Israel Kills 7 Palestinians And Injures 52 In Ongoing Attack On Occupied Gaza

[rosends]

Don't pull the US Mexico border crap on me. That's absolutely not related or anyone like that of the Gaza Israeli border. No, I don't see it as a requirement. But I do know that it's a blockade and a siege. Israel can continue to keep the crossings and borders closed, and blockade the Sea, which keeps them a occupier.

so other countries can keep closed borders, including Egypt, but when Israel keeps a closed border (except for crossings) then it is a siege. So I guess Jordan is putting Israel under a siege. And so is Lebanon. And Saudi Arabia is siege-ing Yemen.

Israel controls the borders inside, not the outside borders.

Both of them share responsibility. And clearly Israel has a bigger role.

So they control what goes in and out and what happens and what doesn't happen.

They prevent many goods from entering Gaza and prevent trade.

Israel prevents trade with Egypt? I thought Israel prevented trade into Israel (aside from spices, peppers etc... http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/HumanitarianAid/Palestinians/Gaza_spice_export_23-Oct-2012.htm )

 

[SAYIT]

Obviously you're a fool, Gaza found ways to transport through Egypt, and Mubarak the dictator was the one who shut the border down on American and Israeli orders.

Israel blockades Gaza and controls 7 of the crucial borders.

Take the blame, Israel is to blame you coward.

You should look up the word "border." Gaza shares one border with Israel and one 7 mile long border with Egypt. Israel has no reason to allow traffic across their border with Gaza and every right to keep it closed. Take your whining to "brotherly" Egypt.

Bullcrap. It's 7 miles long, not at the border crossing, which is is no where near that. The Israeli Gaza border is 26 miles long, and Israel controls the crucial borders that Palestinians need to trade to the West Bank.

And they blockade the Sea, by 20 nautical miles, it's not Israel's right.

It is not only Israel's right to keep weapons out of Gaza, it is her duty and are you really so stupid as to believe that the Rafah border crossing isn't part of that 7-mile long border Gaza shares with Egypt?
Once more for the terminally stupid BecauseIKnowSquat:
Israel controls the one border (not 7) it shares with Gaza. Egypt controls the one 7-mile border it shares with Gaza.
Damn you're stupid.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

so other countries can keep closed borders, including Egypt, but when Israel keeps a closed border (except for crossings) then it is a siege. So I guess Jordan is putting Israel under a siege. And so is Lebanon. And Saudi Arabia is siege-ing Yemen.

Israel controls the borders inside, not the outside borders.

Both of them share responsibility. And clearly Israel has a bigger role.

So they control what goes in and out and what happens and what doesn't happen.

They prevent many goods from entering Gaza and prevent trade.

Israel prevents trade with Egypt? I thought Israel prevented trade into Israel (aside from spices, peppers etc... http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/HumanitarianAid/Palestinians/Gaza_spice_export_23-Oct-2012.htm )

No, I was referring to Israel.

It's amazing how she gives us, one example, for the first time it was allowed, as if one example is enough to dismiss their blockade.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

You should look up the word "border." Gaza shares one border with Israel and one 7 mile long border with Egypt. Israel has no reason to allow traffic across their border with Gaza and every right to keep it closed. Take your whining to "brotherly" Egypt.

Bullcrap. It's 7 miles long, not at the border crossing, which is is no where near that. The Israeli Gaza border is 26 miles long, and Israel controls the crucial borders that Palestinians need to trade to the West Bank.

And they blockade the Sea, by 20 nautical miles, it's not Israel's right.

It is not only Israel's right to keep weapons out of Gaza, it is her duty and are you really so stupid as to believe that the Rafah border crossing isn't part of that 7-mile long border Gaza shares with Egypt?
Once more for the terminally stupid BecauseIKnowSquat:
Israel controls the one border (not 7) it shares with Gaza. Egypt controls the one 7-mile border it shares with Gaza.
Damn you're stupid.

That's a lame political excuse to get away with everything.

Regardless of what you may think the reason is, it still makes Israel an occupier

 

[kvetch]

today's news nosh from Israel

Having reached the age of 67, the age of retirement, I watch with trepidation as the 1967 lines fade away, taking with them the outline of a peace that is within arm's reach, the border of a democratic, Jewish and moral state - a country in which it would be pleasant to live the rest of my life."
--Akiva Eldar dedicates his last column in Haaretz to Israeli activists and groups working towards peace, including Peace Now, Breaking the Silence and B'Tselem.**

 

[irosie91]

'because' claims that the cesspit SAUDI ARABIA is "occupying" jews everwhere because that shit hole denies jews the right to cross its shit encrusted border?

