What does the GOP have to offer?

[Mr. Shaman]

What does the GOP have to offer?

 

[RDD_1210]

Republicans will ...
- repeal Obamacare
- stop the EPA and unions from destroying US companies
- quit raising taxes to pay for social programs and more spending
- maintain a strong national defense
- invest in areas the Feds should like the space industry instead of the green industry

Thanks for the laugh.

 

[IndependntLogic]

A better chance at reduced government.. Does it always happen? Nope.. But it is more likely than with a DEM

Republicans will ...
- repeal Obamacare
This would be a good thing and is so obvious, it needs no verification. So what would they offer as an alternative?
- stop the EPA and unions from destroying US companies
How does the EPA "destroy companies" and what would the GOP do? Get rid of it? Not likely. Unions? They're weak and inconsequential nowadays but okay, what would the GOP do? Make them illegal?
- quit raising taxes to pay for social programs and more spending
Have you seen a single tax increase in the last 3 years? I haven't. I have seen cuts though.
- maintain a strong national defense
How? What does that mean? You consider it less strong under Obama than it was under Bush? Facts would contradict that.
- invest in areas the Feds should like the space industry instead of the green industry

Why is space better than green? Will space get us off foreign oil and reduce the money going to terrorists? No. Will it produce private sector jobs? Nope. Okay so you two have written lots of "fluff" but this thread is for the advanced members of the board. I appreciate that you at least had the balls to post on the thread - The Rabbi and others ran from it like a brushfire.
So let's up our game a bit.
I'm sure there are legitimate reasons to vote GOP. Official positions on specific issues. Written plans. Better yet, specifically what have they accomplished that makes them superior? I invite you exound.

 

[RDD_1210]

A better chance at reduced government.. Does it always happen? Nope.. But it is more likely than with a DEM

Republicans will ...
- repeal Obamacare
This would be a good thing and is so obvious, it needs no verification. So what would they offer as an alternative?
- stop the EPA and unions from destroying US companies
How does the EPA "destroy companies" and what would the GOP do? Get rid of it? Not likely. Unions? They're weak and inconsequential nowadays but okay, what would the GOP do? Make them illegal?
- quit raising taxes to pay for social programs and more spending
Have you seen a single tax increase in the last 3 years? I haven't. I have seen cuts though.
- maintain a strong national defense
How? What does that mean? You consider it less strong under Obama than it was under Bush? Facts would contradict that.
- invest in areas the Feds should like the space industry instead of the green industry

Why is space better than green? Will space get us off foreign oil and reduce the money going to terrorists? No. Will it produce private sector jobs? Nope. Okay so you two have written lots of "fluff" but this thread is for the advanced members of the board. I appreciate that you at least had the balls to post on the thread - The Rabbi and others ran from it like a brushfire.
So let's up our game a bit.
I'm sure there are legitimate reasons to vote GOP. Official positions on specific issues. Written plans. Better yet, specifically what have they accomplished that makes them superior? I invite you exound.

You know not to hold your breath right?

 

[ABikerSailor]

Mitt Romney has already stated his support for the Ryan budget plan which will return us to the policies of the last admin under Jr.

He's also in favor of less regulations on companies which would (possibly) result in more output, but would also end up screwing up the environment. If asked to choose which I value more, the planet or corporations making money, I'm going to value the planet more, because as a human, I can't live in a toxic environment very long, nor can I live in space.

You know..........if we were to put up American windmills, and build American solar plants to provide power to American homes, that would result in American jobs, because those would be built here, and maintained and operated here, it's not something that you can outsource to a foreign country very easy, but that would end up being a forgotten wish under Romney, because he'd want to increase oil production which would be exported to other countries. By the way, that oil sand they want to ship via the Keystone pipeline? Got news for you, in order for it to flow through the pipeline, it needs a certain additive (which instantly evaporates when it comes in contact with air), and without that additive, the oil actually SINKS in the water. What do we do if that pipeline breaks in a major water supply?

The only valid reason that I can think of to vote for Romney is if you're in the 1 percent and you want to keep the benefits that were given under Jr., because you can afford a Romney presidency.

The rest of us? We're gonna take it in the shorts if Romney is elected.

