So, I turned on Fox News for the first time since Tuesday

[Procrustes Stretched]

Dante is largely ignorant on most topics, but I will agree here.

Unaccountable lame ducks are dangerous, as we will witness under Obama.

why does Dante suddenly feel the need to take a shower?

Because you shat upon youself?

So Ravi isn't the only Queen of scat around here? No wonder you two scratch each others eyes out so often. Fighting over who is Queen of the Toilet

 

[FJO]

Primetime line up.

All I'm hearing is throwbacks to the republican politicians of the 60's thru 80's.

I'm hearing hosts who for some reason think we are still in the old days when whitey ruled the political scene and everyone that voted voted on two or three issues.

Times have changed people. Demographics have changed even more. What fucking part of that are you not getting? Everyone is acting like its a bad thing to broaden our base.

We don't have to give away the kitchen sink to appeal to more people. And if you think we do then we're doomed as a nation anyways.

Aspouse our core fiscal issues and leave the damn social issues in the bedroom.

Secondly EVERYONE should support MAJOR campaign finance reform. All this money corrupts our system.

I'm just really dismayed at the reaction many are having to our loss. Its only the end of the world if we don't learn from our mistakes.

So and be specific, what would you do to gain the hispanic vote if you're not giving them the kitchen sink?

Include their concerns in the dialogue. Address their concerns that anger about illegal immigrants might spill over into hostility and suspicion toward all Hispanics. Explain to them how Romney's plan to grow the economy at 4% will allow them to buy their own kitchen sink and open more opportunities for their children. Show them that you feel their pain, understand their anxieties and share their aspirations. That's what Republicans do with the groups that traditionally support them and it's time to reach out in the same way to some of these groups, like Hispanics, who have been supporting Democrats. That's how Reagan got the Reagan Democrats.

There is no cure for stupid. There is no cure for brain-washed.

600,000 mostly white Americans - who were then Republicans and would be Republicans today - sacrificed their lives, so that their descendents could be stabbed in the back by the despicable likes of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Congressional Black Caucus (racist by its name and by definition), the Black Panthers, new or old, BET, (the totally corrupt television channel that exists only because laws instituted by WHITE legislators), Louis Farrakhan and Eugine Robinson and Alex Wagner of MSNBC, just to name a few.

They vote in Nazi-like or Stalin-like or North Korea-like lock-step, 90+% for skin color, throwing a decent and heroic black person, Martin Luther King Jr. who admonished to judge people by the contents of their character, rather than the color of their skin, to the garbage heap.

 

[FJO]

Primetime line up.

All I'm hearing is throwbacks to the republican politicians of the 60's thru 80's.

I'm hearing hosts who for some reason think we are still in the old days when whitey ruled the political scene and everyone that voted voted on two or three issues.

Times have changed people. Demographics have changed even more. What fucking part of that are you not getting? Everyone is acting like its a bad thing to broaden our base.

We don't have to give away the kitchen sink to appeal to more people. And if you think we do then we're doomed as a nation anyways.

Aspouse our core fiscal issues and leave the damn social issues in the bedroom.

Secondly EVERYONE should support MAJOR campaign finance reform. All this money corrupts our system.

I'm just really dismayed at the reaction many are having to our loss. Its only the end of the world if we don't learn from our mistakes.

Everytime we lose an election they say Republicans need to be more inclusive to blacks and hispanics. I'm sick of hearing that shit. We shouldn't have to play divisive politics and pander to any race or ethnicity.

How can you be more inclusive than sacrificing 600,000 lives for the freedom of black slaves?

 

[House]

Primetime line up.

All I'm hearing is throwbacks to the republican politicians of the 60's thru 80's.

I'm hearing hosts who for some reason think we are still in the old days when whitey ruled the political scene and everyone that voted voted on two or three issues.

Times have changed people. Demographics have changed even more. What fucking part of that are you not getting? Everyone is acting like its a bad thing to broaden our base.

