States With Stand Your Ground Laws See More Homicides

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Star, Jan 4, 2013.

  1. Star
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    Star Gold Member

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    .

    These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws."

    What the study didn't find was "evidence of any [crime] deterrence effect over that same time period."



    As to why this is the case, economist Mark Hoekstra told NPR that Stand Your Ground encourages more lethal force by lowering its costs:
    “One possibility for the increase in homicide is that perhaps [in cases where] there would have been a fistfight … now, because of stand your ground laws, it’s possible that those escalate into something much more violent and lethal
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  2. tjvh
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    tjvh Senior Member

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    If the rise in homicides is because criminals are getting killed during the commission of a crime what the hell is the problem? Maybe idiots will get the message that it isn't healthy to assault other people.
     
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  3. Inthemiddle
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    Inthemiddle BANNED

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    1) "Homocide" rates include assailants justifiably killed in the commission of crimes. So your statistic is ambiguous at best.

    2) Not all stand your ground laws are the same, and not all are like that of Florida.
     
  4. Star
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    Star Gold Member

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    No doubt there is a certain amount of built in ambiguity, if for no other reason than the cop that makes the report has, what should be a judge's discretion as to whether or not a crime has been committed, or if an arrest should be made, etc. but-----but two separate reports, one by Texas A&M the other by Georgia State University came to about the same conclusion: ""It could be that these are self-defense killings," he said. "On the other hand, the increase could be driven by an escalation of violence by criminals. Or it could be an escalation of violence in otherwise nonviolent situations."

    But which is it?

    Hoekstra checked to see whether police were listing more cases as "justifiable homicides" in states that passed stand your ground laws. If there were more self-defense killings, this number should have gone up. He also examined whether more criminals were showing up armed.

    In both cases, he found nothing. There were small increases in both numbers, but it was hard to tell whether there was really any difference.

    So if the numbers on justifiable homicide and criminals using lethal force don't explain the rise in homicide, what's causing the increase?

    "One possibility for the increase in homicide is that perhaps [in cases where] there would have been a fistfight ... now, because of stand your ground laws, it's possible that those escalate into something much more violent and lethal," says Hoekstra."

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  5. akelch
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    akelch Senior Member

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    So did the crime rate (rape, theft, etc.) go down, up or stayed the same? Who are the people that died in the Homicides (cops, innocent children, crooks, drug dealers, etc.)?

    Need more data.
     
  6. bigrebnc1775
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    bigrebnc1775 Diamond Member

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    Homicides? are they combining murder with self defense? neither are the same.
     
  7. Claudette
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    Claudette Gold Member

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    Well I live in "stand your ground" Florida and believe me I will stand my ground if someone breaks into my house.

    My shotgun and I are more than ready to "stand our ground."

    Seems I remember when Texas passed the law about carrying guns that folks thought there would victims falling all over the place.

    The only thing that happened was the crime rate went down.

    Stand your ground?? You bet.
     
  8. J.E.D
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    J.E.D What's tha matta?

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    How many homicides would have been found "justifiable" if these laws were not on the books? In other words, judges and prosecutors hands are tied in some cases. Because of the law, people are getting away with killing people who were no real threat to them.
     
  9. J.E.D
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    J.E.D What's tha matta?

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    :rolleyes:

    Are you going to "stand your ground" and shoot a black kid whose music is too loud?
     
  10. squeeze berry
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    squeeze berry Gold Member

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    nine posts in and Jose plays the race card
     

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