We need a new Law: If Congress doesn't pass Budget items on time they lose $$$

[kyzr]

My larger concern is for the 2020 Budget. What happens if they shut down the entire Federal government? How long can that happen for before it turn into a disaster? Is there any way we can hold their feet to the fire?

 

[g5000]

I say they require a new budget for the next fiscal year by the end of the old one or the current budget rolls over with no changes. Either way, the debt ceiling is automatically raised to cover the expenditures, no more debt ceiling bullshit. If they pass any budget changes or appropriations later, then the debt ceiling gets automatically raised to cover the changes.

So here's a funny thing. Trump submitted a budget for FY2019 with a trillion dollar deficit.

If he had submitted Obama's FY2015 budget, we would actually have a two hundred billion dollar deficit for FY2019 instead.

The DOD said they needed more funding to undo the deterioration that happened under Obama. That's why its $719b.

Nope.

Trump's Defense Spending Exaggerations - FactCheck.org

And just wait until you see the deficit when Trump piles on some infrastructure spending!

 

[kyzr]

I say they require a new budget for the next fiscal year by the end of the old one or the current budget rolls over with no changes. Either way, the debt ceiling is automatically raised to cover the expenditures, no more debt ceiling bullshit. If they pass any budget changes or appropriations later, then the debt ceiling gets automatically raised to cover the changes.

So here's a funny thing. Trump submitted a budget for FY2019 with a trillion dollar deficit.

If he had submitted Obama's FY2015 budget, we would actually have a two hundred billion dollar deficit for FY2019 instead.

The DOD said they needed more funding to undo the deterioration that happened under Obama. That's why its $719b.

Nope.

Trump's Defense Spending Exaggerations - FactCheck.org

And just wait until you see the deficit when Trump piles on some infrastructure spending!

Infrastructure spending will never happen.
The dems would need to raise taxes on the top tax bracket and the Senate and Trump would never agree to that. IMHO we will be in 2-years of "mega-gridlock". Everything will be locked down tight.
No new spending or new budgets, it will be CR after CR after CR after CR after CR ad infinitum...until 2021

 

[Hutch Starskey]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

That does nothing if the president won't sign it.

 

[kyzr]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

That does nothing if the president won't sign it.

I hope he'd sign it to avoid shutdowns. Right now both sides are locked down with no negotiation or compromise. How can we force both sides to negotiate in good faith and work out a compromise? Its bad now, but will be disastrous next month when they start on the full 2020 Budget.
If he is "standing in the way" you need to give him some of what he demands.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

That does nothing if the president won't sign it.

I hope he'd sign it to avoid shutdowns. Right now both sides are locked down with no negotiation or compromise. How can we force both sides to negotiate in good faith and work out a compromise? Its bad now, but will be disastrous next month when they start on the full 2020 Budget.

Both sides?

There is no requirement to "negotiate" with the govt shutdown. That's done by choice. Trump's choice. The House has repeatedly passed bills to fund the govt. There's only one person standing in the way of reopening the govt.

 

[kyzr]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

That does nothing if the president won't sign it.

I hope he'd sign it to avoid shutdowns. Right now both sides are locked down with no negotiation or compromise. How can we force both sides to negotiate in good faith and work out a compromise? Its bad now, but will be disastrous next month when they start on the full 2020 Budget.

Both sides?

There is no requirement to "negotiate" with the govt shutdown. That's done by choice. Trump's choice. The House has repeatedly passed bills to fund the govt. There's only one person standing in the way of reopening the govt.

Trump wants his fucking wall. He gets to sign the Budget, that means he gets some of what he wants. The dems won't negotiate and compromise, so there is a shutdown. Neither side will give in, so what happens now....nothing?
My point is that the 2020 budget fight will be 1000x worse if they don't learn how to compromise.

 

[Dragonlady]

If AOC actually proposed that, I’m shocked. It’s the first intelligent thing I have ever heard from her.

How would you know an "intelligent thing" when you are a self-confessed moron?

Let me help you. That is just a screen name. Nobody here actually thinks you are a dragon, and certainly not a lady.

And they would be wrong on both scores!

