Ted Cruz Introduces Bills to Stop Gay Marriage

[Redfish]

Liberace wasn't openly gay. He successfully sued two newspaper that claimed he was gay. It was obvious he was gay but he kept it private as not damage his career.

If you couldn't tell Liberace was gay then you weren't paying attention. I saw him on various TV shows when I was a kid..Ed Sullivan etc. I remember asking my parents why he dressed like that and talked like that and it was explained that he was probably a homosexual. My parents were not stupid. Neither am I.

Thinking one may be gay and openly/stating one is gay is two totally different matters. He wasn't openly gay.

I wasn't paying attention to Liberace in the 50's or 60's b/c I wasn't born until the 80's. Either way I really don't care about Liberace.

I lived a lot of life before you were born as a republican and believe it or not I managed to muddle through it without even once obsessing about homos. I knew they existed but it really wasn't my business so I didn't give it any thought.

me too. you and I did not start the homo debate that is dominating our culture.

But your fellow conservatives did – by seeking to disadvantage gay Americans using the force of law.

This is a controversy you and others on the right created, an issue easily avoided had the states simply followed the Constitution and allowed same-sex couples access to marriage law.

Now the right's unwarranted animosity toward gay Americans has reached ridiculous proportions, with a republican senator proposing to 'amend' the Constitution to codify discrimination.

gays have every right that you and I have. The issue came up because the gays want special rights that apply only to them.

 

[Geaux4it]

Well, where were we now?

-Geaux
-------------------------------

10 Reasons Why Homosexual “Marriage” is Harmful and Must be Opposed

1. It Is Not Marriage

Calling something marriage does not make it marriage. Marriage has always been a covenant between a man and a woman which is by its nature ordered toward the procreation and education of children and the unity and wellbeing of the spouses.

The promoters of same-sex “marriage” propose something entirely different. They propose the union between two men or two women. This denies the self-evident biological, physiological, and psychological differences between men and women which find their complementarity in marriage. It also denies the specific primary purpose of marriage: the perpetuation of the human race and the raising of children.

Two entirely different things cannot be considered the same thing.

2. It Violates Natural Law

Marriage is not just any relationship between human beings. It is a relationship rooted in human nature and thus governed by natural law.

Natural law’s most elementary precept is that “good is to be done and pursued, and evil is to be avoided.” By his natural reason, man can perceive what is morally good or bad for him. Thus, he can know the end or purpose of each of his acts and how it is morally wrong to transform the means that help him accomplish an act into the act’s purpose.

Any situation which institutionalizes the circumvention of the purpose of the sexual act violates natural law and the objective norm of morality.

Being rooted in human nature, natural law is universal and immutable. It applies to the entire human race, equally. It commands and forbids consistently, everywhere and always. Saint Paul taught in the Epistle to the Romans that the natural law is inscribed on the heart of every man. (Rom. 2:14-15)

3. It Always Denies a Child Either a Father or a Mother

It is in the child’s best interests that he be raised under the influence of his natural father and mother. This rule is confirmed by the evident difficulties faced by the many children who are orphans or are raised by a single parent, a relative, or a foster parent.

The unfortunate situation of these children will be the norm for all children of a same-sex “marriage.” A child of a same-sex “marriage” will always be deprived of either his natural mother or father. He will necessarily be raised by one party who has no blood relationship with him. He will always be deprived of either a mother or a father role model.

Same-sex “marriage” ignores a child’s best interests.

4. It Validates and Promotes the Homosexual Lifestyle

In the name of the “family,” same-sex “marriage” serves to validate not only such unions but the whole homosexual lifestyle in all its bisexual and transgender variants.

Civil laws are structuring principles of man's life in society. As such, they play a very important and sometimes decisive role in influencing patterns of thought and behavior. They externally shape the life of society, but also profoundly modify everyone’s perception and evaluation of forms of behavior.

Legal recognition of same-sex “marriage” would necessarily obscure certain basic moral values, devalue traditional marriage, and weaken public morality.

5. It Turns a Moral Wrong into a Civil Right

Homosexual activists argue that same-sex “marriage” is a civil rights issue similar to the struggle for racial equality in the 1960s.

This is false.