 

[BecauseIKnow]

SAYIT seems to deny Israel is active in blockading Gaza, and claims its only for self defense, but when you look into it more....

Israel Planned to Keep Gaza's Economy 'on the Brink of Collapse,' Leaked Cable Says - NYTimes.com

The cable also delves into some of the more complex financial aspects of Israel’s embargo of Gaza, including the fact that Israeli shekel continued to be used as the currency of the territory, even after it was taken over by the Islamist Hamas movement.

One section of the report explained that while the government of Israel “believes that maintaining the shekel as the currency of the Palestinian Territories is in Israel’s interests, it treats decisions regarding the amount of shekels in circulation in Gaza as a security matter.”

Israel used 'calorie count' to limit Gaza food during blockade, critics claim | World news | guardian.co.uk

The Israeli military made precise calculations of Gaza's daily calorie needs to avoid malnutrition during a blockade imposed on the Palestinian territory between 2007 and mid-2010, according to files the defence ministry released on Wednesday under a court order.

Israel says it never limited how many calories were available to Gaza, but critics claimed the document was proof the government limited food supplies to put pressure on Hamas.

At the height of the blockade Israel also maintained a list of foods that were permitted and banned from Gaza.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

GAZA: Devastating Impacts of Israeli Blockade | Global Research

The United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) has released a factsheet outlining the impact of five years of siege on the Gaza Strip.

The impact of the siege on Gaza’s economy is starkly illustrated by statistics; for example, 34 percent of Gaza’s workforce, including half of its youth, are unemployed. Also, Israel restrictions mean that 35 percent of Gaza’s farmland and 85 percent of its fishing waters are totally are partially inaccessible. The restrictions on fishing have severely impacted the livelihoods of 35,000 while an estimated 75,000 metric tons of produce are lost each year because of the movement restrictions, according to OCHA.

OCHA’s report also notes the danger of other industries in Gaza: “Since the intensification of the blockade in 2007, at least 172 Palestinian civilians have been killed and 318 injured while working in tunnels between Gaza and Egypt” — the only lifelines that Palestinians in Gaza have thanks to the nearly hermetic closure of the Israeli-controlled crossings with Gaza.

 

[kvetch]

oh!!!! that "SAUL" I was trying to remember the mysogyny of KING SAUL ------ok ----now I understand Paul was a greek-----he is thought to have been a recent convert to Judaism Anyone interested in the greek view of women-----be prepared ----its not pretty. Interestingly enough----besides being expected to spend most of life indoors----a GREEK WOMAN was expected to COVER HER HEAD WITH VEILS whenever out of home of in the presence of men. If men entered the house she was expected to HIDE ----elsewhere and ------spin wool and knead bread dough. As to sexuality------men could do the homosexual or the heterosexual thing-----women were expected to be UTTERLY ---chaste and husband oriented only Lesbianism was ABHORRENT then she was to die annonymously. Paul virtually invented christianity but I am sure he was a nice guy

he has caused so much suffering to women and gays

Sha'ul / St Paul of Tarsus:

if he hadn't done it, some other schmuck would have said the same and been quoted as he is now.

i read in a "Jewish Atlas" that 10% of all Roman citizens all over the empire at the time of Christ were jews and less than half of Jews then were in Judea or Palestine

do we call them the inverted zionists??

 

[rosends]

Israel controls the borders inside, not the outside borders.

Both of them share responsibility. And clearly Israel has a bigger role.

So they control what goes in and out and what happens and what doesn't happen.

They prevent many goods from entering Gaza and prevent trade.

Israel prevents trade with Egypt? I thought Israel prevented trade into Israel (aside from spices, peppers etc... http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/HumanitarianAid/Palestinians/Gaza_spice_export_23-Oct-2012.htm )

No, I was referring to Israel.

It's amazing how she gives us, one example, for the first time it was allowed, as if one example is enough to dismiss their blockade.

I don't know who she is, or who "us" is but that article isn't about the first time, just the first time for those new products. There have been loads of other examples even of goods marketed to the West Bank and Israel proper, but I figured you knew about all of those.

 

[irosie91]

not exactly even zionists can live -----elsewhere lots of jews in Alexandria and in Rome and also a trend of CONVERTS----paul was probably a convert he wanted more converts so he eased up on the more difficult issues ------like no ham with the eggs then there was conflict ------so he kept on with the little changes here and there------and got annoyed when ------his innovations were less than "appreciated"

 

[Billo_Really]

I respect what you say and the sources you cite, plus your understanding of them. I can cite other sources (including the 1970 decision of the ICJ) which say otherwise. If you wish to read them, they are summed up in this article From "Occupied Territories" to "Disputed Territories," by Dore Gold
feel free to discount the arguments and sources. That doesn't mean they don't exist. Heivant, ima?

