United States and China officials have agreed to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit

[WillowTree]

United States and China officials have agreed this weekend to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit, the White House said Saturday.
The agreement between the world's two biggest economies was made this week in Washington by high-level negotiators from both countries, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

“There was a consensus on taking effective measures to substantially reduce the United States trade deficit in goods with China,” the White House said, in what it described as a joint statement with China.
US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House

Damn... its nice to finally have a smart president working for Americans and isn't a pussy.

And China said that the White House is full of shit and did not agree to such things.

You rubes believe everything you are told. If Trump came out tomorrow and told you it was good to eat your own shit, you would take a dump on a piece of bread and eat it.

You know what tickles me? That all the liberals like your Posts! Hhhmmmm?

 

[Harpy Eagle]

United States and China officials have agreed this weekend to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit, the White House said Saturday.
The agreement between the world's two biggest economies was made this week in Washington by high-level negotiators from both countries, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

“There was a consensus on taking effective measures to substantially reduce the United States trade deficit in goods with China,” the White House said, in what it described as a joint statement with China.
US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House

Damn... its nice to finally have a smart president working for Americans and isn't a pussy.

And China said that the White House is full of shit and did not agree to such things.

You rubes believe everything you are told. If Trump came out tomorrow and told you it was good to eat your own shit, you would take a dump on a piece of bread and eat it.

You know what tickles me? That all the liberals like your Posts! Hhhmmmm?

What can I say. We share a dislike of Trump and what I said was pretty darn accurate, so they like it.

I am this boards version of a bi-seuxal...I appeal to both sides!

 

[Harpy Eagle]

how did a thread on China end up mixed with a thread about MS-13?

 

[tycho1572]

United States and China officials have agreed this weekend to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit, the White House said Saturday.
The agreement between the world's two biggest economies was made this week in Washington by high-level negotiators from both countries, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

“There was a consensus on taking effective measures to substantially reduce the United States trade deficit in goods with China,” the White House said, in what it described as a joint statement with China.
US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House

Damn... its nice to finally have a smart president working for Americans and isn't a pussy.

Except...that's not the real issue. In fact it's almost a non-issue. The trade DEFICIT is not THE problem. It's that China's economy remains largely closed to us, it's business' are heavily subsidized by the government and worse - it demands any foreign companies share proprietary information which is stolen and used.

Big issues and harder to fix then a trade deficit.

Does that mean you aren't seeing the progress being made by Trump?

Not yet...but I will keep watching for actual sustainable achievements. It really would be good to make some major changes in trade with China - but it's not the trade deficit that is at issue and it's not just us that is pissed at China's trade policies. A smart president would work with other countries to collectively pressure China to make the needed changes. Don't see that happening yet though.

Why would other countries want to get involved with the trade issues we have with China?

Because they aren't just our issues, and collectively addressing them gives us more power to pressure China. Unfortunately...China has a lot of leverage, and it's been building for a while.

Their economy is weaker than ours. Trump knows we have the upper hand.
It's why Trump is moving to improve things for American workers. Shouldn't we celebrating that?

 

[Coyote]

Except...that's not the real issue. In fact it's almost a non-issue. The trade DEFICIT is not THE problem. It's that China's economy remains largely closed to us, it's business' are heavily subsidized by the government and worse - it demands any foreign companies share proprietary information which is stolen and used.

Big issues and harder to fix then a trade deficit.

Does that mean you aren't seeing the progress being made by Trump?

Not yet...but I will keep watching for actual sustainable achievements. It really would be good to make some major changes in trade with China - but it's not the trade deficit that is at issue and it's not just us that is pissed at China's trade policies. A smart president would work with other countries to collectively pressure China to make the needed changes. Don't see that happening yet though.

Why would other countries want to get involved with the trade issues we have with China?

Because they aren't just our issues, and collectively addressing them gives us more power to pressure China. Unfortunately...China has a lot of leverage, and it's been building for a while.

Their economy is weaker than ours. Trump knows we have the upper hand.
It's why Trump is moving to improve things for American workers. Shouldn't we celebrating that?

Why do you think it's weaker? They are a huge market...otherwise American business' wouldn't put up with that crap to operate there.