First of all, sexual behavior and race are essentially different realities. A man and a woman wanting to marry may be different in their characteristics: one may be black, the other white; one rich, the other poor; or one tall, the other short. None of these differences are insurmountable obstacles to marriage. The two individuals are still man and woman, and thus the requirements of nature are respected.

Same-sex “marriage” opposes nature. Two individuals of the same sex, regardless of their race, wealth, stature, erudition or fame, will never be able to marry because of an insurmountable biological impossibility.

Secondly, inherited and unchangeable racial traits cannot be compared with non-genetic and changeable behavior. There is simply no analogy between the interracial marriage of a man and a woman and the “marriage” between two individuals of the same sex.

10 Reasons Why Homosexual Marriage is Harmful and Must be Opposed

"It offends God" isn't exactly a very compelling legal argument.

our system of laws is based on judeo/Christian principles, so yes, it is a very compelling legal argument

What is the success rate of that argument in the courts concerning gay marriage? Yeah, not so good.

Why do we allow fat people to marry? Gluttony offends God.

Why do we allow liars to marry? Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord.

Why do we allow those that dishonor their mother and father to marry? They offend God.

Like I said, it is not a compelling legal argument.

nice try, but those things do not compare with homosexuality. Whether its a valid legal argument is yet to be seen. I think the gay mafia will win this round, and the country and society as a whole will lose. .

And how will the country lose if gay couples are allowed to have the exact same access to marriage as my wife and I enjoy?

How will you be harmed?

Because I and we are not perverted like you and they.... evidently

-Geaux

 

[Redfish]

what Cruz has proposed would let the people of each state decide-------------how awful, how radical, how constitutional.

 

[kaz]

Ted Cruz Introduces Bills to Stop Gay Marriage
Bloomberg | 4/23/2015 | Heidi Prszbyla


Bloomberg Title and Link Only
Ted Cruz Introduces Bills to Stop Gay Marriage - Bloomberg Politics
Sub-Heading-- "The Texas senator wants to establish a constitutional amendment that protects states that define marriage as being between a man and a woman from legal action. "

---
Cruz Is going to fight the gays!

Your thread says he tries to stop gay marriage, where does he do that?

 

[peach174]

Where does the 14th amendment say same sex marriage is an equal right?
It says deprive any person of life, liberty or property.
You are free to be gay in this country but it says nothing about marriage.

You are obsessing about an institution that has over a 60% failure rate. That abysmal longevity stat has little if nothing to do with homosexuals. It would serve you that think it is the "foundation" of our society to work a little harder on the actual causes of it's horrible record of success.

many believe that sanctioning gay marriage would harm society, you don't believe it would. There is a difference of opinion-----------so lets put it to a vote in every state and let the will of the people prevail.

I will accept the will of the people, will you?

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

Immoral and Sexual deviancy has brought down many society's all though out history.

Which ones? I keep hearing people make those claims yet when we look at the 'fall' of societies- I can't think of any that did.

The Ottoman Empire? Nope- that was losing World War 1 and rise of secular forces.
The Aztec Empire? Nope- that was caused by the Spanish and the collusion of the Aztec's conquered neighbors.
The Incan Empire? Nope- see above.

The reality is that the United States is the most powerful country in the world- and we have what ancient Jews would consider an immoral society.

The societies that are the least tolerant of 'immoral and sexual deviancy'? Well that would be the repressed of Muslim societies- Iran and Saudi Arabia.

Which do you choose as the most 'moral path'? The United States or Saudi Arabia?

We are tolerant and have always been tolerant. We have never killed gays in this country like the Muslim societies.

The Ottoman Empire killed Armenian Christians because of the rise of Islam and they were seen as a threat.
Aztec's over used their resources as well as the Inca's.

Have you read The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbon?
Life became cheap in the latter days of the Roman Empire. Burdensome regulation and taxes made manufacturing and trade unprofitable. Families were locked into hereditary trades and vocations allowing little if any vocational choice. Eventually, children were seen as a needless burden and abortion and infanticide became commonplace. In some cases, children were sold into slavery.

Manners and social life fell into debauchery. Under Justinian, entertainment grew bawdier and more bizarre. Orgies and love feasts were common. Homosexuality and bestiality were openly practiced. Under Nero, Christians were blamed for the great fire in Rome and horribly persecuted.

