The Threat From Intelligent Design

[LuvRPgrl]

Because you want to teach kids religion, which is unconstitutional, and I want to teach them science, which is not only beneficial to their own futures but beneficial to the future of this nation.

Kids were taught religion for hundreds of years, and we did better than anyone else. Communism kicked God out and failed miserably.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Public school, manu, funded by public dollars. Its called the 1st amendment.




Who said anything about behavior? The topic here is intelligent design, its a idea, not a way to behave.

So you are saying teaching religion is merely teaching people ideas, and not ways to act?

 

[LuvRPgrl]

The purpose of the 1st amendment is to divorce the church from the state and make our government secular..

no it isnt. It was so the states could make that decision themselves. AND ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ELSE.

Since there is no public school class where the children are taught that religion is evil, at least not one that would be banned by the courts if a suit was brought, you have no point.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Moral questions are personal choices? So if I want to kill people and take their money, that's ok because it's my personal choice?

That's fine if you think its OK, but you will suffer consequences for your actions (not your thoughts) under the law.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Sometimes we just have to use our rational mind and think about possibilities. Some things just cant happen.
Take the components of a house, plumbing, electrical, etc. etc. throw them in a lake. Do you think the house will ever miraculously float together and form a house?

What survival incentive would it have to form a house?

If you take what is required in primordial soup to float all the chemicals together and form a living cell, is even less likely.

And you have calculated the odds to be ..... ?

 

[SpidermanTuba]

There are two seperate stages of evolution. It is possible for one to exist without the other. Many think God created life then let evolution bring things to their present form. The idea that chemicals could have been accidentally floating around in some primordial soup and a single living cell accidentally came into form is absurd at best.

The idea that time slows down for observers in fast moving reference frames is also absurd, but true. Science isn't about revealing the obvious. You can't discredit a theory simply because it sounds absurd, I'm afraid that's not how science is done.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Non sequitor. How does that apply to teaching ID in an ID class?

ID is a religious theory. You can't teach religion in school. Nor can you dress up Creationism in the clothes of a scientific theory and expect any reasonable person to be fooled.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Kids were taught religion for hundreds of years, and we did better than anyone else. Communism kicked God out and failed miserably.

Religious education is the responsibility of the parents.

Communism? Last I checked the U.S. has never been communist.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

So you are saying teaching religion is merely teaching people ideas, and not ways to act?

No, I'm saying teaching ID is teaching ideas, not ways to act.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

The idea that time slows down for observers in fast moving reference frames is also absurd, but true. Science isn't about revealing the obvious. You can't discredit a theory simply because it sounds absurd, I'm afraid that's not how science is done.

But dont you think the idea of ID is absurd?

 

[LuvRPgrl]

ID is a religious theory. You can't teach religion in school. Nor can you dress up Creationism in the clothes of a scientific theory and expect any reasonable person to be fooled.

Science has become a religion for some. Its either science or nothing. I guess we should drop science then also.

We cant teach religion in school? Hmm, it happens everyday. Sorry bout that

I dont try to fool anyone. I dont dress anything up. Evolution, as an answer for how life began is impossible, its very evident for any open minded person. Please dont tell me you think the parts of a building could come together and form a house all on their own, if thrown into a lake.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Religious education is the responsibility of the parents..

Education is also their responsability. Parents should also be able to dictate what is taught to their kids in school, NOT THE GOVT.

Not for lack of trying by the liberal left. TRYING to kick religion and God out of school is only one of their methods.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

What survival incentive would it have to form a house?



And you have calculated the odds to be ..... ?

survival incentive? BEFORE any life existed, the concept "survival" didnt exist.

The odds to be ZERO. It cant happen. Some events simply require the exertion of an intelligent being for the event to have occured. If you were walking in a field, and you saw a perfect replica of a hammock made between two branches of a bush, complete with a stick straw man laying in it, reading a book, would you conclude the wind couldnt have thrown about the twigs to make it? Now, mind you, some very complicated knots were used to make this.

 

[manu1959]

Education is also their responsability. Parents should also be able to dictate what is taught to their kids in school, NOT THE GOVT.

Not for lack of trying by the liberal left. TRYING to kick religion and God out of school is only one of their methods.

dude just remember it is ok to teach that it it is ok to kill the unborn but it is not ok to teach the born how to make good moral and ethical choices ....

 

[SpidermanTuba]

no it isnt. It was so the states could make that decision themselves. AND ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ELSE.

Where have you been for the last 140 or so years? The 14th amendment extended the Bill of Rights to include all levels of government. See Cantwell v Conneticut.


"The First Amendment declares that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. The Fourteenth Amendment has rendered the legislatures of the states as incompetent as Congress to enact such laws."

 

[SpidermanTuba]

But dont you think the idea of ID is absurd?

ID is a completely rational idea. It isn't testable, though, so it has no place in a science classroom

Science has become a religion for some. Its either science or nothing. I guess we should drop science then also.

We cant teach religion in school? Hmm, it happens everyday. Sorry bout that

If the best you can do to defend your argument is simply to define science as being a sort of religion, you have surely run out of decent arguments. Religion involves belief in a supernatural being or beings, or God or Gods. At a stretch, you might consider atheism a kind of religion. But science, which neither acknowledges nor denies the existance of a God or Gods, isn't even in the ball park

Education is also their responsability. Parents should also be able to dictate what is taught to their kids in school, NOT THE GOVT.

You aren't a very practical person, are you? Does this mean that if one kid's parents want their children taught that the Earth is flat, another kid's parents want their children taught that ghosts and fairies and gnomes exist, and another kid's parents want their kids taught that Jews are evil people, its the school's responsibility to teach all the kids that?

The odds to be ZERO. It cant happen.

Please show me your calculations.

If you were walking in a field, and you saw a perfect replica of a hammock made between two branches of a bush, complete with a stick straw man laying in it, reading a book, would you conclude the wind couldnt have thrown about the twigs to make it?

What's with the irrelevant analogies? Clearly, complex molecules can spontaneously form, as we have observed this in a laboratory setting. So your general argument that
complex things cannot form out of simple things without intelligent intervention is just plain false. You can think up all the useless analogies you want, it remains a fact that some complex things can and DO form from simple things. Happens everytime water freezes for crying out loud.

Now show me your calculations for the probabiliy of single celled prokaryotes forming without intelligent intervention. You can't scientifically claim that 0 is the answer without showing the details of your calculations.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

dude just remember it is ok to teach that it it is ok to kill the unborn ....

It is? I wasn't aware of that.

 

[manu1959]

It is? I wasn't aware of that.

http://www.research.umbc.edu/~korenman/wmst/abortion02.html

hmmmmmm......tulsa takes funds from the feds and teaches about abortion.....

 

[SpidermanTuba]

http://www.research.umbc.edu/~korenman/wmst/abortion02.html

hmmmmmm......tulsa takes funds from the feds and teaches about abortion.....

I'm having trouble finding where in the link it says anything about what is wrong and what isn't.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Where have you been for the last 140 or so years? The 14th amendment extended the Bill of Rights to include all levels of government. See Cantwell v Conneticut.


"The First Amendment declares that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. The Fourteenth Amendment has rendered the legislatures of the states as incompetent as Congress to enact such laws."

spiderman said:
"The purpose of the 1st amendment is to divorce the church from the state and make our government secular."

Oh, so they wrote the 1st amendment knowing in advance that years later the 14th amendment would be added?