 

[IndependntLogic]

A better chance at reduced government.. Does it always happen? Nope.. But it is more likely than with a DEM

Republicans will ...
- repeal Obamacare
This would be a good thing and is so obvious, it needs no verification. So what would they offer as an alternative?
- stop the EPA and unions from destroying US companies
How does the EPA "destroy companies" and what would the GOP do? Get rid of it? Not likely. Unions? They're weak and inconsequential nowadays but okay, what would the GOP do? Make them illegal?
- quit raising taxes to pay for social programs and more spending
Have you seen a single tax increase in the last 3 years? I haven't. I have seen cuts though.
- maintain a strong national defense
How? What does that mean? You consider it less strong under Obama than it was under Bush? Facts would contradict that.
- invest in areas the Feds should like the space industry instead of the green industry

Why is space better than green? Will space get us off foreign oil and reduce the money going to terrorists? No. Will it produce private sector jobs? Nope. Okay so you two have written lots of "fluff" but this thread is for the advanced members of the board. I appreciate that you at least had the balls to post on the thread - The Rabbi and others ran from it like a brushfire.
So let's up our game a bit.
I'm sure there are legitimate reasons to vote GOP. Official positions on specific issues. Written plans. Better yet, specifically what have they accomplished that makes them superior? I invite you exound.

You know not to hold your breath right?

Yes, the ConservaRepubs are like sailors who, when faced with facts and logical debate, quickly abandon ship...

 

[tjvh]

The truth is neither party "needs" to be offering anything. What America needs is people to get up off their asses and contribute to society rather than milk from it.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Truth
Good leadership
Fiscal responsibility
Personal responsibility
Liberty
More money in our pockets
Sound defense policy.

Tough question.

Fail, What are you a 5 yr old? Anyone who answers "truth" to a question about what political parties bring to the table should be laughed at...severely.

 

[IndependntLogic]

The truth is neither party "needs" to be offering anything. What America needs is people to get up off their asses and contribute to society rather than milk from it.

Let me guess. You're old. Maybe getting those nice SSI checks, some nice health care from MediCare and MediCaid?
I could be wrong but you have that feel.
Younger people know it's hard out there right now.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Wow...the lack of response is telling

 

[Sallow]

The GOP aspires to have the US become as great a nation as Somalia.

Which is a bastion of true free unfettered capitalism and small government!

 

[Immanuel]

A better chance at reduced government.. Does it always happen? Nope.. But it is more likely than with a DEM

"Does it always happen?"

Are you serious? Better question would be "Has it ever happened?" and the answer to that question should be followed up with, "So, what makes you think it will this time?" since the answer is "No, never".

Immie

 

[BillyV]

In a thread asking why anyone would vote Dem, when they have no plans etc... I responded with several items that obviously required planning and were subsequently carried out. I also included a couple things that are still in the planning phase.
While i don't hold the Dems in high regard, I am quick to challenge post that lack substance or logic. One poster got rather hysterical, threw a bit of a fit at being challenged to cite specifics about what the GOP has accomplished / plans they have presented that are so vastly superior to those of the Dems, and why. He insisted I start a new thread because you know, direct answers and such, well gee.
So okay, here we go. If anyone can provide something even more intellectually substantive than the usual "Because Dems suck!" or "Obama wants to entitle votes into...." and other such prattle, I would be genuinely interested in hearing it. I will not stoop to the petty insults and labeling so common here. I just haven't seen much from the GOP that would incite anyone not already Faithful to The Cause, to vote for them. So I welcome specifics about their plans and accomplishments. Cheers!