We don't have to give away the kitchen sink to appeal to more people. And if you think we do then we're doomed as a nation anyways.

Aspouse our core fiscal issues and leave the damn social issues in the bedroom.

Secondly EVERYONE should support MAJOR campaign finance reform. All this money corrupts our system.

I'm just really dismayed at the reaction many are having to our loss. Its only the end of the world if we don't learn from our mistakes.

What disturbs me the most is many republicans here have confirmed my suspicion that their plan seems to be to contribute to the problem until its so bad that they get power back.

Total scumbag behavior.

Kind of similar to what the Democrats did to George W. Bush.

Forgive me for not having pity on Dubya, one of this country's largest traitors since the secession of South Carolina.

 

[amrchaos]

Primetime line up.

All I'm hearing is throwbacks to the republican politicians of the 60's thru 80's.

I'm hearing hosts who for some reason think we are still in the old days when whitey ruled the political scene and everyone that voted voted on two or three issues.

Times have changed people. Demographics have changed even more. What fucking part of that are you not getting? Everyone is acting like its a bad thing to broaden our base.

We don't have to give away the kitchen sink to appeal to more people. And if you think we do then we're doomed as a nation anyways.

Aspouse our core fiscal issues and leave the damn social issues in the bedroom.

Secondly EVERYONE should support MAJOR campaign finance reform. All this money corrupts our system.

I'm just really dismayed at the reaction many are having to our loss. Its only the end of the world if we don't learn from our mistakes.

NO

Replublicans should narrow their base. Republicans need ideological purity!! Conservative principles and social conservative agendas! To comform to communism is to sell America down a harsh road of wrong headedness and backwards economics. We need Big religion and Big military and a free, deregulated government.

We need to get Government out of our way, if we compromise on that, then America is truly doomed. Do not use Romney's lose as an excuse to shake hands with a leftist. Use it as I do!! Romney was not conservative enough! Conservatism wins is proof of that. We need more and purer conservative candidates!! Else America is doomed.

 

[Foxfyre]

Choose. Do you want to be a Democrat or do you want to be a Republican? The two ideologues are 180 degrees different. You get to choose between a nation of dependency or a nation of personal responsibility. If that's too hard draw a straw.

So you're happy with a large amount of public perception being that republicans are only friendly to white males with money who are religious? I'm sure not.

It's not even pandering to certain demographics either. Immigration is a problem that mostly affects Latinos. Latinos should be firmly in the GOP corner because they're generally hard workers with religious values. Crafting a message that pushes for easier legal immigration and path to citizenship goes a long, long way toward expanding the base and solving a problem at the same time. This nation was built by welcoming hard working, disenfranchised immigrants that will work hard and become valuable members of society. Latino immigrants are largely just that. That, and they're the most rapidly expanding voting demographic.

I agree. Certainly there are Hispanics/Latinos who don't love America and are exploiting it for their own purposes. But then so do some people who were born here and have American ancestry going back for generations.

But I believe the large majority of Hispanics just want to be in the mainstream and take their rightful role as fully capable and industrious Americans as those with ancesters who came over on the Mayflower. And I believe the vast majority of Republicans and conservatives actually see them that way; in fact don't see it as an us and them dynamic. But until we learn how to communicate that more effectively, we give the opposition ammunition to continue to demonize us.

 

[FJO]

Diagnosing the problem:

"So, I turned on FOX News..."

problem diganosed

Diagnosis FALSE!

I watch both FNC and MSNBC in recorded time.

MSNBC is full of hate, racism, divisiveness, total lack of common sense, and total lack of compassion and total lack of sense of humor.

Not to mention the total lack of opposing opinion.

FNC, on the other hand, is Fair And Balanced. They feature liberal commentators, liberal pundits, sometimes unopposed by conservative opinions.

