McCain turns down FEC matching funds

[Larkinn]

I guess when the court throws out the Democrats lawsuit, you'll apoligize right?

They won't throw it out. They might lose, but they won't throw it out.

 

[Larkinn]

Show me where MCcain has taken one red cent in FEC funding.

Show me where this matters AT ALL. It doesn't. Are you really this stupid?

..oh ok...I see your speaking out your arse again....

Right.

Try doing some research and then getting back to me. Its obvious you are completely ignorant.

McCain can be bound by the rules even without actually accepting the money. Do you deny this fact?

 

[jreeves]

Did you bother reading any part of this thread?

He BENEFITTED from the funds.

I understand it's really too complex for you, but try to follow along.

I read the thread, but he didn't secure the loan with the FEC funding.

 

[Larkinn]

I read the thread, but he didn't secure the loan with the FEC funding.

So care to tell us how he would have paid off the loan had the campaign have gone badly?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

So care to tell us how he would have paid off the loan had the campaign have gone badly?

He used two other means of collateral. That being the whole point.

 

[Larkinn]

He used two other means of collateral. That being the whole point.

For the $1 million dollar loan?

Please name what he said he would do if the campaign went badly to repay the $1 mil loan.

 

[jreeves]

For the $1 million dollar loan?

Please name what he said he would do if the campaign went badly to repay the $1 mil loan.

Care to tell me where it says that he used Fec funds to secure the loan?

 

[Dogger]

He used two other means of collateral. That being the whole point.

He could have used 40 different pieces of collateral, and the 41st piece of collateral would still be collateral.

McCain guaranteed that the proceeds would be used to pay the loan before any other debt, in that the Bank would have a "first priority perfected security interest" in the funds. See Page 2 of the Loan Agreement (which is page 3 in Adobe Reader), the initialed paragraph at the bottom of the page.

 

[jreeves]

He could have used 40 different pieces of collateral, and the 41st piece of collateral would still be collateral.

McCain guaranteed that the proceeds would be used to pay the loan before any other debt, in that the Bank would have a "first priority perfected security interest" in the funds. See Page 2 of the Loan Agreement (which is page 3 in Adobe Reader), the initialed paragraph at the bottom of the page.

Jeez....ignorant liberals...but do keep right on lying....end of thread.

Lawyers for the bank that provided a crucial $4 million line of credit to Sen. John McCain's campaign late last year said yesterday that the loan agreement was carefully drafted to give the Arizona Republican the opportunity to withdraw from public financing during the primary elections.
In a letter obtained by the Associated Press, the outside counsel for Fidelity & Trust Bank said the loan terms specifically excluded from the collateral any potential share of public matching funds McCain was entitled to receive.

The letter, from lawyers Matthew S. Bergman and Scott E. Thomas to McCain lawyer Trevor Potter, supports McCain's stance against contentions that his withdrawal from public financing is in jeopardy.

The bank's description of the loan came the same day the Democratic Party filed a complaint against McCain, calling on campaign-finance regulators to investigate whether the likely Republican nominee can legally bypass public financing for the primary and the strict spending limits that come with it. The Federal Election Commission also has asked McCain to explain the loan terms.

Staying with public financing could be devastating for McCain because he would have to live within spending limits he is already on the verge of surpassing. McCain said yesterday that he had not considered the financial implications of such a step.

The FEC certified McCain to receive up to $5.8 million in public matching funds. He did not collect any of the money. To withdraw once such funds have been certified, a candidate must not have received any of the money nor encumbered it as collateral for a loan.

"The bank does not now have, nor did it ever receive from [McCain's campaign] committee, a security interest in any certification of matching funds," the lawyers for the bank wrote. - AP


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/poli...__McCain_is_free_to_forgo_public_funding.html

 

[Dogger]

Jeez....ignorant liberals...but do keep right on lying....end of thread.

I posted a link to the original loan document and gave directions to the relevant text that even a dog could follow.

It's right there by the initials. It grants the bank a "first priority perfected security interest". How does that translate into me lying?

The Bank's lawyer may have tried to avoid Federal Law, but the way to do that was by omitting any inclusion of the proceeds as collateral. You may be too stupid to see it, but it is there nonetheless.

I am certain that I wouldn't change my opinion if Obama had done this, and I am equally certain that you would.

 

[jreeves]

I posted a link to the original loan document and gave directions to the relevant text that even a dog could follow.

It's right there by the initials. It grants the bank a "first priority perfected security interest". How does that translate into me lying?

The Bank's lawyer may have tried to avoid Federal Law, but the way to do that was by omitting any inclusion of the proceeds as collateral. You may be too stupid to see it, but it is there nonetheless.

I am certain that I wouldn't change my opinion if Obama had done this, and I am equally certain that you would.

For one the bank isn't partisian. Secondly if anyone should know what the loan agreement was it should be the bank. Since they drew up the loan papers. Lastly, the bank will play an important part in this equation because it was understood that the contract didn't restrict Mccain to public funds.

 

[Dogger]

For one the bank isn't partisian. Secondly if anyone should know what the loan agreement was it should be the bank. Since they drew up the loan papers. Lastly, the bank will play an important part in this equation because it was understood that the contract didn't restrict Mccain to public funds.

1st point - Unsupported by any evidence.
2nd point - I agree that the bank intended to evade federal law, just as tax attorneys often try to evade lawful taxation, but your argument flies in the face of the plain language of the document.