 

[BuckToothMoron]

If AOC actually proposed that, I’m shocked. It’s the first intelligent thing I have ever heard from her.

How would you know an "intelligent thing" when you are a self-confessed moron?

Let me help you. That is just a screen name. Nobody here actually thinks you are a dragon, and certainly not a lady.

And they would be wrong on both scores!

Interesting, you are the female version of a mythical fire breathing creature. Well how nice for you. Good meds?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

they should pay the salaries of those furloughed. you see any of them supporting their own constituents? nope.

I don't see the self professed billionaire (he's not, he's lying) doing it, either.

 

[jc456]

they should pay the salaries of those furloughed. you see any of them supporting their own constituents? nope.

I don't see the self professed billionaire (he's not, he's lying) doing it, either.

he isn't taking a salary. again, the dems can stand behind their convictions by doing the same and giving it instead to the workers. I really don't understand why folks like you owe the dems so much that you'd look so foolish arguing such a known subject. just stupid and unnecessary.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

he isn't taking a salary.

Well that's a goofy lie you just made up.

 

[jc456]

he isn't taking a salary.

Well that's a goofy lie you just made up.

yeah you're right, he had to accept one dollar. I'm sure that one dollar is going to benefit someone.. but here just for clarity for you

Updated - Trump-O-Meter: Take no salary

"Trump's yearly salary is $400,000. Article II of the Constitution requires the president to be paid, so Trump modified his promise to accept just $1 per year.

Trump has donated his quarterly salary since taking office. Other recipients include the National Park Service, the U.S. Education Department, the Transportation Department, the Department of Health and Human Services, and the Department of Veterans Affairs."

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

he isn't taking a salary.

Well that's a goofy lie you just made up.

yeah you're right, he had to accept one dollar. I'm sure that one dollar is going to benefit someone.. but here just for clarity for you

Updated - Trump-O-Meter: Take no salary

"Trump's yearly salary is $400,000. Article II of the Constitution requires the president to be paid, so Trump modified his promise to accept just $1 per year.

Trump has donated his quarterly salary since taking office. Other recipients include the National Park Service, the U.S. Education Department, the Transportation Department, the Department of Health and Human Services, and the Department of Veterans Affairs."

He still gets his salary. He has donated in the past. Unlike the 70+ congresspeople donating their salaries during the shutdown, neither him nor anyone in his administration has done so.

Thought you might like having your facts straight.

 

[jc456]

he isn't taking a salary.

Well that's a goofy lie you just made up.

yeah you're right, he had to accept one dollar. I'm sure that one dollar is going to benefit someone.. but here just for clarity for you

Updated - Trump-O-Meter: Take no salary

"Trump's yearly salary is $400,000. Article II of the Constitution requires the president to be paid, so Trump modified his promise to accept just $1 per year.

Trump has donated his quarterly salary since taking office. Other recipients include the National Park Service, the U.S. Education Department, the Transportation Department, the Department of Health and Human Services, and the Department of Veterans Affairs."

He still gets his salary. He has donated in the past. Unlike the 70+ congresspeople donating their salaries during the shutdown, neither him nor anyone in his administration has done so.

Thought you might like having your facts straight.

dude, I just gave you what happens on every payout. what is it you wish me to do beside shoot myself. cause that is the only way you rid yourself of me. every check to date has been given away. Therefore, he took one dollar for him. constitutionally he had to.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

, I just gave you what happens on every payout

No, you gave me what has happened in the past. And I proceeded to inform you on what is happening now and to correct your lie that no congresspeople are donating their salaries during the shutdown, while adding to it that your lie is only actually true of trump and his officials.

Pay attention!

 

[Hutch Starskey]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

That does nothing if the president won't sign it.

I hope he'd sign it to avoid shutdowns. Right now both sides are locked down with no negotiation or compromise. How can we force both sides to negotiate in good faith and work out a compromise? Its bad now, but will be disastrous next month when they start on the full 2020 Budget.

Both sides?

There is no requirement to "negotiate" with the govt shutdown. That's done by choice. Trump's choice. The House has repeatedly passed bills to fund the govt. There's only one person standing in the way of reopening the govt.