 

[expat_panama]

...President Trump has since his 2016 presidential campaign vowed to improve international trade relationships, including the one with China that last year resulted in a $337 billion trade deficit with the country...

Actually, the trade balance on good w/ China in 2016 ended closing up a bit higher at $347 billion. Here are the numbers from Census.gov:

U.S. trade in goods with China
millions of U.S. dollars (source: Foreign Trade - U.S. Trade with China )

2005 -202,278.10
2006 -234,101.30
2007 -258,506.00
2008 -268,039.80
2009 -226,877.20
2010 -273,041.60
2011 -295,249.70
2012 -315,102.50
2013 -318,683.80
2014 -344,817.70
2015 -367,256.70
2016 -347,016.00
2017 -375,227.50
​

--and now U.S./China goods balance has gone to $375 billion.

Questions for the group:

1. Are we worse off now than before 2017?
2. When the trade defiicit shrank the most from 2008 to 2009 did that mean we were better off?

 

[expat_panama]

...Why do you think it's weaker? They are a huge market...otherwise American business' wouldn't put up with that crap to operate there.

The way we need to compare is by the fact that while total Chinese production is on par w/ that of the U.S., China's got four times the population. That means China's percapita gdp is a fourth of ours. Also, most of China's production is in small sections and the vast majority of the Chinese are living in squalor scratching for food in the dirt.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

...President Trump has since his 2016 presidential campaign vowed to improve international trade relationships, including the one with China that last year resulted in a $337 billion trade deficit with the country...

Actually, the trade balance on good w/ China in 2016 ended closing up a bit higher at $347 billion. Here are the numbers from Census.gov:

U.S. trade in goods with China
millions of U.S. dollars (source: Foreign Trade - U.S. Trade with China )

2005 -202,278.10
2006 -234,101.30
2007 -258,506.00
2008 -268,039.80
2009 -226,877.20
2010 -273,041.60
2011 -295,249.70
2012 -315,102.50
2013 -318,683.80
2014 -344,817.70
2015 -367,256.70
2016 -347,016.00
2017 -375,227.50
​

--and now U.S./China goods balance has gone to $375 billion.

Questions for the group:

1. Are we worse off now than before 2017?
2. When the trade defiicit shrank the most from 2008 to 2009 did that mean we were better off?

Seems that there was something going on in 2008 and 2009...what could it have been that might have kept people from buying things from China...or anywhere else for that matter.

Interesting thing about the trade deficit numbers you gave, since 2011 and the end of the recession, almost all of the increases are accounted for by the change in the US population coupled with our inflation rate.

 

[expat_panama]

...since 2011 and the end of the recession, almost all of the increases are accounted for by the change in the US population coupled with our inflation rate.

That's about a 40% increase in seven years. You can believe we've had population/inflation increases in that order but when it comes to money I try to be a bit more careful w/ what I say.

 

[candycorn]

Worth repeating 1000 times, when America decides to lead and use it's leverage, economic and if needed in some cases Internationally, it's military Might, the world has to follow.

I didn't doubt for a second that if Trump negotiated from a position of strength, which America has over the Communist sob's in China; that he would win.

I repeat for effect, walk away from NAFTA, Canada is exploiting your jobs and using you to supplement their socialism, neo-communist, centralized, unaccountable security apparatus nepotism. Walk away from NAFTA and go with bilateral deals, and then build a wall, and Trump will go get a second term, AND, against all odds, go down as the president who saved America.

This AND North Korea potentially becoming denuclearized.

Get 'er done Trump! God Bless America!



US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House


The White House also said China would “significantly increase purchases” of U.S. goods and services to help America’s economic growth and to meet its own growing consumption needs, in an apparent effort to avoid an international trade war.

Among the primary focuses of the consensus: an agreement to expand trade in manufactured goods and services, increase U.S. agriculture and energy exports, and protect both countries’ intellectual property laws.

The White House also said next steps would include the U.S. sending a team to China to work out the details.

President Trump has since his 2016 presidential campaign vowed to improve international trade relationships, including the one with China that last year resulted in a $337 billion trade deficit with the country.

Trump on Friday called the deal "bad for our country” and said, “We're changing it around."

After the White House announcement, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer suggested the agreement falls short on protecting America’s intellectual property.

