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Seriously, I don't have a problem with what you say, I just don't think we can do it anymore. If we institute a large protectionist tariff right now to protect American industry from competition (Smoot-Hawly much?) what do you think the result would be? A depression like the last time we did it. Worse, a long drawn out trip to the World Court who would tell us to stop it? Tariffs against our goods would immediately go up all around the world. What would that do to workers and businesses here?
So you end up slapping down one set of workers in order to save another. That's just playing favorites. In the meantime, one thing we do produce a lot of here, that we are competitive with around the world is agricultural goods. We throw up a high tariff and I hope you are hungry, cuz you're gonna have a lot to eat bud. Oh, on the way to bankrupting ADM, ConAgra and the tens of thousands of workers they employ.
It is correct to say that free trade is imperfect. But it needs to be fixed with a screw driver, not a sledge hammer.
Do you really live in Michigan?
I mean what? you didn't get the memo? Your state has been in a recession for over a decade! Is you car broke? Your leather personnel carriers don't work?
Why on Earth would you stay in a broken ass state like Michigan? You like seeing despair and desolation all around you? There are winner states out there where life is generally good pretty much everywhere. Why someone would choose to be stuck in a rusted shell of civilization I have no idea.
Really, so if I bust my ass more than you all my life, our outcomes should be the same?
Do you really live in Michigan?
I mean what? you didn't get the memo? Your state has been in a recession for over a decade! Is you car broke? Your leather personnel carriers don't work?
Why on Earth would you stay in a broken ass state like Michigan? You like seeing despair and desolation all around you? There are winner states out there where life is generally good pretty much everywhere. Why someone would choose to be stuck in a rusted shell of civilization I have no idea.
Really, so if I bust my ass more than you all my life, our outcomes should be the same?
Look at how many people started business' in the 90's and look at the fucking numbers today. It's pathetic. Bush was supposed to be all about starting business', buying homes, less government spending, etc.
Clearly I would not take a fools advice if they told me to go out in this economy and start a business. Clearly you are a fool.
And clearly people like Bern who have their own business don't appreciate that the economy was probably in much better shape when they started their business'.
You could fail at a business and just go find a job if that happened. Clearly Bern has not looked for a job lately.
Or maybe he likes that the market is flooded with workers who all need jobs.
I'll work for $8 hr if my unemployment runs out. Better than nothing.
But that doesn't mean I'm only worth $8.
You GOP'ers suck as Americans.
Oh, and my family lives here. I have one of the last good jobs remaining in Michigan. And my brother is a VP of a auto supplier. Makes $400K.
And your red neck ass is jealous. So you'll sacrafice us so you can make $15 hr.
Oh, and my family lives here. I have one of the last good jobs remaining in Michigan. And my brother is a VP of a auto supplier. Makes $400K.
And your red neck ass is jealous. So you'll sacrafice us so you can make $15 hr.
1. the auto workers worked their asses off their whole lives, all to have some snot nosed pussy like you come along and allow the GOP in 8 years to bankrupt the country and cost them their pensions.
You are a fucking sellout bitch.
Ford had profits in 1999.
Decades? Yes, the GOP plot to break unions and lower wages has been in the works for decades.
Who knows if you benefit from it or if you are hurting yourself. Chances are you are hurting yourself. But you are too ignorant to know it.
I say take the bank give away's away too if we won't give the Big 3 their loans. FUCK giving the banks the rest of the $750 billion if the Big 3 can't have $25bill. Fuck it! Let's go into revolution right now!!!!
Dear Mr. Xxxxxxxx:
Thank you for contacting my office regarding the turmoil in the financial markets that has compromised the solvency of several U.S. financial institutions and has threatened our nation's economy. I appreciate your taking the time to share your specific views and concerns.
For many years, I have said that the current Administration has failed to exercise appropriate oversight of the nation's banking and corporate sectors, and has promoted policies that reward Wall Street at the expense of Main Street. The Administration's actions are largely responsible for our current economic crisis, which resulted in President Bush's September 2008 proposal to help restore soundness to U.S. credit markets.
I opposed the original hastily-written and woefully inadequate financial sector bailout bill proposed by President Bush. In the nearly two weeks after the President's proposal, the U.S. Congress radically changed the original bill to better protect taxpayers and to ensure greater Congressional oversight. I am pleased that the bipartisan compromise legislation to stabilize our nation's economic system (H.R.1424), which the Senate passed on October 1, 2008 by a bipartisan vote of 74-25, bore no resemblance to the original Bush proposal. I understand the concerns raised by many Virginians about certain provisions of this legislation that may have been beyond the scope of the bill's intended purpose. However, I was not given the opportunity to offer amendments to the legislation, and as with any bipartisan initiative, compromise is necessary in order to advance our nation's priorities.