Similar patterns can be found in other civilizations. In Greece, the music of the young people became wild and coarse. Popular entertainment was brutal and vulgar. Promiscuity, homosexuality, and drunkenness became a daily part of life. And all moral and social restraints were lost leading to greater decadence.

In Carthage, worship turned from Baal to the earth goddess Tanit. "Sacrifices to the goddess of fertility were supposed to ensure productivity, long life, and even greater profits."Ornately carved funeral monuments depicting infant sacrifice can be seen today along with thousands of tiny stone coffins to infants sacrificed to the pagan goddess.

The parallels to our own nation are striking. No, we don't sacrifice infants to a pagan goddess, but we have aborted over 57 million babies on the altar of convenience. And various sexual practices are openly accepted as part of an alternative lifestyle.

It starts out small and continues until the society falls.
First it became acceptable to have sex out or wedlock
Then it became acceptable for couples to move in together without marriage and have children out of wedlock.
Our children are being exposed to violent video games and sex on TV
From acceptance of homosexuality it moves on to, polygamy, to sex with animals and on and on down the line.

It is a combination of all not just sex or homosexuality that leads to the society's downfall.

 

[Redfish]

Ted Cruz Introduces Bills to Stop Gay Marriage
Bloomberg | 4/23/2015 | Heidi Prszbyla


Bloomberg Title and Link Only
Ted Cruz Introduces Bills to Stop Gay Marriage - Bloomberg Politics
Sub-Heading-- "The Texas senator wants to establish a constitutional amendment that protects states that define marriage as being between a man and a woman from legal action. "

---
Cruz Is going to fight the gays!

Your thread says he tries to stop gay marriage, where does he do that?

because the libs know that if the people of each state are given the right to vote, the gay mafia will lose.

 

[kaz]

our thread says he tries to stop gay marriage, where does he do that?

because the libs know that if the people of each state are given the right to vote, the gay mafia will lose.

You realize it's inevitible gay marriage will happen, right? The percentage of the young who think gays should be able to get married across both parties is overwhelming. It's just a fact. Marijuana is also going to be legal at some point for the same reason

 

[peach174]

PEACH174 SAID:

"Where does the 14th amendment say same sex marriage is an equal right? It says deprive any person of life, liberty or property.
You are free to be gay in this country but it says nothing about marriage."

Wrong - “life, liberty or property” are found in the 5th Amendment, not the 14th.

The 14th Amendment applies the right to due process of the law to the states, both procedural and substantive; it also requires the states to allow all persons residing in the states access to the laws of each state, in this case same-sex couples access to marriage law, where to seek to deny same-sex couples access to marriage law violates the Due Process and Equal Protection Clauses of the 14th Amendment.

Interestingly, Cruz's 'amendment' is an acknowledgment of this fact, he understands that 14th Amendment jurisprudence prohibits the states from denying same-sex couples access to marriage law; to render that jurisprudence void of the force of law, he seeks to 'amend' the Constitution to codify discrimination against gay Americans.

Amendment XIV
Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Says it right there and it does not apply to any marriages.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Golly, another thoughtful and cogent opinion from the anti gay crowd. I'm shocked they haven't won more court cases.

Where does the 14th amendment say same sex marriage is an equal right?
It says deprive any person of life, liberty or property.
You are free to be gay in this country but it says nothing about marriage.

You are obsessing about an institution that has over a 60% failure rate. That abysmal longevity stat has little if nothing to do with homosexuals. It would serve you that think it is the "foundation" of our society to work a little harder on the actual causes of it's horrible record of success.

many believe that sanctioning gay marriage would harm society, you don't believe it would. There is a difference of opinion-----------so lets put it to a vote in every state and let the will of the people prevail.

I will accept the will of the people, will you?

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

in the opinion of many human beings, homosexuality is not a normal human condition, treating a sickness as normal would harm society.

you may think otherwise and thats ok, but the majority opinion should prevail, unless we live in a dictatorship.

I don't believe it is normal. I just don't believe it matters.

 

[Redfish]

our thread says he tries to stop gay marriage, where does he do that?

because the libs know that if the people of each state are given the right to vote, the gay mafia will lose.

You realize it's inevitible gay marriage will happen, right? The percentage of the young who think gays should be able to get married across both parties is overwhelming. It's just a fact. Marijuana is also going to be legal at some point for the same reason

yes, I think both will happen. What won't happen is for the government to mandate what I am allowed to think and believe.

government dictating societal rights and wrongs. does anyone see this as dangerous?