So basically, what you're saying is, you understand my point, you just don't agree with it? If that is the case, I'm fine with that.

Now as far as your link, my issues with some of the things said, are as follows:

Issue 1 from your link:
First, Palestinian spokesmen hope to create a political context to explain and even justify the Palestinians' adoption of violence and terrorism during the current intifada.

Granted, there is violence and terrorism committed on both sides. Both sides have committed war crimes. With that being said, if someone came in and bulldozed down your home in the middle of the night with family members still inside, wouldn't you get violent to? It is interesting to note, why this point was raised in your link, in light of the fact that the 2008 ceasefire was broken by Israel, not Hamas. So it seems to me, that it is Israel is more comfortable with the violence than the Pals.

Issue 2 from your link:
Second, the Palestinian demand of Israel to "end the occupation" does not leave any room for territorial compromise in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, as suggested by the original language of UN Security Council Resolution 242 (see below).

This one ain't ever going to happen. Ever since WWII, it is illegal to hold on to land seized in a war. Any "territorial compromise" would be like saying it was okay for Hitler to annex Poland. Israel has been beating this drum for the last 45 years and there still isn't a single country on the planet that recognizes Israel's right to that land. Even the Israeli Supreme Court refers to these as the "OPT".

Issue 3 from your link:
Third, the use of "occupied Palestinian territories" denies any Israeli claim to the land: had the more neutral language of "disputed territories" been used, then the Palestinians and Israel would be on an even playing field with equal rights.

This is a strawman argument. Israel got their land. Trouble is, they want more than they were given. Israel will never have that land. That's the Pals land. Israel should be thankful that they were only 10% of the population in Palestine in 1948 and were given 55% of the land. The Pals got the shaft on that one.

It should be noted, they have rights to.

Issue 4 from your link:
Additionally, by presenting Israel as a "foreign occupier," advocates of the Palestinian cause can delegitimize the Jewish historical attachment to Israel.

You can't lose something you don't have. What happed 2000 years ago, has no legal standing today. Israel has their country. The Pals have an inherent right to self-determination and they deserve their country to.

It is, what it is.

 

[irosie91]

for sherri-----bulldozing houses without DAYS of warning ----is not done----by israel. In the distant past I heard of one case of a death of person who HID in his house knowing it was determined in court to be put down you are spouting typical islamo nazi pigs lies however ---you fellow islam nazis DO invade the homes of jews and slit throats----especially the throats of infants, to your delight. Throat slitting is nothing new------it has been going on in the name of your ideology for centuries. The destruction of buildings is not new------illegal structures are often destroyed in civilized countries or even as a matter of EMIMENT DOMAIN. someone said you are a lawyer-----was that supposed to be a joke?

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

for sherri-----bulldozing houses without DAYS of warning ----is not done----by israel. In the distant past I heard of one case of a death of person who HID in his house knowing it was determined in court to be put down you are spouting typical islamo nazi pigs lies however ---you fellow islam nazis DO invade the homes of jews and slit throats----especially the throats of infants, to your delight. Throat slitting is nothing new------it has been going on in the name of your ideology for centuries. The destruction of buildings is not new------illegal structures are often destroyed in civilized countries or even as a matter of EMIMENT DOMAIN. someone said you are a lawyer-----was that supposed to be a joke?

irosie,

Are you serious?

Bulldozing homes without days of warning, bulldozing homes with Caterpillar bulldozers, bulldozing people in front of and inside houses being demolished, killing and burying civilians alive, that is something Israel is world renowned for. Noone bulldozes homes and civilians in and around them like Israel does, the way Isreal does! Nobody does it better than Israel does!

I will never forget Jenin and what happened there in 2002.

Here are some photos of all the bulldozing havoc wrecked on the refugee camp in Jenin in 2002, Israel bulldozed houses with Palestinian residents still inside, according to the human rights groups.

An Israeli soldier tank is seen near demolished houses in the Jenin refugee camp, where the fiercest fighting occurred, in the northern West Bank, Sunday, April 14. Israeli forces retained tight control of the camp and surrounding towns and villages, as part of the military offensive launched on March 29 to track down and eliminate Palestinian "militants" and their networks

A Palestinian woman looks at dead bodies in a house in the refugee camp in the West Bank town of Jenin April 13

The burned remains of a Palestinian boy lay amidst toys in a house destroyed by Israeli soldiers in the Jenin refugee camp Saturday, April 13


Here is a discussion of one bulldozing incident, and a paralyzed Palestinian man bulldozed alive and buried alive by the oh so moral IDF, documented by Human Rights Watch:

"Human Rights Watch documented one case in which a civilian was buried alive when IDF bulldozers collapsed his home. Jamal Fayid was a thirty-seven-year-old paralyzed man living in the Jurrat al-Dahab area of the camp, and his family could not evacuate him in time. Despite the pleas of the family, the IDF bulldozer refused to stop the demolition of the home on April 6. Jamal Fayid was killed in the collapsed building (see below for more details). It is difficult to see what military goal could have been furthered or what legitimate consideration of military necessity could be put forward to justify the crushing to death of Jamal Fayid without giving his family the opportunity to remove him from his home. The remains of a number of Palestinian militants have been recovered from collapsed buildings, as well as those of civilians who were known to have died but whose remains could not be evacuated prior to the bulldozing. At this writing, recovery efforts continue at the Jenin refugee camp, and it is possible that more remains of civilians or armed Palestinians killed during the bulldozing will be recovered. Human Rights Watch is not aware of any cases of missing people who are believed to be buried under the rubble at the time of this report."

Detailed Interviews With Survivors Of The Jenin Holocaust

Sherri

 

[kvetch]

sherri

i read that israel is now CHARGING the bedouins for demolishing their houses where they have lived since time began

ethnic cleansing, this, no violence involved at all

so some wretched bedouins are PAYING to have their own houses demolished for 15,000 shekels rather than paying the israelis 30,000 which is what they charge

also that settlers routinely steal the actual soil from pal farmers to put in their settlement farms

there is NO LIMIT to their greed and sadistic thievery

 

[kvetch]

not exactly even zionists can live -----elsewhere lots of jews in Alexandria and in Rome and also a trend of CONVERTS----paul was probably a convert he wanted more converts so he eased up on the more difficult issues ------like no ham with the eggs then there was conflict ------so he kept on with the little changes here and there------and got annoyed when ------his innovations were less than "appreciated"

rosie i read there was a period during the greek occupation of palestine

when greeks and jews were mutually attracted to each others philosophies and a kind of universal judaism was born but then aborted

you could in a sense regard greeks with their many gods and advanced philosphy especially socrates, heraclitus and pythagoras as neo HINDUS.......the square headed romans less so

certainly greek and sanskrit are related in language structure and you can relate some hindu gods to greek ones

this is because the ancient kurgan tribes...the proto indo europeans....split up and some went east to india and others west to europe carrying their gods with them

more interesting than kvetchin at sherri etc etc about gaza and jesus aint it??

 

[P F Tinmore]

sherri

i read that israel is now CHARGING the bedouins for demolishing their houses where they have lived since time began

ethnic cleansing, this, no violence involved at all

so some wretched bedouins are PAYING to have their own houses demolished for 15,000 shekels rather than paying the israelis 30,000 which is what they charge

also that settlers routinely steal the actual soil from pal farmers to put in their settlement farms

there is NO LIMIT to their greed and sadistic thievery

How big of an asshole does somebody have to be to demolish someones house and send them the bill.

 

[MHunterB]

sherri

i read that israel is now CHARGING the bedouins for demolishing their houses where they have lived since time began

ethnic cleansing, this, no violence involved at all

so some wretched bedouins are PAYING to have their own houses demolished for 15,000 shekels rather than paying the israelis 30,000 which is what they charge

also that settlers routinely steal the actual soil from pal farmers to put in their settlement farms

there is NO LIMIT to their greed and sadistic thievery

Where'd you read that shit, Rense?

 

[P F Tinmore]

sherri

i read that israel is now CHARGING the bedouins for demolishing their houses where they have lived since time began

ethnic cleansing, this, no violence involved at all

so some wretched bedouins are PAYING to have their own houses demolished for 15,000 shekels rather than paying the israelis 30,000 which is what they charge

also that settlers routinely steal the actual soil from pal farmers to put in their settlement farms

there is NO LIMIT to their greed and sadistic thievery

Where'd you read that shit, Rense?

I have seen stories like this in several sources. Not in Rense though.

 

[kvetch]

sherri

i read that israel is now CHARGING the bedouins for demolishing their houses where they have lived since time began

ethnic cleansing, this, no violence involved at all

so some wretched bedouins are PAYING to have their own houses demolished for 15,000 shekels rather than paying the israelis 30,000 which is what they charge

also that settlers routinely steal the actual soil from pal farmers to put in their settlement farms

there is NO LIMIT to their greed and sadistic thievery

How big of an asshole does somebody have to be to demolish someones house and send them the bill.

an ultra greedy sadistic un-ethically-jewish immoral klepto zionist asshole...

a dracula klepto zionist

the IDF has also bulldozed solar panels in area c financed by the EU and the UN !!