousins, and their families. The Sheriff told me that on 2-3 occasions, when arriving at the State Park to respond to a call, the "Lafourche Boys" would have the perpetrator sitting on the ground, waiting on the Sheriff. The Sheriff thought it was funny that the perpetrator had always "fallen down" and hurt himself very badly just before the Sheriff arrived.

The Lafourche Boys didn't stay, though many of us wished they had. They were one of the VERY few families who found/accepted temporary jobs in our community, and we even threw a going away party for them when they left about a year later. The Sheriff made them honorary Deputies at the party, and we iced the beer down in a pirogue a local had built to give to them.

They were true cajuns....great people. We miss them.

 

[waltky]

Who got the loot?...

$500,000 vanishes from tsunami-ravaged bank
3/22/2011 - 'Somebody stole the money in the midst of the chaos,' Japanese police official says

The earthquake and tsunami that pulverized coastal Japan crippled a bank's security mechanisms and left a vault wide open. That allowed someone to walk off with 40 million yen ($500,000).

The March 11 tsunami washed over the Shinkin Bank, like much else in Kesennuma, and police said between the wave's power and the ensuing power outages, the vault came open.

"The bank was flooded, and things were thrown all over. It was a total mess. Somebody stole the money in the midst of the chaos," said a police official in Miyagi prefecture, where Kesennuma is located.

The bank notified police on Tuesday, 11 days after the disaster, said the official, who spoke on customary condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media.

Source

 

[High_Gravity]

Who got the loot?...

$500,000 vanishes from tsunami-ravaged bank
3/22/2011 - 'Somebody stole the money in the midst of the chaos,' Japanese police official says

The earthquake and tsunami that pulverized coastal Japan crippled a bank's security mechanisms and left a vault wide open. That allowed someone to walk off with 40 million yen ($500,000).

The March 11 tsunami washed over the Shinkin Bank, like much else in Kesennuma, and police said between the wave's power and the ensuing power outages, the vault came open.

"The bank was flooded, and things were thrown all over. It was a total mess. Somebody stole the money in the midst of the chaos," said a police official in Miyagi prefecture, where Kesennuma is located.

The bank notified police on Tuesday, 11 days after the disaster, said the official, who spoke on customary condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media.

Source

Well so much for the Japanese don't loot theory.

 

[High_Gravity]

But there was looting in Japan - Chicago Sun-Times

 

[LostAmerican]

Who got the loot?...

$500,000 vanishes from tsunami-ravaged bank
3/22/2011 - 'Somebody stole the money in the midst of the chaos,' Japanese police official says

The earthquake and tsunami that pulverized coastal Japan crippled a bank's security mechanisms and left a vault wide open. That allowed someone to walk off with 40 million yen ($500,000).

The March 11 tsunami washed over the Shinkin Bank, like much else in Kesennuma, and police said between the wave's power and the ensuing power outages, the vault came open.

"The bank was flooded, and things were thrown all over. It was a total mess. Somebody stole the money in the midst of the chaos," said a police official in Miyagi prefecture, where Kesennuma is located.

The bank notified police on Tuesday, 11 days after the disaster, said the official, who spoke on customary condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media.

Source

Well so much for the Japanese don't loot theory.

Could you walk away from that loot?