Listen libs, what if the govt was controlled by conservatives? Careful what you ask for, it could turn on you.

 

[Redfish]

Where does the 14th amendment say same sex marriage is an equal right?
It says deprive any person of life, liberty or property.
You are free to be gay in this country but it says nothing about marriage.

You are obsessing about an institution that has over a 60% failure rate. That abysmal longevity stat has little if nothing to do with homosexuals. It would serve you that think it is the "foundation" of our society to work a little harder on the actual causes of it's horrible record of success.

many believe that sanctioning gay marriage would harm society, you don't believe it would. There is a difference of opinion-----------so lets put it to a vote in every state and let the will of the people prevail.

I will accept the will of the people, will you?

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

in the opinion of many human beings, homosexuality is not a normal human condition, treating a sickness as normal would harm society.

you may think otherwise and thats ok, but the majority opinion should prevail, unless we live in a dictatorship.

I don't believe it is normal. I just don't believe it matters.

so you have no issue with the govt calling abnormality normal? How about abnormal pedifilia? polygamy? where does it start and end?

 

[kaz]

You are obsessing about an institution that has over a 60% failure rate. That abysmal longevity stat has little if nothing to do with homosexuals. It would serve you that think it is the "foundation" of our society to work a little harder on the actual causes of it's horrible record of success.

many believe that sanctioning gay marriage would harm society, you don't believe it would. There is a difference of opinion-----------so lets put it to a vote in every state and let the will of the people prevail.

I will accept the will of the people, will you?

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

in the opinion of many human beings, homosexuality is not a normal human condition, treating a sickness as normal would harm society.

you may think otherwise and thats ok, but the majority opinion should prevail, unless we live in a dictatorship.

I don't believe it is normal. I just don't believe it matters.

so you have no issue with the govt calling abnormality normal? How about abnormal pedifilia? polygamy? where does it start and end?

Anyone who thinks the government can tell the difference between normal and abnormal is abnormal

 

[Redfish]

many believe that sanctioning gay marriage would harm society, you don't believe it would. There is a difference of opinion-----------so lets put it to a vote in every state and let the will of the people prevail.

I will accept the will of the people, will you?

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

in the opinion of many human beings, homosexuality is not a normal human condition, treating a sickness as normal would harm society.

you may think otherwise and thats ok, but the majority opinion should prevail, unless we live in a dictatorship.

I don't believe it is normal. I just don't believe it matters.

so you have no issue with the govt calling abnormality normal? How about abnormal pedifilia? polygamy? where does it start and end?

Anyone who thinks the government can tell the difference between normal and abnormal is abnormal

all the more reason that they should not be making those decisions.

 

[HappyJoy]

Holy shitballs this thread is crazy.

It's pre-primary season, Cruz is pandering...nothing brave about it as he is attempting to become the favorite of the only substantial demographic left that is not for gay marriage, that being Republicans and specifically the religious zealots. It's predictable and things like htis happen every four years. In this case, a constitutional amendment is never going to happen. There is not one iota of a chance this is going to happen in 2015. Yea progress!

 

[HappyJoy]

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

in the opinion of many human beings, homosexuality is not a normal human condition, treating a sickness as normal would harm society.

you may think otherwise and thats ok, but the majority opinion should prevail, unless we live in a dictatorship.

I don't believe it is normal. I just don't believe it matters.

so you have no issue with the govt calling abnormality normal? How about abnormal pedifilia? polygamy? where does it start and end?

Anyone who thinks the government can tell the difference between normal and abnormal is abnormal

all the more reason that they should not be making those decisions.

But...they kind of have to if laws are to be enforced. Otherwise who is to stop you from marrying your sister? Seriously...who is?

 

[kaz]

We are tolerant and have always been tolerant. We have never killed gays in this country like the Muslim societies

Until all gays everywhere can buy any cake they want at any bakery across this great land, we are no better...

 

[kaz]

Anyone who thinks the government can tell the difference between normal and abnormal is abnormal

all the more reason that they should not be making those decisions.