MSNBC is happy about the hurricane that destroyed houses, lives and dreams. Hosts on FNC shows prayed for the victims of the storm that Chris Matthews of MSNBC is grateful for and happy about happening.

MSNBC does NOT have a NEWS show, does not have an equivalent to Bret Baer or Shepard Smith. They only have hate-spewing blowhards like "Reverend" Al Sharpton, limey Paki Martin Basher, phony "middle class advocate" wife beater Ed Schultz and even phonier Lawrence O'Donnell.

When one tunes in to FNC, one can see opinions that may not be approved by management. But it's there, while dissenting opinions on MSNBC are not only silenced, but simply NOT ALLOWED.

 

[House]

But I believe the large majority of Hispanics just want to be in the mainstream and take their rightful role as fully capable and industrious Americans as those with ancesters who came over on the Mayflower.

The people arriving on the Mayflower weren't breaking immigration law.

Mexicans, Canadians, and any other foreign nationals that cross our borders without going through the proper channels are.

So until they have that green card, they have no "rightful role". They're criminals that are disrespecting all of those who did take the proper channels.

Illegal immigrants need to get out of our country and come back in (if they wish) through the immigration process. Turning a blind eye to criminals that ignore immigration law only promotes further illegal immigration.

Am I saying that immigration law here in the US is perfect? Hell no! 2-5 years to become a citizen is ridiculous. But you don't show a country how much you want to be here by breaking its laws. That's like going into a bank and saying, "I really want to open an account, so I'm robbing you for the money to do it."

 

[g5000]

Primetime line up.

All I'm hearing is throwbacks to the republican politicians of the 60's thru 80's.

I'm hearing hosts who for some reason think we are still in the old days when whitey ruled the political scene and everyone that voted voted on two or three issues.

Times have changed people. Demographics have changed even more. What fucking part of that are you not getting? Everyone is acting like its a bad thing to broaden our base.

We don't have to give away the kitchen sink to appeal to more people. And if you think we do then we're doomed as a nation anyways.

Aspouse our core fiscal issues and leave the damn social issues in the bedroom.

Secondly EVERYONE should support MAJOR campaign finance reform. All this money corrupts our system.

I'm just really dismayed at the reaction many are having to our loss. Its only the end of the world if we don't learn from our mistakes.

Let me tell you about campaign finance reform.

We have had seven or eight major campaign finance reforms since the 70s, both legislative and judicial.

Take a guess how much impact they have had on the success rate of incumbents who run for re-election.

Go ahead. Guess.


That's right! Zero! How did you know?



Now think about this. The more you grow government, the more government intervention you force onto the American people, the more corruptible you make government. If government controls your life, then the guy with the most money who is controlling the government gets to therefore control your life.

So less government means less control over you which means people with means are less able to fuck with your life.

Keep it fucking simple, stupid.


For example, what if there were no tax deductions, loopholes, credits, subsidies, and so forth? Just imagine if no one was allowed to fuck with the tax code. No one was able to buy a Congressman and get him to give them a tax break which would then have to be made up for from your hide.

See how that works?

The SMALLER the government, the more POINTLESS it becomes to try to buy it.

Campaign finance "reform" is an idiot's way of curing the symptom instead of the disease.

Keep government the fuck out of our lives as much as possible and a shitload of these problems take care of themselves.



.

 

[rightwinger]

Choose. Do you want to be a Democrat or do you want to be a Republican? The two ideologues are 180 degrees different. You get to choose between a nation of dependency or a nation of personal responsibility. If that's too hard draw a straw.

So you're happy with a large amount of public perception being that republicans are only friendly to white males with money who are religious? I'm sure not.

It's not even pandering to certain demographics either. Immigration is a problem that mostly affects Latinos. Latinos should be firmly in the GOP corner because they're generally hard workers with religious values. Crafting a message that pushes for easier legal immigration and path to citizenship goes a long, long way toward expanding the base and solving a problem at the same time. This nation was built by welcoming hard working, disenfranchised immigrants that will work hard and become valuable members of society. Latino immigrants are largely just that. That, and they're the most rapidly expanding voting demographic.