You seem to think that a party has to be “for” something new to be viable; I disagree. Conservatives in general are “for” what we already have, a country that rewards hard work, innovation, intelligence and risk taking, “against” vast new entitlement and social engineering programs that cater to the lowest common denominator, and "against” unbending loyalty to green energy or excessive new environmental and other regulatory burdens. So most are “for” a repeal of Obamacare, because it will cost a trillion dollars over the next ten years (at least, with $500 billion of new taxes). That extra trillion dollars will come partly from Medicare (savings on fraud waste and abuse – right! Read: more deficit spending); taxes on medical insurance premiums (yes, for those of us who pay them), increased Medicare taxes on wages of higher income individuals and on investment income, and excise taxes on medical equipment and fees on pharmaceutical companies (which will be paid by medical insurance companies and, therefore, by those who pay for it), and the penalty on employers who choose not to offer health insurance (that should be good for business). And what will all that money buy? A free ride for anyone who now does not find it “convenient” to pay for health insurance; redistribution on a massive scale. Should we have a safety net? Yes. Should we be subsidizing those who would rather not pay for their own well being? No. And just to be clear, I am not against the mandate (assuming it’s constitutional, which I’m afraid it probably isn’t); I think if we are going to run a health care system that denies no one care, it stands to reason that everyone will at some time in their lives end up using those services. A mandate is unnecessary if we simply deny services to those who can’t pay, but that will never happen (and rightly so). Anyway, Obamacare will lead inexorably to government-dominated and finally government-run healthcare, resulting in the destruction of the most innovative and finest healthcare system on the planet. Please no stats from the UN claiming otherwise; the US system is profligate with resources and is THE place to be if you are suffering from a serious illness. Somewhat expensive, yes, but you will not wait for service nor suffer from lack of available physicians, medical equipment or hospital space.

Most are also “for” a reduction in statutory corporate income tax rates to enhance competitiveness; you can say that “no one pays the statutory rates”, but you would be incorrect. The largest corporations often can avoid them to some degree by making use of deductions and credits, but many are not available to the general mid-size business. In any case, those larger corporations are also the companies that are more easily able to offshore American jobs. Reduce the top rate to 25% (as Mitt has suggested), eliminate many of the “give away” deductions that have evolved over the years and let them all compete equally. Do the same with individual rates, or you will create an “accountants’ full employment act” to manipulate income from personal to corporate earnings. And for the record, most conservatives are “for” supporting our most productive citizens, not badgering them about “fair share” (to which there is never any limit) to support our least productive citizens. Again, safety net, yes; permanent entitlement, no.

Most are “for” exploiting our domestic resources to the fullest, fossil as well as alternative. “Against” cap and trade or other confiscatory policies; the environmental policies of the West have simply moved the pollution to low-wage foreign countries that care less about the environment and therefore do more damage, then send back the resulting products. That’s not a solution; it’s just a bigger problem. Solar and wind energy are fine, but they are not a solution; reliance on them will just lead to poverty and misery until and unless they are competitive in all ways with carbon-based fuels.

Most, finally, are “for” smaller, smarter government. We have, what, three agencies of the federal government responsible for protecting salmon at different stages? That’s lunacy, and a sign of the truth of Reagan’s comment that “A government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth!” A government that gives us only what we need, not everything we want; a right-sized government that spends no more than it takes in (yes, a balanced budget amendment is the only way that will ever happen; pretty sure the Republican House took a vote on that) and expects and encourages its citizens to take care of their own problems. We have serious debt problems, and are careening toward a financial precipice. That’s enough for me not to vote “for” the policies of the liberals, no matter how reasonable their arguments may sound.

And, of course, because “Dems suck!”

 

[rdean]

Truth
Good leadership
Fiscal responsibility
Personal responsibility
Liberty
More money in our pockets
Sound defense policy.

Tough question.

Truth? That's a joke, right?

Good leadership? Republicans let Bin Laden go.

Fiscal responsibility? You know where the debt came from?

Here, study this:

http://cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/ftpdocs/99xx/doc9957/01-07-outlook.pdf

 

[IndependntLogic]

In a thread asking why anyone would vote Dem, when they have no plans etc... I responded with several items that obviously required planning and were subsequently carried out. I also included a couple things that are still in the planning phase.
While i don't hold the Dems in high regard, I am quick to challenge post that lack substance or logic. One poster got rather hysterical, threw a bit of a fit at being challenged to cite specifics about what the GOP has accomplished / plans they have presented that are so vastly superior to those of the Dems, and why. He insisted I start a new thread because you know, direct answers and such, well gee.
So okay, here we go. If anyone can provide something even more intellectually substantive than the usual "Because Dems suck!" or "Obama wants to entitle votes into...." and other such prattle, I would be genuinely interested in hearing it. I will not stoop to the petty insults and labeling so common here. I just haven't seen much from the GOP that would incite anyone not already Faithful to The Cause, to vote for them. So I welcome specifics about their plans and accomplishments. Cheers!