“The key to a strong agreement is protecting our intellectual property here in America and stopping the Chinese from keeping out our best goods until we hand over our trade secrets,” said Schumer, D-N.Y. “The joint statement has nothing specific on those fronts.”

China recently appears to be sending signals about trying to avoid a trade war.

Beijing has dropped an anti-dumping investigation into imported U.S. sorghum, which it had accused the U.S. of unfairly subsidizing. It has also given approval for a U.S. private equity firm to buy Toshiba's memory chip business.

"China has come to trade," Larry Kudlow, the top White House economic adviser, told reporters. "They are meeting many of our demands. No deal yet, to be sure, and it's probably going to take a while -- it's a process."

On "ending" the trade deficit....

Send me a post card from fantasy island.

 

[candycorn]

I have to wonder if N. Korea and China decided to play Trump's game for the next 6 months. I know this concept is way too abstract for most Republican Supporters here to understand, but I wouldn't be surprised to see XI and KIM try to manipulate our election, and keep chaos alive.

Please elaborate on this idea, I don't know how they can manipulate any more than so many other countries tried in 2016. Far too many have been exploiting America, Trumps victory should be celebrated as it proved the global socialists can't ruin America.

Do your part, please. These Communist sob's from China cannot be allowed to become the sole Super Power.

Globalism always wins. If there is a cheaper, better widget being sold somewhere else, those who want the widget will find a way to acquire it. Putting up barriers may work short-term but eventually, they do more harm than good.

 

[Crepitus]

Worth repeating 1000 times, when America decides to lead and use it's leverage, economic and if needed in some cases Internationally, it's military Might, the world has to follow.

I didn't doubt for a second that if Trump negotiated from a position of strength, which America has over the Communist sob's in China; that he would win.

I repeat for effect, walk away from NAFTA, Canada is exploiting your jobs and using you to supplement their socialism, neo-communist, centralized, unaccountable security apparatus nepotism. Walk away from NAFTA and go with bilateral deals, and then build a wall, and Trump will go get a second term, AND, against all odds, go down as the president who saved America.

This AND North Korea potentially becoming denuclearized.

Get 'er done Trump! God Bless America!



US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House


The White House also said China would “significantly increase purchases” of U.S. goods and services to help America’s economic growth and to meet its own growing consumption needs, in an apparent effort to avoid an international trade war.

Among the primary focuses of the consensus: an agreement to expand trade in manufactured goods and services, increase U.S. agriculture and energy exports, and protect both countries’ intellectual property laws.

The White House also said next steps would include the U.S. sending a team to China to work out the details.

President Trump has since his 2016 presidential campaign vowed to improve international trade relationships, including the one with China that last year resulted in a $337 billion trade deficit with the country.

Trump on Friday called the deal "bad for our country” and said, “We're changing it around."

After the White House announcement, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer suggested the agreement falls short on protecting America’s intellectual property.

“The key to a strong agreement is protecting our intellectual property here in America and stopping the Chinese from keeping out our best goods until we hand over our trade secrets,” said Schumer, D-N.Y. “The joint statement has nothing specific on those fronts.”

China recently appears to be sending signals about trying to avoid a trade war.

Beijing has dropped an anti-dumping investigation into imported U.S. sorghum, which it had accused the U.S. of unfairly subsidizing. It has also given approval for a U.S. private equity firm to buy Toshiba's memory chip business.

"China has come to trade," Larry Kudlow, the top White House economic adviser, told reporters. "They are meeting many of our demands. No deal yet, to be sure, and it's probably going to take a while -- it's a process."

Not so much.

Did China make a $200 billion trade offer to the US? Beijing says no

 

[Harpy Eagle]

...since 2011 and the end of the recession, almost all of the increases are accounted for by the change in the US population coupled with our inflation rate.

That's about a 40% increase in seven years. You can believe we've had population/inflation increases in that order but when it comes to money I try to be a bit more careful w/ what I say.

In 2011, the trade deficit came out to roughly $947.40 a year per person in the US.
In 2017, the trade deficit came out to roughly $1151.99 a year per person in the US. Inflation accounts for $1060.15 of the $1151.99.