I agree. Certainly there are Hispanics/Latinos who don't love America and are exploiting it for their own purposes. But then so do some people who were born here and have American ancestry going back for generations.

But I believe the large majority of Hispanics just want to be in the mainstream and take their rightful role as fully capable and industrious Americans as those with ancesters who came over on the Mayflower. And I believe the vast majority of Republicans and conservatives actually see them that way; in fact don't see it as an us and them dynamic. But until we learn how to communicate that more effectively, we give the opposition ammunition to continue to demonize us.

Good point

But it is more than poorly worded communication coming from the Republicans. In some cases it is outright hostility. The Arizona and Alabama immigration bills, opposition to the DREAM act, blocking immigration reform, English only legislation.....all targeted at the Hispanic community

 

[g5000]

How can you be more inclusive than sacrificing 600,000 lives for the freedom of black slaves?

When did you do that?

The Republican Party of today is nothing like Lincoln's Party. Not even close.

It's not even Reagan's party any more.


.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Diagnosing the problem:

"So, I turned on FOX News..."

problem diganosed

I watch both FNC and MSNBC...

Diagnosing the problem:

"I watch both FNC and MSNBC..."

problem diganosed

 

[AmyNation]

Choose. Do you want to be a Democrat or do you want to be a Republican? The two ideologues are 180 degrees different. You get to choose between a nation of dependency or a nation of personal responsibility. If that's too hard draw a straw.

So you're happy with a large amount of public perception being that republicans are only friendly to white males with money who are religious? I'm sure not.

It's not even pandering to certain demographics either. Immigration is a problem that mostly affects Latinos. Latinos should be firmly in the GOP corner because they're generally hard workers with religious values. Crafting a message that pushes for easier legal immigration and path to citizenship goes a long, long way toward expanding the base and solving a problem at the same time. This nation was built by welcoming hard working, disenfranchised immigrants that will work hard and become valuable members of society. Latino immigrants are largely just that. That, and they're the most rapidly expanding voting demographic.

I agree. Certainly there are Hispanics/Latinos who don't love America and are exploiting it for their own purposes. But then so do some people who were born here and have American ancestry going back for generations.

But I believe the large majority of Hispanics just want to be in the mainstream and take their rightful role as fully capable and industrious Americans as those with ancesters who came over on the Mayflower. And I believe the vast majority of Republicans and conservatives actually see them that way; in fact don't see it as an us and them dynamic. But until we learn how to communicate that more effectively, we give the opposition ammunition to continue to demonize us.

I hope a vast majority of republicans see it that way. It's not the impression I get from many conservative talking heads, and it's not the impression I get from many of the conservatives on this site.

 

[FJO]

Capitulate or get out?

Therein lies the problem

Choose. Do you want to be a Democrat or do you want to be a Republican? The two ideologues are 180 degrees different. You get to choose between a nation of dependency or a nation of personal responsibility. If that's too hard draw a straw.

Deal with hispanics and immigration or never win another national election.

CHOOSE

Why "DEAL WITH HISPANICS"?

There never was a "deal with Irish", "deal with Italians", "deal with Germans" and in my own particular case, "deal with Hungarians".

Mind you, in the case of Hungarians, a whole bunch was disallowed to immigrate because of a quota set up by the ever-so-loving FDR. These Hungarians fought against the Soviet Union in 1956, and their fight preceded the eventual collapse of the country that FDR held in such high esteem. So, no Hungarians entered the country illegally. No Germans entered
the country illegally. No Italians, no Irish, no Greeks, no Swedes, no Austrians and no any other people who, unlike the Hispanic horde, respect the law of the land and wish to immigrate within the boundaries of the LAW.

What were Hispanics fighting for? Alamo?