Why mention the funds at all if the bank never expected to rely on them for repayment? Why did McCain's campaign adopt (and initial specifically, by the way) language providing for a "first priority perfected security interest" in the funds?

And why are you so determined to correct me on this issue when even a tropical fish has a better understanding of it than you ever will?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

1st point - Unsupported by any evidence.
2nd point - I agree that the bank intended to evade federal law, just as tax attorneys often try to evade lawful taxation, but your argument flies in the face of the plain language of the document.

Why mention the funds at all if the bank never expected to rely on them for repayment? Why did McCain's campaign adopt (and initial specifically, by the way) language providing for a "first priority perfected security interest" in the funds?

And why are you so determined to correct me on this issue when even a tropical fish has a better understanding of it than you ever will?

Wanna post your Law License? Perhaps you can provide us with which Bench you serve on as a Judge?

 

[Gunny]

For the $1 million dollar loan?

Please name what he said he would do if the campaign went badly to repay the $1 mil loan.

I believe I provided a link at the beginning of this thread that said he put a life insurance policy up as collateral for the $1M loan.

 

[Dogger]

Wanna post your Law License? Perhaps you can provide us with which Bench you serve on as a Judge?

I've never been a judge. And I don't intend to provide information regarding my identity. But Jillian read my posts and easily inferred that I am an attorney. Your tone insinuates that you did not grasp that yourself.

Besides, my license is 28 years old, under glass, and stuffed in a box along with my admissions the the bar of every Federal Court in my state and the US Supreme Court. When I graduated, my law school was ranked 14th in the nation. I have briefed almost 200 cases in appellate courts, most while serving as a prosecutor.

So don't hate me because I'm a liberal. Hate me because I'm smarter than you.

 

[Dogger]

I believe I provided a link at the beginning of this thread that said he put a life insurance policy up as collateral for the $1M loan.

That would protect the bank if McCain died. This is the point where you would say, "Don't you know what life insurance is, dumbass?"

If McCain died, he would not be collecting the matching funds and the bank would be left unsecured or under-secured. That's the same reason you must have fire insurance on a mortgaged home - it preserves the security by substituting insurance proceeds if the collateral is lost.

All of which brings us back to the aforementioned paragraph, clearly initialed at the bottom of page 2 of the Loan Agreement. Why mention the funds at all if the bank never expected to rely on them for repayment? Why did McCain's campaign agree to language providing for a "first priority perfected security interest" in the funds?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I've never been a judge. And I don't intend to provide information regarding my identity. But Jillian read my posts and easily inferred that I am an attorney. Your tone insinuates that you did not grasp that yourself.

Besides, my license is 28 years old, under glass, and stuffed in a box along with my admissions the the bar of every Federal Court in my state and the US Supreme Court. When I graduated, my law school was ranked 14th in the nation. I have briefed almost 200 cases in appellate courts, most while serving as a prosecutor.

So don't hate me because I'm a liberal. Hate me because I'm smarter than you.

Ahh yes the tired old claim of 3 liberals now that because they are Lawyers ( ohh wait Larkinn just claims cause he goes to school he is smarter)that makes them smarter then us dumb hicks. Basically your calling the lawyers and law firm of the bank liars and criminals. All from the safe position of hiding anonomous on a Message board.

Keep up the good work.

 

[Larkinn]

Care to tell me where it says that he used Fec funds to secure the loan?

In the loan agreement that was posted, genius.

 

[Larkinn]

Jeez....ignorant liberals...but do keep right on lying....end of thread.

Lawyers for the bank that provided a crucial $4 million line of credit to Sen. John McCain's campaign late last year said yesterday that the loan agreement was carefully drafted to give the Arizona Republican the opportunity to withdraw from public financing during the primary elections.
In a letter obtained by the Associated Press, the outside counsel for Fidelity & Trust Bank said the loan terms specifically excluded from the collateral any potential share of public matching funds McCain was entitled to receive.

The letter, from lawyers Matthew S. Bergman and Scott E. Thomas to McCain lawyer Trevor Potter, supports McCain's stance against contentions that his withdrawal from public financing is in jeopardy.

The bank's description of the loan came the same day the Democratic Party filed a complaint against McCain, calling on campaign-finance regulators to investigate whether the likely Republican nominee can legally bypass public financing for the primary and the strict spending limits that come with it. The Federal Election Commission also has asked McCain to explain the loan terms.

Staying with public financing could be devastating for McCain because he would have to live within spending limits he is already on the verge of surpassing. McCain said yesterday that he had not considered the financial implications of such a step.

The FEC certified McCain to receive up to $5.8 million in public matching funds. He did not collect any of the money. To withdraw once such funds have been certified, a candidate must not have received any of the money nor encumbered it as collateral for a loan.

"The bank does not now have, nor did it ever receive from [McCain's campaign] committee, a security interest in any certification of matching funds," the lawyers for the bank wrote. - AP


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/poli...__McCain_is_free_to_forgo_public_funding.html

Thats nice. Intent of the contract is meaningless. What actually happens matters. By the way...now that McCain is the Republican nominee, you really think his bank wants to fuck him over?

 

[Larkinn]

For one the bank isn't partisian.

Evidence of this?

Secondly if anyone should know what the loan agreement was it should be the bank. Since they drew up the loan papers.

Haha...the intent now determines how contracts are read apparently

Lastly, the bank will play an important part in this equation because it was understood that the contract didn't restrict Mccain to public funds.

No, it really won't. What the bank thought is irrelevant.