You seem to think that a party has to be “for” something new to be viable; I disagree. Conservatives in general are “for” what we already have, a country that rewards hard work, innovation, intelligence and risk taking,
Okay a civil and intelligent post. I appreciate this. So please no I mean no offense when I state the the Dems could claim the exact same thing, just as legitimately.

“against” vast new entitlement and social engineering programs that cater to the lowest common denominator, and "against” unbending loyalty to green energy or excessive new environmental and other regulatory burdens.
What are the "new" entitlement programs? What social engineering? I'd love to see us off oil completely but for Conservative, not Liberal reasons.

So most are “for” a repeal of Obamacare, because it will cost a trillion dollars over the next ten years (at least, with $500 billion of new taxes).
That is what Repubs say. Dems say it will reduce the deficit. I'd like to see it repealed anyway though. But I think we do need SOMETHING as an alternative.

That extra trillion dollars will come partly from Medicare (savings on fraud waste and abuse – right! Read: more deficit spending); taxes on medical insurance premiums (yes, for those of us who pay them), increased Medicare taxes on wages of higher income individuals and on investment income, and excise taxes on medical equipment and fees on pharmaceutical companies (which will be paid by medical insurance companies and, therefore, by those who pay for it), and the penalty on employers who choose not to offer health insurance (that should be good for business). And what will all that money buy? A free ride for anyone who now does not find it “convenient” to pay for health insurance;

You don't think there are people out there who simply can't afford insurane premiums?

redistribution on a massive scale.
There is always redistribution. It is just a matter of what direction or type of recipient benefits.

Should we have a safety net? Yes. Should we be subsidizing those who would rather not pay for their own well being? No. And just to be clear, I am not against the mandate (assuming it’s constitutional, which I’m afraid it probably isn’t); I think if we are going to run a health care system that denies no one care, it stands to reason that everyone will at some time in their lives end up using those services. A mandate is unnecessary if we simply deny services to those who can’t pay, but that will never happen (and rightly so). Anyway, Obamacare will lead inexorably to government-dominated and finally government-run healthcare, resulting in the destruction of the most innovative and finest healthcare system on the planet. Please no stats from the UN claiming otherwise; the US system is profligate with resources and is THE place to be if you are suffering from a serious illness. Somewhat expensive, yes, but you will not wait for service nor suffer from lack of available physicians, medical equipment or hospital space.

I had government health care in the military. It was fine. Not one officer I knew bought private insurance and I know none of the enlisted men did. I've also lived in three countries that had government health care. None of the horror stories occured in my personal experience and I am not a quick to believe the media claims as some.

Most are also “for” a reduction in statutory corporate income tax rates to enhance competitiveness; you can say that “no one pays the statutory rates”, but you would be incorrect. The largest corporations often can avoid them to some degree by making use of deductions and credits, but many are not available to the general mid-size business. In any case, those larger corporations are also the companies that are more easily able to offshore American jobs.
There is a flaw here but I think we're close in our thinking. I would do the opposite. Global Corporations (there really is no such thing as a big American company any more) pay an average of 15%. Many pay zero taxes. They don't ship jobs overseas because of taxes. Think about it. The tax rate in India is 33%. Do you think they move jobs there because of the tax rate or because there is virtually no regulation and th average wage is $2 a day? Think about that. So i would take away all their tax breaks and subsidies - BUT I would give them to companies that met two qualifications: 100% American employees and 100% of revenues reported and paid in the USA. Think about what THAT owuld do for the deficit and unemployment.

Reduce the top rate to 25% (as Mitt has suggested), eliminate many of the “give away” deductions that have evolved over the years and let them all compete equally. Do the same with individual rates, or you will create an “accountants’ full employment act” to manipulate income from personal to corporate earnings. And for the record, most conservatives are “for” supporting our most productive citizens, not badgering them about “fair share” (to which there is never any limit) to support our least productive citizens. Again, safety net, yes; permanent entitlement, no.