Trump wants his fucking wall. He gets to sign the Budget, that means he gets some of what he wants. The dems won't negotiate and compromise, so there is a shutdown. Neither side will give in, so what happens now....nothing?
My point is that the 2020 budget fight will be 1000x worse if they don't learn how to compromise.

Trump wants his fucking wall.

Yes and he's hurting real Americans in an effort to create leverage. Most decidedly unpresidential behavior.

No one has a problem with compromise. The Dems have a problem with a shutdown. BTW, attempting to force the Dems with a shutdown is not operating in good faith. Not by any definition.

 

[Conservative65]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

Doesn't she realize that for such a law to be passed, those lawmakers that would lose their pay would have to vote for it?

 

[Marion Morrison]

I guess you need reading lessons just like a libtard. Did you read the 27th Amendment?

You didn't say the Amendments, but anyway. Found the 27th its mostly about the timing of pay raises.
The framers were worried about Congress giving themselves raises, and they didn't want the president having pay power over them. So the 27th gives them a raise but only after elections. One could add to the 27th: "except for a pro-rated reduction in pay for Congress, the Senate, and the President when the work of completing the budget is not 100% complete on time as prescribed". (or a standalone law that does the same. How else can we force them to compromise?)

27th Amendment:
"No law, varying the compensation for the services of the Senators and Representatives, shall take effect, until an election of representatives shall have intervened.”

So, you didn't know that the Amendments were part of the Constitution? That takes a lot of guts to admit! Thank you!

You do realize that the Founding Fathers had nothing to do with this amendment being ratified. It was passed in 1789 but was not ratified until 1992, over 202 years later.

Now do you see my point? It would take an amendment to change the 27th Amendment to accomplish your goal.

I'm old and my attention span has gotten a lot shorter. I like to google and run with the answer. I can't imagine your students reading the entire Constitution without their eyes glazing over. I'm no lawyer, but we need a way to force them to pass budgets on time. You did not answer my question: ...(or a standalone law that does the same. How else can we force them to compromise?

A stand-alone law that restricts their pay would immediately be declared unconstitutional. Anyone with any knowledge of the law would know that.

In the real world we would call that a "non-answer". We need a solution to the problem, and failure is not an option.
The country can't stand more of these insane shutdowns because the stupid coxuckers won't do their jobs, compromise, and get the Budget passed on time.

OK, so if we can't change the amount of their pay, can we add a "delay penalty" until they get their pay. Something like 10x the shutdown length. A 1-day shutdown would delay their next pay 10-days, a 100-day shutdown would delay their next pay 1000-days? etc. Their compensation is not "varied" its just delayed based on performance.

Their pay is negligible to the amount of lobby money/bribes they get.

 

[kyzr]

AOC proposed a Law that Congress and the Senate (add the President?) don't get paid during a shutdown, because they didn't do their jobs on time.
I want to go one step further. They lose pay during a budget related shutdown, and do NOT get any money, they get docked pay.

That does nothing if the president won't sign it.

I hope he'd sign it to avoid shutdowns. Right now both sides are locked down with no negotiation or compromise. How can we force both sides to negotiate in good faith and work out a compromise? Its bad now, but will be disastrous next month when they start on the full 2020 Budget.

Both sides?

There is no requirement to "negotiate" with the govt shutdown. That's done by choice. Trump's choice. The House has repeatedly passed bills to fund the govt. There's only one person standing in the way of reopening the govt.

Trump wants his fucking wall. He gets to sign the Budget, that means he gets some of what he wants. The dems won't negotiate and compromise, so there is a shutdown. Neither side will give in, so what happens now....nothing?
My point is that the 2020 budget fight will be 1000x worse if they don't learn how to compromise.

Trump wants his fucking wall.

Yes and he's hurting real Americans in an effort to create leverage. Most decidedly unpresidential behavior.

No one has a problem with compromise. The Dems have a problem with a shutdown. BTW, attempting to force the Dems with a shutdown is not operating in good faith. Not by any definition.

Nancy came in and said no wall money. Trump needs wall money. How can they meet in the middle? Nothing will happen until then.