After much deliberation, I voted to support the Senate's economic rescue legislation. I reached my decision based on the reality that this legislation provides the only possible opportunity that will be offered in the U.S. Congress this year to address our nation's economic crisis. I am also satisfied that the significant recommendations I offered during the legislation's consideration were incorporated into the admittedly imperfect bill. Moreover, I was persuaded to support the Senate legislation because it provided meaningful tax relief to hardworking Virginia families and small businesses.
Throughout the bill's negotiations, I was outspoken in support of several basic principles that are essential for the future economic well-being of our country. For example, I wrote a letter to Senate Banking Committee Chairman Chris Dodd only one day after U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson announced the original plan. I spoke twice on the Senate floor about the proposal. Moreover, I led an
effort to convince the Senate Majority Leader to incorporate these principles in any legislation, including them in a letter that was co-signed by eight of my Senate colleagues.
The fundamental principles that I raised included:
A grave concern about the transfer of so much financial power and discretion to one individual in the executive branch of government, and the lack of a clear mechanism for the oversight of this unprecedented power;
The need for proper limits on executive compensation, and a guarantee that the executives who mismanaged our financial markets not be unjustly enriched by a taxpayer bailout;
The need for a guarantee that the American taxpayer be able to share directly in any benefits gained by the rescue legislation;
Appropriate limits on the ability of foreign institutions to participate in the program; and
The release of federal funds for the program in installments in order to ensure that Congress can properly fulfill its oversight role, and to give Congress time to enact meaningful new reforms to the regulatory structure.
We were able to achieve significant progress in each of these areas. In particular, I am pleased that the Senate included meaningful provisions in the bill to limit executive compensation and to give taxpayers the chance to share in any gains achieved through this legislation. These provisions will help to restore taxpayer confidence in our financial system and ease the credit crunch that threatens economic growth.
The President signed the economic rescue legislation into law on October 3, 2008. Going forward, I will work aggressively with members of Congress from both sides of the aisle to ensure that this new law is implemented fairly, and in a way that safeguards the American taxpayer. Equally important, the next Congress must restore to our financial system a regulatory structure that will prevent this terrible chapter in American history from ever happening again.
As Congress continues to address issues related to our nation's economy and the well-being of hardworking Virginians, please be assured that your specific views and suggestions will be very helpful to me and my staff. I hope that you will continue to share your thoughts with us in the years ahead.
I would also invite you to visit my website at Senator Jim Webb : Virginia for regular updates about my activities and positions on matters that are important to Virginia and our nation.
Sincerely,
Jim Webb
United States Senator
1. the auto workers worked their asses off their whole lives, all to have some snot nosed pussy like you come along and allow the GOP in 8 years to bankrupt the country and cost them their pensions.
air traffic controllers earn between $50K and $140K+ per year. you might want to pick a different occupation to show the evil effects of "union busting", ace.
Air Traffic Controllers
their pensions are guaranteed by the PBGC
I know Michigan is stuck in the 70s, but most of us don't even have defined-benefit pensions anymore, your state really needs to get with the times, no wonder everyone's leaving
Seriously, I don't have a problem with what you say, I just don't think we can do it anymore.
If we institute a large protectionist tariff right now to protect American industry from competition (Smoot-Hawly much?) what do you think the result would be?
A depression like the last time we did it. Worse, a long drawn out trip to the World Court who would tell us to stop it? Tariffs against our goods would immediately go up all around the world. What would that do to workers and businesses here?
So you end up slapping down one set of workers in order to save another. That's just playing favorites.
In the meantime, one thing we do produce a lot of here, that we are competitive with around the world is agricultural goods.
We throw up a high tariff and I hope you are hungry, cuz you're gonna have a lot to eat bud. Oh, on the way to bankrupting ADM, ConAgra and the tens of thousands of workers they employ.
It is correct to say that free trade is imperfect. But it needs to be fixed with a screw driver, not a sledge hammer.
I dunno... perhaps the 50K part is underpaying for the skills needed. I'm pretty sure that you don't want a lot of turnover in that job.
Well, I'm starting my business in this economy. The economy is a very relative thing. It can be just fine for me while it sucks for large numbers of other people.
I'm doing precisely what my dad did though. He started his business in 1974. In the middle of another recession. Why? cuz he worked for Ford and he was last hire and knew he'd be laid off first. Starting then and managing to make it through the Carter years of hyper-inflation and finally to a good economy under Reagan, he made millions from that start. (In spite, rather than because of Democrat policies).
I love how the same people who think social security should be privatized don't believe workers' pensions should be protected.
no, the 50K is for entry level and and areas with less air traffic. people at airports like ohare, logan, laguardia make $140K+.
i wouldn't want the job; i've a friend who is an atc and he's on his third divorce and probably his second liver.
no thanks, but don't try and tell me that they're low paying jobs.