 

[Norman]

United States and China officials have agreed this weekend to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit, the White House said Saturday.
The agreement between the world's two biggest economies was made this week in Washington by high-level negotiators from both countries, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

“There was a consensus on taking effective measures to substantially reduce the United States trade deficit in goods with China,” the White House said, in what it described as a joint statement with China.
US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House

Damn... its nice to finally have a smart president working for Americans and isn't a pussy.

Except...that's not the real issue. In fact it's almost a non-issue. The trade DEFICIT is not THE problem. It's that China's economy remains largely closed to us, it's business' are heavily subsidized by the government and worse - it demands any foreign companies share proprietary information which is stolen and used.

Big issues and harder to fix then a trade deficit.

The trade deficit is not a problem?

Sure... sure...

 

[Ted Frazier]

Worth repeating 1000 times, when America decides to lead and use it's leverage, economic and if needed in some cases Internationally, it's military Might, the world has to follow.

I didn't doubt for a second that if Trump negotiated from a position of strength, which America has over the Communist sob's in China; that he would win.

I repeat for effect, walk away from NAFTA, Canada is exploiting your jobs and using you to supplement their socialism, neo-communist, centralized, unaccountable security apparatus nepotism. Walk away from NAFTA and go with bilateral deals, and then build a wall, and Trump will go get a second term, AND, against all odds, go down as the president who saved America.

This AND North Korea potentially becoming denuclearized.

Get 'er done Trump! God Bless America!



US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House


The White House also said China would “significantly increase purchases” of U.S. goods and services to help America’s economic growth and to meet its own growing consumption needs, in an apparent effort to avoid an international trade war.

Among the primary focuses of the consensus: an agreement to expand trade in manufactured goods and services, increase U.S. agriculture and energy exports, and protect both countries’ intellectual property laws.

The White House also said next steps would include the U.S. sending a team to China to work out the details.

President Trump has since his 2016 presidential campaign vowed to improve international trade relationships, including the one with China that last year resulted in a $337 billion trade deficit with the country.

Trump on Friday called the deal "bad for our country” and said, “We're changing it around."

After the White House announcement, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer suggested the agreement falls short on protecting America’s intellectual property.

“The key to a strong agreement is protecting our intellectual property here in America and stopping the Chinese from keeping out our best goods until we hand over our trade secrets,” said Schumer, D-N.Y. “The joint statement has nothing specific on those fronts.”

China recently appears to be sending signals about trying to avoid a trade war.

Beijing has dropped an anti-dumping investigation into imported U.S. sorghum, which it had accused the U.S. of unfairly subsidizing. It has also given approval for a U.S. private equity firm to buy Toshiba's memory chip business.

"China has come to trade," Larry Kudlow, the top White House economic adviser, told reporters. "They are meeting many of our demands. No deal yet, to be sure, and it's probably going to take a while -- it's a process."

How embarrassing that one hour after this article was posted, this one came out: China Rejects U.S. Target for Narrowing Trade Gap

 

[Aldo Raine]

United States and China officials have agreed this weekend to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit, the White House said Saturday.
The agreement between the world's two biggest economies was made this week in Washington by high-level negotiators from both countries, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

“There was a consensus on taking effective measures to substantially reduce the United States trade deficit in goods with China,” the White House said, in what it described as a joint statement with China.
US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House

Damn... its nice to finally have a smart president working for Americans and isn't a pussy.

Except...that's not the real issue. In fact it's almost a non-issue. The trade DEFICIT is not THE problem. It's that China's economy remains largely closed to us, it's business' are heavily subsidized by the government and worse - it demands any foreign companies share proprietary information which is stolen and used.

Big issues and harder to fix then a trade deficit.

The trade deficit is a totally irrelevant dollar amount.

So, why so much resistance to reversing it?



Why do foreign leaders fight it so much?



Just give US what Trump wants, and then in 5 years when nothing has changed, you can point out what losers we are.

Nobody has to wait 5 years to do that.

 

[Correll]

United States and China officials have agreed this weekend to take steps to reduce the U.S. trade deficit, the White House said Saturday.
The agreement between the world's two biggest economies was made this week in Washington by high-level negotiators from both countries, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

“There was a consensus on taking effective measures to substantially reduce the United States trade deficit in goods with China,” the White House said, in what it described as a joint statement with China.
US, China tentatively agree on ending American trade deficit: White House

Damn... its nice to finally have a smart president working for Americans and isn't a pussy.