 

[Foxfyre]

So you're happy with a large amount of public perception being that republicans are only friendly to white males with money who are religious? I'm sure not.

It's not even pandering to certain demographics either. Immigration is a problem that mostly affects Latinos. Latinos should be firmly in the GOP corner because they're generally hard workers with religious values. Crafting a message that pushes for easier legal immigration and path to citizenship goes a long, long way toward expanding the base and solving a problem at the same time. This nation was built by welcoming hard working, disenfranchised immigrants that will work hard and become valuable members of society. Latino immigrants are largely just that. That, and they're the most rapidly expanding voting demographic.

I agree. Certainly there are Hispanics/Latinos who don't love America and are exploiting it for their own purposes. But then so do some people who were born here and have American ancestry going back for generations.

But I believe the large majority of Hispanics just want to be in the mainstream and take their rightful role as fully capable and industrious Americans as those with ancesters who came over on the Mayflower. And I believe the vast majority of Republicans and conservatives actually see them that way; in fact don't see it as an us and them dynamic. But until we learn how to communicate that more effectively, we give the opposition ammunition to continue to demonize us.

Good point

But it is more than poorly worded communication coming from the Republicans. In some cases it is outright hostility. The Arizona and Alabama immigration bills, opposition to the DREAM act, blocking immigration reform, English only legislation.....all targeted at the Hispanic community

But somewhere there has to be a way to find a balance that is suitable for everybody regardless of whatever sub group they identify with. There must be a rule of law or we are doomed as a civilized nation. Somehow we need to find a way to effectively communicate that and obtain consensus with the sub groups who see our attempts at that as hostility toward them specifically.

There are valid reasons to object to a DREAM act that is just an expansion of a nanny state, but that needs to be expressed so that it doesn't sound uncompassionate or hostile and there does need to be some effective and constructive way to deal with those who were brought here against their will and who have no country to go back to. And at the same time we need to develop consensus on a system that doesn't continue to produce that kind of problem.

There are so many many excellent reasons to have English as the official language of the land, but we need to focus on those reasons and encourage that rather than sounding like we are punishing some people.

Again it isn't that the principles and values are wrong. But the way they have been presented and are perceived need a lot of work. And it would help if we all tried to focus on finding consensus on what most of us want and how best to achieve that instead of insulting and condemning and demonizing each other.

 

[FJO]

What disturbs me the most is many republicans here have confirmed my suspicion that their plan seems to be to contribute to the problem until its so bad that they get power back.

Total scumbag behavior.

Kind of similar to what the Democrats did to George W. Bush.

Forgive me for not having pity on Dubya, one of this country's largest traitors since the secession of South Carolina.

No pity is needed or deserved.

Fairness and equal treatment, however, is essential in civil discourse.

 

[House]

Kind of similar to what the Democrats did to George W. Bush.

Forgive me for not having pity on Dubya, one of this country's largest traitors since the secession of South Carolina.

No pity is needed or deserved.

Fairness and equal treatment, however, is essential in civil discourse.

If we really want to give Dubya fairness and equal treatment, every second of his life should be televised, because that's what he did to us.

 

[Avorysuds]

If you wana save the Republican party the very very very first thing you MUST do is, stop watching Fox News...

They gave you Mitt, they gave you McCain and they LOVE to give you God above all else.

 

[rightwinger]

If you wana save the Republican party the very very very first thing you MUST do is, stop watching Fox News...

They gave you Mitt, they gave you McCain and they LOVE to give you God above all else.

Who did you support for President?

 

[FJO]

Diagnosing the problem:

"So, I turned on FOX News..."

problem diganosed

I watch both FNC and MSNBC...

Diagnosing the problem:

"I watch both FNC and MSNBC..."

problem diganosed

If I had said that I only watch FNC, you would have said THE SAME THING.

If I had said that I watch only MSNBC, you would have agreed with me.

Obviously, the problem is with you.