They call spending investment, tax cuts spending and they call money they spent a trust fund, what do they know about the English language other than how to lie? What they call "marriage" couldn't concern me less

 

[Kondor3]

We are tolerant and have always been tolerant. We have never killed gays in this country like the Muslim societies

Until all gays everywhere can buy any cake they want at any bakery across this great land, we are no better...

We are no better?

Would a few photos of Gays, hanging by their necks from ropes attached to mechanical cranes, in Iran, be of any use to you, in distinguishing between the two?

 

[kaz]

We are tolerant and have always been tolerant. We have never killed gays in this country like the Muslim societies

Until all gays everywhere can buy any cake they want at any bakery across this great land, we are no better...

We are no better?

Would a few photos of Gays, hanging by their necks from ropes attached to mechanical cranes, in Iran, be of any use to you, in distinguishing between the two?

I'd click the needle on your sarcasm detector, I think it's stuck

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

You are obsessing about an institution that has over a 60% failure rate. That abysmal longevity stat has little if nothing to do with homosexuals. It would serve you that think it is the "foundation" of our society to work a little harder on the actual causes of it's horrible record of success.

many believe that sanctioning gay marriage would harm society, you don't believe it would. There is a difference of opinion-----------so lets put it to a vote in every state and let the will of the people prevail.

I will accept the will of the people, will you?

How would it harm society? I see a lot of people who's sensibilities it would harm but 0 evidence for societal harm

Immoral and Sexual deviancy has brought down many society's all though out history.

Which ones? I keep hearing people make those claims yet when we look at the 'fall' of societies- I can't think of any that did.

The Ottoman Empire? Nope- that was losing World War 1 and rise of secular forces.
The Aztec Empire? Nope- that was caused by the Spanish and the collusion of the Aztec's conquered neighbors.
The Incan Empire? Nope- see above.

The reality is that the United States is the most powerful country in the world- and we have what ancient Jews would consider an immoral society.

The societies that are the least tolerant of 'immoral and sexual deviancy'? Well that would be the repressed of Muslim societies- Iran and Saudi Arabia.

Which do you choose as the most 'moral path'? The United States or Saudi Arabia?

We are tolerant and have always been tolerant. We have never killed gays in this country like the Muslim societies.

The Ottoman Empire killed Armenian Christians because of the rise of Islam and they were seen as a threat.
Aztec's over used their resources as well as the Inca's.

Have you read The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbon?
Life became cheap in the latter days of the Roman Empire. Burdensome regulation and taxes made manufacturing and trade unprofitable. Families were locked into hereditary trades and vocations allowing little if any vocational choice. Eventually, children were seen as a needless burden and abortion and infanticide became commonplace. In some cases, children were sold into slavery.

Manners and social life fell into debauchery. Under Justinian, entertainment grew bawdier and more bizarre. Orgies and love feasts were common. Homosexuality and bestiality were openly practiced. Under Nero, Christians were blamed for the great fire in Rome and horribly persecuted.

Similar patterns can be found in other civilizations. In Greece, the music of the young people became wild and coarse. Popular entertainment was brutal and vulgar. Promiscuity, homosexuality, and drunkenness became a daily part of life. And all moral and social restraints were lost leading to greater decadence.

In Carthage, worship turned from Baal to the earth goddess Tanit. "Sacrifices to the goddess of fertility were supposed to ensure productivity, long life, and even greater profits."Ornately carved funeral monuments depicting infant sacrifice can be seen today along with thousands of tiny stone coffins to infants sacrificed to the pagan goddess.

The parallels to our own nation are striking. No, we don't sacrifice infants to a pagan goddess, but we have aborted over 57 million babies on the altar of convenience. And various sexual practices are openly accepted as part of an alternative lifestyle.

It starts out small and continues until the society falls.
First it became acceptable to have sex out or wedlock
Then it became acceptable for couples to move in together without marriage and have children out of wedlock.
Our children are being exposed to violent video games and sex on TV
From acceptance of homosexuality it moves on to, polygamy, to sex with animals and on and on down the line.

It is a combination of all not just sex or homosexuality that leads to the society's downfall.

The Roman empire did NOT fall because of homosexuality. To suggest so it patently stupid. The Roman empire was toppled because of excessive conquest & the inability to defend all territories as the armies we're spread too thin. Political corruption also was a big factor.

ANYONE who twists those FACTS into an argument about sex in any fashion does not know shit about Roman history.