Most are “for” exploiting our domestic resources to the fullest, fossil as well as alternative. “Against” cap and trade or other confiscatory policies; the environmental policies of the West have simply moved the pollution to low-wage foreign countries that care less about the environment and therefore do more damage, then send back the resulting products. That’s not a solution; it’s just a bigger problem. Solar and wind energy are fine, but they are not a solution; reliance on them will just lead to poverty and misery until and unless they are competitive in all ways with carbon-based fuels.

I am all for solar etc... and every technology I can think of, started out inefficient and expensive and then got better and cheaper. Hell, i remember having to pay for a cell phone the sie of a brick and I couldn't even go on the net with it. besides, I like anything that could possibly bankrupt the Middle East. )

Most, finally, are “for” smaller, smarter government. We have, what, three agencies of the federal government responsible for protecting salmon at different stages? That’s lunacy, and a sign of the truth of Reagan’s comment that “A government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth!” A government that gives us only what we need, not everything we want; a right-sized government that spends no more than it takes in (yes, a balanced budget amendment is the only way that will ever happen; pretty sure the Republican House took a vote on that) and expects and encourages its citizens to take care of their own problems. We have serious debt problems, and are careening toward a financial precipice. That’s enough for me not to vote “for” the policies of the liberals, no matter how reasonable their arguments may sound.

I have yet to see a Republican administration reduce the size of government. I mean, they always talk a good game but I don't recall any of them do it. Help me out with that one!

And, of course, because “Dems suck!”

Okay, that I can get behind! But so do repubs. I can't think of anything they have accomplished that makes me say "Well okay, THAT was really good!". And I don't see much that impresses me from them.

 

[Qball]

There isn't much to get excited over with Republicans, but I will say I think they're more willing to accept our current economic stake and make the necessary cuts and budgeting to keep us from going off the deep end. They've done a bad job in the past at keeping spending down, but all you have to do is look at Democrats over the past few years to see they basically have to be lead kicking and screaming into having an adult conversation about the economy and our spending.

I don't even hate people for having a sense of goodwill built up for Democrats, including Obama. I just hate the lack of perspective so many have. With the Bush-era tax cuts and the debt ceiling, Obama essentially waited till the 11th hour to have the uncomfortable talk, and then used the fact that Republicans didn't readily sign on to his plan as proof of their obstruction.

 

[IndependntLogic]

There isn't much to get excited over with Republicans, but I will say I think they're more willing to accept our current economic stake and make the necessary cuts and budgeting to keep us from going off the deep end. They've done a bad job in the past at keeping spending down, but all you have to do is look at Democrats over the past few years to see they basically have to be lead kicking and screaming into having an adult conversation about the economy and our spending.

I don't even hate people for having a sense of goodwill built up for Democrats, including Obama. I just hate the lack of perspective so many have. With the Bush-era tax cuts and the debt ceiling, Obama essentially waited till the 11th hour to have the uncomfortable talk, and then used the fact that Republicans didn't readily sign on to his plan as proof of their obstruction.

I see no evidence of Republicans making any serious attempt at reducing spending. Do you? Have I missed something?
However, Obama did say he would slash defense. That is the one area that makes the most sense to me. There is no benefit derived in jumping into foreign land wars. Well, unless you're part of the Military Industrial Complex.
Doesn't matter though. All the Repubs and several Dems killed that idea before it had a chance.
As far as the Bush Tax Cuts and debt ceiling, I'd have to disagree. Discussions about the Bush cuts have been going on for months. The debt ceiling wasn't suddenly "sprung" on the GOP - quite the opposite. The GOP suddenly came out of nowhere and said "Hey, Let's default on America's loans! That will be great fun!" and made asses of themselves in the process.

 

[BDBoop]

There isn't much to get excited over with Republicans, but I will say I think they're more willing to accept our current economic stake and make the necessary cuts and budgeting to keep us from going off the deep end. They've done a bad job in the past at keeping spending down, but all you have to do is look at Democrats over the past few years to see they basically have to be lead kicking and screaming into having an adult conversation about the economy and our spending.

I don't even hate people for having a sense of goodwill built up for Democrats, including Obama. I just hate the lack of perspective so many have. With the Bush-era tax cuts and the debt ceiling, Obama essentially waited till the 11th hour to have the uncomfortable talk, and then used the fact that Republicans didn't readily sign on to his plan as proof of their obstruction.