Except...that's not the real issue. In fact it's almost a non-issue. The trade DEFICIT is not THE problem. It's that China's economy remains largely closed to us, it's business' are heavily subsidized by the government and worse - it demands any foreign companies share proprietary information which is stolen and used.

Big issues and harder to fix then a trade deficit.

The trade deficit is a totally irrelevant dollar amount.

So, why so much resistance to reversing it?



Why do foreign leaders fight it so much?



Just give US what Trump wants, and then in 5 years when nothing has changed, you can point out what losers we are.

Nobody has to wait 5 years to do that.

If the trade deficit doesn't matter, why fight switching it over to the other side?

 

[Harpy Eagle]

If the trade deficit doesn't matter, why fight switching it over to the other side?

switching it to the other side would mean an increase in the cost of most everything. We buy stuff from China and Korea and the like because they can make it for less than we can. The only way to "flip" the sides is to make their stuff more expensive.

I have a trade deficit with my local grocery store because they can provide the foods I want for less than I could grow/raise them myself. This is the same basic reason we have a trade deficit with China and other places. Because we are in a superior economic situation and the citizens of our country has the money to buy what they are selling.

Tariffs and strict control work well for China because they have a Socialist market economy and those tactics work well when there is no free market.

I wish to neither pay more for the things I buy today or to have my government that involved in the free market, then it would no longer be free. If you wish to have the government tell you what to buy or where what you are buying has to be made, then perhaps you are living in the wrong country.

 

[Correll]

If the trade deficit doesn't matter, why fight switching it over to the other side?

switching it to the other side would mean an increase in the cost of most everything. We buy stuff from China and Korea and the like because they can make it for less than we can. The only way to "flip" the sides is to make their stuff more expensive.

Which is no problem for China and the EU. So, why are they fighting it?

I have a trade deficit with my local grocery store because they can provide the foods I want for less than I could grow/raise them myself. This is the same basic reason we have a trade deficit with China and other places. Because we are in a superior economic situation and the citizens of our country has the money to buy what they are selling.

We are not in a superior economic position. We are borrowing money to pay for consumption. That is not sustainable.

Do you use credit at your grocery store, and then borrow money to pay your credit card bill?

Tariffs and strict control work well for China because they have a Socialist market economy and those tactics work well when there is no free market.

Nothing in your post makes any point against switching the Trade Deficit from US to them.

Nothing in your post makes any point that tariffs would not work for US.

Really, it seems all you did there, was state "Free Market" as an Appeal to Emotion.

I wish to neither pay more for the things I buy today or to have my government that involved in the free market, then it would no longer be free. If you wish to have the government tell you what to buy or where what you are buying has to be made, then perhaps you are living in the wrong country.

You are arguing for a failed Ideological policy.


We, as a nation, made that choice decades ago.

The results are not what we expected.

You don't get to pretend that we have not already seen that policy fail.

 

[Wry Catcher]

I have to wonder if N. Korea and China decided to play Trump's game for the next 6 months. I know this concept is way too abstract for most Republican Supporters here to understand, but I wouldn't be surprised to see XI and KIM try to manipulate our election, and keep chaos alive.

Please elaborate on this idea, I don't know how they can manipulate any more than so many other countries tried in 2016. Far too many have been exploiting America, Trumps victory should be celebrated as it proved the global socialists can't ruin America.

Do your part, please. These Communist sob's from China cannot be allowed to become the sole Super Power.

Globalism always wins. If there is a cheaper, better widget being sold somewhere else, those who want the widget will find a way to acquire it. Putting up barriers may work short-term but eventually, they do more harm than good.

I agree. However, the theft of intellectual property is a serious problems which every nation state needs to eliminate, by criminalizing the act by the private sector. and making restitution to the owner of the patent or copywrite ; If the nation itself engages in such activities sanctions against that state are appropriate and any tariff placed on that piracy needs to be high and given to the owner of the intellectual property.

Domestic wholesalers and retailers who engage in the distribution or sale of said property ought to be fined, and pay restitution too.