Well, I'm starting my business in this economy.
no, the 50K is for entry level and and areas with less air traffic. people at airports like ohare, logan, laguardia make $140K+.
i wouldn't want the job; i've a friend who is an atc and he's on his third divorce and probably his second liver.
no thanks, but don't try and tell me that they're low paying jobs.
If you live in most mteropolitan areas of the United States of American, $50 K isn't shit for pay.
If you live in the New York or Boston, you're POOR if you only make $50 K.
Where the fuck have you been, Del?
Understood. With the world's economy going into free-fall, now is NOT the time to worry about why the American economy has been slowly going into the crapper.
Now is NOT the time to raise taxes, either.
REMEMBER I SAID that, would you?
NOW is NOT the time to RAISE TAXES or BALANCE THE BUDGET or any of the other things that in different economic circumstances MIGHT have MADE sense.
We don't have to do that now, I suspect. The time to have done that was thirty years ago.
Why7 don't we have to do that now? Because the cost of imported good is likely to rise so much people won't be able to buy them anyway.
See above.
Oh, NOW we notice that every tariff policy has winners and losers?
The sad thing is, that for th elast 40 years we have been willing to create ten times as many losers as we were creating winners, and I didn't hear you noting that fact, Tech ESQ.
Why not?
Well I cannot speak for you, but based on what I have been reading, that arrogant indifference to the working class that so many people here have expressed, I have to tell you the reason some people have failed to note what has been happening is because of the
IA GOT MINE GET YOURS, JACK, attitude and hubris of the bougouise class who STILL had decent jobs.
Class treason is ANOTHER way of describing it.
A complete misunderstanding of how national economies work, might be the kinder way of describing the problem, too.
And we do that with damned FEW workers, don't we? That's won't really help all that much. We've been bankrupting family farmers for so long that won't help much at all.
Yeah, I see your point. It's overstated but it's got some validity, I agree.
Yeah and that is exactly what I have been saying for the last six months since I started posting here.
You and I are not so far apart in theory as I think you suspect we are, Tech. I'm just a few light-years ahead of you, I think.
I warned and warned and warned this board where we were headed AND WHY, too.
But because the fucking stock market was doing well, people (with money to invest) assumed the national economy was doing swell.
Well the situation has changed rather considerably in the last six months hasn't it?
So let me tell you what the solution is today, and then you can tell me why you think I am wrong again, and then six months from now when you decide that I'm right you can mischaracterize my solutions as being too excessive again, okay?
We are having (or entering) a CLASSIC DEFLATIONARY DEPRESSION.
Why?
Because we fucked over the working class for the last 40 years, that's why.
The rich had so fucking much money, that all they could do with it is invest it into BUBBLES.
There weren't enough CONSUMERS to buy the crap the SUPPLE SIDERS (with FAR too much money tio invest, money that was chasing FAR too few profits) could possibly sustain.
So while the real estate values were going up faster than the average person sould afford them (so the wroking class borrowed too much and now can't pay it back) and the stock market prices were INFLATING, all those were were nothing but BUBBLES.
We were NOT creating wealth (you ONLY do that by making STUFF!) we were merely inflating the money going to fewer and fewer AMERICANS
And now that those bubble have popped, we all FEEL POOR.
Well, most of us are actually pretty poor, but now the TECH ESQ class is beginning to feel poor, too.
Welcome to our world, amigo.
And so the still reasonably affluent don't SPEND MONEY, and the vicious cycle of DEflation gets worse.
The solution?
Keyneisan SPENDING.
We have got to replace the TRILLIONS AND TRILLIONS AND TRILLIONS of dollars that were lost when those bubbles poppped but THIS TIME we'd best get that money into the hands of the CONSUMERS.
Not the fucking bankers who cause this mess, but the workers who we've been screwing for the last 40 years.
Failure to do that will simply keep this DEPRESSION going and getting worse.
Do you understand what I am saying here?
Inflation isn't the boogieman DEFLATION is.
The hard headed fiscal conservatives (who I so often agree with) are WRONG now.
TOTALLY, inescapably WRONG.
Now the recent bankers' bail out was STUPIDLY designed and once again, what do we SEE?
We see these MORNONS thinking there's a SUPPLY SIDE solution to the CONSUMER SIDE problem.
We are so god damned used to catering our economy to the RICH, we kneejerked 750 BILLION dollars to EXACTLY the WRONG people!
Working people do have any fucking money, Tech. Don't you get that?
Not cause they're lazy, not cause of unions, but because the AUSTRIAN ECONOMIC PRINCIPLES have been taken to EXCESS.
Just as in 1929, the fucking stupid RICH have killed the geese that lay the golden eggs.