I'm sorry; I'm not grasping the concept of the 11th hour.

The deal was an end to three tumultuous months of wrangling over the debt ceiling that brought the government to the brink of default and, thanks to the GOP’s intransigence on new tax revenues, led to the first credit downgrade in the nation’s history. House Republicans have repeatedly threatened to renege on the deal, and this morning, they made it official, adding an amendment to the National Defense Authorization Act that officially replaced spending cuts from the defense sequestration with cuts from the House reconciliation package.

House GOP Throws Out Entire Summer Of Debt Ceiling Negotiations In Less Than 10 Minutes | ThinkProgress

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

In a thread asking why anyone would vote Dem, when they have no plans etc... I responded with several items that obviously required planning and were subsequently carried out. I also included a couple things that are still in the planning phase.
While i don't hold the Dems in high regard, I am quick to challenge post that lack substance or logic. One poster got rather hysterical, threw a bit of a fit at being challenged to cite specifics about what the GOP has accomplished / plans they have presented that are so vastly superior to those of the Dems, and why. He insisted I start a new thread because you know, direct answers and such, well gee.
So okay, here we go. If anyone can provide something even more intellectually substantive than the usual "Because Dems suck!" or "Obama wants to entitle votes into...." and other such prattle, I would be genuinely interested in hearing it. I will not stoop to the petty insults and labeling so common here. I just haven't seen much from the GOP that would incite anyone not already Faithful to The Cause, to vote for them. So I welcome specifics about their plans and accomplishments. Cheers!

You're kind of babbling and you made no real case for Democrats.

Why should people vote for the GOP?

I wouldn't tell anybody to mindlessly vote for the GOP candidate. I think they are a huge part of the problem. I think that the tea party purged them somewhat; but they are still doing business as usual as it stands right now.

Frankly, I'd tell someone to vote libertarian to start transitioning to real solutions. Dems and Reps are in vortex of destruction.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

There isn't much to get excited over with Republicans, but I will say I think they're more willing to accept our current economic stake and make the necessary cuts and budgeting to keep us from going off the deep end. They've done a bad job in the past at keeping spending down, but all you have to do is look at Democrats over the past few years to see they basically have to be lead kicking and screaming into having an adult conversation about the economy and our spending.

I don't even hate people for having a sense of goodwill built up for Democrats, including Obama. I just hate the lack of perspective so many have. With the Bush-era tax cuts and the debt ceiling, Obama essentially waited till the 11th hour to have the uncomfortable talk, and then used the fact that Republicans didn't readily sign on to his plan as proof of their obstruction.

I see no evidence of Republicans making any serious attempt at reducing spending. Do you? Have I missed something?
However, Obama did say he would slash defense. That is the one area that makes the most sense to me. There is no benefit derived in jumping into foreign land wars. Well, unless you're part of the Military Industrial Complex.
Doesn't matter though. All the Repubs and several Dems killed that idea before it had a chance.
As far as the Bush Tax Cuts and debt ceiling, I'd have to disagree. Discussions about the Bush cuts have been going on for months. The debt ceiling wasn't suddenly "sprung" on the GOP - quite the opposite. The GOP suddenly came out of nowhere and said "Hey, Let's default on America's loans! That will be great fun!" and made asses of themselves in the process.

Republicans have done almost nothing to cut spending and in fact they passed a budget with shady accounting that is predicted to be more than the previous budget. There are great talkers like my Congressman Ed Royce who talk a great game but then he passes bloated budgets based on excuses like the military wouldn't get paid. I'm no longer accepting excuses though. I hope we vote his sorry ass out. We don't need politicians that talk a good game and then stab with the knife and twist.

And before you get a hard-on that I'm calling out the GOP for their BS; none of this erases how f'd up Dems are. Voting for them is like voting for teenage girls who think they have access to daddies credit cards. And the mindless crap they say; seriously some of them must have 5th grade minds.

Further, what has Obama done about cuts? Seriously, nothing. He's refused to even make mild cuts which is nonsense and in fact we've seen all types of reckless spending. I'm sorry but he had his chance and he blew it.